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The CDC updated mask guidance was exactly the right move. (Original Post) BGBD May 2021 OP
yes, we KNOW how effective the vaccines are Skittles May 2021 #1
For those of us vaccinated Karma13612 May 2021 #18
While you do, so won't many of the unvaxed boston bean May 2021 #25
I dont understand your comment. vanlassie May 2021 #33
My beef is with the CDC boston bean May 2021 #34
Agree. I'm concerned for the unvaccinated and especially... Kahuna May 2021 #41
easy to do when we actually care about others Skittles May 2021 #42
It's a little soon to say, the heck with those who aren't yet vaccinated. nt Kahuna May 2021 #44
I care about the people who have to take care of those sick folk Skittles May 2021 #45
This Kahuna May 2021 #46
How can it be an incentive for more vaccinations if anyone can just say their vaccinated? SunSeeker May 2021 #2
just wear your mask a little longer..it's the only way you can protect you... diverdownjt May 2021 #5
No... the vaccine is "the way that you can protect you" FBaggins May 2021 #10
Because there are still people Dorian Gray May 2021 #13
That 36 is going to rise quickly... lame54 May 2021 #30
Problem is, the rate of vaccination dropped like a rock after the J&J vaccine pause. SunSeeker May 2021 #32
This message was self-deleted by its author ronlyons May 2021 #3
Honestly, I thought that once 55+ were vaccinated (or refused the option of vaccination) in a state, ronlyons May 2021 #4
Your opinion isn't informed by science DesertRat May 2021 #28
strange how you fail to mention the COMPLETE LACK OF LEADERSHIP from the top Skittles May 2021 #43
I agree. I see more people wearing masks in JoanofArgh May 2021 #6
Reverse psychology... lame54 May 2021 #31
I'll be wearing my mask a little while longer when around groups 2naSalit May 2021 #7
We still have an indoor mask mandate in New York Dorian Gray May 2021 #14
Most states no longer have it. cinematicdiversions May 2021 #23
Yikes.... Dorian Gray May 2021 #26
Arizona has never had a state wide mandate DesertRat May 2021 #29
Nurse union condemns CDC decision cause they'll be dealing with maskholes post holiday surge uponit7771 May 2021 #8
Yes, they are probably concerned with increased hospitalizations and limited resources LeftInTX May 2021 #15
Yes. I'm sure that the unmasked/unvaccinated are the ones primarily at risk from here on out, tanyev May 2021 #16
How does masking vaxed "dead enders" help the unvaxed? vanlassie May 2021 #35
Required masking helped the unvaxed. tanyev May 2021 #36
So this thought process is "if the rest of us wear masks, the unvaxed will feel OK to vanlassie May 2021 #38
No, the thought process is "if everyone is required to wear masks in certain places, tanyev May 2021 #39
Got it. Someone needs to make sure, since they have shit for brains, vanlassie May 2021 #40
The rate of new hospitalizations have declined 76% from their peak in Jan. Yavin4 May 2021 #21
at this point, you can protect yourself w/o a mask. mopinko May 2021 #9
You mean those 0-11 year old assholes? Who have no choice? Ms. Toad May 2021 #48
No, it is not the right move. How many deaths are acceptable?? 58Sunliner May 2021 #11
The vaccine is available to every american from age 12 Karma13612 May 2021 #19
"I am trying to think of another analogy..." Try smoking cigarettes. Yavin4 May 2021 #22
This message was self-deleted by its author Maxheader May 2021 #12
Should've added guidance for operators of buildings where lots of vaccination statuses are unknown sciencescience May 2021 #17
Other experts disagree Doc Sportello May 2021 #20
A correct decision dalton99a May 2021 #24
K&R DesertRat May 2021 #27
I'll probably wear mine until Mr.Bill May 2021 #37
Great post. I'm glad I stumbled upon this. Bookmarking. Thanks. ❤ littlemissmartypants May 2021 #47

Skittles

(154,627 posts)
1. yes, we KNOW how effective the vaccines are
Sun May 16, 2021, 04:39 AM
May 2021

we also know a great percentage of people are NOT vaccinated

this is TOO SOON

Karma13612

(4,584 posts)
18. For those of us vaccinated
Sun May 16, 2021, 09:48 AM
May 2021

We are safe. We are at low risk of getting infected and transmission, according to science.

For those without vaccination, they are unsafe. If they choose to remain maskless/unvaccinated, they are causing themselves unnecessary harm.

I am happy to relax my mask use in public in uncongested indoor settings. I will continue to mask in hospitals and pharmacies. I have always gone maskless in rural low-populated areas like hiking trails and parking lots to and from big box stores.



vanlassie

(5,755 posts)
33. I dont understand your comment.
Sun May 16, 2021, 02:23 PM
May 2021

We should do what because of the unvaxed? Keep masking even tho we can’t transmit?

Skittles

(154,627 posts)
45. I care about the people who have to take care of those sick folk
Sun May 16, 2021, 08:34 PM
May 2021

the goal was never to stop masking, it's to try to contain a pandemic

SunSeeker

(52,390 posts)
2. How can it be an incentive for more vaccinations if anyone can just say their vaccinated?
Sun May 16, 2021, 04:40 AM
May 2021

If the 36% of Americans who are vaccinated can go in public without masks, how will we tell them apart from the 64% who are unvaccinated but are just ignoring the mask mandate?

FBaggins

(27,250 posts)
10. No... the vaccine is "the way that you can protect you"
Sun May 16, 2021, 07:33 AM
May 2021

The remaining risk of any significance is both from and to those who remain unvaccinated.

The only good rationale for the vaccinated to continue to wear masks is to encourage it among the unvaccinated... and it’s reasonable to say that’s enough of a reason... but it’s also reasonable to say that it isn’t a good enough reason to drive mandatory public policy.

Dorian Gray

(13,629 posts)
13. Because there are still people
Sun May 16, 2021, 08:07 AM
May 2021

who were afraid to get the vaccine, but they're also afraid to get covid. I know a few of them. Their anxiety allowed them to delay. This should move the needle. The fear of getting covid.

SunSeeker

(52,390 posts)
32. Problem is, the rate of vaccination dropped like a rock after the J&J vaccine pause.
Sun May 16, 2021, 02:19 PM
May 2021

As of May 16,  47% Americans have received at least one shot, but we're not vaccinating nearly as much as we were last month.

Just before the pause, vaccination rates had jumped to 4 million a day. Now we are vaccinating less than 2 million per day, and the rate continues to drop.





https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/health/covid-vaccine-states-distribution-doses/

Response to BGBD (Original post)

ronlyons

(3 posts)
4. Honestly, I thought that once 55+ were vaccinated (or refused the option of vaccination) in a state,
Sun May 16, 2021, 05:18 AM
May 2021

The mask mandates then should have been lifted for everybody, regardless of age.

That group was always 90+% of deaths from the virus.

In fact, I think that would have sent a message from the beginning that the vaccines were effective, and encouraged younger people to get the vaccine. (Even though they would be no reward for them doing so.)

Instead, we ended up with a situation where Fauci and the CDC themselves were practically raising doubts about the vaccines for months. And then, one day, completely without warning, they reverse themselves. Do you think people are going to trust the reversal?


Now we've got a situation where not only do people have no reward for getting the vaccine (they can lie), but they don't trust the effectiveness of the vaccines either.

JoanofArgh

(14,971 posts)
6. I agree. I see more people wearing masks in
Sun May 16, 2021, 06:12 AM
May 2021

North and South Carolina than I’ve seen since the pandemic started.

2naSalit

(88,850 posts)
7. I'll be wearing my mask a little while longer when around groups
Sun May 16, 2021, 06:43 AM
May 2021

Or when traveling or in stores as most in my area still require them though it seems to be a mere request anymore.

Dorian Gray

(13,629 posts)
26. Yikes....
Sun May 16, 2021, 12:29 PM
May 2021

yeah. I am used to keeping mask on indoors. I understand why people aren't quite comfortable yet. Hopefully enough people will in our neighboring states to keep the regional infection rate down.

CDC is recommending that schools keep masking in place til end of the school year. At least that's something. I"m sure in NYC masking will be in place in most schools next autumn.

uponit7771

(90,543 posts)
8. Nurse union condemns CDC decision cause they'll be dealing with maskholes post holiday surge
Sun May 16, 2021, 07:16 AM
May 2021

The data on individuals is solid, no spread and really no affect but for the US community as a whole I don't see a surge post memorial day being positive.

I pray I'm wrong but even a surge of > 50,000 among half the population is horrible seeing that's the number we were facing with huge hospitalizations when there was no vaccine at all.

LeftInTX

(27,232 posts)
15. Yes, they are probably concerned with increased hospitalizations and limited resources
Sun May 16, 2021, 08:23 AM
May 2021

Also, if it happens again, we will get mask mandates again.

Generally when authorities get involved with health issues, (issuing mandates etc) it is mostly about "health resources...hospital beds etc", versus individual health.

tanyev

(43,116 posts)
16. Yes. I'm sure that the unmasked/unvaccinated are the ones primarily at risk from here on out,
Sun May 16, 2021, 08:55 AM
May 2021

but we've got a lot of exhausted health care workers that will still have to deal with them.

vanlassie

(5,755 posts)
35. How does masking vaxed "dead enders" help the unvaxed?
Sun May 16, 2021, 03:21 PM
May 2021

Considering that they are at this point CHOOSING to go unvaxed?

tanyev

(43,116 posts)
36. Required masking helped the unvaxed.
Sun May 16, 2021, 03:49 PM
May 2021

If masking is not required, there is a large segment of the population who will not wear a mask even though they are not vaccinated. I’ve seen a lot of people express the sentiment that they will then get what they deserve, and I understand feeling that way, but our health care workers must surely be sick and tired of having to deal with them.

vanlassie

(5,755 posts)
38. So this thought process is "if the rest of us wear masks, the unvaxed will feel OK to
Sun May 16, 2021, 04:16 PM
May 2021

continue wearing masks?” Where I live, the anti-vaxers are quite deliberate in only placing masks over their mouths, letting them slip every 20-30 seconds, “forgetting” them under their chins, etc. Frankly I don’t see how my continuing to wear one, properly, is going to help these people. Because I know, from science, that my wearing a mask will not protect others. I have done my part 110%. I will not be in any way implicated in the load on healthcare workers, as I understand it. And I will not be a danger to children, either, by the way. Not according to science, and not even if you believe I can be a good example to stupid people. I have been there done that since day one (March 17 2020 in California.).

tanyev

(43,116 posts)
39. No, the thought process is "if everyone is required to wear masks in certain places,
Sun May 16, 2021, 05:57 PM
May 2021

the anti-masking unvaxed will have to mask up if they want to enter those places.” If it’s left up to the honor system, a small group of unvaxed will comply—mostly those who want to get vaxed but haven’t managed it yet—but there will be a large group of anti-mask unvaxed who will go on as if the pandemic doesn’t exist.

I wish the CDC would have included a state vaccination target with their recommendation. “If your state has reached a 70% vaccination rate, fully vaccinated people may stop wearing masks blah, blah, blah.” That would give governors who are trying to do the right thing a motivational target and it would give businesses in states with governors like mine some cover to keep requiring masks until the target is met.

vanlassie

(5,755 posts)
40. Got it. Someone needs to make sure, since they have shit for brains,
Sun May 16, 2021, 06:07 PM
May 2021

that now, if they think they’re just being oh so clever pretending that they are vaxxed, they are well and truly on their own. (I guess here is where the healthcare system is overtaxed...). Maybe their health insurance should penalize them somehow. Some plans won’t cover self inflicted wounds, for example.

Yavin4

(35,565 posts)
21. The rate of new hospitalizations have declined 76% from their peak in Jan.
Sun May 16, 2021, 10:47 AM
May 2021

And down 13% week over week. It has been a steady decline even among states that have already lifted mask mandates. We did not see any surge after Spring Break in March.


CDC COVID New Hospitalizations Tracker
Current 7-day Average (5/6/2021 to 5/12/2021): 3,956.3
Prior 7-day Average (4/29/2021 to 5/5/2021): 4,556.0
Percent Change: -13.2%

Peak 7-day Average (1/3/2021 to 1/9/2021): 16,578
Percent change from Peak to Current: -76.1%


https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#new-hospital-admissions



mopinko

(70,900 posts)
9. at this point, you can protect yourself w/o a mask.
Sun May 16, 2021, 07:29 AM
May 2021

it gets a lot harder to tell people they have to protect others.
now it's about your own choice to stay safe. let the assholes keep dying.

i dont have a problem wearing one in public, but i'm rly glad to drop it.
my nerves are frayed from the constant threat.

Ms. Toad

(34,710 posts)
48. You mean those 0-11 year old assholes? Who have no choice?
Wed May 26, 2021, 02:22 AM
May 2021

We are not yet at the point at which everyone who wants to be vaccinated is permitted to be vaccinated, so it is our responsibity to protect those who are not yet permitted to be vaccinated.

58Sunliner

(4,741 posts)
11. No, it is not the right move. How many deaths are acceptable??
Sun May 16, 2021, 07:55 AM
May 2021

And it is not going to be just the "unvaccinated", so it's ok. It's about the evolution of a virus as well. As long as it has available bodies, it can and will mutate, potentially into something even more deadly. Masks save lives in many ways. Being vaccinated is to prevent and slow the transmission of a deadly disease. It does not mean we should ignore reality. WTF???????

Karma13612

(4,584 posts)
19. The vaccine is available to every american from age 12
Sun May 16, 2021, 10:04 AM
May 2021

Those that wish to be vaccinated, have the opportunity now, even at walk-in clinics in some areas.

The vaccine, I thought, has been deemed effective even for some of the mutations.

There will always be a chance of getting a virus and we must continue to lead healthy safe lives. But, I will no longer keep worrying and unreasonably altering my lifestyle to accommodate those who willfully choose to not wear a mask or be vaccinated.

It would be like saying that I will not drive on the roads since I could contribute to another person getting in a car accident. I will make sure I will mitigate dangerous driving by not drinking alcohol, and I will drive only according to the rules of the road. But, I will continue driving. I am trying to think of another analogy, but am coming up short at the moment.

For those immunocompromised, they have had threats to their health even prior to this virus. For children less than 12, they have caring parents to make sure they are safe. I thought the younger kids were already deemed not at high risk, and that they did not spread the disease. I have trouble believing that. They should be masked.

There will ALWAYS be another virus that will present itself and it could very well be much worse than COVID. I am not throwing away my masks, and my hand-washing strategy has been my mantra my entire 67 years.





Yavin4

(35,565 posts)
22. "I am trying to think of another analogy..." Try smoking cigarettes.
Sun May 16, 2021, 10:50 AM
May 2021

The government does a lot to mitigate the effects of smoking. Sales tax disincentives. Bans on advertising. Not allowing smoking in buildings. In the end, those that want to smoke are free to do so. The risk that they take is on them.

Response to BGBD (Original post)

Doc Sportello

(7,678 posts)
20. Other experts disagree
Sun May 16, 2021, 10:33 AM
May 2021

Such as former Baltimore Health Commissioner Leana Wen:
"being able to tell people you can get vaccinated, throw away the mask, is a powerful incentive for a lot of individuals. The problem, though, is that only works if it's coupled with some kind of proof of vaccination because if you only have the honor code, you've got some big potential problems here. People who don't want to get vaccinated could just stop wearing masks."

and

"I think what the CDC could have done was to lay out a road map and get us to this ultimate destination through smaller steps. There are actually two really key missing intermediate steps. One is to say fully vaccinated people can be around one another in formal settings. So that paves the way for employers to say, hey, if you're vaccinated, you can come back into the office, be in this conference room together. We can take off our masks, no distancing. It paves the way for restaurants, theaters to say if there's proof of vaccination, we can be here at full capacity. And then the CDC could say once we achieve a societal level of vaccination, whatever that may be, 60%, 70%, then we can remove indoor masking mandates and social distancing. That would have been something for people to look forward to. That would have added an incentive. It also would have been less abrupt because this was so sudden that businesses, local health officials are really reeling because what the CDC essentially did yesterday was to eliminate masking and social distancing for everyone and to make it optional."

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/14/996760419/how-do-we-know-whether-people-without-masks-indoors-are-vaccinated

dalton99a

(82,350 posts)
24. A correct decision
Sun May 16, 2021, 11:52 AM
May 2021

1. If you are fully vaccinated, you are good to go. There is nothing to fear.

2. If you are not vaccinated and have no plans to get vaccinated, good luck and fuck you.

3. Masks are required for K-12 schools, public transportation and healthcare settings.

4. A vaccination passport? It's a private matter between you and whoever.


Mr.Bill

(24,456 posts)
37. I'll probably wear mine until
Sun May 16, 2021, 03:59 PM
May 2021

our local hospital stops requiring it for everyone who sets foot in the building. That's my definition of back to normal as far as masks go.

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