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(36,802 posts)
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 08:48 AM Nov 2021

NBC News: Speaker Pelosi told members of House Democratic leadership they will NOT leave Washington

NBC News: Speaker Pelosi told members of House Democratic leadership they will NOT leave Washington for Thanksgiving without passing the Build Back Better Act. @NBCNews

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NBC News: Speaker Pelosi told members of House Democratic leadership they will NOT leave Washington (Original Post) demmiblue Nov 2021 OP
All Recs and No Kicks Make Jack a Dull Boy American Interregnum Nov 2021 #1
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Nov 2021 #5
Point chin! dchill Nov 2021 #15
Thanks for making sure the OP got a kick.We cover a lot of time zones at DU, & it went up before 5am Hekate Nov 2021 #22
Too bad manchin and sinema aren't in the house mucifer Nov 2021 #2
Manchin and Sinema are not blocking a vote in the House, and we should be reminded.... George II Nov 2021 #4
One more time, and it's really simple, FoxNewsSucks Nov 2021 #11
Bills should be voted on individually. The House did what it SHOULD have done oldsoftie Nov 2021 #30
Wrong. FoxNewsSucks Nov 2021 #31
Oh, they will pass the bill...with the right sugar... TiberiusB Nov 2021 #32
I'm looking towards the '22 elections. And it isnt looking good. oldsoftie Nov 2021 #34
Uh, no TiberiusB Nov 2021 #33
Bad choice of words. "EVERYTHING" should never be used when referring to ANY bill! oldsoftie Nov 2021 #35
Because they are the ones obstructing progress. Gore1FL Nov 2021 #13
because reality TiberiusB Nov 2021 #16
I heard it was 50 GOP Senators blocking BBB. DiamondShark Nov 2021 #25
Why is this a problem? gab13by13 Nov 2021 #3
Not that simple at all unfortunately, as I have warned for ages. Celerity Nov 2021 #20
Exactly TiberiusB Nov 2021 #27
Thank you Madam Speaker mcar Nov 2021 #6
Yes! Go get 'em, Nancy! lagomorph777 Nov 2021 #7
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Nov 2021 #8
IOW: Let's stop pissing around. triron Nov 2021 #9
Not sure if the matters since Manchin/Sinema will hold it up in senate. Nt helpisontheway Nov 2021 #10
It matters, because it needs to be made crystal-clear FoxNewsSucks Nov 2021 #12
No pumpkin pie for you! And you and you and you... Ilsa Nov 2021 #14
This is peer pressure at its finest FakeNoose Nov 2021 #17
What the actual fuck, I thought it was already fucking signed. BannonsLiver Nov 2021 #18
That was the bipartisan infrastructure bill. Elessar Zappa Nov 2021 #19
Nancy Pelosi rocks Hekate Nov 2021 #21
Do your work or no dinner. Love it. Evolve Dammit Nov 2021 #23
There is a reason Nancy Pelosi is our most successful House leader ever. BlueIdaho Nov 2021 #24
A Promised Land lakercub Nov 2021 #26
Tough RayStar Nov 2021 #28
K&R Blue Owl Nov 2021 #29
1. All Recs and No Kicks Make Jack a Dull Boy
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 09:05 AM
Nov 2021

And no, I am NOT referencing The Shining, Kook Kubrick's celluloid defecation!

Response to American Interregnum (Reply #1)


(90,469 posts)
22. Thanks for making sure the OP got a kick.We cover a lot of time zones at DU, & it went up before 5am
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 12:42 PM
Nov 2021

… my time.


(23,444 posts)
2. Too bad manchin and sinema aren't in the house
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 09:26 AM
Nov 2021

they are the ones blocking the bill

Still I'm recommending the post and glad Pelosi is doing what she can.

George II

(67,782 posts)
4. Manchin and Sinema are not blocking a vote in the House, and we should be reminded....
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 09:40 AM
Nov 2021

...they BOTH voted for the recently passed BIF (and signed yesterday), whereas some House Democrats did not vote for it.

For that matter, those two Democratic Senators are not blocking the bill in the Senate, either.

Why are they consistently being bashed here while other Democrats who actually HAVE voted against Biden's bill and his agenda get a free pass?


(10,402 posts)
11. One more time, and it's really simple,
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 11:10 AM
Nov 2021

The House Dems who voted against the BIF did so because Manchin/Sinema keep going back on the agreement to pass the entire package, despite progressives constantly being expected to compromise and give in while conservadems never do. Their vote DID NOT keep it from passing, had that been the case I expect Pelosi would not have let them vote against it.

Manchin/Sinema on the other hand, ARE keeping the BBB from passing. Unlike everyone else, they move goalposts and in Sinema's case refuse to clearly state what she wants. Although, their weaseling and changing do make it clear what they're working for, and it's not Biden or us.

Progressives, from The Squad to Sanders, have worked their asses off supporting Biden and the total BBB package. Manchin/Sinema are working against Biden, and frankly AGAINST Democratic values.

That is why.


(12,475 posts)
30. Bills should be voted on individually. The House did what it SHOULD have done
Wed Nov 17, 2021, 08:03 AM
Nov 2021

And holding up passed legislation that included GOP votes just gives the RW even MORE ammo to throw at the Democrats. "We compromised and they STILL want more"
Any House democrat who voted "no" on that bill, with Marjorie Taylor Greene, should be ashamed. Everything in it is good for the country and it gives the President a major win


(10,402 posts)
31. Wrong.
Wed Nov 17, 2021, 10:45 AM
Nov 2021

Traitor Greene has nothing to do with this. Other than making a braying spectacle of herself I don't think anyone is more irrelevant than her.

If conservadems could have been trusted, the bills would never have been linked. Turns out, it was probably necessary. Mark my words, conservative corporate dems are going to kill the BBB.

I suggest reviewing all the events leading up to this vote, not just the most recent "Problem Causer" issued talking point.

I also suggest everyone stop worrying what the RW will squeal about. No matter what Democrats do, they will lie, scream and fling feces anyway, so who gives a damn what they say.

And as far as this: "We compromised and they STILL want more" , that is EXACTLY what progressives are saying about conservadems. Because it's the uncomfortable truth.


(12,475 posts)
34. I'm looking towards the '22 elections. And it isnt looking good.
Wed Nov 17, 2021, 03:26 PM
Nov 2021

Getting the infrastructure bill passed will fund major projects the people back home will be told about in short order. This will help offset the inflation/gas price double whammy that is going to be put at the foot of the Democrats. Deserved or not, the party in power gets the credit & the blame for stuff like that.
Insisting that EVERYTHING be passed or nothing is ridiculous & just what the GOP does.


(485 posts)
33. Uh, no
Wed Nov 17, 2021, 03:14 PM
Nov 2021

Everything in that bill is decidedly NOT good.

Only 550 billion, less than half, is new spending, making the 1.2 trillion claim a bit of a stretch.

There are oil and gas tax breaks, public private partnerships (aka corporate giveaways of public infrastructure), etc., and no new revenue from tax changes to the rich or corporations to pay for it.

I get the pom pom waving, but let's not oversell a heavily compromised bit of legislation.


(12,475 posts)
35. Bad choice of words. "EVERYTHING" should never be used when referring to ANY bill!
Wed Nov 17, 2021, 03:36 PM
Nov 2021

Unless its a bill with only ONE item in it. How often does that happen? I think it should happen more often. Like a bill to let Medicare negotiate prices. Why not have a bill with JUST that in it? Let anyone who votes against it explain WHY


(21,083 posts)
13. Because they are the ones obstructing progress.
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 11:13 AM
Nov 2021

The progressive House members that you proactively find reasons to complain about that voted against did so knowing the legislation would pass, but wanted to express their disappointment on how it came to the floor. You either know that and are being disingenuous or fall easily for the propaganda of disingenuous people.


(485 posts)
16. because reality
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 11:26 AM
Nov 2021

If they were so ready to vote for the bill, why didn't it get ratified ages ago? All the negotiations have been with Manchin and, to a lesser degree, Sinema. That is, unless you think Biden secretly wanted to strip out all corporate tax increases, paid family leave, climate change provisions, drug pricing reform, and so on, and just needed convenient scapegoats.
Also, it's not just Manchin and Sinema, though they are clearly the face of the opposition. These Dems have also come out against elements of BBB, most notably drug pricing (Gottheimer is particularly vocal on a number of issues):

Kathleen Rice of New York
Scott Peters of California
Kurt Schrader of Oregon
Josh Gottheimer of New Jersey
Carolyn Bourdeaux of Georgia
Filemon Vela of Texas
Henry Cuellar of Texas
Ed Case of Hawaii
Kurt Schrader of Oregon
Jared Golden of Maine
Vicente Gonzalez of Texas
Jim Costa of California

The progressives in the House were fighting FOR the BBB bill and were holding up the BIF to increase pressure to get them BOTH passed. This is incredibly old news. The White House and Pelosi all agreed and came out insisting they would pass them together. Then Biden's numbers began tanking and inflation came roaring into the picture, so they abandoned their promise and pressured Jayapal to get on board and get BIF passed. The hope was clearly to turn around the news cycle and have something to campaign on in 2022.

If Manchin and Sinema hadn't obstructed BBB passage, do you think we would be where we are today? Do you genuinely think that the progressive caucus would still be blocking the BBB act by blocking BIF right now?

This has all been going on for MONTHS and everyone knows who the real roadblocks are and who is fighting for the 99%. Let's not pretend otherwise.


(21,199 posts)
3. Why is this a problem?
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 09:27 AM
Nov 2021

I thought there were only a handful of moderate Democrats who were opposing BBB? I also thought that Speaker Pelosi had them under control? They got the infrastructure bill voted on first which was what they wanted so they should vote yeas on BBB now.


(43,025 posts)
20. Not that simple at all unfortunately, as I have warned for ages.
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 11:49 AM
Nov 2021

The 13 renegade (13 total stretched out over months, it is hard to gauge what all 13 will do) House centrists and conservadem Blue Dog/Problem Solver types (plus Manchin and Sinema in the Senate) are demanding that the CBO scoring (which is due to be published this Friday, November 19th) match the Biden claim that the BBB pays for itself.

Preliminary individual releases, plus a claim on MoJo by the pretty reliably sussed-in Axios would tend to say that it will not match, that it will add to the debt.

Gottheimer (the Problem Solver ringleader) said this a week ago:

Gottheimer Won’t Commit To Backing BBB If CBO Score Doesn’t Match WH Analysis


sooooo, if the CBO comes back with bad numbers, expect the shit to hit the fan again (and expect the BBB to get gutted even more)

The rank hypocrisy of the 15 conservadems is that almost half of the new spend (of the $550 billion, $256 billion is unpaid for) in their beloved BIF is NOT paid for.

Plus, so far, they have, between the 2 versions (House and Senate), ripped out out over $2 trillion in funding mechanisms and/or given giant tax breaks back (mostly to the wealthiest Americans and the giant corporations)

That $2 trillion in ripped out funding and tax breaks for the rich and for the powerful firms is more than the entire present topline number ($1.75 trillion) for the whole BBB. You know, the one they now have this incredible concern for 'fiscal responsibly' about.

And people wonder why many in Congress do not trust Manchin, Sinema, and the Problem Solver/Blue Dogs.

IF that CBO shows a number (for added debt) over what the BIF added, there is likely going to be an all-out brawl. Regardless of the meaningless six protest votes that did nothing to stop the BIF, the progressives have compromised, and compromised for ages. 90 of the 96 voted to pass BIF, and if zero Rethugs have voted yes, 3 of those prog No votes (maybe all 6) would have flipped to Yes in order to pass it.

The progs have compromised (dollar wise) 30.8 times MORE than Manchin and Sinema have. They have come down $7.7 trillion between the two bills, whilst Manchinema have (and this is only as of now, it could easily be nothing or even another slashing) moved up only $250 billion (and only on the BBB, they gutted the BIF by almost 80% new spend wise).

I can see, if the CBO numbers are bad, Manchin further gutting the BBB, down to $1.25 trillion or even his original 'claim' of $1 trillion, and saying 'That is it, it is $1.25 (or even $1) trillion, take it or leave it, AND keep pushing it AND pushing ME, and I scuttle the whole thing.'

Let's hope the CBO says the BBB is all paid for.

IF it does, then any other objections, and especially ANY further gutting and/or blockage from the conservadems TRULY confirm, to a level no one can argue, that they ALWAYS were wreckers and ruiners of the Biden Agenda, all gaslighting attempts to deny it aside.


(485 posts)
27. Exactly
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 08:32 PM
Nov 2021

The Dems are their own worst enemy here. There is always a new excuse to oppose legislation with any hope of improving the lives of ordinary citizens that might take even a penny out of the pockets of the rich and powerful. Again, you have to wonder just how sweet the deals are in the BIF bill to get it passed so easily WITHOUT reconciliation.

And the CBO won't say the bill is paid for.


Apparently, collecting hundreds of billions in unpaid taxes doesn't count as revenue.

Response to demmiblue (Original post)


(10,402 posts)
12. It matters, because it needs to be made crystal-clear
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 11:11 AM
Nov 2021

who is causing the problem.

Progressives are working FOR Americans, and supporting Biden. Certain corporate Senators are not.


(659 posts)
26. A Promised Land
Tue Nov 16, 2021, 06:46 PM
Nov 2021

I've been listening to Obama read his book, A Promised Land, on Audible and every time he talks about Pelosi you just want to smile if you're a Dem.

I've been guilty in the past of thinking she might be part of some problems, but I'm taking it back...she takes the crap from the right, the press, and even her own party and still gets done what she feels needs to get done. She is constantly herding cats, but when it's time to herd...she herds. Hearing Obama talk about how Nancy just got the job done even if she wasn't thrilled when it came to the bailouts and the ACA, you can't help but be impressed. Obama certainly was. Nancy Pelosi stays on target and gets things done. I hope she can do it again.

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