Vermont gov: I can see N.H. from my house!

[BrentWil]

THis points out to me the reality of the situation. Jobs and capital can move. Your tax rate has to stay low enough where you keep them in your area (Rather National or at the State Level) There are some hard choices ahead. Our job is to ensure responsible government that helps the middle and lower classes, as much as possible. But reality is reality.

I can see N.H. from my house!

Vermont Gov. Peter Shumlin, a Democrat with a unified legislature, is rejecting calls from within his party to raise taxes. And he has a Sarah Palin joke to explain why.

“My problem is, on the eastern side of me, I’ve got the state of New Hampshire,” he told POLITICO. “Sarah Palin said that she could do foreign policy because she could see Russia from her house. Well, I’m the first governor in 40 years that can see New Hampshire from my house. So I can do tax policy. And I can tell you, we’ve got no more capacity. They’re killing us.”

New Hampshire has no sales tax and no income tax.

[MannyGoldstein]

1. Mass has the highest rate of new job creation in the country

And we border NH. And we have taxes.

And it's OK.

[RainDog]

2. and the educational institutions and tech corridor to fuel those jobs n/t

Vermont is largely rural

[Oak2004]

5. VT has always had higher taxes than NH

That means we have a rational progressive taxation system as opposed to NH's mess of user fees.

Funny, but I don't remember VT as having always been plagued by high unemployment.

Raise taxes. Don't cut services to the most vulnerable and mouth the usual crap about "hard choices". Which is the genuine hard and courageous choice-- raising taxes on those who can pay, or cutting yet more services to the poor, elderly, and disabled?

[BrentWil]

6. Then you won't have rich in your state

Because they will leave, at a certain rate. Then your tax base will tank. I have seen it over and over again in Urban centers.

THe World isn't prefect, but there is a point where higher taxes only hurts everyone.

[MannyGoldstein]

10. Mass. is #6 in millionaires (per capita)

http://finance.yahoo.com/real-estate/article/109083/the-richest-states-in-america

Taxes don't seem to be hurting us too badly.

[BrentWil]

12. As I said, there are other factors

It is a much more complex picture then the GOP suggests. Human Capital, for example, is a huge advantage that MA has. However, with that said, taxes are part of the picture.

[upi402]

13. Rich don't pay in the end

They have tax attorneys and loopholes. So they go to another state, no loss. Where they gonna go... China? America needs them bleeding us pale more?

[BrentWil]

15. THey actually do...

The top 1 percent pay more taxes then the bottom 95 percent. http://www.taxfoundation.org/blog/show/24944.html


Of course the other part of the coin is that the top 20 percent own 85 percent of the wealth. http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html

[MannyGoldstein]

17. Not really.

Social security is treated as income to the General Account. Most people pay more in Social Security than in income tax.

Thus, all told, the rich pay a far smaller amount. In fact, when one includes Social Security payments, the wealthiest Americans pay about 17% to the feds vs. 16% from the median worker.

The people who get hosed are the upper-middle and lower-upper classes. They pay 30%+ to the feds because, unlike the rich, they don't have appreciable unearned income (i.e., "capital gains") taxed at 15%.

[upi402]

19. Also, the rich don't pay any FICA after $106,800 income. n/t

[BrentWil]

20. FICA does stop..

But as of actual money into the government, they still pay more. But as I stated, they also have more.

[upi402]

18. not so

not the whole story at all. they pay a smaller percentage of their income than lower income levels pay;
http://philosophers-stone.typepad.com/my_weblog/2006/11/how_the_rich_do.html

i wont read your link because i've been in this rodeo thousands of time over decades. somehow i mystically predicted your reply. and i also know that no mattr how many citations i provide that posters who pity the rich will never see that.

[Oak2004]

22. The rich are paying less total tax than they have at any time in the modern era

We are very far away from needing to worry about driving the rich into the poorhouse.

[MannyGoldstein]

8. We need to all race to the top

We will lose any race to the bottom to microwage nations.

[BrentWil]

9. No we won't

At the macro level, we are all winning. China has had the largest reduction in poverty in World history, according to the UN. India has brought 300 million out of poverty. We can all work towards a better future.

[MannyGoldstein]

11. We should all race to the top

China too.

But a US State trying to beat China et al in high-volume unsophisticated manufacturing is like Usain Bolt trying to be the winning jockey in the Kentucky Derby.

[BrentWil]

14. I agree..

And I hate the demonization of both China and India. They have both done amazing things for their people.

[BrentWil]

4. No one said that it is the only thing that determines job creation...

However, even for MA there is a rate in which jobs will start to leave.

[bluestate10]

25. Taxes aren't the problem. The issue is how well tax money is utilized. nt.

[cali]

3. This is the one thing that doesn't make me happy with my new gov

but seeing as he's the guy championing single payer and today in DC was the only major figure to stand with and address protesters, I can live with it.

[ClarkUSA]

7. NH has hefty property taxes, though.

He does have a point, although his reference to Palin is politically tone-deaf.

[BrentWil]

16. Is that a state wide tax in NH?

Or by county?

[ClarkUSA]

23. By county.

Take a look: http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=NH+property+tax+by+county&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

[Historic NY]

21. Appears they are raking it in.....gravel tax?

http://www.revenue.nh.gov/faq/gti-rev.htm#SEPT

[ClarkUSA]

24. heh

:D