Question about two small attached airplanes that separated in flight over my house.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

It was a dark and clear night. We were out on the porch here in Santa Monica about 11:30 last night when a plane with particularly bright lights approached from the north. We watched it approach for a long time so I know it was not two planes flying near each other. I even got the binos and never once thought it was two planes.

As it passed directly over our house (I have no idea how to estimate heights, but I guess it was a mile or so?), it looked as if something unlighted was jutting out forward from it. Then, as I watched, what I thought was one plane slowly separated into two! They looked to be about the same size, what I would call small, meaning not airliner-size. One plane slowly peeled off to the east, headed north a bit, and then went toward downtown LA and disappeared. I saw it in the binos and it was definitely a small plane. My wife went to the other side of the house and watched the other plane slowly curve around and head back north and disappeared.

For aviation experts---what in the world did I see?

[Wickerman]

1. sounds like you saw a plane being refueled

In your neck of the woods that makes sense; lots of military aviation.

added image:

[A-Schwarzenegger]

Do they refuel small planes like that? I can't imagine

we wouldnt have seen it as two connected planes before they
separated. It is certainly a simple explanation that makes
sense, but I never had any idea they would refuel a small
plane right over the city and at night. Hmmm. Thanks.

edit: also, both planes were what I would call small, and
were both about the same size.

[A HERETIC I AM]

8. The Military are the only ones that do aerial refueling....

One thing from your OP that struck me though. You mentioned it was at night. Even with binoculars, it is difficult to accurately determine the altitude of an aircraft with the naked eye at night. You could have indeed witnessed an aerial refueling but they were probably much higher than the "mile or so" you suggested. That would account for them appearing to be small planes, as opposed to the KC135 (basically a Boeing 707) pictured in the other post.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

16. When the one that peeled off came back over our place,

I saw it clearly and at length in the binos and it
was definitely a small plane, not a jet, not military.

[A HERETIC I AM]

17. It would help if you could identify it a little better

For instance, was it a high wing or a low wing? Single engine or twin? Piston or Turbine? If you could really see it clearly, did it (they) appear to be single seaters or have capacity for more than just a pilot? Did the passenger compartment appear to seat them abreast or inline?

There are a lot of various aircraft and scenarios that could explain what you saw. It could be two "Warbirds" or vintage military aircraft owners practicing formation flying. It could have been two friends in Cessna 172's doing the same thing.

If you could use Google and try and find an example of an airplane that is close to what you saw, it will help in solving your mystery.

[damntexdem]

32. Could it have been a glider?

Towed by a powered plane then released?

[PearliePoo2]

2. Might have been a plane towing a glider up to altitude....

and then cutting it loose. ??

[MajorChode]

7. Probably not at that time of night

[A-Schwarzenegger]

20. But I saw the one that peeled off clearly in the binos

and it wasn't a glider, unless a glider looks just like
a small Piper Cub type plane with engines. (I call all small planes
Piper Cubs.) Plus, I can't see anybody towing a glider
at that hour. Oh, plus, it wasn't being towed. It was clear
enough that even if it hadnt had lights on, we would have
seen it was something being towed.

[damntexdem]

36. Oh, then it sounds like a scene out of "Battle in Outer Space."

Or some name like that -- a 50s scifi film where a pilot in a Piper-Cub-like plane is captured by a flying saucer but then escapes with the plane.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

37. If only!

:)

[JuniperLea]

3. Refueling?

I've seen it around the So Cal military bases... but not near Santa Monica! Weird.

[glowing]

4. Maybe they were in tight formation.. or refueling...

With re-fueling one would be atop the other.. as they finish one plane heads on the other vears off.. could be your angle that made it appear to be just one plane.

[NeedleCast]

5. Probably a Decepticon

[ChairmanAgnostic]

6. they were mating, hoping to create a bunch of tiny planes.

[krispos42]

9. Is there a Navy or Marine Corps air station near you?

The Navy and Marines use a varient of the A-6 "Intruder" tactical bomber refitted as a carrier-launched ariel tanker, called the KA-6D.


It's not a big honkin' converted airliner like the Air Force's KC-135 or KC-10, it's the same size as a regular fighter like an F-18 or F-16.

This is a KA-6D refueling an F-14






Here's another. I'm not sure what the other plane is... maybe an F-8 or A-7?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

13. Neither one was a jet. They were going very slowly.

When the one that peeled off came back over our place,
I could see it clearly in the binos and it was just a regular
small plane, moving slowly. I could see it clear as day in
the binos, toodling along.

[krispos42]

18. So they were regular civil aviation prop planes?

Dunno, then. The "plane towing a glider aloft" theory is sound if was daytime... you need sunshine to generate the thermals for gliders to fly on.


Or it might have been a couple of pilots practicing their formation flying.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

22. Yes, regular prop planes. I think two engines, at least

the one that separated & came back over.
I hadnt realized that about gliders needing sun.

[A HERETIC I AM]

14. Pont Mugu NAS is right up the coast

Northwest of Santa Monica.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Air_Station_Point_Mugu

[krispos42]

24. Thanks, looks like it's a dead-end, though

They were prop jobs.

[A HERETIC I AM]

27. E2 Hawkeyes fly out of Mugu

C-2 Greyhounds also;

[Lance_Boyle]

10. Was it Oscar? n/t

[A-Schwarzenegger]

12. If so, we're in big trouble.

(For anybody wondering--the OP is serious.)

[myrna minx]

11. They were filming one of those $10,000 big budget James Bond

films near your house, I'd wager. :D

[Richard D]

15. I don't think that can be done

Over crowded urban areas.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

28. Like your sig.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

26. I have my $1 review ready---

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x5953350

[myrna minx]

43. That's exactly what I was thinking of - your informative review.

(spoilers) :rofl:

I'm excited to see your book will now be published in December. Congratulations!

[billh58]

19. As an old,

(but not very bold) pilot, I'm guessing that you saw two small aircraft at different altitudes flying the same route, until they diverged to proceed to two different destinations.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

21. I simply can't believe that's possible.

We watched the approach for minutes as it came from the north.
We would have seen it as two separated planes. I looked
at it through the binos as it approached and it was one light.

[billh58]

30. Depth perception

is reduced at night, but without actually seeing what you saw, I don't believe anyone can answer your question. I am both a commercial pilot, and a former air traffic controller, and I've seen some strange-looking stuff in the air at night, but nothing from the realm of woo woo. If it happens again, you may want to think about calling the FAA for an explanation.

[Codeine]

23. Guys, just tell him what he wants to hear

so he can stop with the "that's just not possible" nonsense.

It was a secret Bilderberger black op.

It was Reptilians on a refueling mission.

Chemtrails! Chemtrails! Chemtrails!

Israeli special forces on a secret assassination mission.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

25. That's just not possible.

:*

[Vickers]

29. I KNEW IT!!!!

:P

[Swamp Rat]

31. Airplane Mitosis

:yoiks:

[A-Schwarzenegger]

33. I had to look it up. That's it.

You can all go home now. Nothing to see. Move along. :hi:

[JBoris]

34. Was it a glider being towed then released?

[HopeHoops]

35. They were just mating

Where do you think LITTLE airplanes come from? It isn't the cabbage patch!

[RebelOne]

38. I read something about that on some Web site several months ago.

It is two identical planes attached by the wings. It is experimental.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

40. I'd love to see it if you can track it down.

Thanks.

[cbdo2007]

39. Sounds like a weather balloon.

Probably best to stop asking questions now and just leave it at that.

[DainBramaged]

41. maybe the LAPD IS using Predators or versions of them

to monitor drug or gang traffic?

[Buns_of_Fire]

42. You were fortunate enough to view the miracle of birth firsthand, of course! n/t

[SoCalDem]

44. You voyeur.. they were mating.. shame on you !.. n/t

[applegrove]

45. Maybe they were dragon flies...****ing? LOL!

[A-Schwarzenegger]

46. I loves double-decker dragonflies but they would of had have to be

biiiiig. :)

[Skittles]

47. I asked an airline pilot what he thought

he emailed back:

Sometimes druggies do this: File one legit flight plan. Second plane has contraband. Fly tight formation so ATC can't tell there's more than one plane. Legit plane continues to the filed customs airport. Druggie peels off without lights and lands at any field as if was a domestic VFR flight with no flight plan required.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

48. Thanks, Skittles. That actually makes sense.

Although when the one peeled off, he had his lights on.
What I actually thought of was the space shuttle, when it
takes off from Florida & is going up & the boosters burn
out and separate. It was that dramatic. Oh, what's VFR?

[A HERETIC I AM]

49. VFR = Visual Flight Rules.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_flight_rules

As opposed to IFR = Instrument Flight Rules

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_Flight_Rules