Heterosexual Privilege- Some Talking Points

[FreeState]

http://www.pamshouseblend.com/diary/11671/hetereosexual-privilege-some-talking-points

This article is based on Peggy McIntosh’s article on white privilege and was written by a number of straight-identified students at Earlham College who got together to look at some examples of straight privilege. These dynamics are but a few examples of the privilege which straight people have. Lesbian, gay, bisexual, and queer-identified folk have a range of different experiences, but cannot count on most of these conditions in their lives.

On a daily basis as a straight person…

• I can be pretty sure that my roomate, hallmates and classmates will be comfortable with my sexual orientation.
  
• If I pick up a magazine, watch TV, or play music, I can be certain my sexual orientation will be represented.
  
• When I talk about my heterosexuality (such as in a joke or talking about my relationships), I will not be accused of pushing my sexual orientation onto others.
  
• I do not have to fear that if my family or friends find out about my sexual orientation there will be economic, emotional, physical or psychological consequences.
  
• I did not grow up with games that attack my sexual orientation (IE fag tag or smear the queer).
  
• I am not accused of being abused, warped or psychologically confused because of my sexual orientation.
  
• I can go home from most meetings, classes, and conversations without feeling excluded, fearful, attacked, isolated, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance, stereotyped or feared because of my sexual orientation.
  
• I am never asked to speak for everyone who is heterosexual.
  
• I can be sure that my classes will require curricular materials that testify to the existence of people with my sexual orientation.
  
• People don't ask why I made my choice of sexual orientation.
  
• People don't ask why I made my choice to be public about my sexual orientation.
  
• I do not have to fear revealing my sexual orientation to friends or family. It's assumed.
  
• My sexual orientation was never associated with a closet.
  
• People of my gender do not try to convince me to change my sexual orientation.
  
• I don't have to defend my heterosexuality.
  
• I can easily find a religious community that will not exclude me for being heterosexual.
  
• I can count on finding a therapist or doctor willing and able to talk about my sexuality.
  
• I am guaranteed to find sex education literature for couples with my sexual orientation.
  
• Because of my sexual orientation, I do not need to worry that people will harass me.
  
• I have no need to qualify my straight identity.
  
• My masculinity/femininity is not challenged because of my sexual orientation.
  
• I am not identified by my sexual orientation.
  
• I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help my sexual orientation will not work against me.
  
• If my day, week, or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it has sexual orientation overtones.
  
• Whether I rent or I go to a theater, Blockbuster, an EFS or TOFS movie, I can be sure I will not have trouble finding my sexual orientation represented.
  
• I am guaranteed to find people of my sexual orientation represented in the Earlham curriculum, faculty, and administration.
  
• I can walk in public with my significant other and not have people double-take or stare.
  
• I can choose to not think politically about my sexual orientation.
  
• I do not have to worry about telling my roommate about my sexuality. It is assumed I am a heterosexual.
  
• I can remain oblivious of the language and culture of LGBTQ folk without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.
  
• I can go for months without being called straight.
  
• I'm not grouped because of my sexual orientation.
  
• My individual behavior does not reflect on people who identity as heterosexual.
  
• In everyday conversation, the language my friends and I use generally assumes my sexual orientation. For example, sex inappropriately referring to only heterosexual sex or family meaning heterosexual relationships with kids.
  
• People do not assume I am experienced in sex (or that I even have it!) merely because of my sexual orientation.
  
• I can kiss a person of the opposite gender on the heart or in the cafeteria without being watched and stared at.
  
• Nobody calls me straight with maliciousness.
  
• People can use terms that describe my sexual orientation and mean positive things (IE "straight as an arrow", "standing up straight" or "straightened out") instead of demeaning terms (IE "ewww, that's gay" or being "queer").
  
• I am not asked to think about why I am straight.
  
• I can be open about my sexual orientation without worrying about my job.

[FSogol]

1. You are entirely correct. Heterosexuals have no problems at all.

:shrug:

[FreeState]

2. Thanks for your empathy n/t

[Stellabella]

4. Did you READ that list, or is this just a knee-jerk response?

Or are you overreacting to the truth?

Sheesh.

[FreeState]

5. Maybe we could add that post to the link of privileges? n/t

[FSogol]

6. Yes I did. Many of the items are not specific to GLBT people.

For example: Many kids get bullied at school, not just GLBTs and many women have problems at work due to their gender, regardless of orientation. Many people feel isolated at work and home, etc.

[FreeState]

7. Where is that on the list?

Every item on the list is in regard to sexual orientation.

[FSogol]

9. Bullet point #5 is about bullying, the last one is about worrying about problems at a job.

Being the victim of bullying and worry about job difficulties are not limited to GLBT people.

[FreeState]

11. Lets repeate those bullet points shall we?

"I did not grow up with games that attack my sexual orientation (IE fag tag or smear the queer)."

Care to point out where kids are bullied because they are straight? Where are those games called "Smear the Straight"?

and for the last one:

"I can be open about my sexual orientation without worrying about my job."

Care to point out where people are fired for being heterosexual?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

12. Nope.

Bullet point #5:

I did not grow up with games that attack my sexual orientation (IE fag tag or smear the queer).

Nothing about heterosexuals there.

Last bullet point:

I can be open about my sexual orientation without worrying about my job.

So straight people have to be worried about being fired because they're straight? When did this happen?

[Realityhack]

35. The point of this exercise seems to have eluded you.

Have you read McIntosh’s article or are you reading the OP without any context?

The above two posters are correct of course, you are wrong on both the bullets you questioned.

[JackRiddler]

71. So you're saying kids are bullied on the assumption they're heterosexual?

[foxfeet]

10. You demonstrate an amazing capacity for missing the point.

Apparently you have chosen to do so deliberately.

[Stellabella]

13. Fail.

Of course many people are bullied and isolated. But we're talking about disparaging an entire group of human beings with a single slur.

It would be quite a trick to see you do that with any non-oppressed group.

Grow up.

[pepperbear]

52. but those problems aren't due to any kind of societal perception of their heterosexuality...

...which is, I think, the point here.

Hey, but don't feel so bad. That one was a head scratcher.

And certainly no offense taken.

Nice hatchet response, skippy. Here are some blocks and a rainbow-colored slinky to play with.

[QC]

15. Excellent example of privilege! Thanks! n/t

[Terran]

29. Your 'shrug' icon is entirely appropriate

because you so do not get this AT ALL.

[PVnRT]

58. Welcome to FAILtown, population: You (n/t)

[Dora]

3. Good post. Thanks for bringing it here. nt

[izzybeans]

8. K n R

These privilege exercises are always good to reflect on.

[Starry Messenger]

14. k&r

Of course it's almost impossible to discuss this at DU. People seem to think that the word "privilege" means extra candy sprinkles.

[Cronus Protagonist]

16. I enjoy most of these privileges myself

And when I tell people I'm not straight, it always causes some reaction along the lines of "I'm disappointed" or "That's a shame". I like to ask "why" and it's fun to watch them justify their comments. If what I hear is accurate, apparently these sentiments have something to do with me not appearing to be homosexual, and therefore being assumed as being heterosexual, for which it is a "disappointment" to find out the truth.

[noamnety]

17. one more k&r

I'm always discouraged by posts from people who can't figure out that straight/male/white/Christian privileges exist even IF the recipient doesn't earn 6 figures a year, has medical issues, or can't shoot golden unicorns out of their ass on demand.

All the basic problems people face, we all face in varying degrees ... plus oppressed groups have these special ones on TOP of those.

[FreeState]

18. Excellent point - with privilege comes willful and unwillful ignorance many times

when those that are the recipients are informed about their privileges there are those that want to defend the status quo or deny that such a thing even exists. This happens to all minority groups (be they ethnic, orientation or religious). For some its easier to deny than to see that they themselves may be part of the problem.

[NoSheep]

19. "Nobody calls me straight with maliciousness"...wrong.

Edited to add I did not post this comment to in any way distance myself from the struggles of GLBT people of which I am a committed part...I just think that statement isn't true. I feel I'm in it with you and it isn't right to be automatically dismissed from understanding due to my sexual orientation. It happens. That's all.

[FreeState]

21. I think your over simplifying it

yes I can see cases where someone might say something malicious about straight people. The list of privileges though is about society as a whole - for example:

as a gay man I have been told my sexual orientation is wrong by:

My Church (former Church)
My Family
My School
My Government
Total strangers
etc.

I do not see that happening to heterosexuals on that scale.

[NoSheep]

26. I have no wish to compare the depth or degree of our oppression.

But I have experienced discrimination by all those groups because of my politics and my gender. I wouldn't trade places with you in a million years, however. This is a very hard subject for a relatively "straight" person to have a conversation about on a message board with those who are considered or consider themselves otherwise. I only wish you the best and hope you know I care about your feelings. I think the only reason I commented is because I do care and wanted others to know that some "straight" people who are a part of your struggle would like to just be "people" where this is concerned. Many of us understand due to our own personal and varied experiences with oppression. The degree is for someone else to fret over. To me, ANY is enough.

[FreeState]

27. I agree with you

I was not meaning to imply that anyone has it harder, for certainly I can find instances of oppression that are worse towards women, asians, blacks, jews etc. When one of us suffer we all suffer... thanks for your support and your voice. Hopefully one day all of us can live together without fear of discrimination no matter the cause:)

[noamnety]

22. There's a world of difference

between having your orientation used as a slur in a malicious way in the general world, and having it brought up in the narrow context of "when I am fighting for the rights of the oppressed people, they sometimes point out that I am not a member of that oppressed group."

[NoSheep]

25. I think I understand what you are saying.

[Terran]

31. I don't think anyone's saying that straight people are incapable

of understanding our problems...but please, do elaborate. How *exactly* have you been "oppressed" by someone saying something rude to you about your heterosexuality? I don't think you're getting the point here. We're talking about individual incidents as evidence of a society-wide norm of oppression, and to that you are *not* subject, ever. We don't have any power to oppress you.

[NoSheep]

60. Please see post 26 for clarification.

I hope you will at least see my meaning. My original comment was not about being oppressed by homosexuals. No. Not at all. I have been called "straight" with malice, however. That was my only issue with what I quoted. It happens.

[Terran]

66. Maybe if you explained what happened

I might understand better. So far all I'm seeing is that someone, and I assume it had to be a GLBT person, made a snide remark to you. Did this happen a lot? Was there a pattern of it?

I understand if your feelings were hurt, because such remarks are hurtful when used maliciously. But I stand by my point that there's no basis to compare your incident with what all GLBT people are subject to every day of their lives. It's not just, or even mostly maliciousness anyway, for many of us; it's the way we are invisible in almost every aspect of public culture except as stereotypes. If you are a person of color, you probably know this feeling, but you haven't said that.

[NoSheep]

73. I was quoting the OP. A statement was made that was false in my experience.

No one here hurt my feelings per se. I had said the reason I objected to a particular statement in the OP was because it said no one would ever call me straight with malice. And that isn't true. I have been called straight with malice. As if somehow I couldn't understand the oppression someone unlike me might feel.

That anyone would think one individual might have to be gay or of color to understand this isn't being very open minded. It's a stereotype.

For starters, here is my surface profile:

I'm a blond female, from a small town in the South...from an uneducated working class family. (Must be dumb, right?)

I'm 46 and have never been married. No children. (Must be a bitch or crazy or barren)

Add to that the fact that I'm faaaaaaar left of liberal, an atheist, well-educated, bohemian, MIHOP and a smoker on antidepressants and you've got the makings of a person who is stereotyped by almost EVERYONE on the planet! Believe me...I get it.


You said: "it's the way we are invisible in almost every aspect of public culture except as stereotypes". Various pockets of society can marginalize you for more things than your
sexuality. If you have read my other statements here you know by now I"m not making any comparisons; just trying to explain why I pointed out the fallacy of that one statement in the OP. Not to make anyone feel like they need to curb their anger or their struggle for equality....just to say I'm one "straight" person who has experienced stereotyping not only by homosexuals but every other cultural group(for lack of a better term)I can think of.

[Beam Me Up]

76. Thank you!

specifically for bringing up prejudice/stereotyping against MIHOPers (of which I am one) but you're whole point in general. We have a lot in common and have experienced many similar prejudices. The primary differences being I'm male, gay and not blond. However, I grew up rural working class (near poverty). Southern Indiana isn't "the south" but in many respects, culturally, it is. (We say "well" as a two syllable word 'way-L', for example.) To be taken seriously, I had to 'unlearn' my native accent. I'm also a bit 'from another planet' (thus my handle) in a lot of other respects. It took me many years to finally understand that not all my problems 'fitting in' socially were due to the fact I'm gay -- I would have had them even if I'd been straight. As a boy I didn't understand why my interest in designing dresses and learning to sew them for my (mostly female) doll collection and then spending hours staging soap operas for them was a problem. I also had my farm chores, knew how to shoot a gun, played basketball and baseball, among other typical 'boy' things. As an adult white male now I don't understand why anyone else should have an attitude or opinion about my personal interests, habits, beliefs, sexual orientation, etc.

But all that said, I can't imagine (although I've tried and suspect I can 'imagine' at least somewhat better than most straight men) what it is like growing up female or black (for example). Being white and male gives me privileges I don't even see. Now that I'm over 60 I'm faced with both new prejudices and new privileges. For example, I see how police (which I seldom have occasion to interact with but do on occasion) relate to me much differently than they did when I was younger. I seem to be given a more 'automatic' respect, am assumed by them to be 'not a threat' (or something). On the other hand, being no longer young and physically attractive, I'm met with a new set of prejudices, too.

For me, the MIHOP prejudice/stereotyping here at DU is very troubling all the more so because when I point it out to someone here who is exercising it they usually don't 'get it' as a prejudice. It's one thing to disagree with someone's opinion. No problem with that. But this prejudiced attitude is different -- it brings with it a host of assumptions about ME and people like me who hold this opinion. It seems most here who have this prejudice don't even 'get it' that they have this prejudice and that it is oppressive. I've thought of starting a thread on this subject but I don't know exactly how -- and if it is only in the dungeon then it wouldn't even be seen by most DUers who never go there. Since you bring it up, though, I'm wondering how you see this? How do you address it here on DU and in your life?

edit clarity

[omega minimo]

20. There is also a version of this for women. Rigid gender roles affect all of us, F/M, LGBT, and are

oppressive and harmful to many of us all.

[omega minimo]

65. The Male Privilege Checklist

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=229&topic_id=3488

[Blue_Tires]

23. well done...

[Lerkfish]

24. very good list

[MellowDem]

28. Yeah, there is that...

and then there are a ton of things that suck about being heterosexual. For one, the expectations of what you should do according to your gender, the pressure to marry, etc. Really, a straight person raised in a fundy household and community can have it worse off than a gay person raised in a loving open accepting household and community.

The focus should be on how gender expectations hurt everyone, not on trying to divide the group, which is all these "privilege" lists ever do. They are idiotic huge generalizations stated as fact that will conflict with many many people's experiences. They are rather imflammatory and narrow minded.

[joeybee12]

30. We have a winner! And by that I mean the winner of the stupidest, dumb-ass post

of the week!

[MellowDem]

32. Congrats!

Your dumbass post lives up to your own expectations! You are the winner!

[Lerkfish]

45. I don't think there is an equivalence at all, but there is a validity to the post you just trashed

The point being that there is an unnatural pressure from society on ANY person of ANY type to behave in an acceptable sociosexual manner.
You can be hetero S&M and have that looked down on. You can be uninterested in sex at all and have your friends try to fix you up .....

I think the post you chided makes an excellent point, if you think of it, that what business is it of anyone's to decree what anyone else's sexual behavior should be?

[Realityhack]

47. That is not the message I get from this:

"...and then there are a ton of things that suck about being heterosexual."
IMO that implies equivalency.

[Lerkfish]

53. hmm. did I say that?

I don't think so. I think I said the opposite.

but regardless, I was saying that the other person's post had a valid point. I don't mean to say I agree with it in toto.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

34. The pressure to marry? Are you serious?

How do you think gay people feel when they're not even allowed to get married?

Really, a straight person raised in a fundy household and community can have it worse off than a gay person raised in a loving open accepting household and community.

I've never heard of fundies telling straight people they're going to hell because they're straight.

[MellowDem]

39. I'm not downplaying what gay people go through...

I'm pointing out that these privilige lists miss the point. Generally, the point of such lists as this is to inform people who may be naive what a certain group goes through, in other words, it is trying to create empathy for others, good thing to do. It's a good way to challenge people's views and change their minds about subjects by becoming more aware of what others go through. The thing is, for one, as for as I know DU doesn't question whether gays suffer or not. It's preaching to the choir. The other problem is that even for those to whom it is meant, to people naive of what gays go through, it seems the wrong way to go about it. Instead of having a rather silly list created by a bunch of straight students telling other straights about the privilege they have (according to only the student's experiences), having a discussion about the root cause would be much better.

Homophobia and the negative reaction to homosexuality in general is mainly because it challenges gender norms. Gender norms are deeply entrenched in our society through religion and cultural tradition. If you don't tell straights who are ignorant of homosexuality and opposed to gay rights how they themselves are being hurt by gender norms, then you give them no reason to care about the rights of gays. By coopting them and making them aware of how gender norms hurt them and all others, you will get many more people on board with not only gay rights but the destruction of hurtful gender norms. By telling people what privileges they supposedly have, you automatically put them on the defensive and will quickly find that their personal experiences don't match up with certain parts of the list.

Your questioning of what are some general things straights deal with is a perfect example of why these lists don't work. Straights is too broad a category, as is gays, to create a privilege list that won't cause some to raise their eyebrows about the points.

And fundies tell straights all the time that they're going to hell for a lot of different reasons. It's a good way to coopt them into their gender norm.

If you are gay and out, you've already broken out of the gender norms by being attracted to the same sex, which can give you a lot more freedom in challenging other gender norms and being yourself. If you are straight, the pressure to be a certain way because of your gender is much greater in my experience. That's not to say that gays still don't have pressure to act their gender. In fact, one of the greatest conflicts within the gay community is how to address gender roles. Who proposes? Who pays for dinner? Does being a lesbian mean having to act masculine? Does being gay meaning having to act effiminate? In a relationship, does there always have to be the "butch" and the "femme"? The gay community has come a long way on these questions, especially compared to straights, but you still see a lot of gender role pressure even within the gay community. They are able to test new boundaries of gender roles much easier than straights in my experience. Some straights may be more privileged than they think, but the vast majority are more repressed than they know too by their own cultural pressures. If you don't address both, you're not going to get through.

[Lerkfish]

46. they aren't equal at all, vastly different scales, but there are unreasonable expectations

to marry on the heterosexuals.

As an example, I was widowed as a young man, and even in my immediate grief, people and well-meaning friends kept trying to push their unmarried female friends on me to "fix" my situation. Their view was that I needed to be married to heal, instead of realizing I needed to work through my own grief to heal.

No doubt about it that the GLBT community is being abused in current social mores, but and this is a big but, it doesn't make you exclusive in being pigeonholed by others.

[Realityhack]

48. No it does not.

However, for example... how much worse is is for a gay or lesbian to have family pressuring them to get married (out or not)?

I don't think the authors of the list were trying to say being strait (or white) makes one immune to all of life's challenges. But there is a clear benefit for those who are. One that is often invisible to those on the receiving end.

[Lerkfish]

54. and I agree with you on that.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

56. That's a very small price to pay for privilege.

[Lerkfish]

57. I have always supported GLBT rights

both here and elsewhere.

:shrug:

what you consider a "small price" is losing my wife?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

59. No, I was referring to the general concept of pressure to marry, not your loss.

[Realityhack]

37. Huh?

"and then there are a ton of things that suck about being heterosexual. For one, the expectations of what you should do according to your gender, the pressure to marry, etc."
No that is something that sucks about being of your gender. Gender expectations are the same for stratit and gay people in many situations where sexual orientation may not be immediately apparent.

"Really, a straight person raised in a fundy household and community can have it worse off than a gay person raised in a loving open accepting household and community."
Yes and a slave to a very nice family that treats them very well might have it better off than a non-slave in an abusive home. That doesn't actually mean anything about the condition of being a slave vs. not.
In the case of your wording one would have to compare a gay person and a strait person both raised in the same type of environment to make any type of fair comparison. Now care to tell us how the gay person raised in a fundy household is going to be better off than the strait kid?

"The focus should be on how gender expectations hurt everyone, not on trying to divide the group, which is all these "privilege" lists ever do. They are idiotic huge generalizations stated as fact that will conflict with many many people's experiences. They are rather imflammatory and narrow minded."
I do not agree. These lists can show people who have not been on the receiving end of such problems just how different life is from another persons point of view, especially with respect to the less obvious small details that are a day to day fact for some but may not even occur to others. In this way they can further the discussion and open discussion of these issues and how completely they can permeate our lives is hardly narrow minded.

[MellowDem]

41. Generally I agree with you on the point of the lists....

I just dispute their effectiveness.

My point about the fundy househould comparison was that your sexual orientation can be both a privilege and a ball and chain, whether gay or straight. Bristol Palin is a great example. A straight girl raised in a fundy family. As a girl, the pressure to find a mate and marry in those kinds of communities is heavy. And then the crazy idea about sex being bad, yet also getting signals from society that sex is power, etc. etc. And no sex education of course. Viola! She's pregnant and chose to raise a baby on her own. In all honesty, if she had been an out lesbian she might have been better off in many ways. No baby for one thing. These privilege lists tend to make things look like only one side is effected and the other only benefits. The truth is we are all in this together, and the sooner we realize that the better.

[Realityhack]

44. Um. No.

We come right back to the issue of a well treated slave vs. an abused white.

Just because you can show me an anecdote of someone who *might* have been better off 'in some ways' if they were gay (and your example is terribly flawed BTW) does not mean you have demonstrated any lack of systematic privilege in the system.

Does having one board member who is black mean there is no racial discrimination at a company? What about one white janitor? No of course it does not. Our lives can indeed suck despite being privileged in various ways. That does not mean the privilege is any less real however.

Let's look at your example of Bristol Palin. I will take it as a given that her life sucks because she grew up fundi.
Now looking at the list of privileges which would you say she did not or does not benefit from? Aside from ones that might not apply like 'roommate' I didn't see a single one.

As for the 'drawbacks' of being strait you listed:
* As a girl, the pressure to find a mate and marry
You neglected to note that had she been gay this pressure would not have dissapeared and may have intensified. She would have been pushed to change her sexual orientation.

* the crazy idea about sex being bad, yet also getting signals from society that sex is power, etc. etc.
Of course sex would be seen as downright horrific if she was having it with someone of the same sex. So that's the same either way.

* And no sex education of course.
Because sex ed only benefits strait people right?

* She's pregnant and chose to raise a baby on her own.
This is the closest you come to anything that could possibly be interpreted as an 'advantage' of being gay. She would not have gotten pregnant (making a few reasonable assumptions). And yet we still see that it was her choices that got her there.
Sorry but I don't think that cuts it as far as showing how heterosexuality can be just as limiting as not being heterosexual.

There is a systemic privilege associated with heterosexuality.

[MellowDem]

49. I wasn't using the list in my example...

And all the things I was listing were basically those which led to her being pregnant, not things in and of themselves that are bad only for straights.

I agree there is privilege with being heterosexual in general. But to list those without the disadvantages as well makes no sense. All of the privileges and disadvantages straights or gays have are due to ideas of gender roles, so it makes sense to list both and pinpoint the source accurately, otherwise the list won't do much.

My point was never to show that heterosexuality is "just as limiting as not being heterosexual", which is actually the reverse point of the original list I guess from your viewpoint. My point is that the list fails at its original intent by not including how gender roles negatively effect heterosexuals as well, or even really pointing out the source of the privilege. I don't understand this overreaction and defensiveness about who suffers more. That's not the point of what I've been saying, but for some reason it's incredibly important to so many people. If the point of the list is to say that gays generally have it harder when it comes to issues that deal strictly with sexual orientation, then it really is a useless list, since I don't know anyone who thinks otherwise. Even if you're against gay marriage or "the gay lifestyle", why would you care if they have it harder? It's their fault for having a deviant lifestyle in your eyes.

[justiceischeap]

55. Like to point out a flaw in your argument

* She's pregnant and chose to raise a baby on her own.
This is the closest you come to anything that could possibly be interpreted as an 'advantage' of being gay. She would not have gotten pregnant (making a few reasonable assumptions). And yet we still see that it was her choices that got her there.
Sorry but I don't think that cuts it as far as showing how heterosexuality can be just as limiting as not being heterosexual.

It's been a while since I've been a sixteen year old girl (or however old she was when she got knocked up), however, most of the lesbians I know fooled around with guys 'cause it was expected or we put pressure on ourselves to be "normal." So, it's very likely that even if she were a closeted lesbian, she still could have gotten pregnant. Hell, I married a man (*gasp*) before I was willing to admit to anyone other than myself that I was gay.

You can add that to the list:
Heterosexuals don't feel the pressure to be something other than themselves when it comes to picking a mate.

[Realityhack]

81. I am aware of that tendency.

That is the reason I put in the parenthetical note on 'reasonable assumptions'.
I didn't want to get into an argument over how often that happens etc. so I kind of glazed over it.
Sorry if I gave the wrong impression.

[susanr516]

40. I am a straight female reared in a fundy family

and you're wrong. When I walked away from the fundies, it cost me any type of close relationship with my family, but I never worried about losing my job or being harassed by people I didn't know because I wasn't a fundy.

[MellowDem]

42. Umm...

how does that make me "wrong"? I never said anything to dispute your personal experience. Lots of straight people worry about just those things though for not being a fundy. Atheists, pro-choice, you name it, I've seen many of those cases. I'm glad you haven't had to deal with that. Maybe you meant you never had to worry about losing your job or being harassed for being straight? Well, I agree that is definitely more of a worry for those who are gay than those who are straight.

[Ohio Joe]

33. Really good but missed one

I do not have to worry about being beaten and killed because of my orientation.

[proteus_lives]

36. I'm holding quite a hand.

I've got white priviliage, male priviliage and now heterosexual priviliage. I guess my low cards are non-Christian in America and a wild card. What should it be???


Seriously though, there is a element of truth to this.

[Realityhack]

38. +1 n/t

[Vidar]

43. Good post. Recommended.

[muffin1]

50. A great night to be on DU!

This is the second brilliant post about the plight of the GLBT citizens in this country. I thank you very much for taking the time to post something this (hopefully) thought-provoking.:hug:

[bluedawg12]

51. Good post! Thanks! n/t

[county worker]

61. Question: Is someone to be guilty of something because others treat them in a certain way?

I never understand these kind of posts. Is it that the heterosexual is guilty of something bad or is it a compare and contrast of heterosexuals and homosexuals?

We all get the mistreatment that gay people have to put up with. Do we need to show that others don't put up with it to get a deeper meaning? Or should those that don't get mistreated start mistreating each other?

I have empathy for gay people and what they have to go through. I think this "privilege" thing is counter productive.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

64. I disagree. it is important to recognize the privileges that we each have.

We all have privileges to some degree, be it Christian, White, Heterosexual, Able, Sufficient Income, Male or Youth, etc.

Recognizing these privileges helps us build empathy for those around us. Having privileges doesn't make you a bad person, but we should be aware of it.

[Terran]

67. The purpose of 'these posts'

is to increase empathy, if nothing else. So if you read the entire OP and thought, about even one of the items, "Oh, I never considered that", then your empathy is increased. They're only counter-productive for people who think empathy is a bad thing, IMO.

[county worker]

68. In a way I find these posts offensive but that isn't important.

Here at work we have to do 4 hours of diversity training so we can understand the plight of the illegal immigrants we treat and to have empathy for them. I find that offensive. I don't have the slightest problem with illegal immigration or a bilingual society. But it is assumed that since I am a white male I need the training.

By the privilege posts the same kind of broad brush is used. That is offensive.

[FreeState]

69. Dont you think its a good idea for everyone to have diversity training?

I dont think it would be a good idea for management of any work environment to exclude people from training because they are already on board. How would they make sure the employees dont need the training?

[county worker]

72. I am offended by the idea that I need diversity training. I would wait until someone

demonstrated a need for traing before I would make them take it.

[Toasterlad]

74. "I never understand these kind of posts."

Honey, you need diversity training.

[Terran]

70. In my experience

even the most progressive/liberal people sometimes need some help understanding or relating to other peoples' issues. I understand what you're saying, because these are a somewhat in-your-face way of accomplishing that, but if you understand that there's nothing inherently directed at you personally, it pretty much takes away any basis to be offended...especially if you acknowledge the basic truth of what's being asserted.

I was once acquainted a man whose progressive creds stemmed back to the early 1960's and the Civil Rights Movement. He was a board member for a progressive advocacy organization I was employed by at the time. When my state had an ballot initiative to outlaw same-sex marriage, the board voted to oppose it publicly...and this man resigned from the organization because of that vote. I saw his written response to the affair later, and in it he stated one of his reasons (paraphrasing) was that 'gays don't need to marry because they all have plenty of money already'. The guy had just never faced up to these issues, wasn't prepared to start now, and really didn't know anything about them at all.

So, as you may guess, I feel that education is paramount. If you feel offended, try to remember what it's all about. It's not there to offend you.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

62. Further, I am not the punchline of a joke because of my sexuality.

SNL does this for at least three or four times a show. The entire joke is "OMG, he's gay!". And you have to think "If this were happening with the exact same actions but between opposite sexes, it wouldn't be funny at all. Therefore the joke is "haha, he's gay."

I actually did this exact project in my Feminist Class. For my Privilege I picked "heterosexual" and "christian"

[lisa85]

63. good post n/t

[Strong Atheist]

77. Welcome to DU!

:toast:

[liberal mikey]

75. Directed to this thread by my straight, liberal, gay-friendly friend......

....Her response upon reading was "OMG I had never even thought about that...". So...thanks for the post. Anytime there is open honest discussion about these issues, progress is made.

[Strong Atheist]

78. Belated Welcome to DU!

:toast:

[Beam Me Up]

79. +1 and welcome to DU!

:toast:

[muffin1]

80. Hey babe!

I never see you here. :hi:

Mikey's straight, liberal, gay-friendly friend Muffin1