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live love laugh

(13,245 posts)
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:38 AM Jun 2019

The faster impeachment begins the more it favors Trump

There has been massive, unprecedented obstruction all during the investigation and after with Congress. Until the missing information is in the hands of Congress, they are likely to miss or overlook a lot needed for an ironclad case.

Rushing favors Trump and Republicans politically. The sooner they get this out of the way before the 2020 elections the more able they are to capitalize on the short attention span of most.

I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of the “voices” shouting impeach now are trolls.

Impeach? Yes. Rush? No.

66 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
The faster impeachment begins the more it favors Trump (Original Post) live love laugh Jun 2019 OP
Maxine Waters is a troll? BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #1
Waters and many others favor impeachment. Rushing is the issue. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #3
For you it's an issue, not for most Democrats BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #4
+1 Chin music Jun 2019 #9
+1 Locrian Jun 2019 #15
I do see how it works both ways. I am not married live love laugh Jun 2019 #20
3/4 of Democrats now favor impeachment AT SOME POINT. Hortensis Jun 2019 #22
It isn't higher because Democrats watoos Jun 2019 #30
I'm not sure where you have data on the timing live love laugh Jun 2019 #24
Go do your own homework BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #25
Why so hostile? I checked and don't find your poll. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #36
Calls the majority of Dems trolls BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #37
Sometimes defensiveness impedes comprehension. live love laugh Jun 2019 #44
Harry Reid says hello BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #46
When you talk to a fellow DUer in this way, and with no provocation, I think you are acting in a emmaverybo Jun 2019 #52
Interesting BeyondGeography Jun 2019 #54
No. BTW, the CNN Poll link below Nevermypresident Jun 2019 #53
Is Waters posting here? Nuggets Jun 2019 #18
What? Waters has made statements in favor of impeachment. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #21
an impeachment inquiry should start asap standingtall Jun 2019 #2
Yep, exactly right. kacekwl Jun 2019 #6
Start ASAP, and continue vigorously until the end of the Session. lagomorph777 Jun 2019 #7
Exactly, watoos Jun 2019 #8
+1 Chin music Jun 2019 #10
"Courts will be more likely to order the Trump administration to hand over needed documents... Trumpocalypse Jun 2019 #12
It's just common sense, watoos Jun 2019 #31
Is there legal precedent? Trumpocalypse Jun 2019 #34
You believe Barr? emmaverybo Jun 2019 #51
Strange to see people citing a promise Barr made as support for anything, isn't it? StarfishSaver Jun 2019 #60
Barr didn't promise to release grand jury material to Congress. He doesn't have the legal authority StarfishSaver Jun 2019 #59
Pelosi told us Trump is trying to get them to hurry Nuggets Jun 2019 #17
That has been explained to death by people who are for the most part against standingtall Jun 2019 #27
I have said this before, watoos Jun 2019 #32
No, that's not true Nuggets Jun 2019 #39
Then you might as well be saying standingtall Jun 2019 #42
We must have all the evidence needed to make Nuggets Jun 2019 #43
I wouldn't be surprised if most of the posters watoos Jun 2019 #5
Amen to that. Chin music Jun 2019 #11
I've honestly been feeling that way myself. Crunchy Frog Jun 2019 #48
I trust Nancy Pelosi and strongly approve of the way that Speaker Peolosi is handling this matter Gothmog Jun 2019 #13
I agree. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #45
I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the "voices" shouting impeach now are trolls. Nuggets Jun 2019 #14
True enough... but the better argument is that there won't be two different impeachments FBaggins Jun 2019 #16
My point. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #26
The sooner it ENDS the better for Trump. The sooner it BEGINS, and the LONGER it goes on... lagomorph777 Jun 2019 #28
Better said but also my point. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #35
Excellent point. nt emmaverybo Jun 2019 #61
Elizabeth Warren is no troll. Kid Berwyn Jun 2019 #19
Maybe so. IIRC Nixon's impeachment was swift so I would think that live love laugh Jun 2019 #23
(a) Nixon was not impeached (b) the hearings went on for years (not swift) lagomorph777 Jun 2019 #29
It never got to trial, he resigned. Kid Berwyn Jun 2019 #50
Thanks for the info. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #65
Is she posting here? Nuggets Jun 2019 #40
I don't know if she posts on DU. Kid Berwyn Jun 2019 #49
Not at this time it's not. Nuggets Jun 2019 #57
Frankly, I think it's going happen once we are with the 1 year of the election... Javaman Jun 2019 #33
At what date does it become non-trollish to want this jackass impeached? egduj Jun 2019 #38
All of us want him impeached. Nuggets Jun 2019 #41
The impeachment process may be the only way to do a proper investigation. shockey80 Jun 2019 #47
Do you realize that Nevermypresident Jun 2019 #55
That's helpful but doesn't account for the unprecedented unknowns live love laugh Jun 2019 #58
Agree it's a matter of strategy. Risks are associated with all paths. Nevermypresident Jun 2019 #62
Agree! Thekaspervote Jun 2019 #56
Oh boy. Apple Fritter Jun 2019 #63
You make valid points. I'm regretting starting this thread. nt live love laugh Jun 2019 #64
Oh oh..No REGRETS ON YOUR POV! IT's okay. Apple Fritter Jun 2019 #66

Locrian

(4,522 posts)
15. +1
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:12 PM
Jun 2019

I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of the “voices” shouting to impeach later are trolls. <<- see how that works both ways?

live love laugh

(13,245 posts)
20. I do see how it works both ways. I am not married
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:21 PM
Jun 2019

to this position. I post for feedback. Maybe I will change my opinion. I see mostly that there are valid reasons for not rushing.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
22. 3/4 of Democrats now favor impeachment AT SOME POINT.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:22 PM
Jun 2019

FINALLY! It took years to get to this point, some drops and rises along the way, but hardly a wow. That is ONLY 76% of Democrats.

On the plus side, there's no time limit to that 76%. No subversive impeach now or else. On the negative side, why isn't it damned near 100%?

Democrats didn't want to hear it last year. The blue wave was created by pretending the big issues were the kind of things they should be, not massive corruption and treason abetted by Russia that threaten to destroy our republic. Massive denial, but at least they are not the evil agents trying to maneuver us to defeat before we can take them out.

Btw, support for impeachment overall is now all the way up to 46%, after a drop to 43%, after a high of 47% last fall.

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
30. It isn't higher because Democrats
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:38 PM
Jun 2019

respect Speaker Pelosi's judgment, as they should. Pelosi deserves to be Speaker but IMO she is wrong about not impeaching now. If she were to come out today and call for an impeachment inquiry she would get 100% Democratic support.

live love laugh

(13,245 posts)
24. I'm not sure where you have data on the timing
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:27 PM
Jun 2019

of beginning impeachment and Democrats opinions. Please share your source.

live love laugh

(13,245 posts)
44. Sometimes defensiveness impedes comprehension.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:26 PM
Jun 2019

You’re speaking for a “majority” opinion to begin impeachment hastily that you cannot support.

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
52. When you talk to a fellow DUer in this way, and with no provocation, I think you are acting in a
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 06:09 PM
Jun 2019

Troll-like manner though I am sure you are not a troll. Just letting you know how badly your attitude just now came across to me.

Nevermypresident

(781 posts)
53. No. BTW, the CNN Poll link below
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 06:19 PM
Jun 2019
https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/02/politics/trump-impeachment-mueller-testify-cnn-poll/index.html

snipped:
"The shift on impeachment stems mostly from a rebound in support for it among Democrats -- 76% favor it currently, up from 69% in April."

standingtall

(2,787 posts)
2. an impeachment inquiry should start asap
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:46 AM
Jun 2019

The fatal flaw with claiming we need to take our time to built an ironclad case which there really is no such thing to begin with is once time is lost you cannot get it back. The Trump administration is stonewalling everything to run out the clock until 2020. So we are playing right into their hands. Courts will be more likely to order the Trump administration to hand over needed documents we have an impeachment inquiry so the sooner we do it the better.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
7. Start ASAP, and continue vigorously until the end of the Session.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:55 AM
Jun 2019

When it will be too late for McConnell to "acquit" Trump.

Meanwhile, we can spend 15 months publicizing Trump's crimes.

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
8. Exactly,
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:56 AM
Jun 2019

why would courts feel the need to expedite decisions if the Democratic position is there isn't enough there there?

 

Trumpocalypse

(6,143 posts)
12. "Courts will be more likely to order the Trump administration to hand over needed documents...
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:06 PM
Jun 2019

we have an impeachment inquiry"

Why?

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
31. It's just common sense,
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:44 PM
Jun 2019

An impeachment investigation carries more clout. Barr himself even stated that he would release the grand jury testimony to Congress for an impeachment hearing. Just getting that grand jury info would be a huge step to impeaching Trump. The grand jury testimony is where all of the good dirt on Trump is. The new revelations that just came out about Nadar would be revealed in his grand jury testimony. Release of the grand jury testimony will bury Trump and his crime family.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
59. Barr didn't promise to release grand jury material to Congress. He doesn't have the legal authority
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:10 PM
Jun 2019

Only a judge can do that.

He promised to advocate for the release - very different.

But he's also a liar, so there's that...

FYI - even if the material is released to Congress, that does not authorize them to release it to the public. It's more likely that, if a judge allows the material to be disclosed to Congress, it will be on the condition that it remains close hold among the Committee Members and with portions to be released to the public only upon judicial approval. So, don't get to excited about seeing the information yourself any time soon.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
17. Pelosi told us Trump is trying to get them to hurry
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:14 PM
Jun 2019

and impeach.
I believe her. Thus playing right into their hands would be to impeach right away. That would be the fatal flaw and it’s been explained to death on here why.

I will not abandon Pelosi.

standingtall

(2,787 posts)
27. That has been explained to death by people who are for the most part against
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:35 PM
Jun 2019

impeachment of Trump under any circumstances which is why such explanations don't get any traction. I think either Pelosi is wrong or she is trying to sell the base on not impeaching Trump at all or both.

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
32. I have said this before,
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:48 PM
Jun 2019

but this has to be in the back of Speaker Pelosi's mind, she was Speaker in 2010 when Republicans flipped a net 64 seats. She is convinced that pushing for impeachment will hurt in swing districts, especially in California.

That thinking is wrong IMO. I just saw what Justin Amash did, he held a town hall and made the case for impeachment and he got a standing ovation.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
39. No, that's not true
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:09 PM
Jun 2019

I want impeachment when doing so won’t allow the Republican maj Senate to acquit or Pence to pardon.

Pelosi is far more informed than anyone here. Her past ethics and actions prove she is trustworthy and smart.

I will not abandon my leader even as you try to undermine her.

standingtall

(2,787 posts)
42. Then you might as well be saying
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:48 PM
Jun 2019

your not for impeachment under any circumstance, because there is no scenario where the republican senate will not acquit Trump. Even if a video surfaced of Trump shooting someone on 5th avenue while standing next to Putin discussing how to steal the 2016 election there will not be 20 republican senators who will vote to remove Trump. Trump should be impeached and Democrats ought to force republican senators to vote on it and then Kraft a message to hold the senators who vote to acquit Trump accountable in the 2020 elections.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
43. We must have all the evidence needed to make
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:54 PM
Jun 2019

a solid case for the public to see.
Initiating the process too quickly allows Republicans to use it as fodder against Dems for their “witch-hunt ”

Again I will not abandon my leader for some emotional response from an uniformed commenter.
Pelosi has shown great leadership skills in the past.

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
5. I wouldn't be surprised if most of the posters
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:55 AM
Jun 2019

pushing to wait are trolls. There, I gave equal speculation time.

FBaggins

(26,808 posts)
16. True enough... but the better argument is that there won't be two different impeachments
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:13 PM
Jun 2019

Impeach on the current evidence and fail... and there’s zero chance that there will be public approval for a different set of charges a year later.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
28. The sooner it ENDS the better for Trump. The sooner it BEGINS, and the LONGER it goes on...
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:37 PM
Jun 2019

the worse for Trump.

Kid Berwyn

(15,185 posts)
19. Elizabeth Warren is no troll.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:18 PM
Jun 2019

Maybe we should start impeaching now and streeeeeetch out the process to November, 2020?

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
29. (a) Nixon was not impeached (b) the hearings went on for years (not swift)
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 12:38 PM
Jun 2019

It was the long and dramatic hearings that destroyed Nixon.

We need to do the same to Trump.

Kid Berwyn

(15,185 posts)
50. It never got to trial, he resigned.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:58 PM
Jun 2019

Spelling out what he did in public, televised hearings, showed the world, including his supporters in Congress and across the USA, that he was a crook.

On a somewhat more numerous note, Firesign Theatre covered the swearing-out of the 37th President:

(In a grating, officious voice)

“Richard Nixon!
You sonuvabitch!
Get the hell out of here!
Fuck off!”

(Patriotic music)

Next thing we knew, Ford was pardoning him and Poppy and the rest of the Big Oil Wall Street boys were off to strike another day.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
40. Is she posting here?
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:13 PM
Jun 2019

Has she shown bad judgement before? Why yes.

She accused the DNC of rigging election against Sanders in 2016
Doesn’t understand the TPP among others.

While she has done good things her judgment is lacking.

Kid Berwyn

(15,185 posts)
49. I don't know if she posts on DU.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:25 PM
Jun 2019

I do think she was right regarding the primaries and the TPP as Corporate (New) Dems think capitalism and property rights trump human rights and democracy.

ETA (PLEASE READ IN MICHAEL COHEN VOICE): Calling for the impeachment of Donald J Trump also is good idea.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
57. Not at this time it's not.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 07:15 PM
Jun 2019

We may have to wait until a Dem is President
Because that’s the only way to make them face justice.

I’ll wait to see what Pelosi/Schiff says.

Javaman

(62,540 posts)
33. Frankly, I think it's going happen once we are with the 1 year of the election...
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 01:19 PM
Jun 2019

sometime around november/december

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
41. All of us want him impeached.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:16 PM
Jun 2019

Do you want him to get off scott free?
Are you for helping the senate acquit him?

I have to wonder when ppl insist impeaching immediately knowing the consequences at this point will be Trump getting off scott free, and knowing trolls are pushing this divide are helping them.

 

shockey80

(4,379 posts)
47. The impeachment process may be the only way to do a proper investigation.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:39 PM
Jun 2019

Trump is obstructing everything. He is breaking the law every fucking day. Starting the impeachment process does not mean you have to vote to impeach. It gives you more tools to investigate.

Nevermypresident

(781 posts)
55. Do you realize that
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 06:34 PM
Jun 2019

Last edited Tue Jun 4, 2019, 07:13 PM - Edit history (1)

snipped:

"If the speaker assigns the House Judiciary Committee to investigate, there is no time limit placed on their investigation and a likely public hearing would be scheduled at the discretion of the committee chair to vote on the articles of impeachment."


https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/impeachment-process-works/story?id=51202880
_________


Therefore, the House Judiciary Committee's Impeachment investigation can take as long as they so choose.

Let's all please do our homework first...

live love laugh

(13,245 posts)
58. That's helpful but doesn't account for the unprecedented unknowns
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:05 PM
Jun 2019

as the rules are being rewritten daily.

Homework only goes so far—it’s really a matter of strategy.

Apple Fritter

(131 posts)
63. Oh boy.
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 11:12 AM
Jun 2019

"I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of the “voices” shouting impeach now are trolls."
This is how conspiracy starts. Trolls like to play their little mind games to sway public opinion but it also makes everyone paranoid to the point where nothing and no one can be trusted. I say let people cry out for impeachment because it's not a ploy.

Besides nobody knows what could happen, this hasn't happened in history before so we have nothing to go off of. We can't foresee the senate, and we can't foresee the president because he's crazy unpredictable. So impeaching now versus election season? Blargh.

Apple Fritter

(131 posts)
66. Oh oh..No REGRETS ON YOUR POV! IT's okay.
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 01:36 AM
Jun 2019

I actually agree with the slow impeachment process too kinda (I am okay with it). I just had a problem with that one quote. I think there was a lot of really good insight in your POV because some people want to get into impeachment.

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