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Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:43 PM Jun 2022

Vice Presidents are so frustrating. They can't or dont

speak their minds. And they recoil at anything that could be controversial Seems like such a waste of opinion and talent. All across the board, Rs and D's....what a thankless, horrible place it must be?

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Vice Presidents are so frustrating. They can't or dont (Original Post) Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 OP
Which *Democratic* vice presidents are you referring to Ocelot II Jun 2022 #1
Have any? Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #2
Well, you brought it up n/t Just_Vote_Dem Jun 2022 #3
Ok.. I'll research Vice Presidents. Just watched Harris's Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #6
You made the claim; just asking you to back it up, Ocelot II Jun 2022 #5
Wow such a confrontational tone. Jeez Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #8
I'm not being confrontational. You implied that Democratic VPs Ocelot II Jun 2022 #10
Absurd conclusion sorry Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #45
Is this an American thing? Or do other countries Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #4
They all have arrangements for someone to step in if the head of government dies or can't serve. Ocelot II Jun 2022 #9
I'm referring to toeing the Prez's line? Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #27
Well there's a lot to the job... Effete Snob Jun 2022 #33
FDR's VP, Mr. Garner, described his job as "not worth a bucket of warm piss". Another VP, whose Atticus Jun 2022 #7
That has changed significantly since Clinton assigned a lot of duties to Al Gore. Ocelot II Jun 2022 #11
I agree regarding Democratic VPs, but Pence was in the "bucket of warm piss" category. nt Atticus Jun 2022 #16
It actually changed with Carter/Mondale. Beautiful Disaster Jun 2022 #51
Interesting. Think I would hate it having to temper every thought. Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #22
I don't think it's quite like that. 2naSalit Jun 2022 #39
All true. Guess you have to just hope you have a prez who Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #42
Happens on occasion. I would argue Joe spoke his mind Xavier Breath Jun 2022 #12
Joe spoke his mind and on occasion...Obama was pissed too. Demsrule86 Jun 2022 #14
Cheney Was A De Facto President For 8 Years nt SoCalDavidS Jun 2022 #13
Yes!!!! Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #23
Which VP are you referring to? mcar Jun 2022 #15
Post removed Post removed Jun 2022 #18
You mean like VP Biden taking a stand on marriage equality on national TV? speak easy Jun 2022 #17
You are saying Obama was against marriage equality? Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #25
That's exactly what VP Biden did - forcing President Obama to change his thinking and take a stand Rhiannon12866 Jun 2022 #32
Don't agree at all. It was a matter of timing and politics. Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #43
This message was self-deleted by its author speak easy Jun 2022 #49
This message was self-deleted by its author speak easy Jun 2022 #50
This message was self-deleted by its author speak easy Jun 2022 #52
Al Gore, Walter Mondale, Joe Biden, Kamala Harris?? Rhiannon12866 Jun 2022 #19
Prevented from speaking out 100% different than speaking out. But maybe Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #29
Jimmy Carter changed the status of the U.S. VP Rhiannon12866 Jun 2022 #30
Perhaps this importance of a VP has been grossly underplayed? Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #34
VP Biden led the fight for marriage equality causing President Obama to change his mind Rhiannon12866 Jun 2022 #35
Perhaps the timing of taking a stand, not sold on changing mind. Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #44
Yes. I imagine it must be an infinitely frustrating job. Scrivener7 Jun 2022 #20
Yup.. extremely careful dance you have to play Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #24
Did you miss the Clinton and Obama presidencies? TwilightZone Jun 2022 #21
Yes was in a coma Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #28
Lol Effete Snob Jun 2022 #31
Wow. Impressed you dug that up!!! Think it would be really Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #36
Winning the election Effete Snob Jun 2022 #38
If I could guess, it would be youth and inexperience coupled Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #40
And of course the obvious, that he is white. But what Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #41
All across the board ? This hasn't been the case since Gore became JI7 Jun 2022 #26
Perfect example! He was picked to appease the religious wingnuts Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #37
Trump didn't need to appease the religious right. They were Trump's base JI7 Jun 2022 #46
Both. He picked him primarily to attract Evangelicals plus Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #47
He didn't need to attract evangelicals. Evangelicals voted for Trump in the Primary JI7 Jun 2022 #48
Evidently he and his advisors disagree. Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2022 #54
There's some truth to that Patton French Jun 2022 #53

Ocelot II

(116,520 posts)
1. Which *Democratic* vice presidents are you referring to
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:46 PM
Jun 2022

who can't or don't speak their minds and recoil at anything that could be controversial?

Ocelot II

(116,520 posts)
5. You made the claim; just asking you to back it up,
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:50 PM
Jun 2022

keeping in mind that vice presidents have exactly zero constitutional power other than to act as understudy for an incapacitated or dead president. IIRC, all the Democratic VPs in recent times have been very active and influential, so which ones do you think were not?

Ocelot II

(116,520 posts)
10. I'm not being confrontational. You implied that Democratic VPs
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:55 PM
Jun 2022

weren't doing anything and I just asked for names because I don't think it's true.

Ocelot II

(116,520 posts)
9. They all have arrangements for someone to step in if the head of government dies or can't serve.
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:53 PM
Jun 2022

In most parliamentary systems it's the deputy prime minister. In the UK the Queen would appoint an acting PM until someone could be elected.

Atticus

(15,124 posts)
7. FDR's VP, Mr. Garner, described his job as "not worth a bucket of warm piss". Another VP, whose
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:51 PM
Jun 2022

name eludes me, characterized the position as "inside work with no heavy lifting".

Ocelot II

(116,520 posts)
11. That has changed significantly since Clinton assigned a lot of duties to Al Gore.
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:56 PM
Jun 2022

Now VPs have a lot of work to do besides attend state funerals. Obama kept Biden very busy.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
22. Interesting. Think I would hate it having to temper every thought.
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:37 PM
Jun 2022

Guess you just assume the opinions and positions of your prez and relegate your own and carry on. Seems kind of crazy since many VPs go on to run for Prez themselves. Then...they are caught in a dilemma... Express their own if different? or diss their own Prez..

2naSalit

(87,670 posts)
39. I don't think it's quite like that.
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:54 PM
Jun 2022

In these current times it has become necessary for the VP to be visible yet support the agenda of the president. And that is what we will see from VP Harris in public.

That is her job and she knew it when she agreed to do it, but that's the visible side of the job.

What you don't see, partly because the news does not cover it, is the work she does behind the scenes.

She's not there to be the star of the show, she's there to support the president and his agenda AND offer advice which is when she offers her opinion, to the president, in the Oval Office, after briefings. And that, too, is her job.

In more common layman's terms you might think of her job description, in the private sector, as executive administrative assistant; executive envoy/liaison internationally. Which is quite a handful along with her duties in the Senate and tasks I can't think of at the moment.

She just isn't on the teevee very often and she shouldn't have to be.


 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
42. All true. Guess you have to just hope you have a prez who
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:45 PM
Jun 2022

will unequivocally stand up for you once it's all said and done? And the degree of enthusiasm in that endorsement is a direct clue as to why you picked that person to begin with?

Xavier Breath

(3,779 posts)
12. Happens on occasion. I would argue Joe spoke his mind
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:00 PM
Jun 2022

that one time about same sex marriage and it seemed to catch the WH a bit off guard.

Response to mcar (Reply #15)

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
43. Don't agree at all. It was a matter of timing and politics.
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:56 PM
Jun 2022

Obama, as president was much more politically aware than Biden. Which says good things about Joe. But to conclude that Biden caused Obama to change his mind ( other than timing of announcement). ... Not sold on that, sorry.

Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #43)

Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #43)

Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #43)

Rhiannon12866

(209,140 posts)
19. Al Gore, Walter Mondale, Joe Biden, Kamala Harris??
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:16 PM
Jun 2022

No Democrats that I can remember were prevented from speaking out. Same with Dick Cheney, yikes! It's only been true for Mike Pence - till now.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
29. Prevented from speaking out 100% different than speaking out. But maybe
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:00 PM
Jun 2022

they just agree?? Cheney definitely an anomaly. But he had an affable yet very dim prez. He probably quickly realized he could take charge and manipulate the prez

Rhiannon12866

(209,140 posts)
30. Jimmy Carter changed the status of the U.S. VP
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:04 PM
Jun 2022

Vice President Mondale had an office right near the POTUS, in the middle of the action, and had his own independent responsibilities. And that's been the case ever since.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
34. Perhaps this importance of a VP has been grossly underplayed?
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:30 PM
Jun 2022

In my mind, they have to toe the line, in general, with perhaps an exception or two. Seems like a constricted thankless job... But then your reward is that you get to be the heir apparent. Guess it totally works if you agree all the time.

TwilightZone

(25,668 posts)
21. Did you miss the Clinton and Obama presidencies?
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:17 PM
Jun 2022

Gore and Biden were heavily involved in their respective administrations and were quite vocal.

As for Rs, as others noted, Cheney was the de-facto president for eight years.

 

Effete Snob

(8,387 posts)
31. Lol
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:24 PM
Jun 2022

The VP’s Constitutional role is really minor. Yes there have been varying degrees of “giving them stuff to do”, but it varies.

Nixon played up the importance of his role in the Eisenhower administration.

This is what Eisenhower had to say.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
36. Wow. Impressed you dug that up!!! Think it would be really
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:43 PM
Jun 2022

interesting to know exactly why people picked a particular VP. Probably unlikely there'd be an honest comment tho. My guess would be that "thinks just like me" might be below other criteria? Guess you can tell based on how big and sincere their praise & recognition is?

 

Effete Snob

(8,387 posts)
38. Winning the election
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:53 PM
Jun 2022

Does this pick help me among voters in some area where I’m weak?

The president can choose a cabinet and seek advice from whomever he or she wants. If the VP is also worth consulting, great, but you have to win the election.

Joe Biden might be one counterexample, since electoral considerations didn’t seem to favor him as a pick.
 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
41. And of course the obvious, that he is white. But what
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:07 PM
Jun 2022

About Hillary? Why did she pick her VP? Tim Kaine? For VA?

JI7

(89,368 posts)
26. All across the board ? This hasn't been the case since Gore became
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:45 PM
Jun 2022

VP. It's only Pence who has been useless but those were unusual circumstances where even the so called president was useless.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
37. Perfect example! He was picked to appease the religious wingnuts
Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:51 PM
Jun 2022

Not because he's simpatico with the criminal murderer FG. Guess we will see .. how far FG goes to support him if it comes to that. Although gleefully watching as people chant to hang him is a very low bar

JI7

(89,368 posts)
46. Trump didn't need to appease the religious right. They were Trump's base
Tue Jun 28, 2022, 12:06 AM
Jun 2022

He picked Pence because he wanted someone that would not overshadow him and would do as he told him to which he did up until the end.

JI7

(89,368 posts)
48. He didn't need to attract evangelicals. Evangelicals voted for Trump in the Primary
Tue Jun 28, 2022, 01:23 AM
Jun 2022

They were his biggest supporters .

Patton French

(828 posts)
53. There's some truth to that
Tue Jun 28, 2022, 08:22 AM
Jun 2022

I suppose they don’t want to contradict or get out ahead of the President, which I can see.

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