crist reality check

[angee_is_mad]

something that some progressives refuse to realize. If Meek dropped out would the black vote drop out with him? Can crist win w/o the black vote?

Understand this, progressives turning their backs on Meek (true progressive)and supporting the rethug is being talked about on urban radio and the afrosphere. It is leaving a bad taste in the mouths of many.Even if Meek gave a tepid endorsement of crist after dropping out the black community will know what was up.He was FORCED OUT by his own party.

Here are some real facts:
http://www.blackdemographics.com/floridablackdemographics.html


http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/news_politics/2008/08/black-voters-fu.html
Black voters, energized by the nation's first viable black presidential candidate, are a major reason Democrats are outregistering Republicans by more than a 2-to-1 margin in Florida, according to the latest figures released by the Florida Division of Elections.
Blacks comprise about a third of the 252,631 new voters registered by Democrats in 2008 -- compared with 98,354 new Republicans, who are losing black party members.
"The state and the country are pretty evenly divided right now. That means all groups, whether young people or African-American or Latino, can make a difference in a close election," Martinez said.]

Kendrick Meek run for the senate was/is not some vanity act. The man is in it to win it. He looked at the numbers and studied them. Maybe its time that progressives did the same thing and back the true democratic progressive who is not ashamed to caucus with the dems and voted for health care reform.

Oh about that health care thingy, this is what crist said,"the health care bill was too big, too expensive, and expanded the role of government far too much. Had I been in the United States Senate at the time, I would have voted against the bill because of unacceptable provisions like the cuts to the Medicare Advantage program."
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/27/4984532-crist-flip-flops-on-health-care

Florida Progressive Blogger about the senate race:
http://quinnell.us/sspb/?p=8298
Charlie Crist is Scarier Than Marco Rubio

[budkin]

1. Crist needs to drop out for the good of Florida and the nation

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. Crist Is Running A Strong Second And Meek Is Running A Distant Third

Without Crist in the race, the soft Democrats and indys who are voting for him for will go to Rubio.

Is it better for the race to look like this:

Rubio- 43% Crist 36%, Meek 21%

or

Rubio 63% -Meek 37%

The cake is baked either way. At least Democrats will have someone to blame.

DemocratSinceBirth
Florida Voter Since 1976

[LynneSin]

3. I'll be totally honest, I would not judge poorly any democrat who went Crist

I won't recommend it or suggest it but after talking to my friend who is a diehard democrat even she's making that consideration with Crist. I feel awful for Meeks because he seems like a decent person who would make a great senator. But at what point do you stand up and ask yourself "Do I go with my principals which would give me one of the potentially worst republican senators you could imagine as your senator or do I go for the block?"

[Bluenorthwest]

5. Anyone who'd vote for Rubio is no Democrat. Sorry 'bout that.

Rubio and Crist are both Palin loving, right wing Republicans. Crist lost his nomination, and yet he did not have the decency to walk away. That is the sort of man he is.
Seems to me these so called Democrats who refuse to vote for the Democratic candidate must be holding prejudice against Meek. They are willing to vote for Tea Bagging Palin lovers, but why? Seems to me there is only one reason.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. Hugh Rodham Ran In A Similar Environment In 94 And Lost By More Than Thirty Points

Meek can't win for the following reasons

1)Barack Obama is massively unpopular in Florida. His disapproval rate is 56%

2) Florida is always a tough nut for Democrats. Only three Demcrats have won high public office in the last generation-Bob Graham, Lawton Chiles, and Bill Nelson and they were all perceived as centrists

3)Florida tilts Republican. The congessional delegation is majority Republican and the Republicans have near veto proof majorities in the state house and senate.

4) Meek is a weak candidate with little statewide recognition.

All that being said, Democrats might as well vote for Meek rather than alienate a key constituency. Thne downside is Marco Rubio is going to parlay his senate seat into a national role. The Democrats can not win without capturing the Latino vote. Marco Rubio is a dagger aimed right at the Democratic hold on it. The last thing the Democrats need as an opponent is a Latino Ronald Reagan.


P.S. Obama carried Florida. Meek's race has little to with his predicament as Hugh Rodham's race had little to do with his when he lost by more than thirty points to Connie Mack in the 1994 Senate race.

[Bluenorthwest]

9. Oh, my, fear of Rubio, based on half assed assumptions

First off, politics is hard, and you do not always get what you want. You have to build a Party to have a Party. Other States have done so. Other red State Democrats do not explain that the Democrat can not win, not matter what, and simply not campaign for the candidate. If we all did that, we could not grow as a Party.
Marco Rubio will not have a national role. The rest of the nation will hate his guts. He's Cuban. He gets the Cuban vote. That is not the Latino vote, not at all. If you are under the impression that Rubio would have any sort of pull with say, west coast Latinos, you'd be sadly mistaken. Rubio might be a dagger at the heart of the Florida Cubano community, but that does not translate as you seem to fear it does. Assume it does.
So, you say that Obama won Florida, but he is so unpopular that a man who is not Obama can not possibly win. Both ends of that candle. Working hard at it.
And anyone who claims they know what can and can not be is dancing with a tarted up guess, and everybody knows it. A guess, or an excuse.
Charlie Crist chanted 'drill baby drill' with Mooselini on TV for America to see. No one could scare me into voting for that. He went around touting her experience over Obama's to be President. I'd not vote for that, because a vote is an endorsement. It is you saying to the nation, to your kids, that this is a person you see as worthy of trust and admiration, the best choice.
Democrats vote for Democrats. That is the only action that makes a Democrat. At least for me, they did not issue me a hat or a badge, so I have to vote for the D.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. I Will Address Your Points Without Snark As I Am A Gentlemanly Interlocutor

I never said Democrats can not win high statewide office in Florida. I said it is difficult and the record proves it. That's why only three Democrats have been elected governor or senator in the past thirty years and two of them have been both governor and senator.

Now to your disquisition on Latinos. You are in Eugene, Oregon. Let's see the demographics there. It's 5% Latino. I lived in Miami, Florida. It's 70% Latino. I have the advantage of actually living among the people I write. Some people write about diversity. I celebrate it by living among it. Your suggestion that Latinos from different parts of the hemisphere "hate" one another is overblown. There is some truth to that sentiment but not much. If that was the case how did Puerto Rican born Maurice Ferre become the mayor of largely Cuban populated Miami? I live among and have friends in Florida that are Cuban. Puerto Rican, Dominican, Colombian, Mexican, et cetera. Are their rivalries and tensions? Of course. Do they "hate each other guts"t? Hardly.

I will tell you what,amigo. You can visit Miami. Lord knows we can use the money. Take the bus or a cab to SW 11th Street, have a nice Cuban Sandwich, and ask the people there if they "hate" other Latinos.

Oh, before you suggest I visit the West Coast I have been to L.A. and visited Montebello, Compton, and Lynwood, not to mention Koreatown, the SFV, and West Hollywood.

P.S. For the record. Charlie Crist is a lost cause. But that doesn't mean Meek will come within twenty points of Rubio or Rubio's not a potential political threat.

[Diamonique]

10. Florida *is* part of the South after all.

[ChiciB1]

15. Democrats Are Voting FOR CRIST to KEEP RUBIO Out! I Have Yet To Hear

any of my friends utter the words, I'm voting for RUBIO!

[Cognitive_Resonance]

4. Playing the race card helps no one...except Rubio and extremists. Crist is the alternative. nt

[Bluenorthwest]

6. Crist endorsed Palin as worthy of being President

That is not an alternative, that is just another Republican. Those who vote Crist are putting another Palin supporter in the Senate, with full intention and knowledge of that fact. They are doing so to support a Recently Rejected Republican. There seems to be only one reason they are willing to back a Palinite. All the rationalizations do not fit. When people tell me they know the future, as Crist backers here have been doing since early summer, a reasonable person knows they are delusional. The Amazing Kreskin Voters.
If Florida voters are so smart that they can predict an election months out, why is it they keep being the focal point of each cycle, for their 'special needs' and various problems, thrid party, vote counting, always it is something with Florida, yet they also want us to believe they can predict the future! I think they need to prognosticate some of their 'issues' and get their act in order for next cyle, that is what I think. Y'all 'know the cake is baked' why don't you know you have big problems in advance and address those problems?
You can not claim to know everything and still have the most fucked up State Party in America. It will not play. It looks silly.

[angee_is_mad]

8. SO you tell the black folks in Florida

guess we will have to see how that goes over after the election. Oh I know. When crist gets his ass handed to him, progressives will blame the black folks. Just like black folks are going to blame the dems for Meek's treatment.

[PhilosopherKing]

11. No, cmon.

Who has the best chance of beating Crist? According to all the polls, Meek is a distant third. If he drops out, Crist has a shot to beat Rubio. There is a time to be pragmatic and a time to be idealistic. The Republicans of Delaware chose idealism and lost a senate seat pickup.

For the record, I would love to have Meek in the senate. But can he win?

[angee_is_mad]

12. can crist win w/o the AA vote?

which will make scott governor.

[ChiciB1]

14. Meek Is ON THE BALLOT... I DO NOT Think Meek Will Drop Out Either!

I will be shocked if he does. Many Democrats have waited for quite some time now to make up our minds and Meek has never polled ahead of Crist! NOT ONCE!

Living here, reality is setting in and it has NOTHING to do with BLACK OR WHITE, nor racism either, IMO. I'm the furtherest thing from being a racist and I have yet to hear any of my Democratic friends utter ONE WORD about Meek being BLACK! I've posted numbers about Democrats I know "personally" who have and WILL vote for Crist! THEY are not lying to me, many are my own family.

Meek just hasn't been a strong candidate, and up in Tallahassee Crist still has many, many friends who will go the distance for him. Remember, he IS STILL THE GOVERNOR here. I've heard things about the huge rift between Jebby & Crist, and sides have been chosen. Jebby CHOSE RUBIO as "his boy" and many didn't like it. The legislature is GOVERNED by Repukes, and not all are loyal to Jebby!

I live in a very RED county, and I haven't seen ONE, NOT ONE sign up for MEEK! The local Democratic Party here is very DLC and I can't name one county commissioner that has ever been elected as a Democrat! And yesterday was the FIRST TIME I got a flyer with Meek's name on it. But it was a flyer that named ALL the Democrats running in my District, so it wasn't one Meek sent out himself. It came from the local Democratic Party.

I keep coming to these threads trying to explain why it is what it is. AND it ain't easy, but remember what the Indians said. Walk a mile in my shoes, etc., etc. This is the WORST election I've ever had to vote in, but to blame Floridian Democrats is rather harsh. Maybe Meek started too late, or maybe he was the wrong candidate to be running this time around. Who will EVER know?? Nationally it's said that Democrats will lose overall, and given what Florida politics is like, why is it so hard to think that Meek just can't win?? If Feingold is in trouble in a BLUE state, what are the odds of Meek winning in a mostly RED state? We're having to PICK OUR POISON!

I'm done for today, it's late... but it WILL be interesting to see how the numbers add up in the end. We ALL could be wrong!!!!

[angee_is_mad]

16. January 2009 is to late?

Being the 1st person to throw his hat in the race to late?

Also it isn't surprising nor impressive to me that none of your friends and family never mentioned Meek's race for the lack of support. Heck, even the teabaggers say they aren't racist and that the reason they hate Obama has nothing to do with his race. Of course I do not mean to imply or compare your friends and family to teabaggers. My point is that it is RARE that anyone say they dislike or can't support someone because of his/her race in this day in time. Instead they use code words like Muslim, socialist, non American.

[ChiciB1]

20. WELL, Let Me Just Say This AND Perhaps I Can Clarify My Statement

to YOU! I grew up as an Army brat in a state called TEXAS! I AM also a Boomer who lived there through the Civil Rights fight! I SAW "first hand" black/white drinking fountains and even as YOUNG as I was I UNDERSTOOD discrimination. I saw that when I went to high school that when "our" black athletes went out of town to play sports that they were unable to eat with the rest of the team!

There were schools that were segregated, but since Ft. Hood was a very large military installation, we had people of color attending our school and so "my school" was MUCH MORE INCLUSIVE that MOST because of it. I HAVE friends of all colors in my LIFE today, and GOOD ones and COLOR means NOTHING to me.

My father was a Sgt/Maj. so he commanded a company, AND ON A REGULAR basis he brought men home on Sundays to eat dinner with us. Not only blacks, but Latinos, Hawaiians you name it. They were also invited to come along with us when we had picnics at a local lake, and NOT because we felt sorry for them, but because many of them were away from home and our home was open to them! It was because MY FATHER was a good man and taught me that COLOR is simply that COLOR! Just as he taught me that people with disabilities were no less a person because of it! And, I came from a family of SIX girls so it wasn't easy financially as I grew up, but what we had we tried to share! I went to work when I was 14 because I wanted to play tennis & I was required to buy my own racquets and shoes because my parents couldn't afford to pay the extra money. I can recall wearing shoes that I put cardboard in during practice so I could save my "good" shoes for tournaments! I KNOW what it's like to "pinch a penny!" And in these times, I'm right back to "pinching pennies!"

Have I had arguments with others who "dare" to descriminate... YOU BET I HAVE! So please DO NOT judge me for what I said. Perhaps I didn't say it as you would have liked, but maybe that's YOUR problem and NOT MINE!

As for being "late" I was REFERRING to the time of day!!! I didn't check before I started this reply, but I do believe it was past midnight and HEY, I was getting tired!

Am I UNHAPPY about the way things have gone here in this state, you BETCHA BABY!!! But DO NOT blame ME for the fact that Meek HAS not broken through. I came to my decision "late" having watched this race very closely. Some of my friends TOLD me that I was being too optimistic, but still I waited.

I don't propose to be "noble" because of what my father taught me and because we were an inclusive family, but my father didn't single out people of color so he would look good. He was just a wonderful person who taught me that "all men are created equal!" He was the one who was instrumental in introducing me into politics at the age of 11, and I have NEVER forgotten so many lessons he taught me through the years. There should be many more like him, but unfortunately there are not!

Whether we "white" people like it or not, so much of OUR culture would be so "lame" in so many areas of life had it not been for what the people of color have infused into the WHITE culture. I only have to say "music" and you could draw on from there!

I don't want to argue this point with you, nor do I want to start a fight, but I DO want to say that I feel you are out of line "presuming" that because people don't say something, that doesn't mean they aren't racist. I know MY OWN HEART!

I don't associate myself with people who don't understand that "all men are created equal" and that goes for LGBT's too! I am NO better, and I can tell you emphatically that I will call anyone out if I see discrimination when I'm around. Discrimination of any form!

Have a nice Saturday...

[angee_is_mad]

21. bit sensitive aren't you

but as I said I wasn't comparing YOU or your family and friends to teabaggers or imply that you all were racist. I specifically made the point to clarify that I wasn't going there.

The point is that in this day and time it is RARE for someone to say that he/she doesn't like, support someone because of his/her skin color.

[Radical Activist]

13. Crist can't win. Meek can win with an unexpected large black turnout

and Democrats voting for the Democrat.

[grantcart]

17. Too bad we couldn't get a third Republican to run lol

[angee_is_mad]

18. I know right

it just boggles my mind that progressives are asking the progressive to drop out (like he's a spoiler) so that the rethug/indie (?) can win. Mind you, the indie will not say whether or not he will caucas with the dems, he is against HCR and for smaller government.

The ironic thing is that if crist were a democrat, progressives would be shouting, "primary him, get him out of here, we want a TRUE progressive!"