Bradley Manning caught on video with hacker friends around first WikiLeaks release

[Playinghardball]

Source: RawReplay
By Kase Wickman

A soon to be released PBS Frontline documentary depicts Army intelligence officer Bradley Manning palling around in Boston in January 2010, around the time he was allegedly thinking about passing thousands of classified military documents to the hacker transparency group WikiLeaks.

The clip depicts manning at a party at Boston University’s BUILDS space, a hacker collective and student research lab. The party was hosted by BUILDS founder David House, who now helps run the Bradley Manning Support Network.

The documentary, “WikiSecrets,” will air on May 24 on PBS. Video embedded via PBS

http://www.rawstory.com/rawreplay/2011/05/bradley-manning-caught-on-video-with-hacker-friends-around-first-wikileaks-release/

[DeSwiss]

1. This is stierscheiße. n/t

[msongs]

2. any videos of Obama around the time of multiple drone attacks? nt

[Tarheel_Dem]

15. Nope. And if there were, it wouldn't be illegal.

:hi:

[TimLighter]

3. Even if true WTF is PBS doing releasing this kind of crap?

This will taint any jury pool and insure that Manning won't get a fair hearing.

[snagglepuss]

6. I just read this week that the Koch Brothers give financial support to Frontline

as it makes for good PR. I wonder if they are in any way involved with this?

[EFerrari]

8. I've always wondered about that.

Frontline is uneven. Good pieces and every now and then, good propaganda pieces.

[TheWraith]

16. You mean blindly releasing any and all information you can, context free, is a bad thing?

Particularly when it may compromise or taint ongoing sensitive things?

I'm shocked!

[msanthrope]

21. Who knew? n/t

[EFerrari]

22. Straw man. And obviously Frontline didn't do that either.

They are releasing this information very precisely.

[msanthrope]

35. Yes, they are. Very precisely.

Manning's sort of painted himself into a corner--and Frontline isn't helping him...

In fact, here's a thing I noted that his supporters haven't been able to reconcile--

Manning, according to many of this supporters, released the documents and videos because of noble ideals. As proof of this, they point to the Lamo chat logs---which, short of his testifying, remain the only direct evidence of his motives.
For example--some excerpts on why Manning did what he did:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/greg-mitchell/chatting-with-bradley-man_b_843018.html

If Manning is going to use that as a defense/mitigation, he's going to have to authenticate those logs.

Which means that Lamo wasn't lying.

The alternative is going with the prosecution theory of motive--Manning was a fuck-up, and his leaking was prompted by his anger and failure to adjust. According to the charges, some of his worst acts took place after he hit a female superior in the face, and he feared punishment.

His mother's drinking, his being gay--all background noise.

[sabrina 1]

24. Like blindly killing innocents in foreign nations, thousands

of miles away as if it was a video game?

Or dropping bombs on weddings and markets and white phospherous on babies and torturing people, sometimes to death, raping and beating women and children?

The magnitude of the crimes committed over the past ten years against innocent people, called for drastic action to try to stop those crimes.

Since when did the 'left' start supporting these crimes?

I have a feeling that if these documents had been released during Bush's reign of terror, you would not find a single democrat opposed to this. We WISHED for it back then.

The odd thing is that most of the crimes revealed in the Iraq/Afghanistan war logs ARE from the Bush era. But then if the media won't cover this major story, and people don't read for themselves, they probably have no clue what actually is there.

Manning is a hero! He did what all soldiers are supposed to do, report crimes and if those reports are ignored, find another way to try to stop them.

Unfortunately the crimes themselves have been ignored and only the messengers are being investigated. That's how bad it is in this country today. But it will change, one day. These kinds of huge crimes against humanity are never forgotten until justice is done.

A perfect example is what is happening now in South American countries. It took a long time, but people did not give up and justice, finally is being done. Manning, like many whistle-blowers, will be appreciated later. Right now, everyone is trying to hide their own culpability.

[TheWraith]

26. Except for the total lack of said evidence.

What we got was a bunch of diplomatic cables, mostly falling into the categories of things we already knew, and things embarrassing to allies.

[sabrina 1]

29. No, those are completely separate from the Iraq/Afghanistan

War Logs. That was a completely separate set of documents, and in fact, many people think Manning is only responsible responsible for the Iraq/Afghanistan War logs where there is plenty of evidence of War Crimes, including the issue he first reported regarding the US trained Iraqi police and the torturing of detainees handed over to them.

You must not have seen the murder on video of the two reuters journalists either, the killing of the good samaritan who tried to help the wounded journalist, the killing of the wounded journalist, and the shooting of two children inside the van. Along with other bystanders.

For two years the military refused to hand that over to Reuters in an attempt to hide how their employees died. But that has not even been investigated. One of the soldiers, actually two of them, who were there that day now work against the war and have said that this 'crime' happens every day in Iraq and AFghanistan.

But how can people make any judgement about these things when they are so confused about what exactly has been released?

AS for the cables, there is evidence of criminal activity in them also. Different than war crimes, but definitely in need of investigation and probably prosecutions.

Manning did the right thing by trying to expose all that he saw. He was a witness. But we give medals to war criminals and torturers like Sanchez. That's the kind of country this is now. But if the American people refuse to accept it, it can change. If they don't, it won't be worth living in.

[msanthrope]

32. Kindly point to a single charged 'war crime?'

An investigation? A charged crime?

If you can't do that, then kindly name persons who committed crimes and the specific acts they should be charged with?

For example, you cite the video leaked by Manning (which you seem to admit that he leaked). So, who gets charged with what crime?

You'd think Dennis Kucinich, or the UN would be looking at this....

[sabrina 1]

34. Did you read the War Logs or not??

Your questions indicate you did not.

Kindly name persons who have been 'charged' with the crimes viewed by US Congressmembers on video that the Bush administration fought to have kept from the public, but about which Lindsey Graham, after viewing them said 'we are talking about rape, torture and murder here'..

Who has been 'charged' with the crime of instituting the US torture policies which created untold numbers of victims, women who were raped, children, sodomized, beaten and at least over 100 killed? John Yoo? Anyone??

You are asking a stupid question. WE do NOT charge people in this country with war crimes! We charge the messengers.

Which is why OTHER countries are doing it. And when they do, this country attempts to intimidate them into NOT doing so. Another revelation from Wikileaks, and a very important piece of information for the American people.

Are you seriously denying that war crimes have NOT been committed?

Bradley Manning is a hero. And most people around the world view him as a hero. Only a small minority of people here, mostly on the right, do not.

It is a shame that the crimes he exposed were not investigated. It is a shame that when he first reported them, he was told to stfu about them. But when we got a new CIC we expected that people like Manning and other soldiers who wanted to report crimes, would be listened to.

Instead we have this administration covering for the last one.

[msanthrope]

37. You haven't read 391,832 files, Sabrina. No one has.

Which sort of makes your question disingenuous.

Again--can you name a single 'war crime' from the Iraq War logs?

Name a single chargeable offense you think should be investigated?

Name a single person you think should be charged?

If you could, I suspect we would have heard about it, long ere now.



A massive document dump, and not a single, definable charge. By dumping documents, instead of careful, reasoned review and editing, you get screeds about vague 'war crimes' from the usual leftists and not a single, chargeable act... You'd almost think TPTB wanted it that way. Google Dan Ellsberg and Ed Lansdale. History repeats itself, because the left never learns.

[sabrina 1]

39. It is not for me to name individuals. The war logs that have

been published have revealed war crimes. Until there is an invesigation of those crimes no one will be charged. We have been told we will not be investigating them. We have not been told there were no crimes, just that we will not be looking back at them. Is that acceptable to you?

You did not answer the question as to why no one has been charged for the crimes of torture. Names have been provided and prosecutions started in Spain. Why does Spain have to investigate these crimes? Why is this country trying to cover up those crimes?

There's no point in wasting time on this if you feel that no crimes were committed. Why don't you just say so? But there ARE victims, and they continue to try to get justice, so it will not go away until it is dealt with.

Bradley Manning reported crimes. Why was he ignored?

[msanthrope]

40. Kindly name a single person being investigated by Spain because of the Iraq War Logs?

FYI, Sabrinia--the Spanish prosecutions of the Bush Six--now dropped-- weren't based on Wikileaks-dumped info.

They were based on this:

http://armed-services.senate.gov/Publications/Detainee%20Report%20Final_April%2022%202009.pdf

[sabrina 1]

41. I know what they were based on. And the policies of those

named in the prosecutions in Spain, were put into practice and some of them were recorded in the War Logs. They were the masterminds of what is revealed on video from Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo and what Bradley Manning reported and the exposed in the War logs.

Those prosecutions were stopped by THIS president, however it seems they may go forward with a different judge and I have no doubt that when prosecutions do go forward the Iraq/Afghanistan war logs will be used as evidence.

However, you seem not to want prosecutions for torture and other war crimes, so there is no point in continuing this discussion. I'll be completely honest, I cannot really even discuss this horror that we have lived with since the first crimes from Abu Ghraib were revealed, with anyone who attempts to defend them in any way. It is and has been a huge issue for many Americans for more than eight years now, I prefer to discuss the subject with those who have worked hard for so long to get some justice for some of the victims, because it will never be possible to get it for all of them.

I have spoken to soldiers who witnessed many of the crimes revealed in the war logs. They commend Manning for his courage even if they chose not to do what he did. There is no doubt that crimes were committed and continue to be committed, and will, until the American people stop them. Because politicians are not going to do it, they are complicit, all of them who have refused to speak out.

Sorry, I have no patience for people who condone torture or attempt to excuse it in any way, or who feel it ought to be ignored.

I wish there were hundreds of Bradley Mannings in the military, then we would not have to worry about any of this.

[msanthrope]

42. You will never get justice for the victims if you can't make a coherent case for them.

It's too bad you think the soldiers you spoke to are complicit in war crimes. You should have told them that.

[sabrina 1]

45. Clearly you do not believe that torturing human beings, is a war

crime. At least one of the soldiers I referred did not commit war crimes, he refused to follow those orders and spent several months in the brig. But he witnessed them and reported them and was charged with refusing to follow orders.

Others felt it was useless to report anything so tried to get through their time and leave and are now involved in the anti-war movement.

It is not for me to 'get justice' for them. It is for the DOJ, the Military especially the CIC once it is known that crimes were committed. That is a very childish thing to say, but a common ploy to avoid discussing facts.

Your attempts to change the subject fail, totally. The whole world has seem evidence of war crimes and have seen that this country has done nothing about them.

The War Logs back up what Manning claimed. Our government not only knows they are harboring war criminals, they have moved to protect them from prosecution.

I want justice for the victims, as would any decent human being. All ordinary people can do is keep pressuring their Represenatives and support others who have more influence. There are plenty of human rights organizations and attorneys who have spent years trying to accomplish that.

Your avoidance of the actual topic says to me you are of the opinion that no crimes were committed. As I already said, there is nothing further to discuss. We disagree. Manning is a hero. The war criminals have received medals of freedom. This country has lost its soul, for now.

[Cid_B]

44. "You must not have seen the murder on video of the two reuters journalists either"

You must be confused. I saw some reporters walking around with some other folks carrying RPGs. Was there a mugging off in a corner somewhere?

[sabrina 1]

46. The reporters were not carrying RPGs, they were carrying

camera equipment.

Shooting and killing a wounded person, is a war crime. Destroying the lives of two innocent children, who were saved by two soldiers on the ground, those two soldiers since having publicly apologized to the family for what was done to them, and are now part of the movement to get justice for all the victims or war crimes in Iraq.

And hiding the video for two years, why did the military refuse to give it to Reuters?

And torture is still a war crime, sorry. Just because we have democrats in the WH, doesn't mean torture is not so bad anymore. These crimes revealed in the war logs were committed mostly during the Bush years. And this administration has now become complicit by refusing to prosecute them.

And before you attempt to deny there were crimes, even this WH has not denied, merely stated, unbelievably, that they will not be 'looking back' at them.

[Cid_B]

50. I didn't say the reporters had RPGs...

... maybe I was short a comma. Let me break it down.

If a "reporter" decides that he should "embed" with a group of MAM that are wandering down the streets with weapons and RPGs they should not be surprised when they get their dumbasses lit up.

What are you thinking? Guy up on the scope says something like "Holy shit guys! I think I see a Reuters ID card on one of those guys down there! No no.. past the guy with the AK. No... the other guy with the AK. Yeah. We have to leave them alone. We wouldn't want them to be injured"

Ridiculous. They took a stupid chance and deserve what they got.

[sabrina 1]

52. Except that's not what happened.

And the two soldiers who were there have stated publicly that these kinds of attacks on innocent civilians are common.

Where you got that information I don't know, but there has been no investigation of what happened so I'm assuming you made it up.

[Cid_B]

54. Um... yes it was...

Here is the link to the 15-6 (That is Army talk for investigation) from the freaking website that released the video.

http://collateralmurder.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/6-2nd-brigade-combat-team-15-6-investigation.pdf

Secondly..



Looks like an RPG. Gosh what are the odds...? So much for innocent civilians.

[sabrina 1]

56. You link doesn't work for me, but I am aware of what you are

calling an investigation. The military's 'findings' are always the same 'we did nothing wrong'.

There has not been an independent investigation to find out why two reporters were killed, an unarmed man helping a wounded journalist, and two children, and the wounded journalist were all shot and killed. Wounded and unarmed people are not a threat to anyone.

The children, who have been interviewed by the media and who are scarred for life, both physically and emotionally and who have lost their father were never even contacted by the US military. The fear in their eyes is haunting. They deserve to know why their father was mowed down merely for trying to help a wounded man. In their own country.

Your flippant attitude towards the deaths of Iraqis is not shared by a majority of people in the world. Most people view them as human beings, not objects in a video game.

The war itself is illegal so basically every act from that point on was a war crime. They are illegal invaders. But aside from that, people were murdered that day. They have families and friends who want to know why. And for two years, the military refused to give them information that was available.

[msanthrope]

30. I always wondered why Manning didn't leak to someone who could have investigated

the said 'war crimes.'

Dennis Kucinich, or the UN. after all, Wikileaks can't investigate....

[msanthrope]

28. How is revealing the Global Server Address List of the US Command in Iraq revealing a 'war crime?'

I've asked that question a few times, and all I get is screeds about 'War Crimes.'

But no one has been able to tell me how publishing the Global Server Address List of the US Command in Iraq reveals a war crime...

And no one can point to a single war crime that has been charged, either.

[sabrina 1]

31. How can they point to a war crime that 'has been charged'

when none have been charged?

Why don't you read the War Logs for yourself. They are still available online and yes, war crimes were committed, but we knew that when Bush was in charge and we said that was important back them. That's why we voted for Democrats.

Was it all just politics after all? The 'left' really didn't care about the war crimes being committed?

Because most of the Iraq/Afghanistan war logs ARE from the Bush era. Either something has happened to this Party, or we were all being lied to when we were told things would change when Democrats won a majority. THIS IS EVIDENCE of what was claimed when Bush was in power. Why are you defending Bush now?

[msanthrope]

33. You are avoiding the question--explain how the Global Server Addresses reveal a 'war crime?'

As for the War Logs, if you can't point to a war crime that has been charged, point to individuals who should be charged, and their specific offenses....

But first--stop avoiding the uncomfortable question--what war crimes were revealed by leaking the Global Server Addresses?

[sabrina 1]

36. This country doesn't charge war criminals. We are 'looking forward' now.

You are avoiding the issue, I wonder why. When Bush was president, did you defend him then? Because I never met a single Democrat who doubted that war crimes were and had been committed.

Has anyone been 'charged' with those crimes, now that we worked so hard to get a Democratic administration? Anyone??

Otoh, maybe you are trying to be funny. To ask if the US has charged anyone with War Crimes is tragically funny. For the victims, still trying to get justice, is simply tragic. And of course to all the victims, Manning is a hero. He tried to get justice for them.

We charge those who report war crimes. Manning is a witness to war crimes, and look what happened to him for trying to report them.

Why are you avoiding this subject? Is it of no interest to you that your country has tortured and killed, murdered and raped innocent human beings? Because all over the world the victims are asking for justice and will continue to do so until one day we get a government that is willing to deal with these crimes.

[msanthrope]

38. You are the one who claimed 'war crimes' were exposed. So answer the question.

What war crimes were exposed when Bradley Manning leaked the Global Server Addresses of the US Command in Iraq?

[sabrina 1]

49. Torture. Do you believe torture is a war crime or not?

Why is it such a difficult question to answer?

[RaleighNCDUer]

57. How about the fact that there IS a US Command in Iraq?

The entire fucking war is a war crime.

It is, and has been since the beginning, a violation of international law.

[Cid_B]

43. Bravo... I literally "lol"ed.... out loud...

:fistbump:

[LanternWaste]

53. Much like the photographs at Abu-Ghraid?

Much like the photographs of Abu-Ghraid getting released without being property vetted by governmental agencies prior to?

[RaleighNCDUer]

27. He's facing a military court, not a jury.

So what makes you think he's going to get a 'fair hearing' in the first place?

[guruoo]

47. It could also cause the case to be thrown out. nt

[mmonk]

4. Think I'll ask House about this if possible.

[itsrobert]

5. The Traitor is Guilty as Charged

But let's the court decide.

[villager]

7. How dare he impinge the plans of Empire! What can we grovelingly defend, otherwise!?

Throw the book at him for discomfiting us, I tell ya!

[coalition_unwilling]

11. Guilty as charged for releasing video footage of war crimes being

committed by U.S. military forces in Iraq.

But whatever you've got to tell yourself.

Welcome to my Ignore list.

[qazplm]

17. what if that wasnt all he got/released?

If you release/grab stuff indiscriminately but some of it ends up being footage of war crimes, does that make you a hero? does it forgive the stuff that you got that wasn't a war crime but simply classified material? Do you believe in the concept of classified material in the first place?

[coalition_unwilling]

18. You really should read the latest Greenwald piece first:

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2011/05/20/surveillance/index.html

Once you reply that you've read the piece, I'll be happy to answer your questions. Otherwise, we really have very little to discuss.

[msanthrope]

20. That's the wrong Greenwald piece to read--

This one's much more on point...


http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/radio/2011/04/27/wikileaks

[coalition_unwilling]

23. Fine. Let's read 'em both and then we can discuss the

other posters' questions.

N.B. I have already read both Greenwald columns.

[Forkboy]

51. LOL

:crazy:

[midnight]

9. I forgot how long was it before he was charged with a crime?

[TimLighter]

12. 6 weeks.

Manning was arrested on May 26, 2010, and held at first in a military jail at Camp Arifjan in Kuwait. He was charged on July 5 under the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) with violations of UCMJ Articles 92 and 134 for "transferring classified data onto his personal computer and adding unauthorized software to a classified computer system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_Manning#Arrest_and_charges

[bemildred]

10. Yawn. nt

[Fuzz]

13. Just set my Tivo to record. I'll watch it.

[Tarheel_Dem]

14. Can't wait to see this. Thanks for the heads up. (nt)

[msanthrope]

19. This is apparently when he carried the Iraq War Logs to the US.

And I'm betting this was confirmed when House's computer was seized.

Grand jury subpoenas went out last month to people, apparently, in this group.

[Bluebear]

25. 'palling around' - thank you, Ms. Palin! nt

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

48. Manning is a dangerous guy. Palling around with hackers and (gasp!) embarrassing the bosses.

Not to mention all the civilians he's murdered...oh, wait....the murderers are guys who want to shut him (and, anyone else exposing government malfeasance) up.

[DirkGently]

55. I heard he read a book by Bill Ayers, too. And may own a tie dye. Case closed.

(facetious comment)