If the shooter identified as a trans male, why do so many on DU keep misgendering him as she/her?

[Celerity]

Am I missing something? It seems like we are playing into his fundie Christian parents, who refused to accept his transition and keep calling him their 'daughter'.



https://abcnews.go.com/US/nashville-shooter-audrey-hale/story?id=98166039



https://ca.news.yahoo.com/female-nashville-school-shooter-killed-195734711.html

[AZSkiffyGeek]

1. There have been posts that it didn't matter because he was a killer, and dead

And it is kind of touchy - but I agree, it's feels weird seeing him misgendered without any pushback.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

2. This. Gendering someone properly does not depend on their behavior. I've said it before about

Lindsay Graham and others as well.

[Ocelot II]

3. It might be because the initial reports were based on a description

of the shooter's dead body, which appeared to be female, and was later identified by the name Audrey. I have not heard yet what his name was changed to, has that been reported? Those who were not following the story closely might not be aware of these facts. The initial reports stating that the shooter was transgender made it sound like they were a transgender woman; it wasn't until the next day that the opposite turned out to be the case. This might be the reason for the misgendering; I doubt DUers would be doing it intentionally.

[Coventina]

4. I think his name was Aidan.

That's what I recall reading in one of the articles.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

6. I read he was changing his name to Aiden

It sounded like his LinkedIn profile initially had both names and he/him pronouns, but they were scrubbed.

[FreeState]

70. The name wasn't part of LinkedIn.

Aiden however is the user account name on Instagram (see screen shot part way down)

[Celerity]

81. It was his Instagram that was first scrubbed, that is where I first saw Aiden (as a name) and the

term/name Aiden Creates.

Look at this other person on Insta. He had this disclaimer up within hours of the shooting:

https://www.instagram.com/aidencreates/?hl=en

[tblue37]

69. Aiden.

[ColinC]

5. It's pure misinformation

Not just disrespectful misgendering/deadnaming. Like, I thought he was a trans female, not a trans male (based on posts) -which seems like a somewhat important distinction.

[Ocelot II]

12. Immediately after the shooting was over, the police described the deceased shooter

as a teenaged female; then later the same day it was reported that the shooter was transgender, and not a teenager but 28 years old, and gave their name as Audrey. On those preliminary facts it's not surprising that the shooter was thought to be a trans woman. I didn't see news that he was a trans man until the next day.

[ColinC]

16. Yeah that makes sense.

I imagine a lot of folks might not be intentionally misgendering him but also just a bit behind the curve like me -largely because of the way it was reported.

[Torchlight]

7. My guess (only a guess): petulance

I'm not applying this to the forum here (at least, not entirely) as it seems many people in media, and at the water-cooler are using this opportunity to (as a co-worker prefaced her own words to me yesterday) "not get wrangled in by PC bullshit and call it as I see it!"

In other words, petulance. Petulance justified as righteous indifference. And I'd guess that applies to more people in this world than I'd care to admit.

[LostOne4Ever]

8. My thoughts exactly.

I have been referring to the killer by the name Aiden and “he” and “him” in hopes that it was due to the confusion caused by the police chief’s press conference and hoping others would catch on.

No such luck.

[TwilightZone]

9. The situation has been in continual flux.

First, the shooter was reported as a teenage girl. Then, a 28-year-old woman. Eventually, the current understanding emerged.

Perhaps not everyone has kept up with it.

I suspect that's more the case than that people are intentionally mislabeling the shooter.

[Just_Vote_Dem]

10. I am male and I get called "Ma'am" around a few times a month

The last time, I asked the person why he called me "ma'am" and he said I looked like a lesbian. I was kinda shocked at that and just walked away (I'm in South Florida and don't engage with people who could have concealed weapons, heh)

[Celerity]

23. ffs, 'looked like a lesbian' ?

we come in every shape and size and colour and manner of dress (I know you know this, I am just ,marvelling at the stupidity of that fool)

(I'm in South Florida and don't engage with people who could have concealed weapons, heh)

yet another reason I would never live there (or many parts of the US now)

[Just_Vote_Dem]

28. If I didn't have family here I'd be back in Massachusetts

Not perfect but less scary than here

[treestar]

92. we just can't control others' impressions

especially strangers.

They may be unobservant or dumb. Just correct them and move on, no reason to get mad right off the bat.

[Elessar Zappa]

11. I know in my case it was because of initial confusion.

I had thought the attacker was a transgender female who was born male. After I read the story more in depth and realized that he’s a transgender male, I changed my “she’ pronoun use to “he”.

[obamanut2012]

13. For the same reason all my hidden posts

Including one from two days ago, are hidden because I call out anti-trans DUers. I am pretty sure a group keep trying to get us FRRed.

[Celerity]

15. sorry for your troubles

[Ms. Toad]

17. Thank you.

I'm sorry you are being "rewarded" for challenging trans-hostile posts by having posts hidden.

[LostOne4Ever]

18. Thank you so much

Wish there were more like you!

[Tree-Hugger]

40. Thank you

It's been a rough few days on DU....

[yardwork]

41. There are a number who are trying to be "cute."

They're transparent.

[LexVegas]

57. ...

[sl8]

60. Did you appeal the hides?

Seems like the admins would be sympathetic.

They've reversed a couple of mine.

[obamanut2012]

74. Yes, every time

Even when I am QUOTING someone, I get hidden and lose on appeal.

[sl8]

78. Dang. Sorry. nt

[Ms. Toad]

14. I've pushed back a little -

I started to correct people, but gave up since there were so many (and at the time there were confusing reports about his gender).

I think part of the challenge here is that some of the initial new reports had it wrong (he was initially identified as a teen girl - but was actually a 28 year-old transgender woman). In other words, even though the police initially got the age wrong, they got the post-transition gender right. And the texts to a friend were signed Audrey (Aiden) - which added to the confusion about which was the deadname.

So some of it, in this case, isn't deliberately misgendering or deadnaming him, but the product of some initial rushed news reports that tried to get it right, but failed. Once it's out there, it is hard to pull back.

But thank you for calling it out. We should always use the correct gender and name for trans and nonbinary individual. Regardless of how much we hate what he did in the last minutes of his life, he was a human being. And all human beings deserve to have their identity respected.

[LostOne4Ever]

19. Thank you

I always see you standing up for trans people! You are a true ally!

[Ms. Toad]

22. I wish I could do more! n/t

[yardwork]

42. I thought he was a transgender man.

Maybe I'm mistaken? I thought he was transitioning to male.

[Ms. Toad]

47. That is correct.

The confusion was that a number of early reports, identified him as a transgender woman (i.e. assigned male at birth (AMAB), now female).

I'm not usually forgiving at all on this issue, but in this instance I saw enough early reports which identified him as a transgender woman that I'm pretty sure some of misgendering is confusion, not disrespect. In other words, they were identifying him as a woman - not because they were being disrespectful - but because they believed he was AMAB and now femali, rather than AFAB and now male.

People should take the time to sort it out - and by now the dust has settled enough that they should be getting it right. But trying to use the correct gender and messing it up because you relied on initial confused reports is a lesser offense, at least in my mind, than deliberately misgendering or deadnaming someone.

[yardwork]

49. I agree. Honest confusion or mistaken understanding is not a problem.

[Ms. Toad]

53. I called a lesser offense (rather than not a problem)

because by now the facts are clear. Some reports out there are still derivatives of the original confused ones - but by now anyone seriously interested in getting it right should be able to find enough accurate informaiton to do so.

[LeftInTX]

82. I've been calling Hale, "they"

Mainly because there just is not enough information. I could see if there was more info about identifying as male, such as active posts by Hale, so I don't know if there was a transition, non-binary, unsure, gender fluid?? So I just say Aiden/Audrey, Hale and They. I wish there was more info. There does not seem to be any trans friends who have spoken. So, with regards to gender, I don't know.
I have two nieces like this. One is female, but goes by male nicknames, the other said she's taking hormones to transition. The one who is taking hormones goes by her female name. The one who ID'S as female goes by her male nickname.

It's a big decision to make a transition. So I feel many young people may want to go by both genders until they are sure.

[Ms. Toad]

90. From Hale's online profiles, Hale identified as male.

Here's one source: https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/hate-consequences-trans-activist-group-004701427.html. I've seen similar statements others from within the LGBTQ comunity, as well as statements from family members.

Gender is a spectrum. Some people identify clearly as male, some as female some as non-binary, some as gender-fluid, some as agender, and some as another variations along the spectrum.

So when someone has shared their pronouns they (as Hale has done in his online profiles), it is important to honor those pronouns.

[Oneironaut]

58. Sorry. Responded to wrong post. Lol

Last edited Wed Mar 29, 2023, 11:17 PM - Edit history (1)

[BlackSkimmer]

76. I've read numerous interviews with the shooter's friends.

The one who tried to prevent the incident by calling authorities (Paige somebody) has consistently referred to the shooter as "she" and by the name Audrey. Another interview with a friend did the same. I assume the shooter's friends knew what the shooter was called.

People reading these interviews will assume that the shooter was a she when they read these interviews, so probably best not to place blame on posters who are simply going by what they read.

To me, this killer is simply the killer, the shooter. Another gun lover who collected SEVEN guns to kill children and innocents for some blurry, unknown reason.

I'm amazed that DUers who normally keep these massacres on topic as a GUN issue have seemed to have lost that focus in this tragic incident. Someone used the word "transparent" in a post below, and yes, this focus on the shooter's identity is transparent.

Guns are the issue. And as long as they are available, people being treated for mental problems (as the shooter was) should NOT have access to those weapons. Oddly, I'm not seeing that mentioned either.

[Ms. Toad]

77. Going by the pronouns used by the family and friends is someone known to be trans is not a safe assu

Many family members deadname their child, sibling, etc., And use the pronouns associated with that name. Some friends do, as well.

We've had a thread this week by a trans individual who does not feel safe on DU. A step toward changing that dynamic is to be more vigilant about making sure we get it right.

There was some initial confusion about whether the shooter was a trans man or a trans woman. There is information now available that makes it clear that he was a trans man. We should be actively fact checking (always), but especially as to the gender of anyone known to be a trans individual.

[BlackSkimmer]

85. WE may know that, but the average person out there may NOT know that.

Very sad that some here are not concentrating on the fact that GUNS are killing children more than any other cause.

Very disappointing to see people here fall for the rightwing quibbling about pronouns instead of demanding that GUNS need to be controlled, and that mentally distressed people should NOT HAVE ACCESS TO WEAPONS.

[Ms. Toad]

89. This thread, though, was about people on DU.

Pronouns are not "quibbles" to trans individuals. And this misgendering of a trans individual immediately follows a thread by a trans individual, who is a member of DU, who indicated she did not feel safe on DU.

Instead of pushing back about using the right pronouns, or discounting its importance, just say, "Thank you for the reminder!" and get it right.

[treestar]

93. how is it possible to feel unsafe on

a message board? And all you have to do is say that and you can control other people? Who can keep track of all this?

This is the kind of thing that gets Republicans votes they shouldn't be getting.

[BlackSkimmer]

103. That's a great question.

Why would anyone not feel safe here and still stay?

Any trans person who has posted here recently has gotten tons of support that I've seen. EarlG has even gone out to state his full support so that's curious.

Has this person been threatened on DU? If so, surely they would let the admin know? How do they not feel safe?

[XanaDUer2]

105. And hit "alert" nt

[lame54]

21. Because that's what we were told that day

[Celerity]

24. but I am referring to posts made today, after the facts came out

[NutmegYankee]

25. Is a child murderer worthy of respect at all?

[Celerity]

26. it is not about respect, it is about accuracy and not playing into transphobia on a broader basis

[Ocelot II]

27. It's more a matter of respecting the identification,

and the fact that transgender people are now afraid that they will be targeted and attacked more than ever.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

29. Gendering properly isn't a reward for behavior.

[JCMach1]

34. For me equals: that a$$hole who killed the kids

No name, no pronouns...

[NutmegYankee]

37. +1000 nt

[yardwork]

43. Is it ok to mock Trump for being overweight? No, it is not.

For the simple reason that mocking Trump for being overweight insults and demeans other people, who are actually reading DU.

The killer isn't reading DU, but transgender people are, and yes, they are deserving of respect.

[crickets]

45. Well said. nt

[treestar]

94. Most people know what is going on though

because most people aren't going out of their way to play the offended victim.

A lot of people are overweight; and I really doubt they get upset at hearing Trump called overweight. I'm not so self centered that I have to take it as an insult to me that someone mocks the worst person on the world for being overweight, especially when he brags so much as if he's in great shape.

Apparently there are people who see the victim position as so powerful that they jump at any chance to be one. It does get annoying, and so does the virtue signaling (leave that to right wingers).

That's what this thread is - you guys missed the pronoun, you are terrible people, and I'm a good person because I didn't miss that!

[sarisataka]

46. Does a person have to earn their pronoun?

A person isn't transgender until they are worthy?

[LostOne4Ever]

63. No, but isn't about him. It's about the trans people as a whole.

It is about showing that you respect all trans people’s identity and see them as real.

Similarly, it is wrong to use racial slurs against a mass murderer belonging to racial minority. Not because you respect the murderer, but because you respect the minority as a whole and don’t want to help justify or contribute to their discrimination/oppression.

[mcar]

30. I would prefer that the shooter, any shooter, be referred

simply as "the shooter" or "the murderer" or "the terrorist."

[Celerity]

32. that is all good, but then some are still misgendering them with the pronouns she/her

In my OP title I initially just called them 'the shooter', but I had to get into the identity issue as that was the essence of my OP.

[inthewind21]

97. Oh FFS

Any wonder why me too died a silent death? Over the top nonsense, that's why. There is so much conflicting crap out there right now about this case it's exhausting. And it's being sowed by TENESSEE POLICE. But by all means, let's play right into that and get all bent out of shape so they can have a little more fodder to fling around.

[Celerity]

102. his identity as a trans man has been known for days now, there are examples in the OP and in

thread.

The police had it sorted by the night of the shooting, after making several conflicting statements (which kicked off all the confusion early on).

I waited until 2 days after the shooting, and also after seeing many misgenderings done in threads that clearly showed he identified as a trans man, before making this OP.

[Hekate]

31. There was lots of confusion in posts containing various news sources. As the day ended...

…I was still not sure of the murderer’s pronouns. I finally gave up.

As far as I could tell, not one person here deliberately misgendered the human being who chose to murder 3 little children.

Some people got frustrated at the confusion, and some people started referring to that human as simply “the murderer” or similar.

[Celerity]

33. yes, but then they still use the wrong pronouns of she/her. It's been over 2 days now and the

confusion in the most of the non RW press has been cleared up by this point.

Some people got frustrated at the confusion, and some people started referring to that human as simply “the murderer” or similar.

Of course the RW media/social media are just doubling down on the bullshit in many cases.

[Hekate]

50. "By this point" being 30 hours into the event. Glad it's all cleared up.

Meanwhile, I stand by my point that 99.9% of this community is trying to be respectful of other people — at least those who are not Right Wing Nut Jobs. As partial proof of this, the TOS has changed and expanded again and again since DU’s founding. Open-minded people can and do learn, and thank gods for that.

[sarisataka]

44. I did see a post here

That referred to the shooter as a "crazy chick" who wanted to be a man. That was a particularly egregious one, but there have been others who question if they were "really" transgender.

[Celerity]

52. So now we have the trans authenticity inspectors? Glad I did not see that.

there have been others who question if they were "really" transgender

almost 9 years old and still a powerful AF video statement:

Break Free - Ruby Rose

A short film about gender roles, Trans, and what it is like to have an identity that deviates from the status quo.

Written/Produced/Strarring: Ruby Rose

Music: Butterfly Boucher "It pulls me under"

Directed/Edited: Phillip Lopez

Styled: Phoebe Dahl

[meadowlander]

59. No excuse for the "it" posts that survived juries.

[keithbvadu2]

35. Someone on Fox said it was a hate crime on Christians.

Someone on Fox said it was a hate crime on Christians.

Hale was a Christian.

[Celerity]

36. Do we know if he was still Christian? Or was he just raised by fundie Christian parents?

[inthewind21]

98. Oh

So that's still in question, and free game for questioning/discussion but 30 hours later and a few social media claims and everything else is all wrapped up and worthy of chastising others? Got it.

[treestar]

95. do they even know if the victims were

all Christians? I guess it's a good assumption for that school, but you can't assume that. Catholic schools have nonCatholics in them, for instance. I know a Muslim who went to them (LOL so the parents didn't worry about their offspring being indoctrinated, which they weren't).

[Jedi Guy]

39. Best guess, as others have said, is people not closely following new developments/information.

In other mass shootings, there's been a fair amount of incorrect information injected into the conversation since too many media outlets prize speed over accuracy. The information given out here morphed from teenage girl to adult woman to trans male over the course of what, 24 hours?

Worst guess is people just... even after thinking of how to phrase this, nothing eloquent is coming to me... disrespecting the shooter by deliberately misgendering him? I can understand the desire to disrespect the shooter, since Hale's actions are reprehensible. But Hale is dead and beyond caring, so deliberately misgendering him isn't going to wound him, only others.

It's definitely peculiar.

[Ms. Toad]

48. The reports I saw

went from teenage girl to 28 y/o trans woman to trans man.

[Jedi Guy]

51. I'd be willing to bet the media was all over the map on it.

It's also worth noting that initial reports of suspects in chaotic situations are very frequently wrong and authorities often receive contradictory information from eyewitnesses, adding even more confusion to the mix. Humans generally aren't very good at processing information in high-stress situations, and in the aftermath memories are usually muddled.

[Ms. Toad]

54. It was, and in a very short period of time the gender issue was corrected, at least by some.

But once it is out there, it lives forever.

I was out of touch when the shooting happened, and when I returned home my spouse told me the teen girl to transgender woman story line. I challenged her several times on it because, by the time I got home (a couple of hours later) the ones who cared had corrected themselves.

She doesn't always get stories straight (some cognitive decline) - and gender is particularly challenging for her to get right. She insisted that she wasn't confused about the reports she heard. Since the electronic versions of stories change without a trace of the original it wasn't until I found copy/paste quotes of the original that I was able to confirm that she was accurate about the initial story (since once it's out there it lives forever in any excerpts from the original articles).

[Maeve]

55. Misinformation...and anger

Not at trans people (altho there is some of that even here), but the placing of certain criminals into the "not human" box, and so not deserving the decency it takes to care about preferred pronouns or similar niceties.
Call me a bleeding heart, but even broken humans that do terrible things are still humans, not monsters. He had to have been very broken to attack little kids.

[JanMichael]

56. Is it ok to dead name a dead person shot while making people dead?

[LostOne4Ever]

61. No.

Deadnaming them means that you don’t consider their identity as real.

It implies that being referred to by name/pronouns of one’s identity is an act of privilege, to be invoked or revoked at the person’s choosing, to humor the trans person.

That you do not truly respect the identity of that person or any other trans person.

[JanMichael]

64. So not liking one murderer means I don't like any?

That's ludicrous.

[LostOne4Ever]

65. Not what I said

And you know it.

[Polybius]

66. Wiki does it with Caitlyn Jenner

Look at the first sentence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caitlyn_Jenner

[LostOne4Ever]

67. Does not make it right

Just because Wikipedia does it does not make it okay. It can be edited by people with different agendas or biases.

Just check out all the debate and argument on the talk page on Gloria Hemingway, the transgender daughter of Ernest Hemingway, to see this at its ugliest.

That said, I don’t see it. They say she was “born as” but never call her by her deadname nor refer to her by “he/him/his” that I can see.

[Polybius]

71. With trans celebrities, I am torn

Let's say a male actor in 1989 made a popular movie, and then became a woman in 2005 and changed her name. Should the movie credits be edited to show her current name? If yes, why? Some straight actors change their names as they get famous, but their original TV/movie names are listed when you watch their old stuff (Andrew "Dice" Clay comes to mind).

An even better question: Should the movie even be shown at all again, since she's now a woman? I've heard many say showing someone's pre-transitioning photos/videos is even more disrespectful than deadnaming.

[meadowlander]

72. I'm sure it comes down to who owns the rights to the media.

You don't need a hypothetical, really. This is happening right now with Elliot Page.

He was paid to be in a number of movies and TV shows before transitioning. The person who owns the rights to those TV shows and movies can keep showing and licensing them because that was the agreement Elliot signed when he agreed to make them. It would be nice and polite for the people who own the rights to update the credits where possible if Elliot asked them to but it doesn't sound like he's bothered really. I imagine as long as he keeps getting royalties and isn't having photos shoved in his face to sign, it's probably not that big of a deal.

What causes dysphoria is different for different trans people so I don't think you can make a blanket statement like it's disrespectful to show someone's pre-transitioning photos/videos. It depends on the context and the person. I'd get their permission first (and question the motivations/need to do it) but I don't think its completely taboo especially in "someone else's" photo. It's not like when I finish transitioning I'm going to go to my sister-in-law and make her scrub me out of her wedding photos. I don't love looking at them but it isn't all about me.

Not all trans people need or want to erase their pre-transition history. That's a separate issue to deliberately deadnaming someone who has specifically asked to be called by a different name.

[Oneironaut]

86. Wiki does that for everyone I believe. It also does it for actors/actresses.

Putting a dead name in the article is of public / historic concern. For people who aren’t celebrities, there’s no need to and it’s rude, regardless of what they’ve done.

[Oneironaut]

87. No, as it's hurtful to all trans people.

It would be like saying that it’s ok to call dead shooters who were ethnic minorities ethnic slurs.

[meadowlander]

62. Many on DU struggle with the concept that using a group slur insults the group

and not just the person they are aiming it at. There's a lot of weak justifications for using slurs because "that person is a bad person who deserves it".

[ecstatic]

68. I always refer to mass shooters as shooters

I'm sorry but your post provided way too much info. Since when do we do back flips to worry about what a killer wanted? I don't give a fuck what that child murderer wanted.

[DET]

73. Too tired to go into detail...

…but I think a lot of us found the initial description confusing (a woman with a clearly female name who preferred to be called ‘he/him’). I hope you can cut some slack for those of us who are older and have never encountered a transgendered person or, frankly, even knew that they existed until fairly recently - because they (supposedly) didn’t when we were growing up. Personally, I’m thrilled and amazed that the gay community has gained such rapid acceptance, but transgenderism may be a bridge too far for some people right now. Not saying it’s right, but it may take some time.

[Emile]

75. I call the person a cold blooded murderer!

[Chakaconcarne]

79. Why are you immediately assuming people here are "playing into his fundie Christian parents"?

Give people here a little more credit FFS.

Certainly could have nothing to do with the plethora of conflicting reports at the outset..

Don't try and hold people accountable until the reports have been clear and accurate for a few days.

[Celerity]

80. I never said they were *wilfully* playing into the parents' hands, do not put words in my mouth.

Also it's been multiple days now that it has been cleared up (by the later evening the day of the shooting), to the point there should no more confusion as to what he was identifying as prior to his death.

[maxsolomon]

83. I'm using "they" around my Milllenial daughter.

But in general, rampage killers don't deserve the respect that proper pronouns would confer.

[LeftInTX]

84. Really! It's not like this person was murdered or died

of natural causes.

Trying to sort out the gender and/or wishes of a mass killer who didn't have explicit instructions or social connections is not a priority for me

[meadowlander]

88. It's not about showing respect to the killer. It's about showing respect to all trans people.

Let's say your Millennial daughter is trans and hasn't come out yet or some other family member overhearing the conversation. Your disdain for getting this other person's pronouns and name right tells them that you are not a safe person to come out it. Or worse, it tells them that their boundaries and identity don't matter - that respect for pronouns is something bestowed by you that they have to earn. That's completely ass backwards.

People have a right to assert their identity and to have that respected, regardless of what else they may have done. Aiden is dead and doesn't give a shit if you want to punish him by misgendering him. So all you are really accomplishing is telling the trans people in your life that acceptance of their fundamental identity is conditional.

[maxsolomon]

96. I said I'm using acceptable pronouns. 'They' works for everyone. We're all 'they'.

I've been using preferred pronouns for the trans people in my life since the late 1970s when I first had a trans person in my life.

I get your point, but I don't need a lecture around the topic when it comes to a child murderer.

[treestar]

91. is there any information on the murderer's

preferred pronouns?

That's why this is getting out of hand. You can't control what others think or say. You can only control your own reaction.

And there have been plenty of explanations, so there's no reason to be on a high horse. Nobody on DU would deliberately do that, so DU is not the place to get on a high horse and be better than everyone.

[Celerity]

99. Yes, it has been established for days now that he used he/him, that he was born a biological female

and now identified as a trans man.

It is there in my OP and it has been posted a lot by other posters in thsi and other threads.

for instance



from Tuesday

https://www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/openforum/article/nashville-school-shooting-audrey-hale-trans-17864905.php

[treestar]

100. a lot of people in the thread explained

they had not come across that fact yet, which is still possible. No reason to presume DUers would do it on purpose.

[inthewind21]

101. Oh please

It's been less than three full days. How many times you going to post the linked in and chastise everyone? Newsflash, not everyone runs to social media to check out the proper pro-nouns to use for a murderer. It was reported that a 28 year old Audrey Hale shot and killed 3 kids and 3 adults. That's all I need to know.

[Celerity]

104. I wasn't the one who posted the LinkedIn in this thread initially, that was another poster.

I just borrowed it an hour or so ago, from the other poster as it was the first thing found (that I know of) that showed the he/him pronouns, and it was posted here back on Monday, the day of the shooting.