Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Shit, shit, shit: Army: Suspect said `Allahu Akbar!' before shooting

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:22 AM
Original message
Shit, shit, shit: Army: Suspect said `Allahu Akbar!' before shooting

FORT HOOD, Texas The base commander at Fort Hood says soldiers who witnessed a shooting rampage that left 13 people dead reported that the gunman shouted "Allahu Akbar!" before opening fire at the Texas post.

Lt. Gen. Robert Cone told NBC's "Today" show on Friday that suspected shooter, Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, made the comment, which is Arabic for "God is great!" before the rampage Thursday that also left 30 people wounded.

Military officials say they are still piecing together what may have pushed Hasan, an Army psychiatrist trained to help soldiers in distress, to turn on his comrades.

Cone says Hasan was not known to be a threat or risk.

<snip>

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091106/ap_on_re_us/us_fort...

I'm concerned about attacks on U.S. Muslims, particularly those serving in the military.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
geckosfeet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
1. Of course. He probably screamed 'jihadi jihadi - die american pigs'
the whole time as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #1
38. do you know, it might just be what it is. there is nothing to defend. no need
to dismiss, ignore or pretend, with the truth

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #38
41. lol. you're funny. yes, we know both the government & the military are
steadfast purveyors of "truth".

Minitru, in fact.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #41
58. like that is what i said. hey hannah... do you ever discuss the post or change it up to
your false argument every single friggin time.

what a waste of time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #58
74. That poster gets his news from Trotskyite websites. No use arguing with him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #74
84. i never argue with this poster. learned long ago, waste of time. unfortunately
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 10:04 AM by seabeyond
not so unusual to receive a reply from this poster, lol.

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #84
115. "never"? lol.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #115
125. did it with you once.... wink. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #125
134. "once"? lol.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #41
69. when you operate from the frame that everything you hear 100% of the time is a lie, you're paranoid.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
geckosfeet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #69
127. Thanks for the free analysis.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #41
120. Thank God George H W Bush told us all about the terrifying baby incubator murders,
which helped rally "us" to back his attack on Iraq, and thank God for all the crappola George W. Bush and everyone in his administration said, and got Tony Blair, etc. to say, to lie us into HIS attack on Iraq. Way, what about those WMD's? I nearly laughed my head off when the pResident pretended to be looking under tables, and in closets for the missing WMD's. What a fabulous wit.

I can't wait until the next time they tell us some more stuff they want us to think, also. I live for it. I can tell you do, as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #120
126.  I live for it. mmmm. not really. what i do though, is set back and listen
and then listen some more.

today, on bbc i heard two contradictory reports. he was a bad doctor. he was a good doctor. pretty big difference there

since i dont have a story already created, i dont have to fit anything in
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
60. And yet if a Christian snapped and screamed "God help me!"?
Which is essentially what Allahu Akbar (God is great) means.

The ignorance in this country of Islamic cultures is pathetic. Do we not remember praising Iranian youth for shouting this very same phrase from their rooftops just a few months ago?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #1
61. Probably did a shout out to his "brother" Hussein Obama, too - I HEARD it!!!
Yeah, I TILLMAN trust TILLMAN what TILLMAN the TILLMAN government TILLMAN says TILLMAN...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
2. Why is that different than saying
"May God have mercy on my soul" or something similar? It's not. It's something someone that's religious would say before doing something they know will probably result in their own demise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Perhaps, but that's not my point.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:28 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Different because it accentuates the hate & fear of Muslims!
I'm reall sorry that he said that IF HE DID. I've worked with Indians, Pakistani's, Iranians, etc, and they were all great friends. All this does is make people afraid of them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:28 AM
Response to Reply #2
7. It's different because "Allahu Akbar" will generate a certain reaction here
That "May God have mercy on my soul" would not.

Your point is rationally correct but people don't react rationally. This case is bad because it amplifies the divisiveness of the event. The guy went nuts and killed a lot of people - no different than many other cases of people going nuts and killing other people - but being a Muslim it will be seen differently.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. That's it in a nutshell.
And it's what I believe happened.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #7
29. "the guy went nuts"
Are you a psychologist? According to the reports from the base, Nader Hasan was. I don't think he "went nuts." Military personnel who witnessed the carnage and the aftermath, have stated that Hasan was very deliberate and calculating as he killed. In fact, he managed to reload at least two times during murder spree and the shots he fired were very well placed - according to one military official, this indicates that he (Hasan) maintained a high level of focus as he committed these murders.

According to at least one fellow soldier, Hasan said that "Muslims had a right to rise up attack the U.S." Given all of these things and his apparent battle cry of "Allah Akbar," my thoughts are that, this guy didn't "go nuts," but instead came to a place in his thinking that, the best way to "exercise" his views was to murder those who didn't share his.

Just my 2-cents.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #29
31. But there are also reports that he was a "highly dedicated soldier"
"A soldiers soldier" as one of his PTSD patients put it.

What happened to this guy to put him out there like this? Sure, a wild shift to fundamentalist Islam could possibly do it. But it just doesn't fit the initial profile of this guy. Perhaps his own exposure to the atrocities of this war by proxy through his patients pushed him too far and broke him. Or perhaps even that pushed him further into the extreme tenants of his religion. I just think its too early to dismiss any of the possibilities.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #31
40. I agree. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #31
55. I just saw a video on CNN
showing Hasan in a convenience store hours before the shooting spree. CNN reporter says that the store owner said Hasan "seemed normal" and was even "smiling" at times during his brief discussion with him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #29
47. There's a lot of evidence that he "went nuts"
he was someone with poor social skills and a troubled work history at WRMC. He was deeply perturbed about being sent into a war zone. He had been picked on ostensibly because he was a Muslim. None of that excuses him. Neither does "going nuts". He's a mass murderer, but there's more evidence that he was mentally unstable than there is that he was political. That he was organized and deliberate does NOT mean that he was not deranged.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #47
62. "poor social skills"
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 09:32 AM by BennyD
Not according to the sales clerk at the store where he often stopped before heading to the base. The clerk says that he and Hasan often talked and that he sometimes called Nasan by his first name - indicating they had developed a friendship. In addition, someone who is in the field of psychology has to have social skills galore. When your job is not just to talk with people, but talk with them about deep emotional stuff - you have to be a social creature!!!

spelling edit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #62
66. bzzzt. sorry, that's just erroneous. one does not have to have
"social skills galore" to be a psychiatrist. He was reprimanded at WRMC because of having trouble with patients.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoSheep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #66
76. I had heard he was NOT an MD but had a degree from VaTech in
some sort of bio- something or other. Did you hear that too? Just curious. Also, I thought Rachel Maddow did an excellent job last night with this horrible story.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TicketyBoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #76
119. That was his undergraduate degree
in biochemistry (if I recall correctly).

He went on to get his MD at military educational facilities, the way I understand it. Yes, he is a doctor.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #76
121. His B.S. (undergraduate degree) was in biochemistry, a good major for those going into medicine.
He receeved his M.D. (medical doctor) degree from the U.S. armed services health science university in Bethesda, MD. It is connected with Bethesda Naval Hospital and Walter Reed Army Hospital which are in the same area.

Hasan did his psychiatry training there, as well, which took several years after receiving his M.D.

Hasan has been in school or in training for a very long time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoSheep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #121
132. Thanks for that information, both of you.
NoSheep
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #132
133. You're welcome! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #66
85. Sorry, but I disagree.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AllieB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #62
100. It's psychologists/therapists that usually have better social skills.
Psychiatrists are MDs who dispense medicine and are usually more analytical.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #100
122. I agree. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #29
65. One shard of evidence in favor of nuts is THAT HE KILLED 12 PEOPLE.nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #29
67. What do you think people who "go nuts" look like?
Must they be screaming and running around?

To "go nuts" means to lose one's connection with reality. It does not prevent someone from carrying out a task methodically.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #67
82. True, but
just as we don't want to jump to conclusions on a motive, lets not jump to the conclusion that this had nothing to do with an ideology either. That's all I'm saying.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #29
88. Yes and no
not a psychologist, but

"thinking that, the best way to "exercise" his views was to murder those who didn't share his." = nuts, in my book.

"Nuts" is a colloquial expression and I am using it colloquially.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #88
91. touch (n/t)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TicketyBoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
116. Well, I take that phrase differently.
I take that phrase to mean that the person is doing violence in the name of God, and I believe most people take it that way.

That puts an entirely different light on the phrase, and I do believe that is the way it is used in violent incidents by Muslims.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SIMPLYB1980 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. That is just as disgusting as saying Allah Akbar.
Especially when you start killing innocent people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. Too bad there won't be many who will point this out, especially any other Military counselors etc.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:25 AM
Response to Original message
4. In the military, not so much due to the incident and heightened awareness.
In the public is where I believe the risk is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:27 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Yeah, you may be right.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BolivarianHero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
11. Hopefully, people aren't as stupid as you'd think...
The guy's Timothy McVeigh with a Koran, and not a typical Muslim.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Hopefully.
But there's an awful lot of bigotry toward Muslims and those of Middle Eastern descent already in this country. I fear this will exacerbate it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftynyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #11
86. And I remember how many
on the left tried to paint rush and all the schmucks on the right with what mcveigh did.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BolivarianHero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #86
93. Why not?
The rhetoric of far-right trash radio does play a role in fueling people like McVeigh. Just like Stalin's decision to go back to the Imperial-era's anti-gay and sexually repressive policies so that he could go after his political enemies is a key reason for much of the anti-gay bigotry that exists in Eastern Europe and Russia to this day.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftynyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #93
95. Are you going to be surprised
when all you hear all weekend is this murderer being joined at the hip with the jihadists? Same shit, different ox being gored.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:35 AM
Response to Original message
13. Why do these shooters take so many down with them?
Why didn't he just blow his own head off?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BolivarianHero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Very simple.
Misery loves company. I know this is ridiculously trivial given the gravity, but it's the same reason why you may rub your shitty mood off on others if you went through a bad break-up, flunked out of school, or got fired.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
111. Perfectly said. Hate seeks to replicate itself.
There's probably other psychological stuff inside that psycho stuff---emasculated incompetent man seeks to feel like a man by firing off his guns; powerless loser tries to "cure" his powerlessness by affecting change or making his mark on a community that overwhelms his identity. But it's obviously worse than mere graffiti.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Arkansas Granny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
22. Why do people who commit suicide kill their families first? You can't explain
the actions of someone who is apparently mentally unstable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BennyD Donating Member (207 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #13
30. Hatred is an empty stomach that can't be filled....that's why.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #13
70. Most don't. Have you been following the rash of suicides in the army?
Most soldiers simply take their own lives when they can't bear the thought of going or of going back.

This guy took a different path, obviously. Yet the military will probably focus on why this guy performed a mass killing, rather than why servicemen (and some servicewomen) are killing themselves left and right to avoid these wars.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #70
112. Hopefully they won't.
The way Rachel Maddow tied this horror into the silent horror of military suicides in the past few years made the connection seem so natural. Hopefully this quick a tie-in will impact the coverage from the sheep at CNN.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
14. Yeah, and Lt. Gen. Robert Cone said they've not confirmed yet if he really did
I don't think it's too much of a stretch to imagine the good Lt Gen Robert Cone is just putting off the inevitable. Admit it, address it and deal with the situation.


<snip>
Lt. Gen. Robert Cone said officials had not yet confirmed that the suspected shooter, Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, made the comment, which is Arabic for "God is great!" before the rampage Thursday, which left 30 people wounded, including the gunman.

An imam from a mosque Hasan regularly attended said Hasan, a lifelong Muslim, was a committed soldier, gave no sign of extremist beliefs and regularly wore his uniform at prayers.
<snip>
http://www.statesman.com/news/content/gen/ap/US_Fort_Ho...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:41 AM
Original message
If that is the case, they acted irresponsibly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. Same general who said the shooter was dead, IIRC. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #20
114. I'd suggest cutting him slack here.
The general was very direct and candid in his press conference last night. We don't know whether or not he understandably got bad information early on in the chaos of a horrible moment. This was one of his own men doing this killing and they even had 2 or 3 other men in investigative custody yesterday.

His post was just a hairsbreath away from having a much worse tragedy. His composure under that moment was striking.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
16. After the "investigation" into the death of Pat Tillman...
...do you really trust anything said by the military?

:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. No, but it really doesn't matter. It's being widely reported.

Whether he said it or not, a lot of people will believe he said it.

Fuel for the fire.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #17
23. Yeah, sad but true, you most likely are correct. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
el_bryanto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Well they are the only source of information on this one
Unless you think the incident was staged somehow?

Bryant
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. Wow...that's a leap.
I think the incident was staged? :eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
el_bryanto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #24
27. OK - then in what points do you think the Army is being untruthful and, other than
a general mistrust of the Army, what evidence do you have that they are lying?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #27
44. other than it always does, you mean?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
el_bryanto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #44
63. Yes other than that. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #27
87. What evidence do you have that they are telling the truth?
:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
19. It's really too bad we can't round up all the fundamentalist
extremists from every religion, ship them all to an island and let 'em kill each other in the name of their god. It would certain spare the rest of us their fear & loathing.

Julie
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #19
33. Tell me you are not serious Julie. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rebubula Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #33
37. Meh...
...I would sign onto that idea as well.

Many of us would just like to get rid of people that continue to believe old mythology and use it as a basis of oppression and divisiveness.

But...it is just a pipe dream....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:17 AM
Response to Reply #33
51. Aren't you tired of innocent bystanders dying?
They are a clear and present danger to society, all of society that doesn't believe exactly as they do.

Mind you I don't say "all believers", no. Just the lunatics who think it's a good idea to kill those who don't think/believe *exactly* as they do.

Julie
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #51
78. So just exactly how would you identify these people that you want to "round up"?
I have an aversion for the word "round up". As far as "am I tired of innocent people dying?", what kind of question is that? What do you think? But I am very cautious of reactions like "lets round up all the ______ (fill in the blank)".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #78
81. It was a mostly flippant comment
One of those kind of thoughts it can be fun to indulge in, you know, a fleeting moment. I hadn't really made the comment after finishing my thesis on the topic so I am unprepared (and frankly not interested enough) for a thorough analysis of the notion.

Maybe another day. Today, I am content to write them off as lunatics and hope it's a quiet day in regard to lunatic activity (i.e. killing others).

Julie
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #81
97. I completely understand
and should not have used you to take out my frustrations. I agree it would be nice to fix the problem with the wacko fundys in the world.

Peace
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #78
90. You could start with the following:
Anyone who voted for Michelle Bachman...

:evilgrin:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #90
96. Ok I am in. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mountainvue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
21. I'm sorry but this is starting to seem a little
too Lee Harvey Oswald for me. I'm sorry for the victims and their families. I hope that we find out what the hell really happened there.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. I was having a flashback to "Dr. Strangelove" except with a Muslim twist.
Sterling Hayden's crazed RW nut...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #21
26. I honestly don't think it's that hard to figure out.
the guy went nuts and took a lot of people down. I don't think it had much to do with his being a Muslim.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #21
28. This whole thing is either one big fuck-up by the miltary or something else is going on
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 08:57 AM by TornadoTN
I'm really skeptical of all of this and I'm not a :tinfoil: type person.

I understand the confusion during the event, but the way the story shifted and changed last night, it just really seems odd. First the guy is dead (confirmed by a three-star general) and then he's alive again in stable condition. Then comes all of this.

I just hope that they don't botch the investigation and we get to the bottom of this, wherever it may lead.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #21
35. Yes just like what really happened the JFK or MLK or RFK. The gov will give us a report. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BadgerKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:01 AM
Response to Original message
32. Ah, yes...conveniently anonymous soldiers.
I can only imagine what kind of anti-Muslim frenzy our armed forces have been whipped up into.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
34. Any explanations on how he shot close to 50 people before being subdued? nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. Good question.
I was wondering that, too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #34
42. soldiers at fort hood don't carry weapons. He had two guns and an fishbowl of unarmed targets
how long do you think it takes to fire off forty or fifty rounds?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Soylent Brice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #42
89. not true. my sister is a dental specialist at Ft. Hood.
and she is required to carry her sidearm at all times.

she spent all afternoon and evening yesterday tending to gunshot wounds.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
guardian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #89
104. Bullshit!
1st Bullshit: Dental specialists DO NOT carry sidearms at all times.

2nd Bullshit: Dental specialist DO NOT tend gunshot wounds. That's what PHYSICIANS, NURSES, EMTs are for.

So is anything else you said true?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KathyTeaches Donating Member (6 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #89
105. Horse Hockey!
NO ONE on bases carries sidearms at all times except for security personnel in performance of their duties. PERIOD!

I wonder what type of sidearm she supposedly carries?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #105
107. Dental Floss, duh! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #34
43. They are saying now that some of the victims may have been "Friendly Fire"
As in, responding Officer's and MP's may have inadvertently shot innocents in their engagement with the shooter.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TorchTheWitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #34
46. two semi-automatic handguns with extra clips
shooting in a room filled with unarmed people who most likely hit the dirt or otherwise tried to get out of harm's way. Not exactly difficult to do and it could have been a shitload worse.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #34
50. Some of the victims were shot by the security guards when they arrived.
Also, the close proximity of the shooting allowed from ricochets that hit more people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SIMPLYB1980 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:21 AM
Response to Reply #34
57. Not that hard a thing to do when those you are
attacking are unarmed and you have practice with your weapon. A few clips would hold more than enough ammo to do that. 4*15=60 so he only had to change his clips four times and could still have missed 10 times. I also understand he had a rifle so that could mean no reloading at all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #34
59. A lot of people in a confined space is my understanding of events.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #34
77. Because he chose an unsecured area on a base where weapons are prohibited
Except those in use by police and sentries, and there weren't any police or sentries in the immediate area.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #77
108. You seem certain that he did all the damage. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
39. of course he did, cali. that would go with the story about "violent internet posts,"
wouldn't it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #39
52. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #39
71. Allahu Akbar (God is great) is not a violent expression.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TicketyBoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #71
128. It is when
you're shooting people in the name of God.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
45. I wonder what praising of Jesus Scott Roeder uttered
as he murdered George Tiller?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
arcadian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:16 AM
Response to Original message
48. I'm calling bullshit on this one.
DoD spinmeisters got a hold of this one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #48
53. It may well be bullshit. Doesn 't matter.
It will still have a negative impact.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #48
72. Why? You wouldn't exclaim "God help me" before doing such a thing?
I don't doubt that he said it. It would make sense for him to have said "God is great" before carrying out such an act. Whether or not he said it, in fact, could be an important clue to whether he was sane when he carried out this attack.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #48
94. "Acid is groovy"? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #94
123. THAT's a Hall of Famer. They wouldn't tell these whoppers if there weren't so many idiots
who believe crap like that.

I remember that one! It was followed by "Kill the pigs." Those damned hippies!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #123
124. I dunno.
It just means "God is great." It's just so damned stereotypical, though, that my suspicions are aroused by this being pointed out by any military spokescritter.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:16 AM
Response to Original message
49. :facepalm:
As stupid as this sounds, I thought "oh, no :( " when I heard his name on the radio.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #49
54. It doesn't sound stupid at all. My first thought was "I hope this wasn't
a Muslim".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoSheep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #49
99. Exactly. And then I instantly thought of another group of people who were probably thrilled.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #99
101. I wonder why an individual would want to promote hate against "his" people
It just doesn't make sense - grrrr! :mad:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #101
102. I think he was insane, therefore, I don't think he thought about that
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TicketyBoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #49
129. Me, too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
56. Yeah, the teabaggers are gonna be going apeshit now.
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 09:22 AM by backscatter712
Watch the hate groups and militias kick up by a few notches...

And yeah, they're gonna be focusing on the fact that he's Muslim. That's how bigotry rolls.

Never mind that this is actually an incident more like Columbine - the classic disturbed person "going postal."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
64. Like the "Nuke Mecca Now" crowd needed any more fuel for their "fire of stupidity"!
:mad:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
68. Of course, this is all barack HUSSEIN Obama's fault, ya know...
being kenyan/jordanian/muslin...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
73. Of course they're not going to admit that they knew Hasan was a threat
There are plenty of indications that he was having significant problems.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
75. Oh crap. This is not going to be good.
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 09:52 AM by Odin2005
:(

EDIT: I see the conspiracy nuts are already out. :eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #75
79. I see it as potentially good as a source of dark entertainment
Let the weeping, wailing, bleating, braying, and hand-wringing commence.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
80. Is this not the most commonly used Muslim prayer petition.
When a pilot's plane was crashing, he screamed the same thing.

"God is Great".

I consider it similar to some Catholics"Jesus, Mary and Joseph".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #80
83. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #83
92. For approximately the same reason that many Americans yell...
For approximately the same reason that many Americans yell "Jesus Christ!" or "Oh God!", or "God Damn!"when the adrenaline gets going? :shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoSheep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #83
98. Because they have lost their mind?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TicketyBoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #83
131. Because he was killing
American soldiers in the name of God so they couldn't go kill Muslims.

Anyway, that is my take on it. And, no, it's not racist or religious intolerance. It's based on what is being reported, the fact that he approved of suicide bombers taking out "enemy" soldiers, unaware. Sounds very similar to what he was attempting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
justiceischeap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
103. This stinks of "suicide by cop" so it would make sense for him to shout this
Especially if he is a practicing Muslim thinking he was about to die.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #103
109. No, suicide by cop doesn't involve murder a dozen innocent bystanders. It's terrorism.
Suicide by cop refers to the tortured souls who jump out suddenly and point water pistols at cops, or do something else to bring harm onto themselves. He died while still trying to harm more people who just happened to be in the wrong waiting area at the wrong time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
106. If only he'd been ...
a Christian.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proteus_lives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
110. You're going to get a lot of negative responses.
I really don't get the "I hoped it wasn't a muslim, I falmpalmmed when they said his name" meme.

I get the feeling that FR is giddy right about now. But before you get all righteous, if the shooter had been a baptist preacher then on DU you have a hundred gleeful threads about how horrible Christians are.

I don't care if he was muslim. He's a mass-murdering asshole who only deserves a small concrete room until they stick the needle in.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #110
113. It's only inciteful and hate speech when it is against anyone other than christians
You must have missed that memo.

Go on RW sites and bash Muslim folks, you get brownie points. Go on liberal sites and bash Christians you get brownie points.

It is like a mirror that no one wants to look in to.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
frogmarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
117. Not known to be a threat? WTF!
Red flags were popping up all over with this guy, and had been for a long time. The military should have suspected he might be ready to blow.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
118. Someone from DU had family at the base and rumor has it that wasn't what he was screaming...
Edited on Fri Nov-06-09 04:03 PM by LynneSin
but putting "I'm not going back there" in the nightly news won't rile the masses up in a frenzy like `Allahu Akbar!'

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-06-09 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
130. has this been confirmed? it really doesn't matter...all media has printed/spoken of it as truth.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun Dec 21st 2014, 06:24 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC