Curious about your opinions: my county has made it mandatory to post calorie counts on menus

[Happyhippychick]

Is this something you would want?

I am thrilled. I have always been a health nut and I am very happy that I have a better idea of what I am putting into my body when I am out (which, admittedly, is not terribly often). Do you see this as a good thing or nannyism?

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. YEEEESSSS

My State now does that... and I am grateful. As a diabetic it makes so much easier to calculate carbs and all that.

[Dappleganger]

8. In agreement, this would be helpful.

But I can imagine it would be hard on small diners to keep up with it.

[dkf]

33. Why? You just add the calories of individual ingredients.

[nadinbrzezinski]

37. Not quite

you need to send your dish to the lab for testing in a calorimeter. It can be ahem, expensive.

[jberryhill]

65. No

"Cooking" whether by frying, baking, roasting, sauté etc involves complex chemical and physical processes.

The caloric content of a prepared meal is not the sum of the ingredients.

Not only does the prepared meal need to be tested, but it then needs to be made the exact same way every time with the exact same ingredients.

Real cooking doesn't work that way.

[nadinbrzezinski]

36. In this state it applies to chains of I think five or more

restaurants, and the usual suspects... read mickey ds, arbys et al, fought it with a passion.

One of the good things Arnie has done.

[D-Lee]

45. works fine in NYC nt

[DrDan]

2. of course . . . .we need all info possible on what we are putting in our bodies

[Oregone]

3. This creates an unfair playing field for mom & pop businesses that make innovative American dishes

I mean really, these are the companies that should succeed in capitalism....let the dollar be the measurement for who has created the "best" sand-which, rather than some archaic way to count energy. And...speaking of dollars, what would you pay for this bitch?

[Happyhippychick]

7. Is that the new Friendly's sandwich? Two grilled cheese sandwiches with a bacon cheeseburger in

between?

It would be tasty if it was spread out over 4 meals!

[leftofcool]

4. I think it is a great idea.

No one is being forced to eat or not eat anything. Full disclosure never hurts anyone.

[Ozymanithrax]

5. I see it a lot here in California...

Though often the chain restaurants do not put these things together, they are now available.

People should know when they consume 1500 calories of fat.

[gratuitous]

6. Nannyism?

No, it's information (that will soon pass into the category of "ignored", like tar and nicotine numbers on a cigarette pack) useful to the consumer. Now, if there was someone standing there to say "Not for you, you're too heavy as it is!" when Porky McSaddlebags ordered up the Triple Decker Bacon Delight with Extra Cheese, I might say it smacked of nannyism.

[sinkingfeeling]

9. I would like to see such a thing, but nobody's doing it.

[CBGLuthier]

10. If you can't tell by what it tastes like and looks like

Seems silly to me. People who obsess about this will care. But those people should have a clue what food is like. If someone claims to care what they are eating they should be able to tell what they are eating by experience and knowledge about food. Not some bullshit numbers.

[noamnety]

16. Sometimes you can't tell from the menu description.

Fresh Greens with dressing at Macaroni Grill - sounds like a healthy option. I might order that. It's got 26 grams of saturated fat.

Their parmesan crusted sole is another item that surprised me. I might expect it to be middle of the road - it's fish and not battered and deep fried, so my instincts tell me it's a healthier option than macaroni and cheese for instance. Maybe not a diet food, but not a diet breaker either.

Turns out it has 1710 calories, 105 fat grams.

People should have a right to know that.

[Happyhippychick]

26. Excellent point.

[femrap]

25. You either have

a high metabolism or a low IQ.:rofl:

Do you have any idea of the amount of chemicals put in processed food?? And no nutrition?

Are you from Ohio?

[Ignis]

29. You can tell by looking at a muffin whether or not it's non-fat?

I don't understand how accurate calorie counts on food is a bad thing. Could you spell it out a bit more? Thanks.

[wickerwoman]

82. It's a big help to some people

and no harm to you. So why do you care?

My parents are both diabetic and need to know how many calories and carbs they are eating so they can calculate how much insulin to take. They are rarely able to eat in restaurants because you can't actually look at a dish of fried rice or cashew chicken and know how many calories, how much fat and how many carbs are in it. This would allow them to manage their disease better and have a more normal quality of life (enjoying meals out now and again.) 24 million Americans are diabetic. And no, you can't just know the nutritional content of what you're eating by experience. That's ridiculous. The same exact muffin that tastes virtually identical will have a completely different nutritional profile if it is made with sugar, HFCS or stevia and whether it has butter or applesauce in it.

[noamnety]

11. Yes! A good thing.

Giving people the information so they can make informed decisions is NOT nannyism. It's the opposite.

There are a few good websites that let you look up nutritional content at restaurant chains online. I've gotten into the habit of looking online and making my menu choice based on ALL the information before we go out to eat.

http://caloriecount.about.com/restaurants-mc1
http://www.dietfacts.com/fastfood.asp

For people who need to watch fat or calories for medical reasons, it's no different than letting people know what's in medication so they can avoid adverse affects.

[damntexdem]

12. Yes, we should have fully-informed consent to what we eat when we eat out.

If you don't want to know, don't look.

[flvegan]

13. Only if it's accurate. KFC's Double Down, for example

Cityrag did some analysis on it finding that KFC's reported 540 calories and 32 grams of fat was more like 1190 calories and 86 grams of fat.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

14. No.

[Obamanaut]

15. If I have a slice of cheesecake or chocolate silk pie at a restaurant,

do I *really* need a calorie chart to tell me it's loaded with them?

Nannyism can be overdone.

[Paladin]

40. It's Information That Quite A Few People Find Useful.

If you don't find it useful, simply ignore it. And kindly spare us all the Nanny State hysteria......

[Obamanaut]

46. Calorie/carb content for potatoes will be fairly constant whether eaten

at home or restaurant. If one is concerned about these things, one has a fairly good idea of the content of various items, and orders accordingly. If one is not concerned, it doesn't matter.

Why have more rules for restaurants to comply with, especially considering that people with diet concerns (diet meaning everything/anything one consumes, not specifically weight loss) already know what is in most things.?

When I start to shake, I know my blood sugar is down, and I eat/drink something to stop it. I do not need to consult a chart to discover what that something is, I know.

[Paladin]

62. Not Everybody Has Blood Sugar Issues, Like You And I Do.

Knowledge about calories is a natural off-shoot of such afflictions, no doubt. But I repeat what I said: Caloric information is something a lot of people find useful---Don't believe me? Try living in Colorado, the physical fitness obsession center of the known universe. If you don't find such information useful, please feel free to just ignore it. But don't go all Ayn Rand on us and try to add this to your Libertarian Nightmare Nanny State check-off list, OK?

[Gormy Cuss]

50. Where's the "nannyism?"

Information is nannyism now?

[Obamanaut]

53. Assuming the citizenry is stupid and mandating a label for everything is

nannyism.

Banning dodgeball from school playgrounds because someone 'might' get hurt is nannyism.

Banning red pencil/pen grades on school homework assignments because red marks are harsh and 'might' lower little Jimmy's self esteem is nannyism.

Confiscating 'all' supplies from the kids on the first day of school and putting them into a common basket for everyone to use is not only nannyism, but it's teaching the kids that government agents (in this case, teachers) have the power to seize whatever they want from whoever has it so it can be given to someone who doesn't. Some kids have parents who get them the supplies, some have parents who would if they could, and some have parents who could not care less and just didn't get stuff - doesn't matter, it all goes into the common basket.

[Gormy Cuss]

74. You can't look at a restaurant dish and guess the caloric information

It has nothing to do with stupidity. You can't tell by looking if it's loaded with full fat dairy or made with lower fat and calorie substitutes for example.

Notice that all of your examples of nannyism involve preventing people from doing or using something. Adding a nutrition profile isn't similar - nothing about it demands that people order something else.

[Obamanaut]

76. "Adding a nutrition profile" is information by the maker for consumer,

while requiring it, mandating by the government, is nannyism.

[Gormy Cuss]

81. That's ridiculous

unless you also think mandatory vaccines, seat belt laws, etc. are nanny state too rather than public health measures, in which case there's no pointing in trying to discuss this issue with you.

[spanone]

17. we should know everything we can about what we put in our mouths

[bpositive]

18. Great idea

I lost 40 lbs counting calories

[Uzybone]

19. more information to help make choice is always good

[kestrel91316]

20. I support it, with exemptions for mom and pop operations. It's the CHAINS

that need to be doing this.

[nadinbrzezinski]

38. You mean like oh California?

One of the few bills that arnie signed that I applauded, and Mickey D's fought.

[jberryhill]

21. Do you know the calorie content of the meals you cook?

Because Jim Bob over at Jim Bob's Diner probably doesn't know either.

[dkf]

32. Yes I do

I'm logging every thing I eat on my phone and it is hard to find some items especially ethnic foods. Stuff you cook is easy because you know what you added.

[jberryhill]

58. Real chefs don't work with measured quantities /nt

[WillowTree]

61. Actually, I do. And it's not that difficult, either.

[noamnety]

63. If I only made a set amount of items

over and over again, and it was my job responsibility to know the calorie count of those items, I would know it.

Similarly, when I cook for others I wear a head covering, use gloves, don't double dip spoons to taste, etc.

I'm not seeing your point unless you're afraid they are going to make individual homes also get health inspections, liquor licenses, etc.

Two different beasts. Commercial kitchens have always had different requirements for public health reasons.

[LWolf]

22. Yes. Not only calorie counts,

but grams of protein, carbs, fiber, fat, and sugar.

[Happyhippychick]

23. And caffeine content would be helpful for the preggos!

[femrap]

27. Don't forget salt!!! nt

[Obamanaut]

54. Don't forget a warning that food sometimes presents a choking hazard. nt

[LWolf]

64. Only when simultaneously chewing

and reading comments by neoliberal enablers on the internet. :shrug:

[femrap]

24. I like it.....

and I want to know how much sodium is in it as well.

I rarely eat out because the food is so over-processed unless you got the bucks to go to a really nice place which isn't a chain.

[tuvor]

28. They must have some wiggle room.

It's not like every serving of every dish is going to be the same, unless you're talking about fast food.

[Riftaxe]

30. Posted on the menu, umm no thanks

silly and expensive regulation, now an ordinance making it mandatory to provide the information upon request i could support.

[ThomThom]

31. I personally would like a complete list of ingredients

since I am allergic to dairy
and please no cross-contamination
I don't eat out for fear of butter or cheese.
Back to cooking......

[WinkyDink]

34. I find this stupid. Now chefs must count calories per serving? Ridiculous.

[Imajika]

35. I think it is quite useful...

It can serve as at least a sort of general guide of what items are high in calories and which are maybe a bit more healthy. Also it may help people that go to restaurants and almost don't want to know. This will remind them that their cheesecake is some astronomical number of calories per serving - causing them to maybe re-evaluate that food choice.

I agree with you, I'd be thrilled if my county did the same thing.

[NoPasaran]

39. This is the worst thing since the Spanish Inquisition

[jberryhill]

42. I'll bet nobody expected the Spanish Inquisition in this thread /nt

[NoPasaran]

43. NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquistion!

Now, Cardinal, fetch the... cheesecake!

[barb162]

41. I think it's a very good idea. n/t

[WinkyDink]

44. Well, were I a chef, zero substitutions then. Nothing "on the side."

Can you not see the lawsuits from "You had the calorie-count WRONG!"

[jberryhill]

56. I don't think many of the folks in this thread eat in REAL restaurants

...with a real chef.

Cooking is an art, and changes are made in real time.

These people think that real chefs work from recipes with measured quantities of labeled ingredients.

They think "Olive Garden" is an Italian restaurant. A rule like this would make sure that Olive Garden was the only one left.

I like the suggestion for an ingredient list. Yeah... You go ask a real chef for "the recipe" some time and see how that works out for you.

Real chefs... and real restaurants.. make their reputations on distinctive dishes and are not handing out recipes.

[fishbulb703]

59. +1, used to work the line at a corporate chain restaurant

even there the dishes are modified to order and on the basis of what ingredients are available. plus those menus are designed to make easy substitutions

if you cant look at a plate of food and get a rough estimate of the calories on that plate, then you need to take a nutrition class

plus, counting calories isn't even effective/healthy

[KittyWampus]

67. The arrogance. Not only do I eat at "real" restaurants, my family owned one for many years.

And contrary to your assertion that "real" chefs don't measure food. They most certainly do.

They do it by eye and feel and taste.

And they do it well enough for their food to be CONSISTENT.

Cooking is a science as well as an art. Food wouldn't turn out properly without measuring somehow. And it definitely wouldn't be consistent, which is essential for a "real" restaurant.

[mercuryblues]

47. I like it.

I look at it as leveling the playing field. Restaurants prepare foods in a way that it increases the calorie, fat and sodium content.

A lot of restaurants get their fried food already partially deep fried, then frozen. When you order it, they drop it in oil again to finish cooking. If I remember correctly, this process increases the fat content by about 20% over similar fried food only dipped once in the fryer.

People know eating french fries out is not a healthy choice, but they have no idea just how bad of a choice it is.

2 oz. of Chili's Citrus Balsamic Vinaigrette Dressing 340calories, 33 grams of fat.

Mesquite Chicken Salad without Dressing 810 calories, 44 grams of fat.

A total of 1,150 calories and 77 grams of fat for a salad.

or you could eat a Big Mac: Calories 540, Fat Grams (Total) 29

http://www.dietbites.com/Foods-Nutrition-Index/fast-food-nutrition-facts-mcdonalds-6.html

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

48. "Nannyism" would be telling me that a certain harmless food is illegal 'for my own good"

Calorie counts, not so much.

[Indy Lurker]

49. any meal over 1200 calories needs a logo

Such as:

Tour Of Italy (Olive Garden)
Serving Size: 1; Calories: 1450, Total Fat: 74, Carbs: 97, Protein: 00

[Sugarcoated]

51. I think it's great

but only if the information is accurate.

[jberryhill]

57. So if the chef thinks a sauce needs a bit more of this or a bit less of that

He or she opens up a lawsuit?

Because every dish is made the exact same way every time.

Where do you eat?

[KittyWampus]

68. The chef does that before it goes on the menu. And once a chef gets a dish down-

they must be consistent in creating that dish.

[jberryhill]

72. You have never worked with a chef

Ingredients change with the seasons and market conditions.

Cooking is an art. It is not the mechanical reproduction of steps, like mixing paint. That's what chain restaurants do.

You really think being a chef is about learning a bunch of steps and then performing them the same way, over and over, for the rest of a career?

You think when Maria is making the quesadllias that she grabs the same amount of cheese every time?

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jberryhill]

55. Clearly you are not eating in the right places. /nt

[KittyWampus]

69. Reading your replies throughout this thread, clearly you know less about chefs, cooking

and restaurants in the real world than you think.

[jberryhill]

73. You might be right

I eat in a lot of places.

The best thing I had recently was from a Salvadoran pupusa stand. If you asked them about calories, you'd get some funny looks more likely than a number.

How much do you want them to pay to ge their stuff analyzed and make sure it is thenceforth prepared from exact proportions?

[AngryOldDem]

60. Yes. I find that very helpful.

It's not nannyism, because it leaves the choice of whether or not to have that 10,000-calorie fettucine alfredo entirely up to me. That's how it should be.

[KittyWampus]

66. Yes. I would appreciate knowing. And there are free software programs for figuring nutritional info

So it wouldn't be an undue financial burden on smaller restaurants.

Edit- I would not support forcing smaller, family owned businesses to have to send their dishes to a lab for testing.

[Warren Stupidity]

70. Consumer awareness seems a good idea. nt.

[Fleshdancer]

71. yes. Knowledge is always a good thing.

Not only do I care about what I'm putting into my body, but I care about what I feed my kid. Any bit of information that makes this easier for me is great.

[amborin]

75. posting salt content is a good idea, too

[WinkyDink]

77. Chefs add salt by hand, not quarter-teaspoons.

[amborin]

78. sure seems that way

[slampoet]

79. Your county has just outlawed Scratch cooking and improvisational cooking.

As far as I'm concerned, damned yourselves to being a culinary backwater.

Enjoy your Applebees.

[Naturyl]

80. Yeah, it's a good policy.

It hurts no one and might help many.

[Mz Pip]

83. It's a good thing

Haven't seen it here, but when I visited Seattle last month it was the first time I'd even been presented with a supplement to the menu that had the calorie, fat and sodium content of the menu items. I have to admit I was really surprised at how much sodium was in the healthy salad offerings.

Quite and eye opener. I with we had it here.