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TomCADem

(17,393 posts)
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:32 PM Sep 2020

The Story About Trump Trying to Steal The Election Highlights Importance of Senate Races! GOTV!

I would not put anything pass Trump regarding the Atlantic story about the Trump campaign trying to explore ways to bypass election results. However, this does not apply to Senate races.

The 17th Amendment provides that Senators are election by the popular vote of each state. There is no theoretical opportunity to bypass the popular vote:

The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, elected by the people thereof, for six years; and each Senator shall have one vote. The electors in each State shall have the qualifications requisite for electors of the most numerous branch of the State legislatures.

When vacancies happen in the representation of any State in the Senate, the executive authority of such State shall issue writs of election to fill such vacancies: Provided, That the legislature of any State may empower the executive thereof to make temporary appointments until the people fill the vacancies by election as the legislature may direct.

This amendment shall not be so construed as to affect the election or term of any Senator chosen before it becomes valid as part of the Constitution.


This also might be why some Republicans like Ben Sasse have called for the repeal of the 17th Amendment.

Nonetheless, the one real check on Trump being able to hijack the Presidency by convincing Republican Governors and Legislatures of throw out the popular vote is to elect a Democratic Senate.

Far from suppressing the vote, we should use this news to campaign harder for Senate seats, because Trump and Republicans might be tempted to try to hold on to power if they think that they will not be held accountable.
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ProudMNDemocrat

(17,242 posts)
1. A Senate with Democrats in the majority will be a GOOD thing.
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:39 PM
Sep 2020

Trump will try with all his might to STEAL this election, but he cannot steal it for Senators and Representatives. Same goes for State Legislators as well.

We must get out the vote in such decisive numbers.

TomCADem

(17,393 posts)
4. We Can't Just Try to Win the Presidency and Call It A Day
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:46 PM
Sep 2020

During the Obama years, I think many progressives bought into the Republican/right-wing talking point of punishing Democrats by staying home or voting for the Green Party.

Now, more than ever, we have to work for every race to elect Democrats and punish Republicans for their repeated efforts to subvert Democracy. If you do not want Republicans to even entertain the idea of stealing the election, then you need to vote them out at ALL levels. Even if Biden were to win, but if he was stuck with a Republican Congress, then they would just stall for years on end.

Of course, with a Republican Congress, there is nothing to keep Trump from continuing to act in ways that literally leads to deaths of thousands of Americans.

Salviati

(6,012 posts)
2. Not steal. He's suggesting a coup.
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:43 PM
Sep 2020

Ignoring the election results, breaking election laws to seize power illegally is called a coup.

TomCADem

(17,393 posts)
8. Wouldn't You If You Were Evil and Were Concerned About Being Held Accountable?
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:53 PM
Sep 2020

You have seen police chases on TV where a suspect drives over a hundred miles an trying to escape the law, because they know with a certainty that they would be held accountable if caught?

What does Trump have to lose at this point? With a Biden presidency, suddenly all of his illegal activities would be examined. They is a real chance that he and his associates might go to jail given how so many of his other associates have been convicted.

Why shouldn't Trump try to explore ways to negate any election result? Conversely, a lot of Republicans are in too deep. For example, can Nunes suddenly back away from Trump? No.

Think of the criminal trying to evade cops. Why should we expect Trump to act any different in an effort to avoid being held accountable.

This is why we cannot just stop at the Presidency. We also need to win as many Senate seats as possible to prevent Republicans from even considering the possibility of supporting a Trump coup.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
3. Spot on. If the election gets thrown to Congress, we can't have Mitch McConnell
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:45 PM
Sep 2020

in a position to gum things up in favor of Trump and against the Constitution and tradition.

TomCADem

(17,393 posts)
9. Ben Sasse is mistaken with idea for the election of senators in America
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 11:01 PM
Sep 2020

I think we need to stop seeing Trump as being a Republican aberration. Trump is the personification of what it means to be a Republican and how modern Republicans are openly hostile to the idea of a Democracy.

Look at Ben Sasse, who has sometimes celebrated as an anti-Trump Republican despite the fact that he largely moves in lockstep with Trump. Trump's outrageousness simply gives "mainstream" Republicans cover despite the fact that their ideas are just as extreme and hostile to Democracy as Trump's.

The fight for a Democracy does not end with just voting for Biden. Saving Democracy depends on electing people up and down the ballot who are willing to protect our Democratic ideals.

https://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary/516928-ben-sasse-is-mistaken-with-idea-for-the-election-of-senators-in-america

Facing an easy election, Senator Ben Sasse has decided to jump into the national political fray. Rather than get involved on the race for president, Sasse is proposing such major changes to the Senate. Arguably his most significant revamp suggestion is that the country should now repeal the 17th Amendment, which mandates the direct election of senators, then have state legislatures elect senators to Congress.

Sasse is latching onto an idea that has been popular for conservatives in recent years. In theory, this proposal would fit in with the previous desire of conservatives for an increase in federalism and devolution of power to the states. Unsurprisingly, Sasse does not mention to us that Republicans would be the beneficiaries of any change over the short term, since they control the legislature in more than half the states.

While Sasse argues that removing the 17th Amendment may reverse the national focus with current politics, the reality is likely to be the opposite. Such a change would almost certainly make national the state legislative elections. What we would see is the near total elimination of local issues. This is happening to some degree today, but it would become a standard across the country, as every possible legislative win would be seen as the chance to gain control of the Senate. Parties and outside interest groups would look to recall elections as a way to gain an advantage in an off year fight, which could create a truly forever campaign.

Gerrymandering, which has deleterious effects on politics, would rapidly rise in importance. As we saw once more with the debate for the census, redistricting has become a national battle for control of the House. If the idea from Sasse were enacted, state legislatures would work on the most extreme gerrymandering possible to gain control for the Senate. We saw the effects of redistricting on Wisconsin, as Republicans won 64 percent of the legislative seats with only 46 percent of the vote in 2018. We could watch redistricting turn into a constant presence.

TomCADem

(17,393 posts)
10. That Is The Thing. If People Are Concerned About a "Trump Coup," Than GOTV for Senate
Thu Sep 24, 2020, 11:07 AM
Sep 2020

We can't just try to win the Presidency and call it a day. If anything, the Senate races are more important, because if Trump feels assured that he has a Senate majority, then there is a greater risk that he will act with impunity knowing that Republican Senators will not hold him accountable.

KentuckyWoman

(6,709 posts)
7. This entirely ditch Mitch.
Wed Sep 23, 2020, 10:50 PM
Sep 2020

I really don't think the average American understands how dangerous Mitch is. Finding a kindred spirit in Trump only exposed a small bit of the corruption.

honest.abe

(8,709 posts)
11. If Trump pulls anything like this and makes it to SCOTUS, I do believe they will not back Trump..
Thu Sep 24, 2020, 11:14 AM
Sep 2020

even with 6 conservative judges. They are not beholden to Trump. He has nothing on them. This would be too extreme even for them.. well perhaps a couple of them will still vote with Trump.. but I am certain there will not be an majority, especially if the vote results in a big win for Biden.

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