How'd That Pissing on Obama Thing Work Out for You?

[JTFrog]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/11/4/917566/-Howd-That-Pissing-on-Obama-Thing-Work-Out-for-You

Instead of standing by the President when he had to make quick decisions to rescue this country from catastrophe and utter chaos, these critics ripped into the President's staffing decisions. Instead of examining the full context of health reform, the ideologues lamented the loss of a weak public option and refused to admit any good in the overall reform that will provide coverage to 32 million additional American and has already outlawed pre-existing conditions discrimination against children.

Instead of rallying their vast networks of supporters and readers behind the most significant piece of financial reform since the 1930s, these my-way-or-highway minded individuals were busy amplifying its few imperfections over its far-reaching impact and strong regulations on financial institutions.

Other significant once-in-a-lifetime reforms and advancements like student loan reform, credit card reform, children's health insurance expansion under SCHIP, workplace and paycheck fairness for women and hate crimes legislation barely registered on the radars of these pompous self-aggrandizers. They refused to even recognize the unprecedented challenges this President faced both because of unprecedented obstruction and having to be president while black. Instead of having the President's back when he needed us badly, they stabbed him in the back. Why? Probably to cash in (I use that term quite literally) in the populist anger in the aftermath of the financial collapse.

Every single one of these reforms will forever change the lives of ordinary Americans for the better. Most have already begun to. Yet, all you heard from the Cenk Uygur and his cohorts is unabashed, fact-less condemnation of the President and the Democrats every time they have had to make a few compromises to make big reforms forward. All you heard from them is how the President is a sellout, how the Democratic members of Congress who took tough votes (and ultimately ended up losing their seats) must be in the pockets of corporate America since they were not able to get through this little part in one bill or that little part in another. All you heard was what a disappointment President Obama was, despite - or perhaps because of - his accomplishments in office.

more at link.

[nofurylike]

1. K&R! thank you so much for posting that, JTFrog! Truth!! nt

[Number23]

111. "Truth!!" You know it!

:pals:

(Btw, I rec'd but it's still at zero. I'm shocked. SHOCKED, I tells ya)

[nofurylike]

114. "SHOCKED, I tells ya" thanks for the LOL, Number23!!!

and with such sensible people all over this place?! why, how evah?!

i never saw that smilie. i love it!

:pals: indeed!!

:hi:

solidarity

[Junkdrawer]

2. How'd That Pissing on the Base Thing Work Out for Obama ?

:shrug:

[JCMach1]

3. exactly

[ChairmanAgnostic]

4. Let's see. Obama has 1 vote, we have millions.

So it is our fault when he and his team piss on us?

I smell a rahm here, or a rat. Same diff.

[SusanaMontana41]

118. Yup. n/t

[JTFrog]

5. Oh you folks have had that covered for a couple days now.

Best to introduce some common sense to the picture.

[jgraz]

54. I think I see your problem

"Common sense" is not a synonym for "shit I just made up because it makes me feel good."

Go get some actual facts to back up your claims. We'll wait.

[JTFrog]

63. Common sense is the knack of seeing things as they are, and doing things as they ought to be done.

We obviously disagree on how things ought to be done.

I believe that small steps are better than none.

[jgraz]

67. You'll pardon me if I rely on actual facts, then

Like the fact that the Democrats lost because the Obama coalition stayed home. The youth vote, the minority vote, the labor vote all abandoned Obama. The depressed turnout in the youth vote alone more than covers the margin of victory in the House races.

None of these people ever heard of Cenk Uygur or Jane Hamsher. What they did hear about was 10% unemployment, inadequate health care, abandoned campaign promises and capitulation to the Republicans.

[northernlights]

88. small steps are only as good as...

the direction they go in.

Obama's small steps all went the wrong way. They weren't even small steps. They were big steps. Marching us in the wrong direction every step of the way.

[JTFrog]

91. Ridiculous. n/t

[northernlights]

103. ridiculous is a good word.

increasing the war in Afghanistan was ridiculous. increasing spying on citizens was ridiculous. Continuing rendition was ridiculous. Adding assassination of citizens based on suspician is beyond ridiculous and just plain murder. A half-sized stimulus largely re-directed to tax cuts was ridiculous. A health insurance giveaway was ridiculous.

Oh, and then there's the claim that there's no evidence of systematic fraud in the foreclosure nightmare...ridiculous. saying the mortgage fraud was a state issue -- after his best pal W said it was a federal issue when the states tried to stop it early on -- was ridiculous. Letting war criminals off the hook is ridiculous. Letting bankster criminals off the hook is ridiculous. Rewarding them is sheer lunacy.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

122. ...the oil in the Gulf evaporated -- nothing here

Change is hard and takes time -- agreed. So let's bring back all of Clinton's advisors...???

Building a railroad from Chicago to Orlando is hard and takes time. But I wouldn't start building in the direction of Seattle because I'm never going to get to Orlando.


I've been wondering what the "He's playing chess not checkers" crowd would come up with -- attack those who said he's not a very good checkers player.

[pasto76]

80. The post is littered with facts. You are the person he is addressing.

Whole bunch of good stuff since he took office. Real pressing issues. Brink of a depression, crazy inflation, jobs evaporating from this country. Oh and two concurrent wars.

Yes, I want repeal of DADT and some other stuff. I can say that back in 2004 when gay marriage was THE hot button topic of the elections, I repeatedly asked why the War in Iraq didnt get first billing. Equality is important. as a DEMOCRAT I am committed to it. But the fact is, there are a TON more pressing issues at hand right now.

So you think any republican is going to address DADT, or do you think President Obama will, after he gets this economy rolling? Seriously. Ask yourself this.

[jgraz]

83. Here's a fact for you: The Democrats just lost the House.

They failed politically. Therefore, their political strategy was a failure. They violated the first rule of politics: you can't govern if you don't win.

You can try to blame whomever you want, but if the President and the party do not enact fundamental change, they will both be out on the street in 2012.

[BzaDem]

14. Pretty well. To the extent that Obama even personally cares about running again, losing the House

probably helps him gain re-election tremendously (as it did Clinton).

[Junkdrawer]

18. Good Point. Obama can now enact a DLC agenda AND look like a "hold the line" Democrat.

It's a FAR more comfortable position for a conservative Democrat.

[MannyGoldstein]

22. FDR gained many seats in the 1934 mid terms

Worked out pretty well for him, no?

[BzaDem]

92. Well, if Obama had 60 votes in the Senate and GAINED seats in the House, that might have been fine.

But that wasn't in the cards no matter what happened. Political science models not even taking into account Obama's approval rating had us losing tens of seats (just based on things like the PVI of districts and the economy). We were going to lose seats regardless.

The only possible majority we would have had would have been a powerless majority, resting on a few members of the Democratic caucus almost as conservative as Republicans on many issues. Furthermore, we wouldn't have gained seats in the Senate, meaning we wouldn't even be able to pass House bills through the Senate.

Faced with the choice of a powerless majority (but still getting all the blame), and a minority (where Obama can blame Republicans, given their power), Obama clearly would have preferred the latter.

[JTFrog]

98. FDR lost 70 house seats and 6 senate seats in 1938, 55 House seats and 9 Senate seats in 1942.

And he was reelected to 3rd and 4th terms in 1940 and 1944.

[Dinger]

30. Good Point

A perfect reply.:)

[Le Taz Hot]

42. +1

:shrug:

[baldguy]

51. +1000

[ScreamingMeemie]

53. Recommending a reply!

The smug DLCers can't smug their way out of this one. It is what it is.

[racaulk]

66. +1

Thank you! :thumbsup:

[Dappleganger]

76. Exactly how I feel.

Yet I still went out to vote.

[EFerrari]

79. Exactly. n/t

[Individualist]

85. +1

[bigwillq]

99. .....

:thumbsup:

[donheld]

109. +1000

[DailyGrind51]

123. HCR with escalating insurance premiums now, but no pre-existing coverage until 2014,

NO Employee Free Choice!

NO negotiated drug prices!

NO public option!

NO repeal of DADT!

NO end to "too big to fail"!

NO increase in taxation of hedge funds!

NO "fire-wall" between personal and investment banking!

NO "buy America" provision!

NO need to say more!

[Orlandodem]

6. His RTTT plan is a disaster. Enough teachers will not vote for him in 2012 that he may

not be reelected. When you piss off your base....

[JTFrog]

7. I guess everyone is allowed to have dreams.

:shrug:

[Supersedeas]

27. Yep, most of the Blue Dawgs are still dreaming--AT HOME, POST ELECTION

It means more than just a label to be considered a true Democrat.

Think about it.

[BzaDem]

15. We'll see how a Republican president works out for those English teachers. n/t

[Codeine]

35. Sweet. Teachers always find their lot improves under a Puke admin. nt

[TornadoTN]

69. And how, pray tell, is it improving under Obama's administration?

It's not and Arne Duncan is going to make sure it gets a hell of a lot worse. A lot of people will say to hell with it and just stay at home, another nail in the coffin of American democracy but at least people will have wised up to the scam.

[dkf]

8. He got all that done but he couldn't get unemployment down to 8%

Is it truly impossible for government to do? Or was there a lack of will?

[JTFrog]

9. Or were things just truly that fucked up? n/t

[dkf]

10. That would fall into the Impossible column.

Personally I don't think that is the case.

[JTFrog]

11. Yeah, it was impossible for Bush and Co. to FUBAR anything.

:eyes:

[ProfessorGAC]

29. Based Upon What Do You Think It Not The Case?

Were you on Saturn from 2001 to 2008? Or were you simply not paying attention to how disasterous the fiscal policies of the Silverspoon administration were?
GAC

[dkf]

58. You don't think a huge WPA type program could have worked?

I do.

[LAGC]

116. I'm with you dkf.

If they really wanted to get unemployment down, they could have created a massive jobs program.

Put people to work, until the economy picks up steam and the private sector can take back over.

[sendero]

19. The ARE just that ..

.... fucked up but that is no excuse to spend most of the resources spent on Wall Street instead of Main Street.


The perception (pretty much fair IMHO) that Obama was more focused on saving the banks than jobs are what cost him house.

Some would say that he had no choice and to some extent I would agree but coupled with the rest of his weak leadership and promise-breaking it really moved a lot of Independents back to the R column and probably left a lot of people who would normally vote disinterested.

[bluedave]

28. yep

certainly are

[timtom]

36. I dunno...ya suppose getting the HELL out of Iraq

and Afghanistan might have freed up some money to the spending middle class?

[BzaDem]

16. What makes you think it is possible in 2 years?

It might have been possible with trillions in stimulus (which wasn't politically possible). But absent that, what makes you think someone can snap their fingers and direct millions of peoples' economic decisions?

It seems to me that the burden should rest on people who claim it is possible, rather than people who claim it isn't.

[jgraz]

59. You know what was possible in two years? Actually trying.

If Obama had shown that he was truly committed to moving in the right direction, he'd have got all the patience in the world from the voters.

Once again, the problem is not that he didn't move quickly enough. The problem is that he moved in the wrong direction. Continue to misunderstand that and you'll have President Palin in 2012.

[dkf]

62. FDR did it.

[jpak]

100. Boner said the same thing!

GMTA

[TreasonousBastard]

12. Truth.

[babylonsister]

13. Rec'd fwiw. It's working well for a lot of people here apparently. nt

[B Calm]

17. Tax cuts for the rich bastards who sent our jobs away. 2011

[madrchsod]

20. so i am not to question the president?

gee...i thought this was a democracy and i was entitled to an opinion about the man i voted for....

from now on i guess i will sit down and shut up.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JTFrog]

26. Why does it always have to be one extreme or the other? nt/

[frylock]

86. why don't you tell us?

isn't it the STFU crowd that always threatens us with a palin presidency?

[JTFrog]

93. I wouldn't know, try asking the all or nothing crowd, the kill the billers, etc. n/t

[frylock]

95. the all or nothing crowd knew there was going to be small window of opportunity to get shit done..

obama wasted two fucking years trying to prove to everyone what we already knew; that the repubs were not going to play ball. you still think that health insurance reform is gonna be tweaked and fixed now with boner in charge?

[JTFrog]

96. Yes.

The same way social security and medicare were over the years.

[political_Dem]

21. Somebody had to say it. K and R.

[rug]

24. About as well as his wars.

[deacon]

25. He did a lot of great things in a very short time within a system that is obvioulsy reluctant to

change. Even the smallest change is difficult and any larger change requires an enormous amount of complex consorted effort.

[grahamhgreen]

31. Obama does not have a PR problem - he has a policy problem. CLOSE GITMO NOW!

[babylonsister]

33. HOW? RETHUGS AND SOME DINOS VOTED AGAINST IT!!!!!11

House Panel Deals Gitmo Closure a Major Setback
http://washingtonindependent.com/85355/house-panel-deals-gitmo-closure-a-major-setback

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0509/22758.html
Senate pulls Gitmo closure funding

[grahamhgreen]

37. As commander in chief, order the troops to close it.

Let everyone go who you can not build a case against.

Give the rest a fair trial.

[CTLawGuy]

32. K&R

this will not be well received here, but it's the truth. Too much focus on the shortcomings, to the point where people are questioning his motives, and not nearly enough acknowledgment of the positives. It's one thing to want more and its another to say because I didn't get 100% of what I wanted I got 0%.

[BzaDem]

34. K & R.

[JoePhilly]

38. K&R

[Vinca]

39. You have no idea how happy I was with the president's policies

when I called to enroll in the pre-existing condition pool and found out I'd have to be a gold miner to afford it. There's nothing like bone-on-bone hip pain to make you want to hobble up and down the road campaigning. The Dems got my vote anyway . . . how crazy is that?

[Mimosa]

44. No affordable health care, no public option and god only knows what in 2014

Vinca, I'm with you. It hurts and we got no help. We were told that was the best they could do...for the insurance companies! Why couldn't Obama even try?

In public I supported Obama as best as I could. Here on D.U. I can say what I really think.

Obama and his administration did not do enough for the people to get them convinced or enthused. He should be blaming his own message bearers including Rahmbo, Gibbs, and Kaine for their failures.

[GOTV]

40. Don't know. Obama never acted on the critisism. I bet it would have worked pretty good.

[ShamelessHussy]

41. leaders take 0 responsibility these days and take glee in blaming everything on the little guy, like

reTHUGs

damn shame, but until we get a leader who is truly on the side of weTHEpeople, that won't change.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

107. hmm, but don't a lot of people say that Obama works for THEM(aka the people)

that would make the people the leader and the buck stops with them >.>

[tanyev]

43. K & R

[Bobbie Jo]

45. K&R

:kick:

[wndycty]

46. K&R

:kick:

[CommonSensePLZ]

47. K&R and

He was too nice, but that's what makes him a good president and a better person than anyone the republicans will ever send out. He actually tried to give every American, dem and rep a voice. He just took it too far, once they'd made it clear that cooperation wasn't an option on the table for them he should've just given up.

[TwilightGardener]

48. K/R.

[FamousMortimer]

49. Not the guy I voted for

I voted for the Obama that said he would change things.

I got the Obama that continued both idiotic wars, continued rendition and illegal surveillance, bailed out banker criminals, and has a staff full of Clinton DLC retreads that prefer corporate interests to our interests.

When the guy I voted for actually shows up I will support him.

[CBR]

50. K&R nt

[baldguy]

52. I'm sorry I can only unrec this once.

Timidity & half-measures don't win elections - as we saw last Tuesday.

[jgraz]

55. I'll throw another unrec your way

It seems some people are determined to have even bigger losses in 2012.

[JTFrog]

101. You must be talking about those attack rodents. n/t

[ChairmanAgnostic]

60. luckily he fixed all that in his presser the next day,

didn't he? I mean, he just came on strong, showed his spine, and reminded America that
a) he was president
b) we hold the senate
c) we have the monopoly on ideas. The GOP only can say "no."

He did say that, didn't he? Didn't he?



er, you mean he caved into the Right before they made their first demand? Just like Health Care?

[TornadoTN]

70. Hit that one out of the park

All I saw was "Oh, poor pitiful me. I can't believe we lost this election! Well that means only one thing: we need to capitulate some more and march to the right! We just don't have the votes whereas before we.......didn't have the votes. Yeah! That's the ticket!"

[jgraz]

106. Well, you have to understand. It takes 60% of the voters to elect a Democrat

Doesn't it? :shrug:

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jgraz]

61. You mean aside from losing the House?

:banghead:

[TornadoTN]

71. Republican-Loving Values are working swimmingly for Obama!

He thinks it will get him reelected, like it did Clinton in 1996. March to the right, pretend all is well, and hope that your cult of personality rallies to put you back into office.

Plus, there's always the plus that the corporate powers that he has continually propped up and bowed to will be happy!

[cliffordu]

57. K&R

Excellent post.

[butterfly77]

64. Its working out well for many...

like Evan Bayh and his 10 million and the many others who have and are planning on writing another book,being hired as a pundit on tv,or rallying for themselves a tv show or,getting paid to dance in a minstrel show for teabagger,...priceless

[B Calm]

65. Why do we have two posts on page 1?

[ljm2002]

68. What a load of horse pucky...

...talk about trying to sell "black is white, up is down, and lies are truth."

People ripped into his staffing decisions because they sucked and simply extended the rule of the corrupt bunch of financiers who got us into the mess in the first place.

The ones who refused to examine the full context of health reform were Obama and Baucus and the rest of them who never allowed the idea of single payer to even be uttered, and who weakened the public option in the first place before discarding it altogether.

It's hard to argue how great the HCR bill is, in spite of its provisions that "will provide coverage to 32 million additional American and has already outlawed pre-existing conditions discrimination against children", given that (a) providing coverage is not the same as providing health care; (b) health care policies continue to cost more and provide less coverage; and (c) insurance companies are already finding ways around the law's provisions.

But sure, go ahead and blame the left for not following the Great Leader. After all, the left is so all-powerful, it must be our fault that Obama doesn't have any fight in him. Well not against the rabid right, anyway. He seems to have plenty of fight against the left.

Pffft.

[TheKentuckian]

72. Same old lame "If you'd clapped harder then Tinkerbelle would still be here" bullshit spin.

Its not enough to volunteer and vote, you gotta let that Kool Aid work down to the cockles and truly believe.

ROFLMAO....

Get real and deal with the fundamentally flawed nature of our corporate enabling "historic" legislation as you view the absolute black hole of foreclosures, not a net job created in years...not a single one, services being cut coast to coast, gigantic crimes committed and/or confessed to on national TV with almost zero accountability, continued dismantling of the commons (see space program), the shit deals cut and law and regulations being written by "stakeholders", increased use of illegal and immoral mercenaries in wars without end, Banks get all the resources and the people told they want a pony and shut the fuck up, ever mounting debt but nothing but a corporate police state for the people in exchange, and the future looks more bleak by the passing days.

The stupid meme that heeing and hawing about bad solutions would have won the day is beyond laughable.

Motherfuckers don't care what happens as long as they can sell. Clever marketing is not going to make this jacked up nonsense work nor are cheers going to make the lives of most of our brothers and sisters better.

When your dumbass is driving off a cliff, all the hip-hip-hoorays and Cosby kid celebrations in the world are not going to make the ride fly.
People have repeatedly advised of severe STRUCTURAL issues with policy that will cause rather serious problems and blowback and the blind insist on selling a list of nice features in hopes of creating support whether the underlying legislation is good or not.

Obama is willfully caught up in the Reagan paradigm and is consequentially and inherently not acting primarily in the best interest of the majority of the American people or those of the world.
Even rhetorically he only seeks to reverse Bush when what is needed is a smashing down of Reaganism. Not even a reversal will do, we must never forget and never lose track of the arrogant stupidity and greed that led us there.

The entire worldview must be indicted, tried, convicted, and put away forever. The desire to go back to pre-Bush times is empty as it leads right back to where we are and have been.

Obama is off on some old bullshit and should be called on it because it is about the people of our country. The game stops at belly, roof, and Constitution.
I'd love for the game theory fuckers to also be the ones sucking up the downside of a political calculation but it seldom works like that. Folks that are still holding on have room for patience and faith. Those that feel comfortable find it easy to joke and poke about ponies, they have a stable that may not be full but certainly has a few equines about.

The anti-change establishment wing needs to shut the fuck up because the problem is the stupid shit you do. Dumping the trash out onto the floor is "getting something done" but what got done sucks even if you find a couple good coupons that shouldn't have been pitched.

One step forward to take two or three back is a net fucking loss. Maybe a little better than opting for three steps back off the bat but we're still surely not moving forward and steadily the goalpost moves to the horizon.

Change must be substantive in direction, if not distance at first. Our institutions and structures have failed. We need to start building not an interior remodel because this ragged shit is coming down and if we outright refuse to use it as a bridge then bringing it down is the only pragmatic option.

[frylock]

87. ^this^

:applause:

[bullwinkle428]

73. How many times will this article get posted in GD?

I can guarantee that a lot of us have itchy un-rec fingers!

[donco6]

90. Until you learn to LIKE it! ker-SNAPPP! n/t

[Radical Activist]

74. Yes. The need for criticism from the left does not justify the spin and false narratives

of people like Cenk, Ted Rall, and Dave Sirota. They didn't help pass a progressive agenda. They didn't help raise the profile of progressive issues. They did nothing but act as speed bumps to change, just as much as Fox News did.

We needed a progressive echo chamber to reinforce progressive words and actions taken by Obama. That should include accurate criticism but it also needs to include praise for the positive. Instead, we got a group of left cannibals determined to eat their own.

[wndycty]

82. Plus 1000

:kick:

[Skidmore]

75. k&r

[bushisanidiot]

77. K&R!!!

WHINERS in our own party is what ousted Nancy Pelosi from the Speaker's seat. I hope those idiots are PROUD of themselves for helping Fox news get the word out about how "liberal" and "socialist" she is.

[EFerrari]

78. Pathetic blame shifting.

[TexasObserver]

81. How'd That Pissing on Supporters Thing Work Out for Obama?

When any Democratic politician dumps on his or her supporters after winning the election, those of us who have been involved in the process a long time find that offensive.

The president got bad advice and took it. Going after one's supporters is never a good idea.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

84. As usual...blame the left for the failures of the Centrists. Pathetic.

[Obamanaut]

89. More discussion at this thread w/ same subject line

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=9486091&mesg_id=9486091

[JTFrog]

94. D'oh, hijacked!

:rofl:
:rofl:
:rofl:

[WellsStreetHell]

97. thats what happens

If you just stand there and let your sworn-from-day-one enemies piss all over you and not only take it, but try and be their friends by caving on damn near every important issue, then what the hell do you expect from Americans? I believe that a significant percentage of voters went against Dems(Obama) because of this obvious weakness. It may not make a lot of sense, but Americans don't like percieved wimpishness and that is what Obama exudes.

[Scurrilous]

102. K & R

:thumbsup:

[jgraz]

104. Unrec for worthless scapegoating

Failure to learn the proper lessons from this loss will lead directly to President Palin in 2012. Your call.

[nadinbrzezinski]

105. Hippie punching!

And not KNOWING how politics actually works in this country...

Unless there is a culture where voting is just one thing YOU DO... or it is made mandatory... figure out how to get the base out EVERY FUCKING TIME... not getting them excited is NOT the way to do this.

But I am sure you will not understand this.

[struggle4progress]

108. .

:kick:

[Hekate]

110. Word.

[LostInAnomie]

112. That needed to be said and should be repeated often.

[readmoreoften]

113. I don't quite fathom how you can have a PFLAG icon and argue with critiques of Obama.

What kind of ally stands for this crap? Unreal.

[JTFrog]

121. I have a PFLAG icon because I fully support my two gay children and was a member

all during their school years.

Are you seriously saying that anyone who supports Obama is a homophobe? Sounds like something Palin or Beck would say... Palling around with _____________ (fill in the blank here).

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JTFrog]

120. Ewww.

No thanks.

[old mark]

117. Well, it took a lot of pissing, but I think we finally got his fucking attention.

Maybe he will become Democrat sometime soon...And maybe the Democrats will get some direction and fortitude...

So I suppose it worked out pretty well, but I'm ready to continue at any time.

mark

[Name removed]

119. Deleted message

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