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Joyce Vance on Carroll lawsuit (Original Post) cilla4progress Jun 2021 OP
The decision is a Sur Zobra Jun 2021 #1
Are Trump appointees holding people hostages in the DOJ building? dalton99a Jun 2021 #2
DOJ's argument really isn't about Trump StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #3
And it's a defense of his words while in office... zaj Jun 2021 #4
Hmmm, who is to decide if Putin's Whore "was acting within the scope of [their] office" ... uponit7771 Jun 2021 #5
A judge will decide. StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #9
So we are more concerned about frivolous law suits gab13by13 Jun 2021 #7
No. StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #10
Looks like DOJ is obligated under Westfall Act to defend Putin's Whore only until it's decided uponit7771 Jun 2021 #6
Didn't a federal judge already determine gab13by13 Jun 2021 #8
It was a trial court judge but the case in now on appeal. StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #12
Hmmm, the judge determining whether Feds should be involved makes this more non partisan. FG45 ... uponit7771 Jun 2021 #13
Yes StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #11
DOJ should not be acting as Trump's personal lawyer. lagomorph777 Jun 2021 #14
They're not StarfishSaver Jun 2021 #15
Even worse! lagomorph777 Jun 2021 #16

dalton99a

(81,780 posts)
2. Are Trump appointees holding people hostages in the DOJ building?
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 01:49 AM
Jun 2021

Bizarre and disappointing.

Disgusting, actually


 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
3. DOJ's argument really isn't about Trump
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 02:08 AM
Jun 2021

It's about the Westfall Act's application to government employees.

I doubt the court will accept this argument in this case, but it's important that they make it. If they don't raise this here, they will have a hard time raising it in the future in cases much less odious than Trump's. For example, if (when) Trump or his henchmen sue Biden or Harris for something they say and do, DOJ would be hard-pressed to push back on it if they didn't raise this argument in this case.

 

zaj

(3,433 posts)
4. And it's a defense of his words while in office...
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 02:58 AM
Jun 2021

... Which is far different than a defense of his actions before he was in office.

uponit7771

(90,380 posts)
5. Hmmm, who is to decide if Putin's Whore "was acting within the scope of [their] office" ...
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 06:50 AM
Jun 2021

... when he slandered someone while he was president?

Benedict Donald was keen to use every single damn loophole he could so he could do the wrong thing

gab13by13

(21,611 posts)
7. So we are more concerned about frivolous law suits
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 07:54 AM
Jun 2021

against an honest president meanwhile there is the flip side of that coin. A criminal president can act with impunity knowing that he can't be prosecuted while president for his blatant criminal behavior.

Sorry but I'm with the federal judge and Joyce Vance on this one.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
10. No.
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 10:10 AM
Jun 2021

No one - not even DOJ - is claiming a criminal president can act with impunity. DOJ will not make that decision - a judge will decide whether the act applies to Trump in this case

I understand why some people don't understand it because it's a complicated area of the law and even lawyers disagree about it. But in this instance, I'm going with Attorney General Merrick Garland, a brilliant, thoughtful and ethical jurist and attorney, over Joyce Vance, who is not in his position, doesn't have the information the AG has, didn't participate in the discussions and decisionmaking that led to this option, and isn't responsible for future cases that could be impacted by how this case is handled.

uponit7771

(90,380 posts)
6. Looks like DOJ is obligated under Westfall Act to defend Putin's Whore only until it's decided
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 06:55 AM
Jun 2021

... that he didn't act in within the scope of his office when he slandered someone while president.

We'll see, I do think the DOJ out to explain this ... its an easy explanation

gab13by13

(21,611 posts)
8. Didn't a federal judge already determine
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 07:57 AM
Jun 2021

that the DOJ should not get involved? I realize I am slow but why can't DOJ simply say, sorry a federal judge made the determination. Why does DOJ have to say the federal judge was wrong?

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
12. It was a trial court judge but the case in now on appeal.
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 10:11 AM
Jun 2021

The final determination has not yet been made.

uponit7771

(90,380 posts)
13. Hmmm, the judge determining whether Feds should be involved makes this more non partisan. FG45 ...
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 11:08 AM
Jun 2021

... crimes made crap more complicated than need be

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
14. DOJ should not be acting as Trump's personal lawyer.
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 11:18 AM
Jun 2021

This is disgraceful. The case is clearly not related to his presiduncial doodies.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
15. They're not
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 11:51 AM
Jun 2021

They would not be his personal lawyer. They would be substituted as the defendant.

I don't think that's going to happen, however.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
16. Even worse!
Tue Jun 8, 2021, 12:12 PM
Jun 2021

I hope SCROTUS blows this nonsense out of the water.

Seems like a longshot though, with the packed court.

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