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allgood33

(1,584 posts)
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:11 AM Nov 2018

Somebody please explain why there is so many against Nancy Pelosi as Speaker?

Why would so many pledge to be against her BEFORE even winning their seats? They don't even know her. This is so much like what has happened to Hillary over the course of her political career. Effective, smart, fearless women are always attacked and usually by other women who have little idea about why they really dislike either of these Democratic warriors. WTF?

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Somebody please explain why there is so many against Nancy Pelosi as Speaker? (Original Post) allgood33 Nov 2018 OP
Because today is a day that ends in "y" jberryhill Nov 2018 #1
+1 2naSalit Nov 2018 #10
They have fallen for the right wing demonization of a supremely capable female. LexVegas Nov 2018 #2
.B.I.N.G.O. (N/t) Lefta Dissenter Nov 2018 #60
That's exactly it. Repugs ran against her so they thought it would help their chances also. brush Nov 2018 #64
Obama described her as one of most effective speakers in history. good enough for me nt wiggs Nov 2018 #3
girl parts nt DURHAM D Nov 2018 #4
Democrats are stupid sometimes. apcalc Nov 2018 #5
There aren't. There are a handful of house members out of hundreds. Squinch Nov 2018 #6
Yup, about half are trolls and attempting to portray a small group of anti-Pelosi reps as the FSogol Nov 2018 #23
BINGO FarPoint Nov 2018 #52
You got it zipplewrath Nov 2018 #31
Can't go th the right! Silver1 Nov 2018 #39
Ageism plus sexism Dream Girl Nov 2018 #7
yup.... hlthe2b Nov 2018 #8
Agreed lpbk2713 Nov 2018 #15
SELECTIVE Ageism and sexism. Yup! n/t Guilded Lilly Nov 2018 #57
She is a smart and powerful woman. redstatebluegirl Nov 2018 #9
Frustration...She has held the top spot since 2003 BeyondGeography Nov 2018 #11
Had enough of what? What would they do differently and what could they honestly accomplish? allgood33 Nov 2018 #13
Are you saying only Nancy Pelosi of all the people in the House is capable of advancing our values? BeyondGeography Nov 2018 #14
Guess They Don't Like/Are Tired of Winning Me. Nov 2018 #19
Get rid of Hoyer Bev54 Nov 2018 #32
This could and should have been done years ago BeyondGeography Nov 2018 #34
Ahhh...the top spot is Speaker. She has not held that since '03. brush Nov 2018 #65
They were taken in by the repuke "Pelosi is evil" propaganda meow2u3 Nov 2018 #12
King Kompromat GeorgeGist Nov 2018 #16
It's about branding Johnny2X2X Nov 2018 #17
Not against her - frustrated none the less... List left Nov 2018 #18
Are You Putting That On Her? Me. Nov 2018 #20
Old axes to grind, I guess... Blue_Tires Nov 2018 #21
Schumer needs to go Bev54 Nov 2018 #36
case in point: Blue_Tires Nov 2018 #44
It's a right wing narrative. Stop giving it legs. n-t Whiskeytide Nov 2018 #22
+1 Exactly. n/t FSogol Nov 2018 #24
+1000 n/t WA-03 Democrat Nov 2018 #42
Because some think the 2 words "Nancy Pelosi" have become too much of a rallying cry for the enemy mtnsnake Nov 2018 #25
Exactly. What they're now refusing to admit is those repugs who ran against her lost. brush Nov 2018 #66
Republican talking points. onecaliberal Nov 2018 #26
Some white men do not like it when a woman is in charge, especially a smart, effective woman. LonePirate Nov 2018 #27
Republican Ratfucking Operation Turbineguy Nov 2018 #28
She's female? Ferrets are Cool Nov 2018 #29
It's Sexism with a Healthy Dose of Ageism Thrown In for Good Measure dlk Nov 2018 #30
It's a "funny" thing Docreed2003 Nov 2018 #33
I'm sorry, that conversation is off the table Sentath Nov 2018 #35
+1 PDittie Nov 2018 #48
Yep, thanks! LibDemAlways Nov 2018 #58
Many are in moderate-to-leaning-red districts Tarc Nov 2018 #37
$ or py6, take your pick. n/t rzemanfl Nov 2018 #38
There are those that would like a bit stronger stance. PurgedVoter Nov 2018 #40
They don't know why they hate her. They only know that they've been TOLD to hate her. Aristus Nov 2018 #41
This is spot on! n/t Greybnk48 Nov 2018 #50
I think its because she is a bad salesperson for Democratic and progressive ideas. Mr. Sparkle Nov 2018 #43
Well, many think Populists make better politicians. But History always proves them wrong. haele Nov 2018 #47
For answers, I turn to Stealers Wheel Small-Axe Nov 2018 #45
Pretty much Conservi-Dems are against her - West Coast values, you know. haele Nov 2018 #46
When she's in charge, the repukes get their asses kicked Greybnk48 Nov 2018 #49
Because there is a lot of propaganda being spread around MrGrieves Nov 2018 #51
Sexism, lies, and propaganda Botany Nov 2018 #53
There aren't. PubliusEnigma Nov 2018 #54
It's simple. You can be old. You can be female. You can't be old and female. MaryMagdaline Nov 2018 #55
Because we may have gained 40 seats INdemo Nov 2018 #56
The Koolaid was free with facebook randr Nov 2018 #59
Because they bought into the republicans demonization workinclasszero Nov 2018 #61
soy tin lee! struggle4progress Nov 2018 #62
I started ignoring them rather than kick them up. pwb Nov 2018 #63

brush

(55,262 posts)
64. That's exactly it. Repugs ran against her so they thought it would help their chances also.
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 12:18 PM
Nov 2018

Hope Speaker Pelosi puts them on the "scraping gum off the sidewalks" committee.

Squinch

(51,410 posts)
6. There aren't. There are a handful of house members out of hundreds.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:20 AM
Nov 2018

As for those posting here that they want her gone, about half are trolls. Of the rest, a lot just like sparkly new things, some are just sexist, and some get scared when republicans get angry. Which seems like daddy issues to me.
That leaves a small sliver who have actual gripes against her. I have yet to read any who say what those gripes are, but I'll trust they are there. But its a very small percentage.

FSogol

(45,752 posts)
23. Yup, about half are trolls and attempting to portray a small group of anti-Pelosi reps as the
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:50 AM
Nov 2018

majority with thread after thread of this tripe.

Pretty transparent if you ask me.

zipplewrath

(16,646 posts)
31. You got it
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:06 PM
Nov 2018

There might be 12 - 15 "liberals" that are unsatisified for one reason or another. The balance are Blue Dogs that are tired of having to support positions they don't share and want the party pulled back to the right. Then there are the other 200+.

Silver1

(721 posts)
39. Can't go th the right!
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:35 PM
Nov 2018

If the democratic party goes to the right we will lose all our gains, which would probably cause another rift in the next election. We saw some of that happen already in 2016, and look at the result.

The Blued Dogs should switch parties if they're unhappy, and make room for progressives who are focused on real issues important to Americans, like the environment, jobs, and healthcare.

BeyondGeography

(39,501 posts)
11. Frustration...She has held the top spot since 2003
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:32 AM
Nov 2018

Hoyer has been either Whip or Leader since 2003. A lot of good Democratic reps have had enough. The mystery is why this is so hard for so many to grasp.

BeyondGeography

(39,501 posts)
14. Are you saying only Nancy Pelosi of all the people in the House is capable of advancing our values?
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:40 AM
Nov 2018

People have had enough of being limited in their careers by others who won’t let go, even when the writing (ie incoming reps who promised not to vote for Pelosi) is on the wall. This, btw, happens in every human organization.

Me.

(35,454 posts)
19. Guess They Don't Like/Are Tired of Winning
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:47 AM
Nov 2018

Heard Sean Patrick Maloney this morning who used to be against Nancy. Said she say down with him and others for 5 months and developed the winning message starting with health care and low priced prescription drugs and down the line. What is their approach, were they out there helping others win, raising money for the Dems in record amounts?

Bev54

(10,577 posts)
32. Get rid of Hoyer
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:09 PM
Nov 2018

Get rid of Hoyer, he has done nothing, put someone in whom Pelosi can mentor to take over for her.

BeyondGeography

(39,501 posts)
34. This could and should have been done years ago
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:13 PM
Nov 2018

It wasn’t. Which makes the “we can’t possibly change because no successors have been groomed”argument look more than a little self-serving, which tends to piss humans off.

brush

(55,262 posts)
65. Ahhh...the top spot is Speaker. She has not held that since '03.
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 12:24 PM
Nov 2018

She has keep her caucus together through all the repug opposition during the O years and the trump debacle.

She just help spearhead our fabulous blue wave. Fuck those who think she should be gone.

Maybe they should realize that when Pelosi is Speaker again the Majority Leader spot will be open and they should maybe try for that to get into leadership.

meow2u3

(24,850 posts)
12. They were taken in by the repuke "Pelosi is evil" propaganda
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:32 AM
Nov 2018

Nobody set them straight on the reality that Pelosi is a boogiewoman because repukes are scared to death of her.

Johnny2X2X

(19,964 posts)
17. It's about branding
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:44 AM
Nov 2018

For a good 8 years Republicans branded her and branded the Democratic Party with her. The thought is that to grow the party we need a new face of the party or the effective branding from the Republicans will continue.

I'm not sure what to think, I know she's very effective, but all I want to do is win. Did we win last week because of or in spite of Nancy Pelosi. I know that Republicans used her name and face in endless ads in my state, they obviously think tying any candidate to Pelosi helps them.

What I don't want to see is a messy power struggle. I hope the leaders decide this behind closed doors and move forward as 1.

Pelosi can be effective at her job. Is she the only one in the party that can be effective? Surely there are many others who could be great as Speaker in our party. What do we gain by replacing her? Do we expand the voting block for 202 by replacing her? Do we shrink it?

It's not an easy discussion. And above all, this is not an issue to be decided by emotion, the parties political masterminds need to weigh in on what makes 2020 the biggest blue wave possible. Winning is the only thing that matters.

List left

(601 posts)
18. Not against her - frustrated none the less...
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:45 AM
Nov 2018

Banksters and previous administrations not prosecuted for their crimes paved the way for more of the same.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
21. Old axes to grind, I guess...
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:48 AM
Nov 2018

And there's always some shit stirrers who are hellbent on imploding the party from inside -- And nevermind the fact that with the sun setting on the Clinton's political careers, the media, the GOP and the leftbros had to invent a new "Hillary" lightning rod or polarization, and Pelosi drew the short straw...

The real question is why is there no similar outcry against Schumer, who is infinitely worse than Pelosi in almost every regard...

Bev54

(10,577 posts)
36. Schumer needs to go
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:18 PM
Nov 2018

I agree, Schumer has conceded almost everything to the republicans and has done nothing to advance the dems agenda. Pelosi has been strong and managed to keep her caucus together for the tough votes. We need her experience to deal with Trump, this is not the time to put an unknown in. She will step down when the work is done, why can't people understand this.

mtnsnake

(22,236 posts)
25. Because some think the 2 words "Nancy Pelosi" have become too much of a rallying cry for the enemy
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 11:55 AM
Nov 2018

More than a few of our own people worry that her name alone brings out the republican base to vote against us more than anyone else, other than Hillary's name of course.

dlk

(11,878 posts)
30. It's Sexism with a Healthy Dose of Ageism Thrown In for Good Measure
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:05 PM
Nov 2018

In our sexist culture, women over a certain age are expected to go quietly into the ether, no matter their level of accomplishment and success. This isn’t ever expected of powerful, successful, older men, just the women.

Docreed2003

(17,119 posts)
33. It's a "funny" thing
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:10 PM
Nov 2018

Some were pinning House losses on her for years, but when we take back the house, thanks to her fundraising and messaging, people are now calling for her to step aside.

Personally, I think we need her experience and expertise at wrangling votes at this time in history.

Tarc

(10,491 posts)
37. Many are in moderate-to-leaning-red districts
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:20 PM
Nov 2018

and it's what they had to do to win.

I fully support Pelosi and hope that she is the Speaker for the next 2 years. At the same time, a challenge to her leadership isn't evil or nefarious, it is a part of our democratic ideals. By no means should she step down just because someone things "it's been long enough" or such gibberish.

If someone else wants the gavel, then they have to challenge her for it.

PurgedVoter

(2,275 posts)
40. There are those that would like a bit stronger stance.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:50 PM
Nov 2018

There are long term members of the Democratic Party who have had issues with Pelosi well before the Republican smear jobs started. I for one, have trusted her more since the attacks. When the lying, twisted, vast, right-wing conspiracy starts to attack you, it means you are doing the right thing. Whenever they attack we need to do the right thing. Keep our minds open, look for evidence and not judge the victim. Grayson, Avenatti and Franken are all victims of our sides over enthusiastic willingness to turn on our best defenders.

I don't want to cast shade on anyone fighting the good fight and Pelosi is currently fighting the worst most lying and unethical crew of Republicans we have seen in my lifetime. I will ignore the weak issues that many bandy about without proof or logic. Here are the convincing and negative arguments that I know of that quite a few old time Democrats hold against Pelosi.

Patriot Act and the Iraq war. The vast majority here on Democratic Underground knew that both were wrong. They shared information that has been confirmed time after time. In Pelosi's position, many thought she should be better informed and have a better understanding of things. Pelosi was against Re-authorization of the Patriot Act and she has indicated regrets over the Iraq war. In my own view she has not been a statesman on these issues, but then only a few Democratic Party leaders have been. She learns from the past and sadly that is not always the case in our leaders and never the case in Republican leadership.

Pelosi has never supported impeachment. More than once she has said, "Impeachment is off the table." She has referred to her preference to supporting battles that can be won as "Keeping your powder dry." The environment and the numbers have been against the success of an impeachment during both Bush and Trump's tenure so this may be wisdom. I am not sitting at any of these table so I can't judge this as well as I would like to be able to. Pelosi is against wasting the time, effort, connections and government money on useless fights. This is good management and what we expect from good leadership. On the other hand, we live in a political system, and by saying, "Impeachment is off the table," you are handing over one of your better weapons without a single negotiation.

As far as replacing Pelosi as Speaker, my answer is simple. Find someone better. Find someone who has survived the worst that Republicans can throw at you and still stay strong. Then we will talk.

Aristus

(67,067 posts)
41. They don't know why they hate her. They only know that they've been TOLD to hate her.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 12:52 PM
Nov 2018

So they do. Just as with Hillary Clinton.

It's like the concept in Nineteen Eight-Four: "Who are we hating this week?"

Mr. Sparkle

(3,015 posts)
43. I think its because she is a bad salesperson for Democratic and progressive ideas.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 01:08 PM
Nov 2018

So doesn't attract independents or left leaning republicans. She cant grand stand at all. Some are also worried that she will look poorly going up against trump.

She is right(as in correct) on most of her positions but due to the nature of congress, not much is going to get passed.

haele

(12,876 posts)
47. Well, many think Populists make better politicians. But History always proves them wrong.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 06:29 PM
Nov 2018

Populists are great in front of the media. They're really great come election time, convicting people that their great rhetoric is going to get things done. But Congress isn't a Board of Directors; once one is elected, then the real work begins.
Being able to gage the way 536 people are going to vote and assess what in bills is going to pass and what is going to fail, no matter how much you push and plead, is far more important when dealing with policy and process than standing in front of a camera and pounding the podium.

I actually wish earmarks were back, even with the potential for corruption. For all the cries of "pork", earmarks really didn't affect the budget much (as most earmarks were made up of "sweep-up" or left over discretionary funding), but they were a great way to convince members of the opposition to vote your way because they get to bring home a benefit that outweighs their political "discomfort" by voting against party and potentially against the majority of the social attitudes of their constituent voters.

Earmarks - how Social Security, Medicare and the subsequent improvements for them got passed. That's how Civil Rights, and Voting Rights got passed. That's how the CCC got established.

Haele

haele

(12,876 posts)
46. Pretty much Conservi-Dems are against her - West Coast values, you know.
Thu Nov 15, 2018, 06:18 PM
Nov 2018

Many of those who want her out are concerned with "economic anxiety issues" far more than pro-choice or equal rights for LGBTQ folks, so they see her as someone who isn't totally on their side, because she considers those issues as well as their favorite issues.

Those who actually understand how politics works are willing to support her, whether or not they approve of her personal beliefs or focus. Because unlike a lot of folks who live in an "all or nothing" world, Ms. Pelosi understands how politics works - how to count, when to commit to an agenda, and how to put an issue on the incremental back burner rather than push for everything at once so that it continues to advance, even if there's significant opposition to it from people with other agendas.

Haele

Greybnk48

(10,262 posts)
49. When she's in charge, the repukes get their asses kicked
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 10:32 AM
Nov 2018

over and over and over, and they've made her out to be Satan incarnate. Some Dems have gotten sucked in by right wing spin, unfortunately.

 

MrGrieves

(315 posts)
51. Because there is a lot of propaganda being spread around
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 10:34 AM
Nov 2018

Because there is a lot of propaganda being spread around amplifying the few voices that have been her opponents for some time.

 

workinclasszero

(28,270 posts)
61. Because they bought into the republicans demonization
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 11:19 AM
Nov 2018

of Nancy Pelosi.

It’s terrible to see the effects of Fox right wing brainwashing in our own democratic House members.

pwb

(11,860 posts)
63. I started ignoring them rather than kick them up.
Fri Nov 16, 2018, 12:15 PM
Nov 2018

It's three or four people mostly. Trying to divide us for comrade Putin And trump.

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