Egypt Thread #4 (1-30-11)

[justiceischeap]

JacobPark Jacob Park
AJE video of ElBaradei speaking through a bullhorn not live; seems to be about 10-15 min after the fact. #Egypt

http://twitter.com/#!/JacobPark/status/31767762032402432

[DearAbby]

K&R new thread

Thanks

[gateley]

1. Thank you!! Kick! Recommend! nt

[L. Coyote]

44. ***** Al Jazeera English: Live Stream *****

http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/

[justiceischeap]

2. 'ElBaradei’s words about dignity, honor, living a life devoid of indignity'

AymanM Ayman Mohyeldin
#ElBaradei’s words about dignity, honor, living a life devoid of indignity that #Egyptians have suffered most resonate w #Egyptians #jan25


http://twitter.com/#!/AymanM/status/31768498917081088

[defendandprotect]

78. K/R --

[justiceischeap]

3. BBC Arabic: Martin Indyk former US Ambassador to Israel & Brookings VP says that it seems the US gov

SultanAlQassemi Sultan Al Qassemi
by JacobPark
BBC Arabic: Martin Indyk former US Ambassador to Israel & Brookings VP says that it seems the US government is leaning to @ElBaradei

http://twitter.com/#!/SultanAlQassemi/status/31768338203942912

[dixiegrrrrl]

4. Link back to old thread, for bookmarking if you need it:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x307160#308309

Hey, y'all.....I will be back in a bit, have something to take care of.

[justiceischeap]

5. Reuters: Police getting back to streets of Egypt

Jan25voices Jan25 Voices
Reuters: Police getting back to streets of #Egypt for traffic, crime control but not sent in to confront protesters #jan25 #jan28

http://twitter.com/#!/Jan25voices/status/31769906684891136

[elleng]

7. Good news.

[justiceischeap]

6. 'In the 50's a bunch of colonels took over w/ coups, in 2011 MILLIONS OF CITIZENS'

weddady weddady
In the 50's a bunch of colonels took over with coups, in 2011 MILLIONS OF CITIZENS brought down dictators #Jan25

http://twitter.com/#!/weddady/status/31771389048393728

[justiceischeap]

8. 'Since I'm tired of PC, here's what many r thinking but don't want to say-the islamist scare'

weddady weddady
Since I'm tired of PC, here's what many r thinking but don't want to say-the islamist scare= "arabs aren't ready for democracy" #Jan25

http://twitter.com/#!/weddady/status/31772666822135808

[justiceischeap]

9. in response to news of redeployment of Police tomorrow, protestors say they will arrest any police'

jan25live Jan 25 Live
RNN: Now: in response to news of redeployment of Police tomorrow, protestors say they will arrest any police office they see.

http://twitter.com/#!/jan25live/status/31773490575056896

[justiceischeap]

10. 'Even if Mubarak used his entire arsenal of US-supplied weaponry he'd never be able to stop'

justimage matthew cassel
Even if Mubarak used his entire arsenal of US-supplied weaponry he'd never be able to stop the people power present at Tahrir Sq right now!

http://twitter.com/#!/justimage/status/31774270518464512

[justiceischeap]

11. 'People told El Baradei: We don't need anyone to represent us.'

abdu Abdurahman Warsame
People told El Baradei: We don't need anyone to represent us. Couldn't finish his speech and left dejected #Egypt #cairo #Elbaradei

http://twitter.com/#!/abdu/status/31775401915187200

[fishwax]

12. Protesters in Tahrir Square spell out "Down with Mubarak" with their bodies

:kick:

[rollin74]

13. Al Jazeera reporter in Cairo

just said that there is once again Interior Ministry police presence on the streets for the first time in a couple of days

[justiceischeap]

14. 'They gave me yellow armband to wear to avoid harassment'

sharifkouddous Sharif Kouddous
passed thru neighborhood patrol. Most holding sticks, teenager holding shotgun. They gave me yellow armband to wear to avoid harassment

http://twitter.com/#!/sharifkouddous/status/31781897486999554

The people of Cairo seem to be policing themselves quite well.

[Iterate]

15. 55% of AJE traffic is from the US and Canada

55% of our Al Jazeera English (http://english.aljazeera.net) web traffic is from the US and Canada tonight. #egypt vor 11 Minuten via web
http://twitter.com/mohamed/status/31780042916765696

[Lars77]

18. Evidence of the utter failiure of US media nt

[Inuca]

22. Not to defend the media, BUT

would you not expect most of the traffic for AJ English to come from English speaking countries?

[Lars77]

24. I am Norwegian, living in Germany and i watch it :)

So, no not really, not 55% from US-Canada at least.

[Iterate]

26. Don't know how many streams that is though,

but there might be a couple hundred from DUers alone. The problem I see with US media is that they have so de-skilled any international coverage that, when it comes time to cover something, there are few good people available to cover it. And of course any potential audience has been already discouraged from tuning in.

I haven't even looked at EU coverage though. I'll save that for tomorrow.

[justiceischeap]

16. The key factor is the Egyptian military, if the US gov makes them feel they will lose on aid

SultanAlQassemi Sultan Al Qassemi
The key factor is the Egyptian military, if the US gov makes them feel they will lose on aid + military equipment they will abandon Mubarak.

http://twitter.com/#!/SultanAlQassemi/status/31782864768991232

[justiceischeap]

17. 'Army tank joins in protesters' procession through Alexandria, Al-Jazeera TV reports.'

6.41pm: Army tank joins in protesters' procession through Alexandria, Al-Jazeera TV reports. The commander of the tank insisted that the army had "no intention of stopping this march", the station says.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/blog/2011/jan/30/egypt-protests-live-updates#block-57

[justiceischeap]

19. 'People now chanting slogans in support of Baradei in Tahrir square.'

lars_akerhaug Lars Akerhaug

http://twitter.com/#!/lars_akerhaug/status/31787715284439040

[Lars77]

20. Reuters reports Police are coming back into the streets

could be the final decisive battle here.

[justiceischeap]

21. Curfew changed to 3pm tomorrow & Western Media STFU

AJE TV just said curfew has been moved back to 3pm tomorrow... Like it's worked so far.

justimage matthew cassel
...So when you see Western media keep trying to paint this uprising as "Islamist," plz kindly tell them to stfu. #Egypt #jan25
http://twitter.com/#!/justimage/status/31789566633443329

[justiceischeap]

23. 'Elliot Abrams: "I think Mubarak is finished...here is no legitimacy to his government'

SultanAlQassemi Sultan Al Qassemi
Elliot Abrams: "I think Mubarak is finished. If he hangs on he hangs on through brute force. There is no legitimacy to his government"

http://twitter.com/#!/SultanAlQassemi/status/31790115109998592

[fishwax]

25. a ruling party official interviewed by AJE claims that "millions" want the president to stay

"Where are they?" the interviewer asks. :rofl:

[Lars77]

27. I was wondering where he went

[fishwax]

36. lol -- I was also thinking of Kevin Bacon in Animal House

"Remain Calm! ALL IS WELL!"

[dixiegrrrrl]

28. in the Shadow government, I would think.

[eleny]

29. Yeah, they aren't out in the streets "because they don't have to"

[Lars77]

30. BBC Arabic: Dozens of judges are now joining the protests

accusing the police of corruption and destruction of evidence of criminal action.

[suffragette]

34. That sounds like a major development

[dixiegrrrrl]

31. A good article when y'all get time:

The CIA's complicated relationship with Egypt
By Jeff Stein

"“Omar Suleiman negotiated directly with top officials” on the renditions,
Jane Mayer wrote in “Dark Side: The Inside Story of How The War on Terror Turned into a War on American Ideals.”

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/spy-talk/2011/01/the_cias_complicated_relations.html?wprss=spy-talk

Yeah, I know it is in the Post, but still is a good story.

[dixiegrrrrl]

32. Who was calling it an "Islamist" uprising?

I was gone for a bit, found this phrase all over Twitter when I got back.
what did I miss about the "Islamist" thing?

[justiceischeap]

33. I'm thinking CNN

I saw stuff earlier in the day against CNN from the Tweeter's in Cairo.

[justiceischeap]

35. Arabist: I have a clear view on the US embassy too.

arabist arabist
I have a clear view on the US embassy too. A lot of lights on in the upper floors - people working late, it seems.

http://twitter.com/#!/arabist/status/31801112302452736

[justiceischeap]

37. Covering himself with his demands and dreams in Tahrir square.

DannyRamadan Danny -Ahmed Ramadan
Covering himself with his demands and dreams in Tahrir square. #jan25 http://twitpic.com/3uy59r

http://twitter.com/#!/DannyRamadan/status/31802924128542720

[dixiegrrrrl]

38. Message to Mubarak from a protester: (pic)

Titled:
the Message is simple

[suffragette]

52. Fantastic pic

Succinct message.

[justiceischeap]

39. 'how close the helicopters were flying in Tahrir'

DannyRamadan Danny -Ahmed Ramadan
This is how close the helicopters were flying in Tahrir around 4PM. No zoom used here. #jan25 http://twitpic.com/3uy8lo

http://twitter.com/#!/DannyRamadan/status/31805806970150912

[elleng]

40. Al Jazeera English Comcast #275.

[dixiegrrrrl]

41. Ohhh..comcast channel.

Sorry, have no tv, did not get that reference.

yes, gee, Comcast carrying AJ, huh?

[elleng]

43. sorry, dxgrl, assumed EVERYONE understood what I was saying!

Silly me, as I've just recently watched w comcast.

[justiceischeap]

42. Verizon FiOS East Coast 457

[blaze]

48. And Dish Network 9410 nt

[BlueMTexpat]

45. Robert Fisk reports ...

Egypt: Death throes of a dictatorship
Our writer joins protesters atop a Cairo tank as the army shows signs of backing the people against Mubarak's regime
Sunday, 30 January 2011

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-egypt-death-throes-of-a-dictatorship-2198444.html

[CJvR]

46. I don't know...

...it seems a bit like the revolution have run out of steam.

Mubarak obviously isn't easily intimidated and the elites around him have to much riding on the current regime to let it fall.
Fortunately the conscript army is unreliable in a confrontation with the people so it will be hard to turn it loose on the people.

Unless something breaks soon Mubarak might ride out the storm, unbelivable considering the rout of his security forces on Friday. What the revolution might need is some junior officer driving his tank through the Ministry of the Interior or the Presidential Palace or a loudmouth asshole yelling "CHARGE" at the right moment and ElBaradei hardly seems the person to do that.

[Iterate]

55. Mubarak may be tough, but

I've been thinking all day of a quote from Emerson: "When you strike at a king you must kill him."

Too many thousands of people have taken actions and said things in the past few days that would have gotten them disappeared even a week ago. They can't go back. If Mubarak and his security apparatus retain power there will be no place to hide.

Most telling of all, when some judges and academics defected today, you can be sure that Mubarak has not only lost credibility within those institutions, but the institutions themselves will retain no authority if he remains.

He only has the security police, probably the air force, some bankers (and we know how fickle they will be), international corporations, and the US/EU, plus some unknown number of party hacks and appointees. It's not enough to govern for any length of time.

Frankly, I think what we're seeing is some stalling to see if he can weather it and plenty of behind-the-scenes maneuvering. As soon as those interests are satisfied that they will be protected, we'll hear about how the poor man has cancer and needs treatment in London (or some such acceptable story).

[Avalux]

65. The people of Egypt don't need someone to yell "charge" for them. n/t

[dixiegrrrrl]

47. Anybody hearing from other Egyptian cities?????

[justiceischeap]

49. Try this:

http://twitter.com/#!/search/%23Alexandria

[dixiegrrrrl]

50. ty

[dixiegrrrrl]

51. Cairo pop of 15 million, only 1500 demonstrators in square right now???

AJ says only 1500 or so in square.

[blaze]

53. Almost 11:30pm. They must be exhausted!!! nt

[sufrommich]

57. Most are probably home protecting their homes. nt

[justiceischeap]

54. 'Heavy machine gunfire erupts over Alex center'

NicRobertsonCNN Nic Robertson
Heavy machine gunfire erupts over Alex center as roaming groups of men throw rocks at passing vehicles #egypt #jan25 #mubarak

http://twitter.com/#!/NicRobertsonCNN/status/31825640114098176

[dixiegrrrrl]

56. "Gunshot just rang out underneath my house.

Neighborhood patrol grabbed some guy--chasing a second on motorbike" #Egypt
Sharif Kouddous.

[dixiegrrrrl]

58. A lot of gunfire in Cairo tonight. Seems like larger caliber weapons also used.

RT @iDeskCNN: RT @fpleitgencnn: A lot of gunfire in Cairo tonight. Seems like larger caliber weapons also used. #egypt #CNN

[dixiegrrrrl]

59. Reports that Israel has sent weapons and ammos (for crowd control) to the Egyptian regime.

Reports that Israel has sent weapons and ammos (for crowd control) to the Egyptian regime. #Israel #Egypt

[sufrommich]

60. I'm not buying that. That sounds like disinformation meant to

incite. The Egyptian Army has more than enough weapons and ammo for whatever reason they would need it.

[EFerrari]

62. Yep. n/t

[sufrommich]

61. AJ: Army rounding up escaped prisoners. nt

[sufrommich]

63. AJ interviewing a member of the NDP who is saying that

"the majority of Egyptians want the President to stay". lol.

[EFerrari]

64. LAT: Opposition plans to negotiate with military, not with Mubarak.

January 30, 2011 | 1:34 pm

Arab satellite network Al Jazeera has reported that Egyptian opposition leaders plan to negotiate a transition government with the Egyptian army, which maintained a heavy presence throughout the country on Sunday, and not longtime President Hosni Mubarak.

Al Jazeera reporters blogged that protesters still crowded Cairo's Tahrir Square after 11 p.m. Sunday, calling for Mubarak to resign. At one point, protesters spelled out "Down with Mubarak" with their bodies, the network reported.

Heavy machine-gun fire could be overheard Sunday night as thousands of protesters marched through downtown Alexandria, CNN's Nic Robertson reported. Army troops were positioned in various parts of the port city, having moved some of their checkpoints over the weekend.

Maajid Nawaz, executive director of the Quilliam Foundation, a London-based think tank, told Al Jazeera that Mubarak was a liability to political allies within Egypt and overseas.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/babylonbeyond/2011/01/arab-satelite-network-al-jazeera-has-reported-that-egyptian-opposition-leaders-say-that-their-negotiations-for-a-transition.html

No more at link.

[sufrommich]

66. That makes sense. I'll bet they're already talking to the Army.

I'm very impressed so far with the leaders of the Army. They've managed to keep very cool heads.

[EFerrari]

67. Me, too. They have been under pressure for days, my guess,

and have come through well so far. They are probably in the Coalition of the Bribed and Coerced but their behavior toward the people has been exemplary with the exception of buzzing Tahrir Square today. I still can't figure out what that was about.

[sufrommich]

68. Maybe Mubarak still has some loyal generals? That

would explain the planes. It will probably be a mystery until the revolution is over and the books are written.

[Iterate]

70. Mubarak was in the Egyptian AF for ~25 years,

from student to hero to Chief Air Marshal. However that buzzing story ends up being told, it's bound to be interesting. Either way, somebody took the protests personally.

I wonder though if it indicates a split between the AF and Army, because there is no way it could have benefited the Army.

[CJvR]

71. Not so sure about that.

IIRC there was some soldiers on Al Jazz who said they had order to shoot.

It might be less the leadership and more the rank & file of the army that is keeping cool.

[dixiegrrrrl]

69. hashtag dates already being planned for Arab world - Sudan #Jan 30

Yemen #Feb3 Syria #Feb5 Algeria #Feb12

Add #Feb14 Bahrain MT @rimakader:
http://twitter.com/#!/search?q=%23Feb14

[rollin74]

72. latest AJ live report

04:00 Cairo time

lots of military movement over the last couple of hours
tanks taking up new positions near Tahrir Square, setting up roadblocks etc.
seem to be more organized than in the past

protesters calling for general strike on Monday
another massive march being planned for Tuesday

still several hundred protesters camping out in Tahrir Square

[Turborama]

73. Joke on Twitter: #U.S. & #Israel change relationship status with #Egypt to "It's complicated" on FB

12:48am New York-based Palestinian-American writer Ismail Khalidi makes an apt social media joke on Twitter: #U.S. and #Israel change relationship status with #Egypt to "It's complicated" on facebook.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/middle-east/2011/01/30/live-blog-311-egypt-protests

[rollin74]

74. Al Jazeera reporter in Cairo just reported

military is setting up barricades at entrace points to Tahrir Square
in a possible move to restrict access to protesters tomorrow

possiblity of a general strike on Monday

[EFerrari]

75. Flashpoint map via @JamalDajani

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12315832

[Ghost Dog]

76. Monday morning (new thread?):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fMnF0Fvdpo

[Ghost Dog]

77. New thread: Egypt "Time will tell" Thread #5 (1-31-11)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x312521