Cofferdam fails, BP looking for solutions

[merh]

Cofferdam fails, BP looking for solutions
By DONNA MELTON - [email protected]

The cofferdam BP had hoped would cap the leaking well in the Gulf now sits beside the flow of oil as experts scramble to find a way to stop ice crystals from forming inside the 125-ton box.

BP Chief Operating Officer Doug Suttles said today the cofferdam was removed from the leak and placed 600 feet away from the leak source “in a safe location while we evaluate options,” Suttles said.

The hydrates, which make the cofferdam buoyant, resemble slush and in large quantities also prevents oil from being funneled through the dome to the surface, Suttles said.
The containment vessel is lowered into the Gulf of Mexico at the site of the Deepwater Horizon rig collapse, Thursday, May 6, 2010. (AP Photo/Gerald Herbert)

http://www.sunherald.com/2010/05/07/2165420/cofferdam-fails-bp-looking-for.html

:(

[gateley]

1. ...“in a safe location while we evaluate options,” Suttles said.

We're supposed to believe a word they say? They assured everyone the drilling was safe! And, they don't know what the fuck they're doing, so how can they even attempt to reassure us?

This is a nightmare.

[janx]

3. That one jumped out at me, too.

Criminy!

[dixiegrrrrl]

4. Apparently they have failed to tell us that the oil site

contains millions of barrels of oil.


As reported in 2009 by USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/energy/2009-09-02-bp-giant-oil-discovery-in-gulf-of-mexico_N.htm




"The well, 250 miles southeast of Houston, was discovered after BP drilled one of the world's deepest exploration wells. It went down 35,000 feet, a distance on par with the cruising altitude of many domestic flights.

BP hasn't released specifics on the size of the field. But if it turns out to be truly "giant," it'll contain more than 500 million barrels of recoverable oil, according to definitions by the U.S. Energy Information Administration. The last giant discovered in the deepwater Gulf of Mexico was Thunder Horse in 1999. It's also operated by BP"

[gateley]

8. An honest oversight, I'm sure. nt

[jberryhill]

26. I wish I hadn't read that

That really sucks

[dixiegrrrrl]

29. Yeah, I know what you mean.

Sorry.
I am just a few miles from the beaches down here, and have years of marvelous memories
of the coast.
Knowing how much BS is going on about this eco-cide is keeping my blood pressure up.

[jberryhill]

31. I wish I hadn't read that either

I'm sorry to hear that. I live near the Chesapeake Bay, and at least that's been a slow death.

[malaise]

9. A nightmare is an understatement

This is lunacy.

[gateley]

15. Perfect. nt

[HughMoran]

45. What is the significance of the location of the cofferdam?

...or is calling them liars once again significant? What am I missing?

[janx]

2. This is driving me crazy.

I can only imagine how it must make you feel.

[snagglepuss]

7. +10000

[flyarm]

5. well many of us were trying to warn people here and elsewhere..this had never been done that deep..

but we were shouted down and insulted for giving that warning..

I am getting pretty damn tired of the blind obedience I am seeing here..and those willing to swallow Placebo pills...while our Gulf is dying...or better words would be..while our Gulf is being murdered!

[BeFree]

52. Abortion, is more like it.

The pregnancy of a large portion of life in the Gulf is being aborted.

[ensho]

61. it is not like an abortion! please get a grip

nt

[BeFree]

65. They are, in fact aborting life before it is even conceived.

This is not by choice and it has nothing to do with an individual woman deciding what to do with her body. But it is an abortion.

[NotThisTime]

6. Making this as simple as possible, the dome is in water that is too cold and is forming ice crystals

rendering it useless? Am I reading that correctly? This is a horrid nightmare... no option is a good option, they are all shades of truly horrible.

[Speck Tater]

10. That's essentially correct. The "ice" include frozen methane hydrates

making the whole thing buoyant enough that the additional buoyancy of the oil they need to capture (oil being lighter than water) would lift the whole structure up off the ocean floor and possibly tip it over making it useless. Plus the ice crystals are clogging the vent hole at the top of the funnel that they need to use to pump the captured oil to the waiting tanker.

(ed:sp)

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[merh]

12. I'm not giddy, I'm sick - I so wanted the dome pyramid

thingie to work.

Something has to work, something has to stop the oil.

:(

[SidDithers]

14. I really don't think they've given up yet...

they've placed it to the side while they try to figure out a way to reseat it without the formation of hydrates.

There are teams of very smart people working on the problem as we type these posts. I know it's not in their nature to give up easily.

Sid

[merh]

19. I have no doubts that they are not giving up

BP does not want to lose this reserve of oil, they want to save the oil for their production and profits.

If they cared about the wildlife and the environment, they would have cared before they began drilling and immediately after the explosion.

[jberryhill]

32. Well they can't give up

it's pretty much the only game in town for anyone with the relevant expertise.

But, at what point does somebody say "let's nuke it". What are, if any, the explosive options here?

[ensho]

63. on that other oil disaster over by Asia that discharged oil for wks. and

wks. didn't they finally get it stopped by putting tons and tons of cement on it? or is it still spewing oil?

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheWatcher]

23. Sid, honestly, please stop.

You and many other DU'ers seem to have this standard line of attack toward anyone who doesn't follow your doctrine of thinking.

"You WANT The Worst To Happen."

"You WANT The Gulf To be Destroyed."

"You WANT The Economy To Fail."

"You WANT Obama To Fail."

"You're HAPPY The Worst Happening, and that People Are Suffering."

Just STOP IT.

The Hard Truth is, there HAS been a lot of cover-up, mis and disinformation, misrepresentation, and outright lying in regard to this situation, and it is well documented for the past couple of weeks.

We have NO IDEA how bad things really are because of this.

Just because you refuse to believe any of it, does not make it Tinfoil, does not make it a desire for the worst to happen, and does not mean that people are hopeful for armageddon or taking pleasure in suffering.

Perhaps, just perhaps, some people choose to live in reality, and not follow the false paradigm of lies, deception, and Propaganda that are fed to us on a daily basis.

Maybe some people just want to live in actual reality, instead of the cocoon of a false one that is carefully managed through Propaganda and Perception Management.

Maybe they want the actual truth instead of a manufactured one.

If living in a false paradigm where you only believe anything that makes you feel good and hopeful, where the only truth is what you want to hear, as opposed to how things ACTUALLY ARE, then that is your personal choice.

But PLEASE, just lay off of the rest of humanity that doesn't want to do the same.

This is a disaster of unknown and frightening proportions, the key word right now being UNKNOWN.

The potential consequences to our lives and our future is staggering, and there is so much humanity, wildlife, and ecology that could be in dire peril because of this event. A lot of people are scared, and they are tired of being lied to and treated like children and cattle.

They just want THE TRUTH.

That's all.

To say that there are people who are happy, giddy, or taking pleasure in what is happening is disgusting and sad.

I have not seen any evidence of that.

NO ONE WANTS THE WORST TO HAPPEN IN ANY SITUATION.

What people want is The Truth.

I'm sorry if that's so offensive and fearful to you.

I know I am probably wasting my time here. This is just going to provoke an insult or attack.

But we are ALL in the same boat in regards to this.

We NEED to know what is REALLY going on, and what we are ACTUALLY facing.

[chill_wind]

46. The policing and patrolling commentary

laced into so many of these threads for what the "right" and "correct" responses should be does get distracting and disturbing.

In the example of the controversial and questioned use of the dispersants that came to light a few days ago, for instance, some of us were chastised for trying to push the information out for question and discussion as no-nothing internet message board backseat drivers that should have been ignored. We were assured right here on DU that the experts knew what they were doing and that it wasn't even topic-worthy. Turns out that within 48 hours of wider scientific and public scrutiny, they halted the activity (until they get some safety studies, after the fact). Eh?

Similar derisive and dismissive patterns in the discussions of the new MMS exploration waivers just recently disclosed and the concerns/questions to be had about those, as another example.

Many, many others have aggressively researched and pointed to the abysmal overall patterns of corrupt and negligent regulatory patterns of the vested parties and the ongoing ass-saving agendas among all of them (Big Oil, MMS, lobby and massive PR flacking $$ etc). You are so right to point out that above all we need and have a right to know, question, discuss and try to find out what we are actually facing-- and there is almost zero reason to fully trust or wholesale accept a whole lot of what's being sold to us at face-value right now.

[Richard Steele]

48. Very well said. nm

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[flyarm]

35. that is pathetic..to even say what you did is very immature and ridiculous!

Thousands of people from my state of Fla and all up and down the Gulf coast.. have been taking classes to learn how to save the wildlife that is now threatened ..and have been hindered in many ways by BP..and even our local news has reported that BP was holding up their rescue efforts..

It was also reported that many of the top enviorn people were meeting with Janet Napilatano and they were going to tell her that they would no longer listen to BP.. the criminals... who caused this disaster..they would do what had to be done to save as much of the wildlife as humanly possible...That BP WAS THE PROBLEM with the salvage of these animals. And they would no longer take orders from them or anyone.


No matter how many times what is going on and the lies that are being told..by national media.. is explained to you..you keep up with a fantasy and playing like ..you don't GET IT !!

Enough!

My back yard is the Gulf..I lay in bed and look at the Gulf..I brush my teeth looking at the Gulf..I shower and look at the gulf.. I cook and do dishes looking at the Gulf!


I would do anything to save this remarkable water..and our pristine beaches..and I have, by joining many Environ groups and conservation groups..I just spent all last week daily walking 2 miles on the beach morning and evening..charting dead birds and fish for our aquarium to come get them and test them for oil..and charting the Black smoke over the Gulf that came and went with different winds.

You have a lot of nerve accusing anyone of wanting anything to fail, that is killing our Gulf....but this try did fail to this point..it breaks my heart and the heart of millions of Americans that live on this Gulf and make a living from and with this Gulf..but as ypu chose to keep ignoring is what many of us have posted to you and replied to you .. most environ scientists at our Fla universities said it would fail, as well as many other scientists..and they said it nightly on our local news.

For 25 years I have worked closely with our conservation and environmental groups to save our beaches and the Gulf..as have many many Dem's in my area of the state of Florida....and so many wonderful Americans all up ad down the gulf coasts....and Atlantic Ocean..see I am one of the lucky ones to have two beach properties..and I give a damn about my neighbors..the marine life and Birds..and mammals .. that put up with us using their home for our greed..and our needs..and our pleasure.

The destruction of this body of water will hurt all of us! For decades if not longer..

And it makes most of us up and down the Gulf and Atlantic Ocean..damn angry!

I cry with each dead bird I find on the beach..my heart is broken..and to know that our manatee's will be hurt by this when they have rebounded from almost extinction..words can not convey my heartbreak.

But all i want is the truth..the plain and simple truth and all we have gotten is lies and cover ups.

That is inexcusable. And I will never accept that..from anyone!

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

66. The only way to properly reply to this monstrosity of a post...

...is in a non-moderated message board.

But then, you'd run into the natural limitations of language, which is insufficient to correctly describe the dickishness.

[riskpeace]

16. WTF BP?!

Man oh man, The Northern Gulf Coast, including Northwest Florida, where I live, is in for some sad times. Many people, like myself, will likely have to move. Then where the oil goes after that, who knows? BP has no idea what their dealing with. And the Coast Guard? They didn't.

BP's going to have go to bankrupt. Then, who pays? The St. Joe Company alone must have claims in the billions of dollars. St. Joe owns about a million acres in the FL Panhandle, and mostly pristine waterfront locations in Walton, Bay and Gulf counties. Google West Bay Sector Plan. They've got documentation. They've also just subsidized Southwest to begin flights into our publicly funded brand-new $350 million airport in Panama City Beach. The airport opens and Southwest flights start May 23. Cluster-Fugoily!

[JVS]

17. Oh wow. The gulf is fucked!

[BarbaRosa]

18. sigh...

:-(

[Gin]

21. was BP shutting this well down? I thought I read haliburton was

filling in the well with some sort of cement to seal it...

[merh]

24. I believe Haliburton was the one doing the "cementing" at the rig,

as it was operating and in place. "Cementing" the drilling hole means they pour cement and the gaps between the hole and pipe. Apparently this process is very unreliable at great depths (sort of like the problem with the dome, the presence of the gases and the formations that the gases cause).

[ljm2002]

42. I was puzzled about that too...

...but somewhere I read (sorry don't have a link) that well the Deepwater Horizon was drilling was exploratory, i.e. it was never meant to be an operating well.

Now that's confusing also since I would have thought that once you go to the trouble to drill a well 35,000 feet down, and then you strike oil, you would not want to have to do it twice?

[BeFree]

60. To be clear

There is a hole in the face of the earth shaped like a "V".
Height = maybe 12 feet. Width = maybe 20 feet.

Down through the middle of that "V" is a @8 inch steel pipe.
That pipe was part of the drilling rig.

Below that "V" the pipe was shoved down the hole in the earth thousands of feet as it cut into the earth.

The pipe wobbled as the rock was drilled and the pipe created a gap between the 8 inch pipe and the rock, maybe 2 inches wider. Maybe more, maybe less. It is hard to see underground you know?

The drillers then have to fill in as much of that gap as they possibly can with a special cement.

Once drilling is completed the drill rig leaves the pipe capped off, with something like the Blow Out Prevent valve, or BOP. BTW: they drilled the hole right through the middle of that BOP valve.

Later, a new pipe is attached to that valve and pumping ensues.

[dtotire]

20. I Wanted It To Work

extremely unfortunate.

[Dr Morbius]

22. Note to BP executives:

Look faster.

[jberryhill]

25. Wow

It is really something that anyone would approve doing something on this scale of potential risk, and without really having a clue what to do if something goes wrong.

That's the jaw dropper for me. They have tremendous engineering expertise and just went ahead without a god damned clue of a contingency plan. The mere fact that they have to now scramble the absolute top skill in the industry, and they STILL don't really have much in the way of alternative plans is a sure sign they never should have been working this damned rig in the first place.

Dammit. I was really hoping this would work.

They'll come up with some mod of the cofferdam, either chemically or electromechanically, because it is on site and they've put so much time into what they have. But... damn this well was a stupid project in the first place.

[merh]

27. check out this powerpoint from a Nov '09 presentation

Deepwater Cementing Considerations to Prevent Hydrates Destability

[jberryhill]

30. You have got to be f'n kidding me

So are those guys on the emergency team now, or are they off getting drunk someplace nice?

God damn it I want to know WHO SIGNED OFF ON THIS? What god damned idiot put his name on these plans and said "let's do it".

[northzax]

36. Hey, in the face of a decided lack of other options

It was worth a try. When your house is on fire, you throw everything you have at it. The cofferdam didn't make the situation worse, it just didn't fix it. Remember, no one has ever done this before, under these conditions, (mainly because everyone else requires auto-kill switches)

Anyone know who BP's insurance company is? Cause they're fucked.

[jberryhill]

37. No I get that

I understand they have to work through options... I'm talking about the decision to drill this well without having a full deck of options in the first place.

I don't expect management to give a shit, but an engineer somewhere should have said, "Um... Guys?" at some place along the line here.

[northzax]

43. Yes, piss-poor risk assessment

Seems to be the order of the day. For lack of a $500k kill switch, BP and it's contractors (Deepwater, Halliburton, etc) are going to be on the hook for I figure $10-15+ billion at the end of the day. Oops.

[Odin2005]

28. Fuck!

:cry:

[WillyT]

33. Fuckin Great...

:wtf:

:mad:

:shrug:

[Rex]

38. They've had billions of dollars to R&D these kind of things. Did they?

Hell no and now they are hauling ass trying to plug the hole in the ever cracking dam.

[flyarm]

39. hell they had plenty of money to buy Politicians!! But but but...safety ?? Not so much! eom

[kentuck]

40. Have they called Tiger Woods yet ?

I hear he's pretty good at plugging holes?

[EFerrari]

41. .

:(

[ssolid71]

44. I have lost faith...

I don't understand why you people are so surprised. They knew the containment box wasn't going to work from the get go. It had the least risk, so they went why not try it anyway? But in the meanwhile tons of oil is spilling into the ocean...There really isn't time for this shit. BP is doing damage control and worrying about their own asses instead of getting that nine inch hole closed.

They should have had a second team working on an immediate plan B if plain A failed which it did as most expected. Instead they are sitting around for two days with their thumbs up their asses trying to decide what to do next. You know... lets not do anything drastic and stay calm...

my opinion.... people stay calm too long, if panic would set in earlier it might save them.

They will go the least risky route to mitigate damage to their company and in turn damage the environment. They will try the box thing again and that wont work. They will then try it a third time and then begin to install a mile of piping to try to cement the hole shut, this will take weeks.... IF they can clear the rubble from the bottom of the ocean floor. At some point they might be able to say oh look we slowed the leak down a little.... for PR.

The real fix will not happen until the relief well is drilled which will take three months. Either way, the damage is done.. Trust me, that guy was behind that drill as soon as the shit hit the fan... and that guy, whoever he or she is, knows hes the one thats going to be the one closing the leak... the rest is bs.

The real solution, drop a small nuclear bomb down the well where it will seal off the rock,. Melt the rock and seal it off. Another possibility might be thermite, but I know the nuclear option has been used by the russians. Everyone will go oooh radiation... but trust me the amount of radiation is most likely nothing compared to blackened ocean... the russians have done this....

"oh but its too drastic..."

I say it'll solve the fucking problem, skip all the fuck up ideas that you know aren't going to work and just get it done.

[WeDidIt]

47. Even if they can stop the icing in the dome it still won't work

As soon as the crude starts flowing through the pipe, the asphaltenes and parafins will clog that up with no hope of stopping it.

This whole dome boondoggle is nothing more than a blatant attempt to buy time while they try to figure out a real solution which will most likely end up being drilling a new hold close by to relieve the pressure.

Which means the gusher will gush for three months.

Goodbye all aquatic life in the Gulf of Mexico and along the Eastern Seaboard.

[SidDithers]

49. They're already drilling a relief well...

the cofferdam was (is) not a effort to buy time, but an effort to contain the gusher at the source, rather than at the surface.

Drilling on the relief well began on May 2. Last report I'd seen had them at 9,000 feet, but still 2-3 months away from finishing.

Sid

[WeDidIt]

50. The Cofferedam is just to make it look like they are progressing

It's to keep everybody's mind off the fact that we are three months away from the gusher stopping the gushing.

[SidDithers]

53. It's been pretty clear from the beginning that a relief well was going to take 3 months...

that's been published over and over and over and over.

The relief well at Ixtoc 1 took 9 months.

The containment was an attempt to control where the oil goes. Nothing more.

Sid

[WeDidIt]

54. but it cannot work

They *might* be able to stop the icing by pumping water from the surface to the dome.

They'll never stop the asphaltenes and parafins from clogging the pipe they will attach to the dome and attempt to pump crude through.

It would work like a charm at 1000 feet but they will never be able to stop the asphaltenes and parafins from precipitating at those low temperatures. That requires a proper well head.

[SidDithers]

55. The pipe that they're proposing to use...

is actually a double pipe, with heated water circulating in the outer pipe, and the oil/water mix from the container being pumped in the inner pipe. Will the ashpaltenes and parafins clog if they're heated?

Sid

[WeDidIt]

56. That's the pipe they use at 1000 feet

The heated water comes from the surface.

By the time it gets to 5000 feet, it will have cooled too much to be effective.

[SidDithers]

58. OK, understood...

I'll be watching with interest to see if they can find a workaround to that problem too.

Sid

[WeDidIt]

59. If, instead of using surface heated water

they instead heated the water nearly to boiling before they pump it, it MIGHT be warm enough to allow the asphaltenes and parafins to remain suspended by the time it gets to 5000 feet.

But that would be incredibly expensive.

[BeFree]

64. You send down hot water, and guess what?

The hydrates turn to gas. The gas expands. Great pressure is made.

Then it blows up through the pipe again.

Who and what is at the end of that new pipe? A boatload of people.

[BeFree]

51. I am reminded of a favorite saying, Sid.....

You may have read it before? From another DUer:

"Keep digging, you're almost there."

Thanks for the memories, dude.

[lonestarnot]

57. Whatever they do will not fucking work as they are fuckups. Isn't there anyone in the world who is

smarter than them?

[ThomWV]

62. If I'm not mistaken, that oil is very hot. Insulate the box.