How is this not Romney's plan?

[Lorax7844]

Mandates, fines, and if you don't like your insurance you have to keep it?

Public Option for those that DO NOT have health insurance, and that only starts in four years.

Please explain to me where I am wrong, I beg of you, please.

[t0dd]

1. We've been had. While everyone is fawning over how pretty his speech was at the end,

allow me to puke over his actual proposal.

[rockymountaindem]

2. Mass. doesn't have a non-profit public option

I guess we're trading individual mandates for the public option. I'm not thrilled, but on the other hand it could be worse. What's more, it's not like this bill isn't going to go through the sausage grinder in the Senate before anybody votes on a final package.

[Lorax7844]

3. A public option that basically NO ONE can get into

[rockymountaindem]

4. I think the idea is that the other components of the plan

will cover everybody except the supposed 5% who will still find that the public option is the best one for them. I think they're underestimating the appeal the public option will have by overestimating the possibility of wringing the cost reductions out of the current system. It will probably cover more people than they think.

[iris27]

5. Not if you HAVE to accept whatever insurance your employer offers.

It doesn't sound like this is going to be a public option that anyone can opt into if they find it more appealing than their current plan:

"Let me be clear – it would only be an option for those who don’t have insurance."

[Fire1]

14. Then why did he say you can 'choose' your coverage from

the 'exchange?' Meaning, your employer will have a VARIETY of plans available from which to choose. That sounds damn good to me!

[Lorax7844]

15. your employer will choose

not you.

[Fire1]

16. That is blatantly FALSE!! n/t

[Lorax7844]

17. prove where I am wrong

I sincerely am looking for some sliver linings. I would like any reassurance that I did not waste my time and money.

I don't want to hate this.

[Fire1]

18. We listened to the same speech. There is only one

conclusion that can be drawn. You clearly did not comprehend what was being said or you have selective hearing. Both of which is like talking to concrete. A perfect example. I just told you what the man ACTUALLY SAID (and he has said this REPEATEDLY over the past several months) and you twisted it to fit your little agenda. You don't need reassurance. I don't know who you think you're fooling with that act. Try not to be so transparent.

[Lorax7844]

19. go find it and SHOW me!

you can't.

[Fire1]

21. If I have to SHOW you parts in a speech you're admitting

you're an idiot. If you didn't comprehend it when he SAID it, chances are, you're not going to understand it if you READ IT!!!:rofl:

[Luminous Animal]

26. You are an idiot for not reading the House bill

and understanding the limitations and restrictions on individuals and the insurance exchange.

[Fire1]

27. I don't consider having choices, better known as options,

to be 'limitations' or restrictions. If an employer has several plans for me to choose from how would I be limited? If I lose or change jobs and still get coverage, how am I losing? If my employer gets tax credits for offering various plans, why would that employer decide not to offer health insurance plans? If need be, why would I not contribute to a 'fund' to supplement those plans offered by my employer?
It's a PROPOSED house bill. Which means, it is subject to change and not in the concluding stages.

edit to add: People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, idiot.

[Luminous Animal]

28. You will have no choice

if your employer offers you insurance unless you pay 100% out of pocket for insurance on the exchange. You will not be allowed to opt out of your employer's plan even if insurance on the exchange is cheaper. Large employers are not obligated to offer you several plans, they are only obligated to pay 72.5% of any plan that they offer. Obama, himself has said he is committed to an employer based health insurance plan. Employers already get tax credits for offering insurance and most employees already contribute to their employer based plans.

[Fire1]

32. All employers don't get tax credits b/c all employers don't

offer insurance benefit packages, which I believe was his point. Yes, he is committed to the employer based plans b/c the majority of Americans are quite satisfied with their employer based plans and have no desire to opt into an exchange.

edit to add: Employers may not be obligated to offer numerous plans but many DO, just the same.

[Luminous Animal]

23. There will be a lot of firewalls in place to bar you from choosing.

Under the House plan, the CBO estimates that only 10 million people will be eligible for the exchange.

Under the House Democrats’ legislation, workers who are eligible for job-based insurance could go on the exchange only if their costs were more than 11 percent of their incomes. The CBO estimates that three million people would fall into that category by 2017. Both the House and Senate health committee bills would offer sliding scale subsidies for insurance on the exchange to those earning up to 400% of the federal poverty level, about $43,320 a year for an individual.

People willing to pay for their entire premiums, without subsidies, also could enroll through the exchange, under the House bill. There's no way to know exactly what the premiums would be, but the average cost for family coverage available through employers last year was $12,680, according to the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation. The cost for covering individuals was $4,704. (Kaiser Health News is part of the foundation.)

Lawmakers and some health care analysts say that legislation has to create barriers around the exchange to protect the stability of the employer-provided insurance market. Without the restrictions, called firewalls, younger and healthier workers, they say, might find cheaper options on the exchange, leaving older and sicker workers in their employers' plans—and driving up their costs.

“We are trying to provide as much choice as possible and trying to honor the president’s promise to protect the employer-based system so that if people have coverage they like they’ll get to keep it," said Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse, D-R.I., a member of the health committee. "That’s the way you resolve that balance.”

To keep the pool of people covered by an insurance plan strong, "you just can’t allow people to drop out of employer-sponsored coverage,” said Paul Van De Water, a senior fellow with the liberal-leaning Center on Budget and Policy Priorities in Washington. “You don’t want people to think they can get a better deal by just going into the exchange.”

[Lorax7844]

6. mandates and fines

please some one prove me wrong.

[Fire1]

7. I think you heard what you wanted to hear. n/t

[redqueen]

9. Gotta start somewhere...

Canada only had a public option in one province... and the rest of the country had to wait another 20 years for it.

We're trying to start it all over the country, all at once. It's not going to be perfect right out of the gate.

[ipaint]

11. Did canada have a working popular national medicare system that they ignored?

[redqueen]

12. Not a national system, no... but they had regional ones for decades, yes.

Do some reading, eh?

[ipaint]

22. That's what I thought.

[ddeclue]

24. Neither will we - this isn't Obamacare this is Romneycare...

[bvar22]

8. Reced back UP to +5

In spite of the lofty rhetoric and smooth talk,
this IS a Republican Plan.

[LeFleur1]

10. Republican plan?

If you think those right wing Republicans are going to vote for such a plan you are hanging out in la la land.

[Cha]

30. What a stupid

complaint.."republican plan":silly:

[bvar22]

31. Stupid comment?....only to the ignorant..

[liberalpragmatist]

13. Stronger regulations and a public plan

But keep in mind that Romneycare gives Mitt Romney too much credit. It was written by the Democratic legislature with active input from Ted Kennedy. Mittens just signed it and looked pretty.

[Lorax7844]

20. Sure like the banking industry?

The system they have in MA is expensive and it sucks, if some one that lives in MA has it and would like to disagree with me I'm all ears.

I still don't have an answer, I want one!

[Mixopterus]

29. Naw

It sucks, it sucks real bad.

[HughMoran]

25. Uranus Hertz

:D