Are we being softened up for war with Iran here at DU.....

[Rebellious Republican]

I keep seeing stories popping up more and more these days in LBN about those barbarians that "W" and Uncle Dick want to kill. I seem to have noticed more and more seemingly innocent stories of people who have knowingly and without any regard to the consequences for breaking the laws of their country, having to face harsh and extreme punishment.

With full knowledge of the consequences of breaking known laws, are these true human rights abuses, or are we being softened up by questionably motivated posts to win our hearts and minds here at DU? Could this be flame bait, could this be propaganda, could this just be fodder for other issues, could this be divide and conquer tactics being used on us for the up coming war with Iran or are these true human rights issues?

Just a thought.
RR

:shrug:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

1. Are you being deliberately obtuse?

With full knowledge of the consequences of breaking known laws, are these true human rights abuses, or are we being softened up by questionably motivated posts to win our hearts and minds here at DU?

I assume you're referring to the recent story of people being stoned to death for adultery. Or for being gay.

I can assure you that EVERY reputable human rights organisation in the WORLD considers these to be violations of human rights.

[cornermouse]

2. But does that give us cause or a reason to attack them

or to launch yet another front on this "war"?

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

3. Stop changing the subject.

You asked whether these were human rights violations. How can they NOT be human rights violantions? The fact that some neoconservative fucktard wants to use them as an excuse for war DOES NOT change this fact.

[cornermouse]

17. I may not approve of what they do in their country

(actually I don't approve of what they do) but it is their country not mine and I just don't see anything justifying going to war with Iran. As far as I'm concerned it's not about human rights as much as it is whether I want to go to war with them because I disapprove of the way they run their country. Answer: I don't.

[Rebellious Republican]

4. No I am actually not being "obtuse", I could not sleep and questioned

some articles such as this one http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3171334&mesg_id=3171334. Seriously, the young man broke the law four times, its not our law, but it is the law of the land in his country. He obviously had to know what the consequences would be. As a matter of fact in his country, the third time would have been punishable by death, so he was given a break by their standards.

I am just seeing an an inordinate amount of stories that all point to Iran. If you do a quick google, you will find as many harsh punishments for as many strange laws from around the entire world in very democratic or free thinking countries. However the only ones I am seeing here at DU in LBN focus on Iran. Just a curious observation, thats all.

I do see stories concerning genocide and other atrocities from many places in LBN, which have nothing to do with breaking laws. Is this the best that can be used as a reason for attacking Iran. I mean are we being felt out to see if these would be considered serious enough human rights abuses to drop bombs on innocent women and children?

How many stories in LBN do you come up with that are from the other 193 countries around the world regarding their harsh laws?

:think:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

5. Well then you're cherry-picking.

These stories come up all the time in relation to many countries, not just Iran.

How about Saudi Arabia?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3321637.ece

Oh, but they *pardoned* the woman who was convicted of being raped. Good for them!

Or Afghanistan?

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5ir_nVfK4lypJtUCo37h_LjjpicWQD8ULB47O0

This kind of shit happens all over the place. It's not specific to Iran.

[Rebellious Republican]

6. Great links to sites outside of DU, I agree very similar.

As I said, if you google you will find many stories from all over the world.

What is the ratio of stories regarding Iranian laws being broken as opposed to other countries appearing in LBN here at DU lately?

[sendero]

7. Last time I checked...

... invading a country that is no threat to you and causing somewhere between 500,000 and 1,000,000 people to die is not exactly an example of moral leadership.

Iran sucks but they are pikers in the scheme of things, as was Iraq.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

8. Paranoid much?

I'm sure it's Karl Rove, from his secret bunker, trying to convince a bunch of people on an internet discussion forum. Because that's... pure, evil genius.

[Rebellious Republican]

12. Wow dude or dudette, you were making somewhat intelligent

observations up to this reply. You digress to rambling at this point, well, keep up the good work defending your position with such blather. Have a nice day, its off to earn a living for me. I will check back later for more great and insightful replies such as this one.

:eyes:

[TZ]

15. okay

Bush is responsible for mistreatment of women all over the world? Yibbehobba's response was tempered by your idiotic refusal to see reality. There are a whole bunch of African countries that treat their women like crap. IS that the CIA trying to justify invading for oil/blood/diamonds/sawdust or whatever.
This thread gets my vote for dumbest of the day/week

[ixion]

10. Or how about the US

why, just yesterday the UN and Amnesty International attacked the US for human rights abuses and torture.

[left is right]

9. While I would disagree about DU pushing an aenda to demonize Iran

I would go along with you that the M$M follows this maladmisistration's agenda of "all war-all the time." They focus primarily on Iran but seem willing to broaden to include any Muslim state. That being said, States controlled by fundie Muslims are some of the most repressive and harsh in the world. Religion and government is a bad mixture.

[Rebellious Republican]

11. No, don't misunderstand, I am not saying that DU the website

itself as whole, is pushing the agenda to demonize Iran. We all know that we get occasional visitors, trolls, operatives, freepers, what ever term you would prefer, that post sysop type propaganda here. Nope, that is just what I am pointing out, that it seems the number of those type posts on this particular subject have risen here.

Great observation on the rest!


:toast:

[LWolf]

13. If there are human rights issues,

that does not make the logical response a military response. Military action brings human rights abuses with it as a matter of course.

I think it's okay to recognize a violation of human rights without beating war drums. I also think that human rights abuses, whether real or "spun," make great fodder for war propagandists.

It's our job to see past propaganda.

[dmosh42]

14. The split is not among DUers, but the Dem leaders!

Over the last year or so, this site has posted hundreds of commentaries urging impeachments, prosecutions or other procedures against the Bush administration. But to no avail. The Dem leadership is hopeless and useless for some unexplained reason. We heard about how the "swamp" would be drained, but it's still full.

[JerseygirlCT]

16. This manichean view of the world, especially as regards foreign

policy, is what's troubling.

We don't need war with Iran. That said, the rulers there - they theocrats - are dangerous, bad guys. They don't have to be less bad in order for us to avoid another unnecessary war.

The "known laws" you're speaking of are imposed upon the people by a theocratic ruling "gov't" that simply overrules any democratic reforms there. They're culturally based, and usually very restrictive of individual rights - particular women's rights. Being "known" does not in any way make them less wrong.

The thing about Iran is that the more we (the US) push, the more the extremists gain power. When we've let them be, and worked toward civil relations, the democratic forces gain power. It was Bush's stupid talk about axis of evil that started this latest round of trouble. They want very much to be seen as accepted parts of the world community.

Makes you wonder why it's been ok for us to cultivate normalized relations with China all these years (another gang of not so nice guys) while it's somehow evil to try to find some detente with Iran?

[earth mom]

18. I think people are being softened up for acceptance of DINOs that are really rethugs.

Oh look, Obama's giving us "hope". Oh joy, oh boy! :eyes:

It's ALL hogwash.

The status quo is in place. H & O will carry out the plans that the corporations & elite powers that be already have in place.

War with Iran? NO doubt.