Artisan Cheese Under Attack

[marmar]

from the Food Renegade blog:




Artisan Cheese Under Attack
Wednesday, February 09th, 2011 |





The FDA has declared that no one should consume raw dairy for any reason. So, it’s not surprising that they have come down hard on raw milk artisan cheese makers like Estrella Family Creamery in Washington state. In the interview below, radio host (and local Weston A. Price chapter leader) Shonagh Home interviews Kelli Estrella to get the inside story of the FDA’s heavy handedness.

You absolutely MUST listen to this interview!

It is full of example after example of law-maker’s ignorance regarding heritage foods like artisan cheese. In one example that Kelli provides, the FDA argued with her about the wooden shelving she uses to age her hard cheeses. According to Kelli, these shelves are an integral part of the making of quality cheeses, much like the kind of wooden cask contributes to the bouquet and flavor of various aged wines. Yet to the FDA, these shelves were “unsanitary” despite being tested clean time after time for pathogens. They want to see stainless steel shelves, as in a cheese factory.

In another example, the FDA hounded her for her recipes. Kelli balked. She’s an artisan cheese maker. She doesn’t use recipes. “It’s not like I’m making chocolate chip cookies,” she said. .................(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.foodrenegade.com/artisan-cheese-under-attack/

[xchrom]

1. recommend -- small movements like this is how we rebuild an american cuisine.

i think these people should be held up as examples -- and aided with government help to create the best product possible.

[Scruffy1]

59. And make a lot of people sick

Listeria is no joke. I would have shut the dam place down too.

[handmade34]

2. rec

[Solly Mack]

3. K&R

[myrna minx]

4. K&R n/t

[Erose999]

5. K&R I love artisan cheeses, especially raw milk ones.

[regnaD kciN]

6. A bit more information about this story...

Problems at Estrella began in February. That's when an inspection by the Washington State Department of Agriculture (WSDA) turned up Listeria monocytogenes, a bacteria found in animal feces, in the creamery's production areas and in its finished cheese, according to court records. WSDA found the bacteria in March, as well.

(...)

On Aug. 2, the FDA conducted an unannounced inspection, taking scores of swabs throughout the operation. Several swabs turned up listeria, although no cheese tested positive at that time.

"They found I think a total of four in the whole entire place," Estrella said.

Two weeks later, an investigator took a sample of a cheese called Caldwell Crik Chevrette and that also tested positive for the bacteria. On Sept. 1, the FDA and WSDA conducted another inspection and this time the creamery revealed that it had been testing cheeses in recent months, and had six positive tests between May and August, court documents state.

More here.

When I was a child living in Europe, I once got some unsanitary raw milk, and was sick as a dog for over two weeks. (Imagine the worst stomach flu you could ever have, and multiply it by four.) Sad to say, I'm not all-that-sympathetic with feces-filled food products, no matter how "artisan" they may be.

Oh, and there's this...

Estrella said the whole episode — and a similar recent incident involving a Missouri cheesemaker — shows that the country is off-track.

"To me the subject of this whole thing isn't really about listeria," she said. "It's about liberty and freedoms."

On the company's website, she likened the action to government attempts to take away guns and said her faith in God would help the family get through this. The post has since been removed.

Can the Cheese Party be far away? :eyes:

[PearliePoo2]

10. She don't NEED no stinkin' FDA?

"She likened the action to government attempts to take away guns and said her faith in God would help the family get through this."
Is God going to take away the Listeria from her cheese so people don't get SICK?

[MineralMan]

13. Ah, Listeria. How did I know there was a Listeria story about

this "artisan" cheesemaker? Hmph!

[MattBaggins]

14. Found listeria in the finished cheeses.

But we don't talk about that. This is about magical small farmers and "heritage".

[MineralMan]

16. Yup. Listeria is a nasty, nasty bug, and every year, raw milk

dairies make the news when Listeria cases crop up. Public health is a legitimate concern of government, and food regulations designed to help protect public health are completely justified. Pasteurization of milk has saved countless lives since it was introduced. What's not to like?

[FLAprogressive]

20. Don't ruin the outrage with logic!!!

[lumberjack_jeff]

25. +1. The Estrellas are not victims here.

http://www.marlerblog.com/case-news/should-estrella-family-creamery-be-treated-differently-than-sangar-when-it-comes-to-listeria/

[MineralMan]

52. Thanks for that link. It demonstrates that advocacy websites

are not always the best source for information.

[Renew Deal]

54. She has a God given right to eat feces cheese

:9

[Scruffy1]

60. There you go again using facts and reason

I could name hundreds of examples, but the one that sticks in my mind was the farmer who got tetanus because he didn't believe in vaccinations. The fact that he built his new hog barn on the sight of an old horse barn didn't help since horses manure is famous for tetanus. Luckily the guy lived, which was amazing back in the 60's. I think he had been brainwashed by a fundy church, which he quit after he got out of the hospital. From then on every guest was questioned about the currency of his vaccinations in a nice way.
My father dedicated his life to improving the public health by controlling diseases spread from animal to man and to make both humans and animals healthier. Every time I hear one of these ignorant assholes spout off on his food theories
I want to choke them. Arguing does no good because the information is readily available from the USDA and millions of other sources. They choose to be ignorant.

[meegbear]

7. When cheese is outlawed, only outlaws will have cheese

[ChazII]

9. Thanks for the chuckle. n/t

[MineralMan]

17. Raw Milk Products - Russian Roulette You Can Eat!

The new ad campaign.

[reggie the dog]

74. you have no idea what you are talking about

millions of people eat raw milk cheese each day here in france and becuase there is strict sanitary policy people do not get sick, no russian roulette, just good raw milk "lait cru" cheese

[MedicalAdmin]

8. Great post.

I'm waiting for the usual corporate science supporters to show up chanting "woo, woo,"'while ignoring evidence that the Corp controlled FDA is wrong.

[jeff47]

19. Yes, how dare the FDA not want listeria in food.

Clearly, it's an evil corporate conspiracy preventing us from getting food poisoning as God intended.

I'm all for "artisan" cheese, but this demonstrates that not everyone can make it safely.

[MedicalAdmin]

65. OK, maybe I missed something.

And if I did I'll go stand in a corner and look chagrined, but what exactly is this woman doing wrong? Do they even have a case of wrongdoing? Has harm happened?

I guess we just need to bomb the hell out of France for mass murder via cheese. After all, the body count over there must be HUGE.

[MattBaggins]

69. Read some of the posts here that actually link the FDA complaints

She was observed taking core samples, biting into them and then putting the core back.

She had listeria in her cheese samples.

She is using "the big ebil gubmint is after poor liddle ol me" excuse to cover the fact that she has no clue how to run a sanitary operation.

[MedicalAdmin]

72. I'll go stand in the corner now. Can I borrow your pointy hat?

Serves me right for shooting from the hip. (hangs head in shame)

[EOTE]

24. Ahhh, yes the "woo woo" of harmful bacteria causing illness.

Everyone knows there's no correlation between consuming harmful bacteria and becoming sick. Listen, no one here thinks the FDA should control every aspect of our lives. But protecting us from stuff that could make us incredibly sick, or even dead, is something the FDA should definitely continue doing.

[MedicalAdmin]

67. I agree. Mostly.

But this seems to be a case of corporate guidelines being adopted without input from the artisan producers. It seems that the French are dying in droves via cheese made exactly like this woman is.

Does everyone know that there's no correlation between consuming harmful bacteria and becoming sick? I'm not sure. Did you mean causation? Because I could build a case of correlation between my toe nail clippings and how much money wall street is stealing daily. I'll take pictures. It's proof.

Seriously tho', they are swating a gnat with a sledgehammer. How many people have / might die from a small producer artisan cheese maker? What is the number one killer in America? And why is it that McDonalds gets to sell shit that is proven to kill (over time) - is it because they have steel shelving or is it because of the $$$ they spread upon the political and regulatory systems?

I'm just spit balling here, but it really is a matter of realtives to me. All of which means zip, I realize, but c'mon, there isn't a reported case, is there? Are they just grasping at straws?

It's not like the field tests the FDA and USDA use are anything close to accurate (they still candle eggs fer cryin out loud) and they don't seem to spend a commesurate amount of time crawling up the ass of big producers as they do small. Why is that?

[Divernan]

11. Recipe or not, how she makes her cheese is a trade secret

39 states have different laws protecting proprietary information. She needs to check out what Washington State law says. If the state has no law, it should pass one ASAP. Even the GOP should get behind such a law.

Proprietary information, also known as a trade secret, is information that a company wishes to keep confidential or protect from those outside the company. The Uniform Trade Secrets Act (UTSA) defines trade secrets as "information that derives independent economic value from not being generally known, and that is kept secret through reasonable actions." Proprietary information can include secret formulas, processes, and methods used in production. It can also include a company's business and marketing plans, salary structure, customer lists, contracts, and computer systems. In some cases, the special knowledge and skills that an employee has learned on the job are considered to be a company's proprietary information.

"Simply put, a trade secret is unpublished knowledge that, unlike a patent, can be kept forever if it is maintained as a secret," Keith Orum wrote in Beverage World. "One common characteristic of a trade secret is that it gives its owner an advantage over the competition in the marketplace. Other characteristics of a trade secret are that it can't be easily 'reverse-engineered,' and that its secrecy must be aggressively protected by its owners."

Although legal protections exist for inventions (patents), creative works (copyrights), and distinctive names and symbols (trademarks), no specific form of legal protection is available for trade secrets. In fact, there is no single standard by which to determine whether or not information is proprietary—some 39 U.S. states have different laws that define a trade secret and the conditions under which it is considered to have been stolen. But there is a significant body of case law covering proprietary information and trade secrets. This legal framework recognizes a company's right to have proprietary information and provides the company with remedies when its trade secrets have been misused or appropriated illegally.

In some ways, the lack of specific forms of protection makes it easier for small businesses to protect their proprietary information. No complicated forms or formal registration are required, for instance, and trade secret protection lasts indefinitely—or at least as long as the information remains secret. In other ways, however, the lack of specific forms of trade secret protection hurts small businesses. It does not prevent competitors from determining the trade secrets by examining products already on the market, for example, and it does not prevent others from using the proprietary information once it is uncovered. Compared to other legal forms of protection, it also makes it more difficult to prove a violation of rights.

Read more: Proprietary Information - advantage, cost, Protecting trade secrets http://www.referenceforbusiness.com/small/Op-Qu/Proprietary-Information.html#ixzz1DwXNoum7

[MattBaggins]

12. Anti-vaccers or raw milkers.... who will kill more people?

No diseases in raw milk.. nope non at all... all small farmers are automatically honorable and wouldn't ever skip rules or regulations to ensure the public health.

heavy handedness?

Government doesn't understand "heritage artisan cheeses" or the "small farms are magical places where cows romp and frolic" folks don't understand disease vectors?

[reggie the dog]

73. reserach before you speak

raw milk cheese is not a health danger, otherwise shitloads of people would be dropping dead here in france where many cheeses, both artisan and supermarket sold, are raw milk cheeses. i eat it several times a week and have so for years. perhaps it is because we cannot feed our cows the hormones you feed cows in the usa

[LiberalEsto]

15. They'll have to pry my cheese

from my cold dead fingers

[krabigirl]

41. Same here.

[struggle4progress]

18. Raw Milk and Cheeses: Health Risks are Still Black and White

http://www.cdc.gov/healthypets/cheesespotlight/cheese_spotlight.htm

The Dangers of Raw Milk: Unpasteurized Milk Can Pose a Serious Health Risk
http://www.fda.gov/Food/ResourcesForYou/Consumers/ucm079516.htm

Raw Milk Associated Public Healthy Risks <ppt>
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Food/FoodSafety/Product-SpecificInformation/MilkSafety/ConsumerInformationAboutMilkSafety/UCM181964.ppt

It's fine with me if hobbyists want to make raw milk cheeses for themselves. But if folk want to introduce food products into the marketplace, then they have some obligation to assure the products meet modern food safety standards.

When the lady says her wooden shelving is an "integral part" of her cheese-making "much like the kind of wooden cask contributes to the bouquet and flavor of various aged wines," she's simply bullshitting: if she has a dry sanitary shelf, there is no "bouquet" or "flavor" passing from the shelf through the cheese rind into the cheese; if the shelf affects the flavor of the cheese, it's because there's some unknown bacterial or fungal gangbanging party while the cheese sits on a moist dirty porous piece of wooden shelf

She's bullshitting when she refuses to give the FDA her recipes, too. Yeah, cheesemaking is an "art" -- but it's a pretty precise and well-studied art for the great cheeses. She just doesn't want to tell the FDA she's winging it or taking sanitary shortcuts that she thinks don't matter

[FLPanhandle]

21. Just put a warning label on it and let people make their own choices.

The FDA can put a warning label on Raw Milk cheeses as easily as having warning labels on cigarettes.

We don't need this much Nanny state.

[struggle4progress]

27. "... on 9/1/10 cheese wheels were observed being stored in cheese storage Cave I, in direct contact

with rough-cut, undressed lumber shelving that showed a buildup of product residue. On 9/1/10 a leaking cooler water line in Cave 1 was observed dripping onto the top wood shelf within several inches of exposed cheese product ... the owner was observed on 9/1/10 removing a core of cheese from a wheel with a trier, placed a portion of cheese into her mouth, and replaced the cheese plug in the wheel, before loading it for transport to market. The trier was wiped with a rag after each use without apparent washing or sanitizing and no hand washing was observed before a repeat of this process ... the owner was observed on 9/1/10 making multiple trips to transfer unwrapped ready-to-eat cheese from the processing area to the retail area and transport vehicle without washing her hands before handling other ready-to-eat cheeses ... on 9/1/10 cheese wheels were observed stored directly on rough-cut wood shelving in Cave I that showed extensive splintering and loose wood particles. Loose nuts, bolts, tacks, and other metal parts were observed on several shelves next to produeL A hand wrench was observed lying on one shelf in direct contact with a wheel of cheese ...

<FDA Report on Estrella (pdf):> http://www.fda.gov/downloads/AboutFDA/CentersOffices/ORA/ORAElectronicReadingRoom/UCM231080.pdf

I'm not particularly excited about the prospect of replacing sanitary practice regulations by a vague warning label

[FLPanhandle]

30. Those issues aren't related to the cheese being made from raw milk

Those are sanitary issues that could just as well come from pasteurized milk cheeses. You are combining two separate issues.

Raw milk cheese is made safely daily in Europe. If the FDA is concerned about it, then put a warning label on it.

[struggle4progress]

47. The Estrellas claim they're being persecuted for making raw milk cheeses. They aren't.

They're under fire for unsanitary practices. Many raw milk cheeses are legal in the US, if produced appropriately

[FLPanhandle]

49. "The FDA has declared that no one should consume raw dairy for any reason."

Do you agree with that FDA statement?

No one is saying they shouldn't do it in a sanitary manner, but that FDA statement is ominous and could be considered an attack on artisan cheeses.

[struggle4progress]

56. The OP is a plea for donations to an unsanitary dairy, which is trying to distract everyone

from its real problems -- and you aren't quoting an actual FDA statement: you're quoting from the garbage OP

[Arkansas Granny]

55. It does sound like unsanitary practices are the cause of the problem, not raw milk.

Pasteurization alone cannot make up for bad sanitation at other stages of making the finished product.

[GreenArrow]

40. Sounds simple. Sounds reasonable.

Sounds practicable. Therefore, that idea is bound to find little or no support.

[LanternWaste]

58. I think that was the premise of The Jungle by Upton Sinclair...

"Just put a warning label on it and let people make their own choices."

I think that was the premise of The Jungle by Upton Sinclair... :eyes:

[reggie the dog]

36. the lady is not bullshitting

ask the artisan cheese producers here in france and they will say the same. taste comes from many different elements, and ageing cheese in a different cellar will give it a different taste.

[struggle4progress]

50. Factors like temperature and light exposure might matter, and these will vary with cellar.

I'm sure storing cheese (as the Estrella folk do) on "rough-cut, undressed lumber shelving that showed a buildup of product residue" with a nearby "leaking cooler water line .. dripping onto the top wood shelf within several inches of exposed cheese product" could affect the flavor too, but it would be because of unknown and uncontrolled bacterial/fungal contamination, not from careful use of known and harmless cheese culture

[cali]

68. right. terroir and affinage

[FLPanhandle]

22. France manages just fine with a large raw milk cheese industry

They aren't dropping dead by the hundreds.

I like artisan raw milk cheeses. Of course, I've been known to eat things from street vendors in Mexico too. :)

[struggle4progress]

28. "On Oct. 21, 2010, the United States Marshals Service seized all cheeses, including in-process and

finished products .. on the premises of the Estrella Family Creamery, pursuant to a warrant issued by Judge Benjamin H. Settle on Oct. 21, 2010. Judge Settle issued this warrant at the request of the United States Attorney’s Office for the Western District of Washington, which filed a complaint in the United States District Court for the Western District of Washington alleging that cheese and other articles of food held at Estrella Family Creamery are adulterated under the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act because they have been held under insanitary conditions whereby they may have become contaminated with filth or whereby they may have been rendered injurious to health ...
http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm224990.htm

emphasis added

[FLPanhandle]

31. No one is arguing that cheeses should be made and stored in sanitary conditions.

Raw milk cheeses can and should be made in sanitary conditions. However, to ban raw milk cheeses just because of some are made in poor conditions is silly. Other cheeses can just as easily be made in unsanitary environments also.

[struggle4progress]

48. The Estrellas don't seem to be making cheese under sanitary conditions

[Chimichurri]

23. Prescribing seizure meds for anything is okay but raw milk isn't

[krabigirl]

43. Pretty much.

[Gormy Cuss]

26. "radio host (and local Weston A. Price chapter leader) Shonagh Home ..."

Weston A. Price chapter? The group that carps about teh evil soybean and thinks what's wrong with our diet is that we eat too little animal fat? That Weston A. Price foundation?

[reggie the dog]

29. i eat this kind of cheese all the time here in france

i have never once been ill from it, pasturized cheese has no taste damn it!

[FLPanhandle]

33. +1

Raw oysters can be dangerous too, but I'll still eat them.

[reggie the dog]

39. in france we often start with raw oysters and finish with non pasturized cheese

[cali]

71. I eat it too, My neighbors are credited with being some of the best artisan cheese

makers in the U.S., but you're wrong about cheeses from pasteurized milk having no taste.

http://www.murrayscheese.com/prodinfo.asp?number=20301100000

These are some of my favorite raw milk cheeses:

DORSET A washed-rind, raw Jersey cow milk cheese. A soft ripening cheese with a rich, buttery texture and seasonally influenced pungency. An elegant appetizer or dessert, often served here in the historic village of Dorset, VT. Available year-round in 2.5 pound wheels.
Winner American Cheese Society (2008)
Winner World Jersey Cheese Awards (2008)

RUPERT An aged, raw Jersey cow milk cheese inspired by great European Alpine cheeses like Gruyère and Comté. These 25-pound mega-wheels age a minimum of six months, with a sharpness and complexity that gains with time. A long aging cheese like the town of Rupert, VT, one of our states oldest towns, settled in 1761. Available year-round in 25 pound wheels.
'Best In Show' 3rd Place Overall, American Cheese Society (2009)

PAWLET Raw Jersey cow milk is the basis of this Italian-style toma, which is aged four to six months. A creamy texture and bright bite makes this a great sandwich cheese or an appetizer with broad palate appeal. A versatile cheese, like the town of Pawlet, VT which brings us slate, syrup, and timber. Available year-round in 10 pound wheels.
Winner American Cheese Society (2008)
Winner American Cheese Society (2009)

http://www.considerbardwellfarm.com/cheese.html

Bayley Hazen Blue is a natural rinded blue cheese. It is made with whole raw milk every other day, primarily with morning milk, which is lower in fat. Ayrshire milk is particularly well suited to the production of blue cheese because of its small fat globules, which are easily broken down during the aging process. The paste of a Bayley Hazen is drier than most blues and the penicillium roqueforti takes a back seat to an array of flavors that hint at nuts and grasses and in the odd batch, licorice. Though drier and crumblier than most blues, its texture reminds one of chocolate and butter. It is aged between 4 and 6 months. We developed this recipe by starting with a Devon Blue recipe, changing its shape, and altering the aging process to end up with a stable rind that will hold up under typical retail conditions.
http://www.jasperhillfarm.com/

Made in Vermont by Andy and Mateo Kehler at Jasper Hill Farms, these small cylindrical wonders always make me smile. Biting into a slice of Constant Bliss, its buttery richness coats your tongue, even as a light acidic bite plays at the back of your palate. There’s almost a tingle at the roof of your mouth as the cheese awakens your taste buds, its resonance slowly fading until a lingering, clean flavor is all that remains. Though modeled after a French Chaource, this version hardly even resembles it. Made from raw whole cow’s milk, Constant Bliss is a mold-ripened soft cheese aged for exactly 60 days (the legal age for raw milk cheeses in the US.) I’ve found that less acidic white wines (Chardonnay) pair nicely with when Constant Bliss is still young but after it’s developed more character and spicy notes a Pinot Noir or Super Tuscan blends are better partners.

http://www.tastingsgourmetmarket.com/store/item.asp?ITEM_ID=82

[dionysus]

32. if you're selling food, you have to meet FDA guidelines. simple as that.

[reggie the dog]

37. yet we eat raw milk cheese here in france every day

and have so for centuries and we are not dropping dead..... hmmm

[regnaD kciN]

62. Perhaps, but...

...France was where I got the raw milk that made me sick as a child. Just sayin'...

[krabigirl]

44. Funny how the FDA approves crap like Velveeta, though.

[KamaAina]

34. Got listeria?

:P

[reggie the dog]

38. i refuse to buy the mass produced pasturized cheeses here in france

and stick to the small scale unpasturized cheeses and have never had a problem, nor have most french people

[krabigirl]

42. When I go to visit my in-laws there, we do the same. Artisan cheeses have never made me sick.

Commercial, chemical-laden cheeses are nasty.

[JVS]

35. Maybe she needs to develop some artisan public safety precautions.

[annabanana]

45. LEAVE THE CHEESE ALONE

[cali]

46. Vermont produces a hell of a lot of raw milk cheeses

and there has never been a listeria problem with any of them.

<snip>

All the fuss is over a rule that some experts say is a blatant anachronism.

The aging rule was created in the late 1940s in response to outbreaks of typhoid fever linked to cheese.

Scientists knew then that hard cheeses, like cheddar, dried out as they aged, making them less hospitable to bacteria.

So regulators decided that if cheese was not made with pasteurized milk, it should be aged. But the choice of 60 days as the necessary threshold was a fairly arbitrary one, according to Dennis J. D’Amico, senior research scientist of the Vermont Institute for Artisan Cheese of the University of Vermont.

Since then, many things have changed. The primary pathogens that now cause illness associated with cheese, like toxic forms of E. coli and listeria, were either unknown in the 1940s or not of great concern. And artisan cheesemakers today are making many cheeses whose chemistry varies greatly from the basic hard cheddar of six decades ago.

“The 60-day rule wasn’t based on real science,” Dr. D’Amico said. “The pathogens have changed and the cheeses have certainly changed. But the rule has not.”


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/05/business/05cheese.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2&src=busln

[Arugula Latte]

51. You know what is dangerous cheese? Crapola like Velveeta!

It's not even cheese -- it's more like disgusting orange processed sludge.

[Renew Deal]

53. Aren't raw milk cheeses safe?

I thought the issue was just milk. Raw milk cheese is extremely common.

[struggle4progress]

57. Tuberculosis Cases Prompt Warning on Raw-Milk Cheese (NYT | 2005)

By MARC SANTORA
Published: March 16, 2005

One infant has died and dozens of New Yorkers have contracted tuberculosis from 2001 through 2004 by eating cheese made from raw milk that was contaminated with bacteria, city and federal officials said yesterday ...

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/16/nyregion/16milk.html?_r=1

[packback]

61. makes sense if you think about it

You have to remember that cheese does not have the same restrictions as tobacco or liquor but it can be just as dangerous when the wrong person eats it without being aware of the contents or the context in which it was produced.

[regnaD kciN]

63. By the way, a false equivalency here...

It is full of example after example of law-maker’s ignorance regarding heritage foods like artisan cheese. In one example that Kelli provides, the FDA argued with her about the wooden shelving she uses to age her hard cheeses. According to Kelli, these shelves are an integral part of the making of quality cheeses, much like the kind of wooden cask contributes to the bouquet and flavor of various aged wines.

Wines can be aged in wood because the alcohol kills off any residual bacteria; cheese doesn't have that sterilizing property. It's a little like saying that, since loaves of bread can be left at room temperature for many days, there should be no problem with leaving raw meat out for similar periods of time.

[mainer]

64. Raw milk cheeses more delicious ... but it's risk vs. reward

If you're an otherwise healthy person, not pregnant, not immunosuppressed, then raw milk cheeses are a true delight. I ate them all the time in France and never got sick.

But if you're in a risk group, Listeria can kill you.

It's the same with oysters. Or rare hamburgers. Or Caesar salad with raw eggs. You just have to weigh whether the reward (amazing food) is worth the risk of being sick.

Most of the time, I think the risk's worth it.

[Liberal_in_LA]

66. k&r

[Matariki]

70. Outlawed cheese so evil it tries to eat your eyes....

http://boingboing.net/2009/01/15/maggot-cheese-that-t.html

Casu marzu is an illegal Sardinian cheese that is served riddled with writhing maggots that try to jump into your eyeballs as you eat it.

Casu marzu is considered toxic when the maggots in the cheese have died. Because of this, only cheese in which the maggots are still alive is eaten. When the cheese has fermented enough, it is cut into thin strips and spread on moistened Sardinian flatbread (pane carasau), to be served with a strong red wine.<6><7> Casu marzu is believed to be an aphrodisiac by local Sardinians.<1> Because the larvae in the cheese can launch themselves for distances up to 15 centimetres (6 in) when disturbed,<5><8> diners hold their hands above the sandwich to prevent the maggots from leaping into their eyes.<3> Those who do not wish to eat live maggots place the cheese in a sealed paper bag. The maggots, starved for oxygen, writhe and jump in the bag, creating a "pitter-patter" sound. When the sounds subside, the maggots are dead and the cheese can be eaten.<9>

[reggie the dog]

75. we have worm cheese here in france too

i tried it but am not very fond of it