Would MANDELA (or Jesus) bomb Libya? Pause and think: was Mandela really dumb in his SUPPORT

[Distant Observer]

Anyone wondering if there is another side to the story of the
HORRIBLE internal conflict in Libya than what is being portrayed in the
recent media coverage press should investigate Nelson Mandela view of Gaddafi.

Even an analysis of Gaddafi's Libya from a cynical western perspective shows that
there can be valid alternative views on question of the "Crazy Colonel Gaddafi?"


http://www.boydjudson.com/files/FPA_4.pdf

Strategic Moral Diplomacy: Mandela,
Qaddafi, and the Lockerbie Negotiations
LYN BOYD-JUDSON
University of South California

On October 29, 1997, South African President Nelson Mandela arrived in Libya to
award Colonel Muammar Qaddafi the Good Hope Medal. The Medal, also referred
to as the Order of Good Hope, is the highest honor that South Africa can
bestow upon a citizen of another country (it would be given a year later to U.S.
President Bill Clinton.) At the time, Colonel Qaddafi was a pariah in the international
community. Libya had been under United Nations (UN) sanctions since 1992
for its refusal to hand over the two indicted suspects in the bombing of Pan Am
Flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland, that killed 270 people.
‘‘Those who say I should not be here are without morals,’’ Mandela said. ‘‘This
man helped us at a time when we were all alone, when those who say we should not
come here were helping the enemy’’ (Mandela Dismisses U.S. Opposition, 1997).
When Qaddafi’s turn at the microphone came, he said, ‘‘What we are facing is an
attempt of domination from one power. All international proposals serve this evil
purpose.

[Posteritatis]

1. Mandela liked him 14 years before he started talking about wiping out large chunks of his population

That means Qadaffi's just fine today, clearly.

[Distant Observer]

3. Please think about where you heard that. I have never seen that report

[Amonester]

4. Yep. Some cannot make the difference between good actions 14 yrs ago

and ignoble actions today.

[Distant Observer]

7. IGNOBLE? YES, Compared to Sudan, Bahrain, Yemen????

Or let's just compare with the criminally justified mass killings of the US in Iraq.

[Amonester]

10. Yes, ignoble. And I am not playing the comparing game. Sorry. n/t

[Distant Observer]

17. I AGREE. But you have to COMPARE to discern the motives for the escalation in death and destruction

[Teaser]

2. I believe Nelson Mandela DID bomb things

At least the ANC did under his leadership.

Not saying it wasn't justifiable in many cases.

[tabatha]

6. Mandela was released from jail in 1990.

Long after any bombings by the ANC.

He had no communication with them from inside his jail cell.

[Teaser]

9. Mandela led a bombing campaign of government targets

*before his arrest and imprisonment*

[tabatha]

12. from wiki

In 1961, Mandela became leader of the ANC's armed wing, Umkhonto we Sizwe (translated Spear of the Nation, and also abbreviated MK), which he co-founded.<33> He coordinated sabotage campaigns against military and government targets, making plans for a possible guerrilla war if the sabotage failed to end apartheid.<34> Mandela also raised funds for MK abroad and arranged for paramilitary training of the group.<34>

Fellow ANC member Wolfie Kadesh explains the bombing campaign led by Mandela: "When we knew that we going to start on 16 December 1961, to blast the symbolic places of apartheid, like pass offices, native magistrates courts, and things like that ... post offices and ... the government offices. But we were to do it in such a way that nobody would be hurt, nobody would get killed."<35> Mandela said of Wolfie: "His knowledge of warfare and his first hand battle experience were extremely helpful to me."<12>

Mandela described the move to armed struggle as a last resort; years of increasing repression and violence from the state convinced him that many years of non-violent protest against apartheid had not and could not achieve any progress.<12><36>

[Teaser]

15. which is what I just said

.

[tabatha]

19. Unlike Gaddafii, he tried to avoid killing people.

[JackRiddler]

23. Mandela successfully communicated with the ANC many times while in prison.

[Distant Observer]

11. Mandela DID bomb, with Gaddafi's support. And Jesus cleansed the temple

My point is that at a time when the UN under US leadership condemned and sanctioned Gaddafi,
Mandela came forward to support him.

There may be "THE REST OF THE STORY" different from what is being portrayed in the MSM.
Remember, all the MSM rallied for the Iraq war and told us there was WMD and the Iraqi
scientist were deceitful liars.

[tabatha]

14. Mandela did not bomb with Gaddafii's support.

Gaddafi entered the Libyan military academy at Benghazi in 1961 and, along with most of his colleagues from the Revolutionary Command Council, graduated in the 1965–66 period.

Mandela went to prison in 1962.

President Mandela took a particular interest in helping to resolve the long-running dispute between Gaddafi's Libya, on the one hand, and the United States and Britain on the other, over bringing to trial the two Libyans who were indicted in November 1991 and accused of sabotaging Pan Am Flight 103, which crashed at the Scottish town of Lockerbie on 21 December 1988, with the loss of 270 lives.<90> As early as 1992, Mandela informally approached President George H.W. Bush with a proposal to have the two indicted Libyans tried in a third country. Bush reacted favourably to the proposal, as did President François Mitterrand of France and King Juan Carlos I of Spain.<91> In November 1994 – six months after his election as president – Mandela formally proposed that South Africa should be the venue for the Pan Am Flight 103 bombing trial.<92>

However, British Prime Minister John Major flatly rejected the idea saying the British government did not have confidence in foreign courts.<93> A further three years elapsed until Mandela's offer was repeated to Major's successor, Tony Blair, when the president visited London in July 1997. Later the same year, at the 1997 Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting (CHOGM) at Edinburgh in October 1997, Mandela warned:

"No one nation should be complainant, prosecutor and judge."

A compromise solution was then agreed for a trial to be held at Camp Zeist in the Netherlands, governed by Scots law, and President Mandela began negotiations with Colonel Gaddafi for the handover of the two accused (Megrahi and Fhimah) in April 1999.<94> At the end of their nine-month trial, the verdict was announced on 31 January 2001. Fhimah was found not guilty, but Megrahi was convicted and sentenced to 27 years in a Scottish jail. Megrahi's initial appeal was turned down in March 2002, and former president Mandela went to visit him in Barlinnie prison on 10 June 2002.

[Distant Observer]

16. Correction I meant the ANC DID bomb with Gaddafi's financial support

I was in Africa during the heat of the conflict.

[tabatha]

18. Which years?

I left in 1977, and visited in 1988.

[babylonsister]

20. Thank you, Tabatha, for making that big distinction and difference. nt

[tabatha]

5. Mandela was in jail until 1990.

Then he was involved in a transitional government and being a President of a new democracy.

Gaddafi did give money to the ANC. But, what I know of Mandela, he would not have supported Gaddafi's brutal ways.

Not at all.

[Warpy]

8. Nope, things can change drastically in 14 years.

Remember, the US had a thriving economy 14 years ago and guess what happened.

[qazplm]

13. would Jesus have gone to war with Germany in WWII?

Or Japan?

[Arkana]

22. Well, if he hadn't, the entire West Coast of the US might have fallen under Japanese control

[JackRiddler]

24. Maybe after the part with bombing Pearl Harbor and Germany declaring war on the US, yes.

[Arkana]

21. I'd say that Mandela didn't know the Gaddafi of today, apparently.