In light of the latest betrayal by "our" pols in DC, I ask the people here who

[T Wolf]

spout the "never not vote for a democrat" line,

Is there any line a democratic politician could cross that would make you not vote for them?

[AndyA]

1. What are the other options?

If it's allowing a Republican in that seat, the Dems will always have my vote.

I'd rather elect a Dem being investigated for a crime than have a hypocrit GOPer in that seat. At least with the Dem, you know what you're getting. With a Republican, they would vote against their own best interests if it furthers the party agenda.

Just ask Larry Craig.

And countless others, who will cut off their nose to spite their face, if the GOP demands it of them. Who the hell wants someone in office who won't even look out after their own personal best interests?

[redqueen]

9. This is why the two-party system has us fucked.

Now, which candidates propose changing that system... hmmmm

[JackRiddler]

15. Exactly the reverse.

With the Republican you know what you are getting. This is obvious.

With the Democrat, you only know most of the time - that is, if you always assume they will betray their promises.

[OzarkDem]

27. Replace them with real Dems

work within your local and state party system to hold them accountable and replace them at the earliest convenience.

Learn to make your local and state party structure work for you. The progressives helped get these people elected, raised money and turned out the vote. Its time to wield your power within the party structure and remove them if necessary.

[rucky]

2. this line:

_____________

ok, how about this line?

_______________


this is it!

________________


this one?


_________________


That does it! Cross

_____________________


this line, and


_____________________


I'll never

____________________

vote

___________________




















Ok, this one!
_________________________

[cali]

3. This is your line? LOL

This stupid meaningless vote, counts more than votes against funding the war or restoring Habeas or criminalizing War Profiteering?

Yikes.

[T Wolf]

6. No - the question was "IS there a line?" This vote was just indicative of

the lack of action on progressive issues.

How about another vote to give the POS more war powers?

Or a bill to expand the domestic spying?

Or any of a thousand issues?

My sense in reading much that is posted here goes something like, "Yeah. I'm disappointed. But I still will always support the Democratic candidate because they are better than any republic."

How do you expect them to act like Democrats when you always reward them (with votes and dollars) for acting like republics?

Just wring your hands, hope that NEXT time they do the right thing, and continue to do the same thing.

That is the definition of insanity - expecting change from them without making any change in your behavior.

[cali]

7. OK, but what if you have, as I do,

a Senator who has been voting against IW funding, wrote and sponsored the Habeas Restoration Act, voted against the IWR, wrote legislation restricting the sale of Cluster bombs to Israel, wrote and sponsored the War Profiteering Act, yet voted for this piece of crap? Should I stop supporting him?

[NoPasaran]

4. Well, "my pol" is the idiot Cornyn himself

And if you want to know what I think about him, you can read it right here.

And as far as my Presidential candidate goes, I notice she voted Nay.

[onenote]

5. which betrayal are you referring to specifically? the cornyn resolution?

If so, I'm thoroughly disgusted by the Dems that voted for that resolution. And I'm going to be letting my Senator, Jim Webb, know how I feel. But if I had to choose between Webb and George Allen again tomorrow, I'd still vote for Webb.

[Virginia Dare]

8. I could see the hypocritical self righteous rethugs in Virginia..

beating him up over this and probably getting some traction out of it unfortunately.

I don't agree with his vote, but I'm not going to beat him up over it either, it's really not that important in the scheme of things. Anyway, this is probably the best thing that ever happened to Moveon.

[T Wolf]

10. From the few responses, I take it that no Democrat could ever do anything

that would cause a DUer to withhold their vote.

If that is the reaction of this "leading liberal" site, there is absolutely no hope that "our" politicians will ever really take a progressive action. They can continue to flock to the right so that the "middle" will accept them. They can safely count on their base.

That is good to know.

[redqueen]

11. It's the two-party party. The politicians win.

And the public loses.

Ain't it great?

[Virginia Dare]

12. What if you are a liberal who lives in a right-leaning area?

where the only Democrat who has a hope or a prayer of winning anything is by nature a "moderate". What should you do then, just not vote, because they're not progressive enough for you?

[T Wolf]

13. Virginia - and everyone else. Will just ONE person answer the god damn

question? And I will repeat it...

Qualifications and excuses and questions-back-at-me aside, is there anything a Dem could do, or vote for, that would cause you to withhold your vote?

And if there is not - how do you expect to get them to do anything you want them to?

[Virginia Dare]

14. Okay, fine..

if the candidate was running a dog fighting ring and burned, electrocuted and/or stomped dogs to death, I would not vote for them...:eyes:

I don't expect candidates to be 100% pure, I guess that's why I'm not living in constant disappointment.

[JackRiddler]

16. The U.S. is running such a dog fighting ring

It's called Abu Ghraib.

Its creation was facilitated by a great many votes from Democratic senators and House members.

[Virginia Dare]

20. Okay, you got me..

I will never vote for another Democrat again, long live the Rethuglican Party!!!...:sarcasm:

[JackRiddler]

21. argument by forcing it to the extreme

I didn't say you should never vote for another Democrat again.

[Virginia Dare]

22. argument by forcing it to the extreme..

If that is the reaction of this "leading liberal" site, there is absolutely no hope that "our" politicians will ever really take a progressive action. They can continue to flock to the right so that the "middle" will accept them. They can safely count on their base.

That is good to know.


You said it!

[JackRiddler]

23. Fascinating.

Half of the Democrats in Congress just told the leading part of the liberal blogosphere that has supported them (a large part of their "base") to FUCK OFF.

And the shocked response within within that liberal blogosphere... is turned on its head as though it was the offense.

Those poor, poor Democrats. They only voted for this resolution, which they were forced to do by the taser-wielding Republican mob, and now they have to actually sustain criticism for it?

Terrible!

[Virginia Dare]

24. So, you're telling me that's your line that's been crossed..

that's fine, it's not mine. So I guess I'm just a DLC enabler. Shame on me.

[JackRiddler]

25. Honestly?

My line was crossed with the USA PATRIOT Act and the Iraq War Resolution. At the latest.

After the brief hope of 2006, it was crossed again when enough Democrats agreed to continue financing the war, betraying their election promises and, oh, continuing their criminal complicity in war crimes.

The right person could make me say otherwise. Gore perhaps.

Certainly not Hillary Clinton, who got my vote in 2000 and used it to help establish the present regime.

[Virginia Dare]

26. See, I don't get you people who are now giving Gore a pass..

and not Hillary. They are cut from the same cloth. Gore is out of politics and now free to say and do what he wants. Perhaps he's changed, and that's good, because I wasn't overly fond of him (and much less so of Lieberman) back in 2000, but I voted for him, and I don't regret it one bit. Perhaps Hillary has or will change too. She's certainly not my ideal candidate, but if she's running against a Romney or a Giuliani, I will vote for her with no regret.

You're trying to look at something in a black and white (or line in the sand) way, and I simply can't look at it that way. I need to keep everything in perspective.

[JackRiddler]

29. This is simply untrue.

I don't trust people who don't say what they want. Perhaps that's the problem, that you are willing to grant politicians some kind of leeway. It's why everything's always wrapped in layers of lies, it's why we repeat the same shit for decades. Gore saying what he wants has resulted in a transformation. He can't go back to pretending he didn't say these things. He spoke out early against the war and against the dismantling of the constitution. Even now Clinton has barely done either.

[Marrah_G]

17. It depends on the position they are running for

Have to look at the end game and what it is you need to accomplish.

[mdmc]

18. if someone more qualified then the dem candidate

I always vote for the best person for the job.
If the dem is incompetent, then they will just shame the party once they get in office.
Vote for the most qualified, the one that represents you the best.

[mdmc]

19. take, for instance, my local mayor race

My buddy was the endorsed Dem candidate. He was challenged by a radical black activist. The radical black activist won the dem primary.

My buddy is still on the conservative party line. He is also on the Independent line.

And there is a Republican.

If my buddy is the best candidate, then I will vote for him on the CON line. Or the INDY line.

Just cause someone secures the dem line does not make them the best candidate.

[halobeam]

28. lying us into a war would be one thing for sure.

actually, most things this administration has done, if a democrat did these things, I wouldn't vote for a dem.

[Generator]

30. Here's your elephant in the room

I've never felt this way before but now I get it. It's the not vote at all option-certainly you can vote for local issues-as that is something that can affect your life immediately-school, library etc, or even mayor.

But there is a reason a majority of Americans don't vote. You are looking at here on this site. When the opposition isn't one-it becomes a farce.

I wonder how many people are going to feel motivated to vote for some of these Democrats again. I actively will seek to not vote IF that's the only dissent I have. It's damn personal and when it comes down to it-I don't know how I'll feel when the time comes. But honestly since the Democrats have made EVERYTHING about 2008-I really am considering writing in my own name and fuck them. After the horror of the last two elections-I can't hope or believe anymore. My only self power is to say-no-fuck your ambitions for president. How about you act like a citizen first? Then maybe I'll vote for you again.

My vote is mine, I will not be blackmailed anymore into voting for the lesser evil that is just another letter.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

31. Thank You For Your Concern.