Florida girl, 9, arrested after throwing fit on school bus

[The Straight Story]

Florida girl, 9, arrested after throwing fit on school bus

FORT MYERS, Fla. -

Lee County Sheriff's deputies say a 9-year-old girl faces multiple felony charges after a fit of rage that began on the school bus.

Officials say the girl jumped off the school bus Monday afternoon after spitting at staff members.

A sheriff's report says a deputy saw the girl toss large pieces of asphalt at the bus, hitting the windshield next to the driver.


Authorities say the girl walked away when she saw the deputy. She picked up a metal chair in a nearby yard and threw it at the deputy, according to authorities. When he said she was under arrest, the girl resisted by kicking and attempting to push him, deputies said.

No one was injured.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/Florida-girl-9-arreste...

[yella_dawg]

1. Our society has collapsed.

This kind of crap is possible only after the breakdown is well advanced.

[Rebubula]

15. LOL WUT?

Kids getting out of control is a indication that society has collapsed?


I think that you should recalibrate your meter.

[Name removed]

62. Deleted message

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[dtexdem]

24. Yeah, and then there are all those babies throwing hissy fits!

Who do they think they are, acting so infantile?

I say arrest the babies who get out of line. If we don't stop this infant coddling, all of Western Civilization will collapse like a soiled diaper!

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

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[redgiant]

33. No...

...it happens when people who have no business being parents.....become parents.

[redqueen]

53. ... and when mental and emotional issues are stigmatized,

delaying or preventing many from investigating such issues... and most health plans have little to no coverage for it.

[redgiant]

58. Mostly what I said n/t

[snooper2]

64. Maybe the girl was just having a really bad day...

I guess we should just drug all the kids up like zombies...

[redqueen]

68. What that has to do with my post, I have no idea. (nt)

[snooper2]

72. not sure, was kind of reading the sub-thread and that's what came out

lol

[redqueen]

78. Hah...

well it's true that too often drugs are the first thing that people turn to, when they should be the last IMO.

[lib2DaBone]

79. Bingo. YOu hit on it. people having babies that have no business being parents..

Plus.. thanks to the corrupt lobbyists in CONgress... it makes raising a family today , almost an impossible task.

Once again the greedy politicians and Corporations shoot themselves in the foot. If they don't allow people to raise families.. who is going to populate the military to fight their oil wars? Duh..?

[Darth_Kitten]

94. Too many idiots have children...

and then choose not to raise them properly. Sad.

[Brickbat]

2. Many, many people have failed this girl if it has come to this.

Unfortunately, she is the one that suffers for it.

[AverageJoe90]

57. Quite probable. nt

[rbnyc]

73. +1 (nt)

[LeftinOH]

3. That "fit" could have been from any number of things; society and/or upbringing may

not have anything to do with it.

[TwilightGardener]

5. Yes--there may be some developmental delays, mental or emotional issues, etc.

[snappyturtle]

4. What in the hell are we doing arresting nine year olds? That will help her.

[Coyote_Bandit]

6. That kind of behavior in a child that age

may very well be a sign of childhood onset bipolar disorder. That kind of rage often is an early indicator.

Hopefully this incident will prompt an assessment.

[Shagbark Hickory]

19. Really? You managed to diagnose her just by reading that article?

Maybe she was Occupying Disney World. Maybe she had a good reason to throw a chair. Maybe she didn't throw a chair at the cops at all? That's the kkkops' rendition of the story afterall.

Maybe it was just an ordinary temper tantrum or maybe she had a legitimate reason for being upset.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

32. And maybe the other poster didn't "diagnose" a problem but said rage...

... may very well be an indicator prompting an assessment. And he/she is correct.

That other person introduced a learned and interesting observation in to the discussion. Can't say the same about your "contribution."

[Shagbark Hickory]

35. I'm sorry you weren't satisfied with the quality of my contribution.

[demigoddess]

52. with cops these days, I would ask did she throw the chair or did she

just happen to knock it over and they took it badly. We are seeing cops going postal for no reason what so ever.

[Shagbark Hickory]

81. There's a reason.

The reason is because they can.
I am a victim of their abuses. They do it day in and day out with no consequences.
For me, a cop held a gun to my head and body slammed me against a sidewalk in front of dozens of people. Without the money to sue them and frankly I was afraid of what happened if I did, they get away with it.

[Coyote_Bandit]

80. I once knew a kid

who was prone to these kinds of fits of rage. Knew him his entire life. As a pre-schooler he took sharp kitchen knives and tried to stab his older sister. In school he displayed hyperactive and oppositional defiant behavior - some reminiscent of what is described in this episode. This kid was diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He didn't do well with treatment and later refused medication and on-going care. He would have uncontrollable fits of rage and could be quite violent. Often these episodes of rage would be followed by intense shame. He eventually put a gun in his mouth and blew his brains out.

You obvoiously have never known anyone well who had this terrible disorder. If you had, you would recognize this kind of behavior as a possible symptom and would encourage a mental health assessment of this child.

Perhaps you should educate yourself about the disorder before condemning those who have had first hand experience with it.

[Shagbark Hickory]

82. You're missing the point. You're all ready to make a judgement in this case from a brief article.

That's why I got so pissed about this in the first place. Because you can't possibly rush to judgement on the information provided because you haven't heard all sides of the story. You've only heard the kkkops' side of the story.

[Coyote_Bandit]

83. Uhhhhhhh.........No

Perhaps you should re-read my post. I said that the behavior may be a sign of early onset bipolar disorder.

May be. As in one possible explanation. One that warrants early diagnosis and intervention for s successful course of treatment.

If you consult a dictionary you will find the word "may" is used to express a possibility. Identifying a possibility is not expressing a certainty or passing a judgment. Most people understand that distinction. Apparently, you don't - or choose not to.

No, I haven't heard all sides of the story. Neither have you. I suggested an assessment. You seem to insist that any possibility that the child might have bipolar disorder should be dismissed. Are you opposed to diagnosing and treating sick people or are you ignorant of the nature of this disease?

Bipolar disorder is a serious illness. It can and often does destroy the lives of those who have it and/or the lives of those who love them. It is an illness and it carries both genetic and chemical identifiers. And it can often be treated. It is estimated that 20% of those with bipolar disorder commit suicide.

Rage (which is distinguished from anger) is one of the hallmark signs of childhood earl;y-onset bipolar disorder. You don't have to take my word for it. The internets are full of information about the disease. Google is your friend should you choose to inform yourself.

[Shagbark Hickory]

89. Is your name Gregory House M.D. ?

[Coyote_Bandit]

96. Ummmm......No

You completely dismiss and deny the value of personal experience and observation of childrenb with bpolar disorder.

Welcome to my fucking ignore list.

[Marazinia]

97. I admit it

I laughed.

[HuckleB]

84. It could be a sign of many things.

There is no way to jump to any specific diagnosis or underlying reason.

[Coyote_Bandit]

87. Rage is a hallmark of early onset bipolar disorder

Don't take my word for it. Or my first hand observations. Google is your friend.

Bipolar disorder is one possibility and given the nature of the disease it is one that warrants assessment.

[HuckleB]

88. In other words, you're a Google mental health "expert."

That explains why you want to jump to a simple conclusion.

[Coyote_Bandit]

95. See my post 80 above - I have personal experience

with childhood bipolar disorder.

I loved that kid and would hate to see another person or family go through the same pain and loss.

There is a difference between a suggesting a possibility and making a conclusion. It's the difference between having a winning lottery ticket and just having the possibility of having a winning ticket. But you already knew that didn't you?

I have the kind of expertoise that comes from first hand experience. I've consoled a child that was chased by her 5 year old mentally disturbed sibling who had a sharp kitchen knife and was trying to stab her - and who made that attempt more than once. I watched the family dynamic develop through the years and spent considerable time with the family - including the kid with bipolar disorder. I watched him struggle and succeed - only to fail again. I saw him rage as a child - and as an adult. I saw his remorse, his shame, his frustration with treatment. I also watched the mother take the call informing her that her mentally ill son has taken his own life. And I was the one who spoke with police and medical personnel on behalf of the family to confirm the sad details of what transpired.

Welcome to my fucking ignore list.

[Fumesucker]

7. I'd be surprised if this happened out of the blue..

Something set that girl off on the bus I'll wager.

It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out this is a reaction to bullying somehow.

Oh and whoever mention bipolar, probably something like that too.

[LanternWaste]

11. One guess is as good as the other...

"Something set that girl off on the bus I'll wager..."
Her cell phone was taken away and she couldn't text melodrama to her friends.


One guess is as good as the other...

[Fumesucker]

20. Hmm.. That wasn't in the OP..

It would be nice if you could share information you have without the snark.

Oh, and who took away her cell phone and why?

[LanternWaste]

48. A guess... just like yours.

A guess... just like yours.

[Fumesucker]

56. Sorry, apparently someone filed off the serial numbers..

And speculation emerged presented as fact.

[Speck Tater]

8. Since I know nothing about the details of the case, I will abstain from passing judgement either way

I just thought maybe somebody should say that.

[dawg]

14. I won't abstain.

I may not know all the details, but "9 years old" is all I need to know.

A felony charge is bullshit.

[Bladian]

21. I get where you're coming from, but...

She threw a chunk of concrete at the driver's windshield and threw a metal chair at...I think it was a cop, I'm not looking at the story right now. "But she's 9, what kind of damage could she do!" A chunk of asphalt or concrete? That could do a LOT of damage, especially hurled at the driver of a school bus.

[dawg]

23. Oh, I'm sure she could do lots of damage.

I just think America has a messed up attitude about what to do about a situation like this. A 9 year-old acting out like this needs some sort of help.

Without knowing all the details, I'm not sure exactly what kind of help she needs. But clearly there is a problem.

But America's solution is always punishment. It's already scandalous the percentage of our adult population we have locked up.

There is no way under the sun that criminal prosecution of this child is in either her, or society's, interest. But that what we do.

'Cause we're Americans.

And somebody has to pay, by God!

(Someone always has to pay)

[HuckleB]

85. +1

[Douglas Carpenter]

9. however wrong the old "spank they and send them to their room" approach was - it was a lot less

crazy and a lot less damaging then turning childhood acting up into criminal cases.

[pipi_k]

10. Less crazy doesn't make it better

One of my nieces used to have terrible fits when she was very young. She bit my mom one time, and my mom bit her back. Not a good way to handle it, IMO.

After about five or six years of this sort of thing, my sister found a doctor who insisted on brain scans. Well, they found the problem, put my niece on meds, and she has been fine ever since.

So it's not always "acting out", and it's not up to a parent (or grandparent) to decide it IS "acting out" and spank or otherwise punish the child.

Parents need to keep their hands off their kids in anger, because the
"acting out" could be one of two things...

1. Actual medical issues

2. Emotional issues caused by medical issues OR sloppy parenting

[onpatrol98]

30. Is it possible the bite...was just a bite...

Is it possible that when your niece bit your mom...your mom, knew it was just an old fashioned kid "bites" adult and not anything more than that...even if later she was found to have other issues?

[pipi_k]

77. No.

My kids never bit me.

My siblings and I never bit our mom.

My niece nearly always bit people in the middle of her worst fits.


And even if it was just a "kid's bite", you don't teach kids NOT to do something by doing to them what you don't want them to do to others.

I mean, really...where would that even make sense? If the kid hauls off and kicks an adult in the shin and throws a toy at his head, that's what the adult should do back?

[onpatrol98]

101. I was personally never a biter...

But, I have noticed adults biting back. It always strikes me as an odd and awkward moment. Even biting toddlers back...of course, the kid never bit one of these adults twice.

[Shagbark Hickory]

12. Now why would something like this make even local news?

This is a private matter.

[TwilightGardener]

13. Because she was arrested--that is public info.

[Shagbark Hickory]

17. Right but why would any respectable news organization announce a child's temper tantrum to the world

Shame on them. They need to get a life.

[TwilightGardener]

29. Because it's pretty unusual to arrest and charge a nine-year-old. Unusual and ridiculous.

[Odin2005]

16. Ugh, that poor girl needs mental help.

[Shagbark Hickory]

18. Really? You managed to diagnose her just by reading that article?

Maybe she was Occupying Disney World. Maybe she had a good reason to throw a chair. Maybe she didn't throw a chair at the cops at all? That's the kkkops' rendition of the story afterall.

Maybe it was just an ordinary temper tantrum or maybe she had a legitimate reason for being upset.

[Odin2005]

27. That was a little excessive for a mere "temper tanrum".

One poster mentioned possible Bipolar.

[Shagbark Hickory]

34. Yeah another talented clairvoyant. n/t

[Odin2005]

38. See post 36, that poster and I were right.

The kid is in special ed.

[Shagbark Hickory]

43. Please explain why.

[Odin2005]

59. KamaAina already did.

[Name removed]

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[slackmaster]

71. You get the Sir Arthur Conan Doyle award for the day...

[justiceischeap]

22. Girl throws fit, gets arrested. Boy beats up gay kid, gets 3 days suspension.

One has to wonder about why this girl got arrested and the boy who planned to beat up the gay kid didn't. I know this happened in different jurisdictions but still...

edited to add link to story I'm referring to:
http://www.khq.com/story/15892254/horrific-attack-of-ga...

[Kurmudgeon]

40. The girl got arrested for destroying public property (the bus) and attacking a police officer.

It's no wonder at all why the girl got arrested, she was violent in public and a danger to herself and others.
And while it's sad the boy is so messed up in the head, you can't arrest people for what they plan to do all that easily.

[Jamastiene]

65. No, but they could sure arrest him for assault.

I would say he was violent and a danger to others too.

[justiceischeap]

69. You obviously didn't read the article or watch the video of the gay kid getting the crap

beat out of him.

[Jamastiene]

74. They should arrest the boy who did that to that gay kid.

That was horrible.

[Kurmudgeon]

103. Because there was no mention of that in the original link.

[HuckleB]

86. The girl was nine, and was clearly in fight of flight mode.

There is a huge part of the story that is missing.

The boy is older, and everything he did was premeditated. The fact that he's not sitting in jail is ludicrous.

[redqueen]

55. *Special needs kid* throws fit, gets arrested...

I was just about to make the same comment.

Really says something about society. This girl wasn't punished harshly because of the incident, but because it involved pissing off a pig.

Yes, a pig. Any officer that would arrest a 9-year-old special needs student for throwing things is most definitely a pig IMO.

[Ilsa]

91. I didn't see that. She's special needs? My oldest is also.

He was a holy terror at age nine, too. I had to keep defensive kickboxing gear in my car. He broke my nose, damaged our house, etc. He finally out grew it several years later.

That school and officer need to get a clue. And she shouldn't be on the bus unless there is an aide with her.

[etherealtruth]

100. That was the first thing that came to mind

[ohheckyeah]

25. Something is seriously wrong

with the adults in this country if the only way we can deal with a temper tantrum from a 9 year old is to arrest her and charge her with a felony. Seriously? How absolutely absurd.

[Odin2005]

28. In many distriscts teachers are not allowed to restrain kids because of legal fears.

Too much legal risk from angry parents who insist that little Johnny could not hurt a fly.

Blame the litigiousness of our society and blame narcissistic parents.

[cyglet]

26. Felonies?

When no one was hurt?

No, nothing wrong. Nothing wrong at all.

[Dont call me Shirley]

31. Feel sad for her, chemicals and promotion of violence are causing this.

[KamaAina]

36. She's already in special ed

http://www.news-press.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=201...

A 9-year-old Royal Palm Exceptional Center student was arrested today after a fit of rage resulted in felony charges.

[Odin2005]

37. I guess I am clairvoyant!

[Shagbark Hickory]

41. What does "special ed" have to do with anything? That doesn't mean she's a psychopath.

[KamaAina]

47. I was addressing the notion that "she needs help"

She's (supposedly) getting it. I can't imagine what an "exceptional center" in pRick Scott's Florida must be like, though.

[Shagbark Hickory]

50. So, she may have a learning disability. Or Autism. Or any number of things .

That doesn't explain the alleged violence but if you want to pat yourself on the back, go right ahead.

[rug]

76. Not a psychopath but a child with emotional disabilities.

"Royal Palm School is a k through 12 public education program primarily designed to educate and assist Lee County Florida students identified as having emotional disabilities."

http://roy.leeschools.net/principal.html

That said, a felony arrest is not the way to handle this.

[Ilsa]

92. Some special needs students, such as some autistic kids, go through a phase where

They are very over-reactive, violent, etc. We were lucky to survive those three years, and they covered age nine. Usually some ABA training will help get it under control. The school should look into it and offer it to e parents.

[Shagbark Hickory]

42. Another rubbish "news" outlet

[KamaAina]

46. That's the main daily paper for the city where this happened

of course it's part of the M$M, but what do you want?

[Shagbark Hickory]

49. I want them to butt out.

This is between the parents, the child, school and the kkkops.

[Avalux]

39. 9 years old. Special needs. FELONY charges.....WTF????

That child needs a medical evaluation, attention and guidance...not an arrest w/court, felony charges and possible time in a detention facility. All this does is burden her family more and keeps her from becoming a functioning member of society.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

44. Send her to bed without dinner......then bring it up to her later

That seems to be the response of many on DU that think it's no big deal she attacked a bunch of people.

[Bragi]

51. I've not seen that view expressed here

What I see here are posters saying that the criminal code is being used inappropriately where medical intervention is what is actually called for.

Anyway, to support your condemnation of "many on DU", could you link me to one of the many posts you see here where her behavior is described as no big deal?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

61. Here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

It's all fun and games, or just some "pig" overreacting.

I've witnessed nine year olds and younger do severe damage to people, similar to women who get out of control, because the natural inclination of the majority is to "go easy on them" because you are walking the fine line of using pain to subdue them before they hurt themselves and others. Putting as child in handcuffs may be the easiest thing to do (although they can likely slip out of them).

[Bragi]

45. Might that be the only way to get help for her?

The thought occurs to me that social services in Florida are so degraded that charging her with a felony might be the only way to get her "into the system" where she can actually get some medical help, and then they just drop the charges?

I say that because it otherwise makes no sense, and I'm trying to make some sense of it.

[ladjf]

54. It appears that the child needed to be brought under control both for

her safety and that of others. As the the legal form of apprehension, the police might have been the
most available. The questions are (1) was minimum physical force used and (2) was it handled after that as a mental health problem?

[Bragi]

60. Good questions

I too suspect that charging her criminally was the only sure way to get her into the system so she would qualify for assessment and help.

If so, then the cops probably aren't able to confirm it because it could be considered by some as being technically an abuse of the criminal justice system.

[TwilightGardener]

75. I agree that taking her into custody for her own protection (and that of others) was

maybe the only way to go here. Not sure that arrest and charging her was necessary, maybe they could have put her into the police car until her parents arrived at the scene? I don't know what the legal alternatives are in a case like this.

[ladjf]

102. The one certain aspect of this case is that the child is in need of

some good therapy. nt

[Name removed]

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[slackmaster]

70. That sounds like a child with some serious psychological problems

I hope she gets appropriate help before it's too late.

[Kaleva]

93. My sister-in-law went thru something like that.

As a little girl, she broke a few windshields by throwing rocks. After social services talked to her, her mother (my wife's mom) was called in. What I was told was that Social Services had some serious questions as to what was going on at home. But alas, not much came of that and my sister-in-law is now one messed up adult.

[Rex]

90. Police state.

[Marazinia]

98. I'm not sure what the cop could have done differently

If an arrest wasn't made but the kid was detained, is that false imprisonment?

If no arrest was made and the kid wasn't detained, did the officer fail to protect both the child and anyone within asphalt-hurling range?

[aikoaiko]

99. Not normal, but arresting her be the only way she gets some professional help

It should take that, but sometimes it does.