financial attack on the capitalistic system by means of shorting?

[Coes]

Hi,

I actually got out of bed for this question. It was too much of a shock.

My question is:"Is is possible for a terror-group ( or any hedge-fund if you like ) to start a financial attack against the ENTIRE capitalistic system by means of an attack on our system banks?" Not to make money, but to destroy the very system itself, that is.

[On the Road]

1. Against the US,

it would take more money than any terrorist group has. And if it did not work, they would probably lose all their money.

[DJ13]

2. Certain Arab countries have the money

[Coes]

4. so what is going to stop them?

There are Arabic groups out there who are interested in destroying the Western Capitalism at this very moment, not?

We are leaving the back door open here people!!!

[Coes]

12. that was so in the past, but what about this very moment?

hi,

Stocks are down somewhat like 40% compared to the end of last year, including the system banks. This is a major buffer that we have lost. So even if we weren't vulnerable for such an attack a year ago, we don't have that buffer anymore. Do you still feel totally comfortable with the current situation? What's your opinion about our CURRENT vulnerability?

[On the Road]

14. If There is a Danger from Shorts,

it won't be from terrorists. They loom so large in political rhetoric it's easy to forget what Mickey Mouse outfits they are.

If there is a danger, it will be from speculators as a group. George Soros had enough money to launch a run on Indonesian currency, but neither he or any other individual can take on the US.

Plus I believe the temporary restrictions on short selling are still in place. I don't think a run on bank stocks is allowed.

[Coes]

22. temporary restrictions were abandonned just last week

on october 8th that was.

SEC announced it on october 3th. See Reuters article

Where is the safeguard for our systembanks against such a run on stocks? And where is the buffer to sustain such an attack, and regain confidence?

[On the Road]

27. Thank You. I Had Forgotten the Dates

I do think the SEC and Treasury are on a hair-trigger and will be quick to jump in with further action when necessary.

Shorts are a general concern, but not from terrorists and not from Arab governments. And I doubt the Feds will allows them to cause serious problems until the crisis passes.

[thunder rising]

3. This was an inside job made possible by deregulation of the financial trading.

The corps knew they could extort the money 10 years ago, so they played the game to create the crisis.

[earth mom]

5. You need to figure out who the REAL terrorists are-the ones in Washington DC that are already

terrorizing ALL of us.

Just who do you think is responsible for the financial chaos we're experiencing right now? It ain't no arabs from the middle east, that's for damn sure.

[Coes]

6. but are the governments' plans that drastic?

Okay, the government wants us to live in fear, but they don't want the capitalistic economic system to entirely crash.

But what about a coordinated attack on one of the major systembanks? AFAIK, if one falls, it's a domino-effect, and where is it going to end?

[razors edge]

7. For what purpose, at this point?

To speed along the inevitable?

[Coes]

9. I live in the Western Capitalistic System

and I want to keep it that way. We rely on our system banks. If they fail, the economy gets very very crippled.

And at this very moment, our system banks are vulnerable, and if we get the domino-effect of failing system banks, how can we stop our financial system from collapsing?

[razors edge]

11. What if it is designed to fail?

“I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.”

Thomas Jefferson 1802


This is not a new concept, by any means. You may prop up the system a tad longer but you won't change the final outcome.

All it will accomplish is the delay of the starting point at which we retake the responsibility and control of our own futures.

[Coes]

16. Jefferson is absolutely right.

And we are at such a point already, that the banks have control of us. That's probably why you quoted him, I would say.

My problem is that in our current financial model, we rely heavily on banks, and we cannot even function without our system banks. I totally don't care about those greedy regular banks of which the CEO's, and let them fail I say.

But I don't agree about letting our system banks fail. That's the very thing what happened in Iceland: two of their three major system banks have collapsed, and they now WITHIN JUST A FEW WEEKS have a national deficit 12 ( twelve! ) times the size of their entire GDP. see article at The Guardian

If we don't protect our system banks, and let them fail, and we go down the same drain as Iceland, and our National Debt explodes, where will that lead us?

[razors edge]

18. It's not in our hands to stop it.

Governments have limited tools to work with in the matter.

Borrow.

Inflate.

Blow the hell out of anyone with the express and clear intentions of stealing their resources and or influencing others who might threaten your position.

Do both and call all it all something more impressive and hope it sticks to the wall. Enhanced Leverage of American Investment to Secure the Twenty First Century, or some other such nonsense.

It is not some choice of letting it fail or not. It has failed.

Personal skills will become more valuable in the new "Economy".


Edit to add the blow the hell out of folks option.

[razors edge]

17. Houses built on sand tend to fail.

I refuse to live in fear, it is bad for your health and generally makes you an undesirable person to associate with.

I could say I see this ending very badly with mass death and destruction for the American people, that wouldn't help anything, now would it? And it shows a severe lack of faith in the resolve and abilities of my fellow Americans.

I would guess you are under 38, college educated, in debt for loans and underemployed. I'm a 44 year old high school drop out, former Marine, former homeless, and making six digits+ and other than a mortgage on a $50,000 house from hell, I have no debt. I don't expect my situation to last forever, nor do I fear it going away. Life goes on till it doesn't.

I would rather go out on my feet, than my knees.

[Coes]

23. pleased to meet you actually!

yes, you are right. I am under 38 ( just 34 since october 6th ), and I have a somewhat higher degree, but that won't give me access to a job that would mean that I can sit on my ass all day: I am one of those who actually makes real stuff at my company. I do have a job right now, but the reorganisation is only a week away.

And I am trying with my wife to start the next generation of my family line. And I hope to give my child an improved version of the very life that I am enjoying right now: live in a safe and prosper environment, get a decent education, lots of love and care from the family, a decent job to look forward to, and an honest workingmans' payment.

I was close of dropping out of school as well some day, but then I ended up during summer holidays, at age of 16 or so, working on a dump. Yes, the dump, the real thing. I was driving the tractor that transported the grinded dump all of the garbage people made, to the pitt it was collected in. It didn't take me a month to open my eyes, and realise that it was better not to drop out of school. So I refocussed, and became the person that I am today.

'Life goes on till it doesn't.' It's a very nice saying, but it is not good enough for me: life has to go on for the next generation as well.

[razors edge]

28. Good luck with family plan.

I wish you all the best.

I also wish that for everyones sake they would just wipe out all the Student loans for those who haven't found a job in their field of study.

Call it a national security thing, that will get the votes for approval.;)

[razors edge]

8. You got that right.

This has been going on for a long, long time.

Responsibility for this culling of the heard will be diverted at all costs. Same shit, different times.

[htuttle]

10. All it takes is rapacious greed and selfish irresponsibility to explain the current situation

Hardly need theories about 'terrorists' to explain what happens when Capitalists Run Wild...

:eyes:

[wvbygod]

13. George Soros has that covered...

See: George Soros, "The Capitalist Threat"

[Coes]

24. found it, and I have a remark

"With the demise of communism, the present state of affairs, however imperfect, can be described as a global open society. It is not threatened from the outside, from some totalitarian ideology seeking world supremacy. The threat comes from the inside, from local tyrants seeking to establish internal dominance through external conflicts. It may also come from democratic but sovereign states pursuing their self-interest to the detriment of the common interest. The international open society may be its own worst enemy."

This text pre-dates 9/11. Isn't that the day that we found out that there indeed is such a thing as some totalitarian ideology seeking world supremacy?

[Ichingcarpenter]

15. This was on Faux Noise...... Is this where you heard it?

By Gov. Huckleeybee.

I heard it there last week.

[Coes]

20. LOL, but no

I never watch fauxnews, and I don't visit their website either.

The issue about failing system banks just came to mind, I have been reading and informing myself about our economic system lately.

We have two different types of banks, and one of those types is a minority in number, but they are vital to our very daily functioning. System banks is where Wall Street meets Main Street, in a physical manner. Both Streets will suffer very badly if the interconnection collapses.

In the current economical system that we live in, we need a healthy interconnection between Wall Street and Main Street. We also need a healthy political interconnection between those two, that's where Obama is needed, but that is not enough. Especially not now, Bush is still the sitting-duck-but-nevertheless-still-president.

[Ichingcarpenter]

25. Bullshit I saw it on Fox and I can get the tape... and trace

the Governor's story to a right wing fear Fascist.

[Coes]

26. sorry, I misunderstood you

The 'LOL' was about the insinuation that I would watch fauxnews.

[gravity]

19. No

To short stocks enough to destroy the financial system, you will have to have a shitload of money to do it. I am talking on the order of magnitude of a trillion dollars. There will also be smart money taking the other side of that bet, because it will create a good value for the stock, so it will stabilize.

The only way that shorting can bring down a company is performing poorly and has to issue equity to raise capital. For the most part, the stock price doesn't affect the company the operations of the business itself, so it isn't going to destroy the system.

[Coes]

21. yes, shorting can bring down a company if performing poorly

and what have our system banks been doing lately?

Do you agree with me that the Western Economical System is very interconnected? The collapse of a futile ( in world measures ) bank in Iceland has caused several problems in the UK: the UK has seized the assets, Iceland is going to sue the UK, Gordon Brown himself is also considering legal actions against Iceland, UK politicians are even accusing Iceland for significantly increasing the financial crisis. Several communities within the UK had their entire payroll on that bank, and are now unable to pay their staff. And we are just talking about a very very futile bank here, this is not one of the major players.

And with Stocks down as much as they are right now, do you think that it is possible for banks to issue equity, in order to raise capital? Do you know about Belgian bank Fortis, who did that very same thing, and their stocks went down 20% poof? That would in normal circomstanced maybe not that difficult to overcome, but stocks are already down 40% and more compared to last year. How much of a buffer is left at this very moment?