The ongoing failure of Dems to deliver: time for a new party, or to (once again) "reform" the old?

[villager]

Poll question: The ongoing failure of Dems to deliver: time for a new party, or to (once again) "reform" the old?

[Echo In Light]

1. People need to create a genuine, not phony, oppositional party to the corporate/state nexus

[DailyGrind51]

8. The present "Democratic" Party has become "Republican Lite",

We need a new Party clearly reflective of our views. Call it "Progressive", "Labor", or "People's" Party, it has to function without any input/funds from corporations.

[Echo In Light]

9. And that transformation wasn't accidental as narrowing the parameters serve vested interests

[dembotoz]

18. the problem is money

and while yes
obama and howard dean raised all kind of cash from dem internets,
the compare and contract in the future would be against obama and i am not
so sure that the lefties like myself will be willing to click the contribute button.

[lumberjack_jeff]

2. How about we wait until we know what we're pissed about? n/t

[villager]

4. "just keep waiting -- it's bound to get better?"

I wish the auguries supported your contention....

But I'd loved to be flabbergasted and surprised...

[lumberjack_jeff]

6. I simply don't know what I'm supposed to be outraged about.

If they pass a healthcare bill which sucks, you might have a point.

Until then, we're just engaging in a bunch of randomized angst.

The president will be presented with a bill very much like HR3200.

[villager]

7. I guess if you think the Dems have been a splendid advocacy party *until now*

on issues like credit card reform, Wall St. bailouts, checking executive power, visionary environmental legislation (which we essentially have no more "time" for), etc., then, yes, you are free to imagine this discussion is only about the imploding health "care" bill....

[babylonsister]

5. Thank you. The knee-jerkers are intent on bringing everyone else

down. Nothing is a done deal yet.

[Enrique]

3. keep voting for good dems in primaries

and keep improving campaign finance reform. No magic bullet, unfortunately.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

10. "Not as bad" doesn't equal good. Anymore than a "White Lie" equals truth.

As it is, we have a "not as bad" party telling "white lies" and the knee-jerk party loyalists telling us that it's going to get better....someday...maybe...if we get enough (60?) votes in the senate.

[redqueen]

11. A new party has no chance. That worked before, but it won't know.

They have so much power they don't care if they lose votes, apparently... or they'd have learned from 2000.

That's how it seems to me anyway.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

12. Catch-22 for progressives. Vote for the status-quo or vote for the not-as-bad status quo.

"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever, in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else, where I was capable of thinking for myself. Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent. If I could not go to heaven but with a party, I would not go there at all." --Thomas Jefferson to Francis Hopkinson, 1789.

"Were parties here divided merely by a greediness for office,...to take a part with either would be unworthy of a reasonable or moral man." --Thomas Jefferson to William Branch Giles, 1795.

“Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." --John Quincy Adams

[redqueen]

13. They lived in a different country...

before things like centralized banks and corporate personhood became what they are today. Jefferson was opposed to such things, and now even the least intelligent can see why. It all sounds very nice, though.

I'll join in and post one of my favorite Jefferson quotes:

"I hope we shall... crush in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations which dare already to challenge our government in a trial of strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country."

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. Works for me even today.

Do we, as individuals, simply surrender to a corrupt system, and perpetuate it? Or, do we, as individuals, resist? Even if we think it futile to do so?

I with them on their resistance.

[redqueen]

16. The issue is not whether to resist, but how. (nt)

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. A conundrum to be answered by one's conscience..

I'm willing to shrug and overlook most of the antics of the Democrats when they try to get votes...but, there are certain issues when the usual nose-holding doesn't suffice. That's when John Quincy Adams kicks in and I vote my conscience.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

14. What's the point of this poll? I think a post that straight up says you want a new party would be

more direct.