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kentuck

(111,111 posts)
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 06:54 AM Sep 2022

The five basic principles set forth in the Preamble to the Constitution

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

(You will note that the very first objective is to "establish Justice". )

8 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Samrob

(4,298 posts)
1. What, exactly, is the weight of the Preamble in Constitutional litigations?
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 06:59 AM
Sep 2022

Does it carry legal weight?

DFW

(54,680 posts)
3. Beware of abuse of the second clause
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 07:08 AM
Sep 2022

"insure domestic tranquility"

From "Der Rattenfänger" (The Pied Piper) by Hannes Wader

Es geschah was heute noch immer geschieht, wo Ruhe mehr gilt als Recht
Denn wo die Herrschenden Ruhe wollen, geht's den Beherrschten schlecht

It happened like it still happens today, where calm is more important than justice
Because when the rulers want calm, those who are ruled don't do so well

kentuck

(111,111 posts)
4. Yes.
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 07:23 AM
Sep 2022

That is why the "people" must have control of the military and police forces, so they do not run rampant over the rights of its citizens. (Civilian control)

DFW

(54,680 posts)
6. In theory, I agree
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 08:01 AM
Sep 2022

And yet, over here, ever since the defeat of the Axis powers, it has been the "People's Republics" that have been the worst offenders of just that. The slogans aren't enough. Benevolent control over the military, and, especially, the police is an absolute necessity.

ariadne0614

(1,757 posts)
5. Abuse is unlikely as long as the other principles are maintained.
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 07:37 AM
Sep 2022

It seems to me that domestic tranquility flows naturally from the establishment of Justice, promotion of the general Welfare, and provision of the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity.

DFW

(54,680 posts)
7. Justice, general welfare, and liberty--three things the Republicans fight against tooth and nail.
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 08:06 AM
Sep 2022

All of it must be constantly fought for. The Constitution gives the guideline, but it only works if there is benevolent power that is willing to enforce it. One has only to look at the Trump presidency to see what happens to us when that enforcement is deliberately abandoned.

ariadne0614

(1,757 posts)
8. Yes, and the bad actors can only succeed when the electorate is uninformed and disengaged.
Thu Sep 15, 2022, 10:14 AM
Sep 2022

Decades of a Republican assault on public education set us up for this moment. If I were queen of America, we would be teaching effective citizenship from K-12. Age-appropriate civics would be imbedded in the core curriculum, and a high school diploma would include automatic voter registration.

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