Raise the retirement age to 69?

[leftyladyfrommo]

Big headline in the KC Star this morning. Great idea for cutting costs.

Well, except:

There are tons of people who will never be able to work until they are 69. I'm sorry but people who are 69 and just not able to compete physically or mentally with 25 year olds. I sure can't. And it's so humiliating to try and then just get knocked down. My memory isn't what it used to be. I used to be able to remember everything. Not anymore. And physically? Stuff is starting to wear out. Not much I can do about that.

And now anyone over 40 can't get a job. So just what are people supposed to do?

Boy, am I depressed today. This whole thing is really starting to settle down right around my 62 year old head. I can't get a regular type job. So I pet sit. I make about $20,000 a year doing that. $6,000 out for health insurance. Not much left to live on. I'm sure not living high on the hog. And I have it a lot better than a lot of people. At least I have some income.

[ixion]

1. Yeah. It should actually be lowered...

to 50-55.

[leftyladyfrommo]

3. I would be happy with 62.

That seems to be about the age when people's health really starts to take a beating.

[Ginto]

30. I would go as low as 45.

Let the young fill the workforce.

[area51]

35. +1

This would help with the job discrim for anyone over the age of 40.

[dkf]

2. Aren't they doing that in 2050?

Why are we scaring the man? We are freaking him out for no reason.

[leftyladyfrommo]

4. I don't know. I just read the headline and went on.

Too depressing.

[dkf]

14. They start raising the age gradually in 2050. It ends at age 69 in 2075.

People need to calm down.

[leftyladyfrommo]

21. Are you kidding me? 2050?

Well, maybe by then they will find something so people can live forever.

I'm lost here. Why did they decide 2050? Someone just throw that out and everyone agreed?

[dkf]

32. Because that doesn't affect most of us who would freak out now.

And it gives time to plan.

[eridani]

65. IOW, the people who will retire in 2050 are right now looking at a job market--

--that will DECIMATE their lifetime earning potentials. There will be even MORE people in the situation of the OP by then, so just fuck your retirement age raise straight to hell.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

56. Longer lifespans?

I'll be 70 in 2050, FWIW.

[eridani]

66. Fuck that shit. We now have DECREASING life spans for low income women

Most of the increasein longevity is due to lower death rates at very early ages. Moreover, the increase is very unevenly distributed. For lower income women, longevity is actually decreased. Needless to say, low income women are by far more likely to have Social Security provide most of their income in old age.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn13746-no-southern-comfort-as-life-expectancy-falls.html

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hus/tables/2002/02hus030.pdf On average, life expectancy at 65 years (the only number that matters—not life expectancy from birth) is up 3.5 years for males and up 4.2 years for females.

[Parker CA]

7. I believe it's 2075. nt

[yurbud]

5. raising the retirement age during high unemployment means more people competing for jobs

[leftyladyfrommo]

6. Maybe we need to go back to living in communes.

A lot of us did that when we were younger. Maybe we could just do it again. At least we would have a place to live. We could take care of each other.

[fasttense]

24. There are several communes around here in TN.

They are people living on huge tracks of farmland where each member's contribution varies depending on the commune you join.

I don't think they call them communes though and it's open to people of all ages. They are designed around farming the land in a natural and sustainable way and sharing the bounty they raise. Some are here today and gone tomorrow. Some are no bigger than 3 people. But it may be something you would be interested in.

I've been looking at a couple of such "communes". We have land and a house of our own and we are raising chickens and specialty crops (naturally and in a sustainable way) to sell to restaurants. To expand our business we need more people working the land. If we combined our efforts with one of these "communes" or farms, we may be able to increase both of our yields.

I'll see if I can find you a link.

[Terry in Austin]

49. Yes -- linky, please!

Good on ya for seeing the future and living it!

:fistbump:

[daleanime]

8. I hear you....

putting in 50+ hour weeks(when I can) wondering how long I'll be able to and I'm only 50. No way in hell will I be able to maintain this pace for 19 more years.O8)

[Cant trust em]

9. 69 is old.

Sorry for all of you who might be approaching that age, but folks should not need to work that long. My mom just turned 62 and 7 years feels like a long time from now. She's probably in better shape than 80% of people her age too.

[no_hypocrisy]

10. Even if one could work until 69, there's the perpetual challenge of age discrimination.

Workers in their forties report blatant job discrimination based on their age. Imagine being 66?

The true viable workers at age 69 would either be menial service jobs or entrepreneurs. I can't see even Baby Boomers hiring other Baby Boomers.

What the Commission is asking us is to live in poverty for four years before getting the Social Security we paid for. The SS "donut hole".

[Turbineguy]

11. They already did

for most Americans.

[uncommon]

12. This is just another policy that will disproportionately hurt the poor and lower-middle class.

People who do hard physical jobs can't keep up that pace in theirs 60s.

$20K a year doesn't go far these days. :hug:

[Crazy Dave]

13. I agree

They should be lowering the retirement age for unemployed workers over 50.

All these "shovel ready" road and construction projects may help the young and fit workers get a paycheck again but nobody gives a shit about the 60 year old, laid off office clerk who hasn't worked in two years.

[Bigmack]

15. Left teaching at 55....

at the top of my game. Yes, I am bragging.

I could see the handwriting on the wall, tho. To teach (high school), you have to be able to run while juggling chainsaws and nerfballs at the same time. You have to be on your game 200% of the time. If you ain't?.... well... you're not teaching, you're just standing in front of a classroom.

I've worked construction and logging, too. (Can't make it on a teacher's salary alone.) Anybody who thinks a roofer or framer can work to 69 is too stupid to be making laws.

[kstewart33]

16. Lefty lady, I hear you.

I'm 58 and my memory has declined especially with remembering names.

There is no way that people over 65 can compete for good jobs. It's not going to happen.

So retirement at 69 is essentially saying that once you're in your sixties and you get laid off (and many will), you're stuck with dirtbag jobs until you're 69.

[KansDem]

17. Especially when one considers this report--

DU Thread: 'The new unemployables': Workers over 50

I guess we're supposed to twittle our thumbs for another few years...:(

[laughingliberal]

22. "I guess we're supposed to twittle our thumbs for another few years..."

No, it would help them a lot more if we'd just die before we're eligible. And many will. With no income or access to health care after 50, it will really cut down on the numbers who actually make it long enough to collect.

They're not stupid, you know.

[glitch]

57. Not stupid, just evil. nt

[laughingliberal]

18. People who advocate raising the retirement age are either too young to know how life is after 60...

or they have very easy jobs.

I'm an RN, 55. Average age of retirement for nurses is 57 and it's not because we all get rich and don't need the money. It would be poetic justice to assign the nurses forced to keep on until 69 to anyone in the hospital who supported this plan.

[MineralMan]

19. Well, the full retirement age for anyone born after 1960 is already

67. The age stopped being 65 quite some time ago.

http://www.ssa.gov/retire2/retirechart.htm

If you're not aware of how this all works, the link above will explain it. The age for full retirement was changed to a variable age.

I don't like it, but it's nothing new.

[ILFightinDem]

52. Yes - and this latest proposal is actually 'kinder' than the last change

Not that I'm enamored of this proposal - but for different reasons...

Example: At the last change, which went from 65 to 67 for people born after 1960 - I was born in 1964, and my 'full' retirement age is 67, according to that little mailing we all get each year. So in four years, they implemented a full 24 month delay in claiming benefits (although I can still get a 'reduced' benefit at 62).

This proposal says that the 'full benefits' age will bump up one month, for every two years of elapsed time - starting in 2050. I haven't done the math, but that seems like the age will bump up more gradually than it did for us the last time they changed it. Is it pushing the boundary of quality time left to enjoy any sort of respite from work? Yes. No argument there.

What upsets me more is the proposal (?) that the benefits are no longer indexed to earnings - but to inflation. That says to me that there'll be one standard benefit, which won't change much at all, because the CPI numbers don't reflect reality at all (food & energy costs being excluded from CPI), and the benefits not being increased for current recipients for 2 years running due to 'lack of inflation' (1st time ever, I believe). Fixed income is really going to mean 'fixed' :(

Anyway, someone with a better understanding than me chime in here - I'm not an expert or an actuary :) There's a link to the 'actual' proposal (Powerpoint / PDF) in the 'Economy' discussion area. 50 pages - but worth looking at (if only to see who benefits most - and it's certainly not working class folks - never is, though).

As I write this, I'm hearing Larry Kudrow saying "the left is whining", and Trish Regan (CNBC) saying she's a big believer in privatizing SS. Sickening - that's going to be our 'starting' point, and we'll be expected to move rightward from there?

[whathehell]

20. This really sucks...and boomers, such as me and you, shouldn't take it.

At least a Million people in France RIOTED at the thought of not being able to retirement going from Sixty to Sixty Two.. and they're trying to push this shit on us?

We've got to reclaim our backbones, people.

[Skidmore]

23. My mother died at age 62

of cancer. She worked at just about $.25 above minimum wage for the 35 years as a nursing assistant in a county nursing home. She was put on a fast track to get SS because she was terminally ill and the first check arrived the day after her funeral. I think of all the hard work she did and the toll it took on her physically. It makes me angry that physical work is so scorned by our society and those who ostensibly are deciding our laws. You tell me the last time any of those people up there did anything physical in terms of work except to show off for a campaign fundraiser. The poor and lower classes don't retire. Retirement is a middle and upper class thing. People on the lower levels go to work and work until one day they are just too sick to report in and then die because they don't have the resources to pay for extensive medical care.

Frankly, I was prepared to sacrifice some for improving the nation's financial future, but I'll be damned if I assent to further cuts so long as those in the catbird seats are let go after stealing with impunity hand over fist for the past 30 years. Not one more thin dime will I hand over. Not one. Can we die fast enough for them?

[MadHound]

25. The real kicker on raising the eligibility age is that American lifespans are actually shrinking

<http://www.healthnews.com/family-health/aging-getter-older/us-life-span-declining-937.html>

So essentially what this rise in eligibility age means is that many, many people will simply work until they drop, no retirement, no Social Security.

[glitch]

59. Yep. As laughingliberal said up thread, they're not stupid.

They're evil, not stupid. Thanks for the link.

[deminks]

26. Growing older is not for the timid. Why make it harder than it has to be?

[leftyladyfrommo]

27. I wonder if we could start a political group for boomers?

We are going to need it. And we are going to need a voice that's hear in Congress and at the State and City level.

I wonder if we could do something her on DU?

I think it would spread pretty fast if we could just let people know what we are doing. There must be millions of us all got in the same swamp.

[Skidmore]

29. What purpose does the AARP serve?

[leftyladyfrommo]

34. I don't know.

I checked on getting my health insurance thru AARP once and I think it wasn't any better than anything I could just get on my own.

DEMOCRATS for older people!

[LiberalFighter]

28. If it can be done they should consider basing retirement age for different job categories.

But that would probably get really complicated.

Dangerous jobs that require daily physical activity. 55
Factory jobs working on the assembly line. 58

Executive and managerial type jobs. 102 :sarcasm:

[Lugnut]

31. My husband is a coal miner.

He's 67 and is already retired. There is no way on earth he could've made it to age 69.

[littlewolf]

33. I am intending to retire at 62 ... yes it will mean

less money .... but it will be worth it ....

[Not Me]

36. That's my plan too...

It'll mean a 25% reduction in Social Security and a 15% reduction in pension (yes, I am one of the very few that have a defined benefit pension) but I have other things in life that I want to do, including freeing this job up for someone else. About five years to go...

[littlewolf]

40. 8 for me ....

with my military and state pension ... I will be ok ....

[B Calm]

69. It's reported people live longer who retire at an early age compared

to the ones who work to 65 or older.

[TheKentuckian]

37. Not lowering it is fucking crazy talk. Talk of raising it ought to earn you an asswhopping

[mainer]

38. It won't affect most of us. Which is why it could pass.

Since it doesn't take effect until most of us are dead and gone, we can go ahead and screw the grandchildren.

[global1]

39. What Do 55 y/o's Do Between The Years 55 and 69 If They Can't Get A Job?......nt

[leftyladyfrommo]

46. You do like me. Just cobble stuff together to make enough to pay the bills.

Lots of people have a couple of part-time jobs. No benefits but at least you have some money coming in.

I pet sit. I never in my wildest dreams thought I would be 62 and working 16 hours a day. But I do. I get up at 4:30 and go out on my first run. I get done by about 8 most mornings. Second run is around noon. And then there is the nightly run - starts about 7:30 and usually make it home before 10.

I don't know what else to do. Computer stuff is so far ahead of me that I would never be able to catch up.

Physically I can't stay on my feet all day.

[JustAnotherGen]

41. The concept disgusts me

My mom is 63 and an exec in the hotel industry. Being an exec in that biz means NOTHING. You still have to pitch in as a server for Mother's day brunches, and clean the stairs on your hands and knees when a new hotel opens.

Due to the cheap bastards she works for not backfilling people that have left that particular brand/hotel - she's AGAIN working now for 17 days straight from between 9-12 hours a day with no break.


She would LOVE to retire - but she needs health insurance. So great - they are working her to death - she'll retire (I hope in 2 years - but I think these 'raise the age proposals are complete designed to fuck over the baby boomers) and then drop dead a day later.

Lovely. Isn't America just a beautiful place to live and die?

[leftyladyfrommo]

48. It's a great place until you get old.

Old people are just completely left out.

[glitch]

60. Kids and students and the newly graduated are getting shit on too.

Basically anybody who isn't in the top 2% is being attacked.

[avaistheone1]

42. Lots of companies start firing workers around age 40 and 45

because the companies can pay less the wages to someone almost half their age to get the job done.

So what are these folks aged 40+ supposed to do to support themselves until they reach age 69 and are Social Security eligible?

[FinsUpTechGuy]

43. so backwards

The people of France get it. This is backwards thinking. We need to LOWER the retirement age, not raise it. All raising it will do is add to the unemployment lines. Right now, people are working later anyway since Bush crushed their retirement accounts. Even if the nation stops losing jobs, unemployment would still get worse because we will have less people leaving the workforce, and the people coming in out of college/high school will have no jobs to take.

[leftyladyfrommo]

44. At least a lot of college kids can go home to live.

Where do you go when you are 62? And your retirement blew away with the bubble?

[raccoon]

55. Yep. If your parents are gone, what are you supposed to do, stay in the cemetery?

Or, if they're still around, their room in the nursing home?

[Sanity Claws]

45. What about the fact that employers won't hire older workers?

I am in my 50s and would love to work but employers won't even talk to me. In over two years of job applications, I've had only one interview.
There are no jobs for older workers.

[leftyladyfrommo]

47. You have to make your own job.

There are no jobs to get and its a huge waste of time to look.

[Sanity Claws]

50. Yes.

However, I have a hard time thinking about businessed most 65-69 year olds could create. With such a short span, it isn't worth sinking a lot of capital into it.
Further, your body is not as adept at doing a lot of things it used to.

[jwirr]

51. If they raise the age they will only have more people claiming

disability before the age limit. That is as long as they leave the disability issue alone.

[eridani]

67. And they aren;t goint to do that. It's hard enough to get on disability now n/t

[LibertyLover]

53. It worries me somewhat

Where I work we must retire at age 62. They sometimes make exceptions for some of the upper management, but never for us peons. I do have an old-fashioned pension here and I am vested, but still, the changes they are proposing to Social Security worry me.

[wordpix]

54. I feel for you and health insurance is killing me (in my 50's) - these so called "leaders" need to

ensure there are decent jobs for those in their 50's and 60's + affordable health insurance before they go cutting anyone off.

[kenny blankenship]

58. Retire 536 assholes in Washington and start over

[Scuba]

61. Let's see those proposing this....

...move patients, hang drywall, etc. for ONE DAY.


Bet they can't make it.

[Overseas]

62. No no no. Tough enough to get work at over-50. //nt

[progressoid]

63. Frankly, I don't really plan on retiring.

It would be nice but I doubt I'll be able to afford to. Can't really count on SS to live on and most of our savings are gone. The last decade has drained us dry financially. I can't see that getting any better in the next decade or two. So, we'll just keep working - even if it's some shit job.

[Catherina]

64. Rec'd n/t

[TheWebHead]

68. 69 by 2075

we have absolutely no idea of medical advancements that will occur in the next 65 years, talking about the impact of 2 extra years until benefits kick in using today's terms seems rather silly.

[Obamanaut]

70. If it is true that people who are 69 cannot compete mentally and physically,

why do we elect/reelect so many of them to congress?

Some say John McCain is too old, yet there are many senators who are older.

Some say 'the rich' don't care about the rest of us, yet 44% of the members of congress are millionaires.

Some say 'old, rich, white men...', well, this is who we put/keep in office.