“The Fourth Amendment doesn’t apply here.”

[MrScorpio]

Will Civil Rights Leader Arnwine Sue over Police Raid? Her Lawyer Won’t Say
Posted Nov 30, 2011 5:59 AM CST
By Debra Cassens Weiss

http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/will_civil_rights_leader_arnwine_sue_over_police_raid_her_lawyer_wont_say/

A lawyer representing Barbara Arnwine, the executive director of the Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights Under Law, won’t say whether her client is planning to file a lawsuit over a police raid on her home three days before Thanksgiving.

But Atlanta lawyer C.K. Hoffler, who is representing Arnwine along with Florida plaintiffs lawyer Willie Gary, does say her client isn’t letting the matter die. “We can’t discuss our strategy going forward, but she does intend to fight this,” Hoffler tells the ABA Journal. “I think that’s the best way of putting it.”

Arnwine has told radio interviewers that police held her and other family members at gunpoint during a raid that lasted three hours, according to a report on Politic365.com. Police refused to show a warrant, Arnwine said, and didn’t believe her when she identified herself as a lawyer. When she cited her Fourth Amendment rights, Arnwine told interviewers, one officer allegedly responded, “The Fourth Amendment doesn’t apply here.”

Arnwine “asked for a copy of the warrant and they basically told her that she needed to get out of the way,” Hoffler tells the ABA Journal. No one, including Arnwine’s 80-year-old mother, was allowed to use the bathroom during the three-hour ordeal, Hoffler says. Other family members living at the home include Arnwine’s brother, who is a disabled vet; her son; and two nephews.

Hoffler says the alleged civil rights abuse is the “ultimate irony” given Arnwine’s position as “an advocate for the voiceless.”

Police searching the home were looking for items related to a Nov. 4 armed robbery at a Popeyes restaurant, according to a search warrant (PDF) unsealed Nov. 25 and released by the Prince George’s County, Md., Police Department. An arrest warrant (PDF) names Curtis Lamar Ford as the suspect. Hoffler confirmed that Ford is Arnwine’s nephew.

[WingDinger]

1. Happened to me. Four cops at midnite.

Cop as he left said that the thing that made them sure I was guilty, is I didnt let them in right away. Lectured their sorry asses for an hour in handcuffs. They didnt seem to k now the law.

[Devil_Fish]

2. If I ever own a house, I am going to build it in such a way that they can't bust the door in. NT

[Downwinder]

3. I just want a signed wavier of liability so when they fall through

the floor I am not responsible. And if they don't know where to walk they will fall through.

[Old Codger]

4. Doors

Make your door swing out rather than in, almost impossible to break push them in with battering ram that way...

[Devil_Fish]

5. That and security shutters. NT

[msanthrope]

6. Actually, the cop may be correct--the 4th amendment may not apply to Arnwine..

Her nephew, who gave her address as his residence, was the subject of the search warrant, not her. Further, her nephew (the booking photo pretty much says it all) was arrested, at her home, for armed robbery.

I don't see what Arnwine is citing as a 4th amendment violation that is particular to her. She isn't denying that her nephew lived there. When asked, she confirmed that the police did not handcuff her or anyone else. They searched, and later, arrested her nephew for armed robbery. Sure, she may be pissed that the cops searched her place, but when you allow your gun-toting nephew to live with you (convicted for it!) you really can't be surprised when the po-po show up at your door.


Here is the search warrant--
http://www.abajournal.com/files/SEARCH_WARRANT.pdf

Last week, she was on the radio ranting and raving that the cops had the wrong house. Of course, that was before her nephew was arrested, and the warrant unsealed.

The video evidence described in the warrant, and the specificity of the house, indicate that this was no mistake as to the house. Nor was it a mistake as to the subject. One should not rob places where one has worked...

[Kennah]

8. Umm, there are no escape clauses in the Fourth Amendment. It applies everywhere.

A warrant isn't required every time, and there's lots of caselaw about warrantless searches and when they are Constitutional.

However, to reiterate, with or without a warrant, Fourth Amendment still obtains.

[msanthrope]

9. Um, you are missing the point. First of all, there are exceptions to the 4th Amendment.

Then there is simply activity that does not rise to invoke the protections of the 4th Amendment.

In this case, you have a search warrant executed on an occupied dwelling. The person of interest in the warrant is the nephew--only one of the residents of the occupied dwelling. A 4th amendment violation against HIM, whether perceived or actual, does not TRANSFER to other residents.

So far, she hasn't alleged any activity that is specific to HER that would constitute a 4th amendment violation.

It's entirely possible her rights have been infringed upon. But I'd love for her to state precisely what it is that she thinks was wrong.

Can you tell me what YOU think violates her 4th amendment rights?

[Kennah]

10. The Fourth Amendment obtains everywhere in the U.S.

It allows for reasonable search and seizure. Whether the police are adhering to the Fourth Amendment, or violating it, reasonable search and seizure still obtains.

I don't know the details of the case, and none of us really does.

They had an arrest warrant and a search warrant, so the Fourth Amendment obtains. Was it an illegal warrant? That's for a judge to decide, but whether it's a legal or illegal warrant, Fourth Amendment is still there.

Because they refused to show the warrant I would think is the likely area where a lawsuit is likely. Evidence obtained illegally without a warrant, or under an illegal warrant, isn't admissible. If the warrant said they could search a car, but they searched a house, any evidence would not be admissible. Refusing to show the warrant, IMHO, should be illegal service of the warrant and invalidate any evidence found.

[hootinholler]

7. Well in this case it's she said he said...

They did have a warrant.

The Prince George’s County Police Department in Maryland has provided documents to Politic365 indicating they were looking for someone at a residence believed to be that of prominent Civil Rights attorney Barbara Arnwine.

Among the documents provided: arrest and search warrants for a residence in Prince George’s County believed to be Arnwine’s.

See this thread.