Stop crying, Oasis singer tells British troops in Iraq

[ECH1969]

Noel Gallagher of the British rock band Oasis has told soldiers fighting in Iraq to stop complaining when they get wounded.

The chief songwriter and lead guitarist said Tuesday troops loved getting involved in war-zone action until they get hurt.

"You get a million people walking through Hyde Park -- 'don't send the troops' and all that.

"The troops want to go, all they want to do is fight! They're soldiers. They're loving it, until they get shot -- then they're claiming compensation." If you're bothered about getting shot -- here's a thing -- don't join the army."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20061121/wl_uk_afp/afpentertainmentbritain_061121132054

[PsN2Wind]

1. Walk it off

says the guitarist and songwriter. Kind of a Toby Keith type.

[Nikki Stone1]

2. Tell darling Noel to trade in his guitar for a gun and get his ass out there

Piece of shit.

[Dr Fate]

5. Why? I dont agree with his tone, but that would be against his entire point.

His point is that if you dont join up and then "get your ass out there" you wont get shot.

I dont care for his blunt wording either, but your response to his point makes no sense.

[LittleClarkie]

7. I think it's this bit right here that bothers me

I was just fine with his sentiments until "then they're claiming compensation."

What the hell is that supposed to mean? Don't ask for help?

[Dr Fate]

14. I agree- but it still does not make sense that he should sign up himself. n/t

n/t

[LittleClarkie]

35. True.

Kneejerk response, I reckon.

[bliss_eternal]

11. Made sense to me.

He's an asshole. "Voluntarily joining" or not, he's got no right to make light of what they are experiencing. The don't join up argument seems a right wing talking point, and I really hate seeing it here.

The fact is they are there now, suffering with little support from our government--and no end in sight. Only a heartless piece of shit, with little understanding of the issues or facts could make light of that.

[Dr Fate]

That does not explain why this guy should have to sign up himself.

"If you dont like combat, then dont sign up" is now an anti-Draft DEM talking point too-it is not just on the GOP side, BTW.

And it still does not make sense that someone who makes these comments should have to fight himself.

You may disagree with what he says- that is fine- all I'm saying is that it is a senseless retort to say that he should have to sign up for combat when he is saying NOT to sign up for combat.

It's a small point- I just thought it was a silly retort.

[bliss_eternal]

20. Right.

Guess that's why you've countered so many on this thread that think he's an asshole. Nice way to say,"small point."

[Dr Fate]

28. Oh-I think he is an asshole and a bad song-writer. It was still a lame retort to his comments.

You can try to make this about me all you want- but saying that someone who says people should not sign up, should sign up themselves- it just doesnt make sense.

You said it did make sense, fair enough, but I still dont see it.

[bliss_eternal]

31. Nope. You attacked a person that was trying to say

he's full of shit--and you defended him. The argument you claim you are poking holes in doesn't make any sense.

[Dr Fate]

40. Attacked? I allowed him or anyone to clarify the retort that he should "pick up a gun."

Why should someone who is telling others not to pick up guns have to put down their guitar and pick up a gun? that is what i asked. it was not an attack or an accusation.

Despite anything else he might have said, that retort still doesnt make sense.

[bliss_eternal]

61. Why should they clarify it.

Noel Gallagher is not a member of this board. He's not a Democrat running for office. Your need to defend him makes no sense.

Anyone that is mocking someone else's life should walk a day in their shoes--in other words, pick up a gun. Nothing wrong with anyone here saying so, either. All you've done is argue for the meritless judgement of others. Newsflash--that's not a progressive value.

[Dr Fate]

63. You dont. But you dont have to attack me either. Either answer the question or dont.

But you did clarify the point with the follwing paragraph- so thanks for that:

"Anyone that is mocking someone else's life should walk a day in their shoes--in other words, pick up a gun. Nothing wrong with anyone here saying so, either."

Of course there is nothing wrong with someone saying so- nothing wrong or against progressive values in me asking for clarification either.

Thanks.

[bliss_eternal]

65. That's all they said to begin with...

with their comment...how you didn't see that makes no sense at all.

[Dr Fate]

68. I was trying to find out more about what those posters thought.

I was attempting further, detailed opinions & discussion of the OP issue at hand, as opposed to merely being accused of not supporting the troops.

[bliss_eternal]

70. You don't get people to share their thoughts by calling them

names, and insinuating that their thoughts are silly.

One asks questions. Which you did not do. You made insinuations and assumptions and defended Noel Gallagher as if you know him personally and were offended that anyone would dare insult him.

:wtf:

[Dr Fate]

73. Oh BS- I was never offended by anyone except you and your personal attacks.

I challenged the notion that Noel should have to pick up a gun when he said that he is against such thngs.

I was not in least bit offended- just curious-I would have challenged that notion no matter who it was being said against.

Peace

[bliss_eternal]

79. All you did was argue for people blindly judging others

without taking the time to walk a mile in their shoes first.

[Dr Fate]

82. Actually, that is the conclusion we came to-not the argument I made.

Which is why I asked the questions and opened myself up for opinions in the first place.

I was not arguing for having to walk a mile to have an opinion or arguing that you should not have to walk a mile , just questioning why another poster felt the way he did.

Peace

[bliss_eternal]

85. I call bullshit on that.

All of your contradictions and backpedaling are there for everyone to see.

Peace.

[Dr Fate]

88. What contridictions and backpedaling? Please provide the post #s.

I asked questions, made comments, accepted some answers and comments as valid, and asked futher questions and made further points.

[Nikki Stone1]

81. Hey Dr. Fate, my real life interfered with my net usage tonight, but I'm back baby!

Bliss-eternal gave a great interpretation of my response. You don't make fun of people who put themselves on the line without walking a day in their shoes, especially when the best you can do is create mediocre music and you're wearing shoes that might be a whole month's salary to some of those guys.

And in terms of the politics, you and I know that a lot of the "volunteer" military are there because they couldn't afford higher education without it. Lots of kids go into the military to get job skills as well because social services are often abysmal. I'm sure Britain since Thatcher hasn't been terribly kind to the poor and working classes either. So for a little whiny singer to bitch because soldiers are getting their legs blown off and are shockingly! asking for some kind of compensation for their lost limbs and things just frosts my cookies.

I am a proud progressive and I stand for the rights of those soldiers to voice their opinions and to get medical care and other compensation. Little Noel, on the other hand, sounded like a right winger on the rag.

[bliss_eternal]

83. ...and people defending him sound the same way to me.

:hi:Nikki Stone1. Well said.

[Nikki Stone1]

87. Hey bliss!

Thanks for gettin my back on this one.

[bliss_eternal]

90. Anytime...!

:hug:

[Nikki Stone1]

96. Thanks.

:)

[bliss_eternal]

98. I always appreciate posts

where people advocating walking a mile in someone's boots before passing judgement. :thumbsup: Your's was a good post, and I appreciated seeing it. I have a relative in the military, too--so I understand.

People slamming comments like yours--advocating for such mindless judgement really burn me.

best,
bliss

[Nikki Stone1]

102. Appreciate the kind words

:)

[Dr Fate]

91. Just so you know- I was never attacking you. I'm sorry if you thought I did.

I'm not sure why you needed anyone to have your back- I was only asking for clarification for your comment.

I see what you meant about Noel, but I'm still not sure I agree with the GENERAL notion that you have to be a combat vet in order to say things about them that some may find disparaging.

It would have been great if there could have been an honest discussion of your notion as opposed to all the sniping and attacking.

[Nikki Stone1]

95. Ok. I didn't think you really were. You just had a different take

I have a problem with folks who give veterans a hard time. My uncle was in Vietnam and was exposed to Agent Orange. I get steamed when penny-ante pop pricks start running their mouths about injured soldiers.

[Dr Fate]

84. Thanks for the sensible answer- and thanks for not attacking me personally. n/t

n/t

[Nikki Stone1]

89. Well, did you at least have a good time?

:)

[Dr Fate]

92. Always do- but I would have rather discussed your views w/o the attacks. n/t

n/t

[Nikki Stone1]

93. Which attacks?

?

[Name removed]

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[Subdivisions]

56. Yep. He needs to put his skin in the game. Put up or shut up...

[qnr]

99. He is putting up. He's saying "Don't go." and he is not going. n/t

[Dr Fate]

103. You crystalized some of my thoughts on this "issue"

What you said about that comment is what I have trying to express on this thread...

I was not even taking a position on whether he is right or not- he is certainly not tactful one way or the other...

I dont agree with taking pot shots at the troops (These are Brits in any event)- but I also dont like the notion that you have to be a soldier to say one thing or the other that some may find disparaging about soldiers...

[qnr]

105. I understood what you were saying from the start. I might not agree with what he is saying, but he

certainly is being consistent with his philosophy, and he's just as entitled to an opinion as anyone else.

[tridim]

3. I didn't need any verification that he's a massive asshole,

But there it is.

[Shakespeare]

24. Exactly what I was thinking. n/t

[Hav]

4. .

I think most won't read past the subject line and I'm sure that many will miss the points in the article. Yet, his reasoning is still kind of respectless in my opinion.
I'd say he has something against the war and is vocal about it in his usual manner, being a jerk.

[Richard Steele]

6. Am I outta line for thinking that Noel Gallagher can go FUCK hisself?

Seriously, Noel: you are obviously too damn DUMB
to have an opinion on this. I'm sure that EVERYONE
hopes you aren't claiming to be on "their side", after
a comment as beehive-porking STUPID as that.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

10. What a bone head.

[Dr Fate]

13. His tone could be more polite- but what was incorrect about what he said?

He basically said that if you dont like getting shot in a war zone, then dont join the army as opposed to complaining about it.

With all the talk about how the army should be "all volunteer" so that it is made up of people who "want to be there" -I would think more would be in line with his take on this.

[bliss_eternal]

15. There is more to people joining than you seem to realize.

Frankly, your lack of support for what our troops are going through is disturbing. The argument is the same one you can hear any day of the week on right wing talk radio stations and Fox news.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

16. The right wing argument I hear every day is...

"Frankly, your lack of support for what our troops are going through is disturbing."

The right wing argument I hear less frequently is:

"Oh yeah, well shut up and join the Army!"

[bliss_eternal]

18. Let's be clear--my support for the troops is working to bring them

home. Got that? Do a search under my name and see how few right wing talking points you find.

But the last thing I want to see is someone basically blaming them for what they are enduring. That's bullshit.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

39. I'm sure you do.

And there was only the one talking point.

[bliss_eternal]

42. You misunderstood...

But thanks for calling me a rw-er. So nice of you.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

45. Oh, I'm not calling you a RW.

Just using their talking points. Err, point.

I'll just assume you got angry and irrational. You know, like Michael Richards.

Personally, I think you owe Dr. Fate an apology.

[Name removed]

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[Dr Fate]

50. Personal attacks and "you dont support the troops" is easier than answering pointed questions.

I was honestly asking for clarification on what DUers found particularly offense and why- as opposed to just "he is an idiot"- which is something we already know.

[bliss_eternal]

53. I wasn't talking to you...

unless of course the person I responded to and you are one in the same.

[Dr Fate]

57. And I was not talking to you in that post. I was responding to post #52 n/t

n/t

[bliss_eternal]

86. Then why are you flaming me,

one that is defending one that shared that sentiment(of shut up and pick up a gun)--and in doing so seeming to defend the guy that said the oppposite?

Contradict yourself much?

[Name removed]

25. Deleted sub-thread

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[Richard Steele]

33. What was WRONG is this:

QUOTE:"The troops want to go, all they want to do is fight!"

This statement makes the rather RIDICULOUS assertion that
every soldier approves of the illegal invasion/occupation
of Iraq, and is eager to take part in it.

When, in fact, the vast majority of military personnel joined
the armed forces with the expectation "to protect and serve"
their own nation, and only a very few true psychopaths joined
because they were eager to kill random strangers in an illegal war
created to boost the profits of a chosen few multinational
corporations.

[bliss_eternal]

36. Thank you for stating so beautifully

what I could not. :hi:

[Richard Steele]

41. I _DO_ have my moments.

You're welcome! :hi:

[Dr Fate]

44. Now that makes sense. That generalization is moslty wrong.

"kill random strangers in an illegal war
created to boost the profits of a chosen few multinational
corporations."

I doubt to many troops ever get to that point one way or the other-pro or con- but I think you are correct to say that he was over-generalizing.

[spoony]

106. Perfectly in line and right on

I have no idea why the press still records anything this washout says.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

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[bliss_eternal]

26. Apparently you didn't see Fahrenheit 9/11...

:eyes:

[kenny blankenship]

30. people can make mistakes and still deserve our sympathy and pity

In fact if we limited our pity only to those who do not make mistakes we would rightly be called pitiless. And maybe sanctimonious, and probably a few other terms as well

[bliss_eternal]

34. Great post, thank you!

:)

[Ilsa]

9. Someone, please paint

a large red target on his ass. See how he likes it.

[baby_mouse]

12. Oh, dear.

:rofl:

Cool Brittania's wearing off at last, eh, Noel? tut, tut...

silly sod.

[rinsd]

17. Thanks Noel. Hadn't heard from a self important douche like yourself in all of 5 min

[Warren DeMontague]

19. Oh, are they still alive?

Funny, last time I heard one of their shitty songs, it was on like an AT&T commercial or something.

They've always pretty much sucked, IMHO.

[bliss_eternal]

21. Best response to this thread, yet.

:rofl:

[JeffR]

22. Noel's a well-known idiot

but if he's trying to say that the occupation of Iraq is bullshit, then I agree with him. If he's saying something else, then I'll just say, "Cor, mate, mind if I have some o' that fookin' Jack Daniels and a line or two? And by the way, shurrup."

[Hav]

29. .

Only these parts of the article are relevant:

"Blair made an almighty cock-up going to war in Iraq," Gallagher told The Sun newspaper.

"You get a million people walking through Hyde Park -- 'don't send the troops' and all that.

"The troops want to go, all they want to do is fight! They're soldiers. They're loving it, until they get shot -- then they're claiming compensation.

"If you're bothered about getting shot -- here's a thing -- don't join the army."


I agree with the poster above who found the thing about "claiming compensation" too strong. I don't agree with the tone and some things are too harsh. On the other side, it's the same reasoning I've seen often enough here on DU on threads about another dead soldier whenever they found out that this soldier was heavily supporting the war.
So yeah, when he is a jackass for talking like that about injured soldiers, then some of us are as well for talking like that about dead soldiers.

[JeffR]

43. Point well taken

I have a longtime fondness for Oasis and a longtime conviction that the Gallagher brothers are either dumb as rocks or have medicated themselves to the point where they might as well be. But yes, "an "almighty cock-up" pretty much describes Iraq to a T, both for the Iraqis and for the British and American troops stationed there.

[Chomp]

23. I don't mind John Lennon

or Thom Yorke or Bruce Springsteen getting political. Their talent and wonderousness buys them a lot of wriggle-room in my book.

But when you suck as enormously as Oasis do, you should have a bit of humility about it and keep your piehole shut.

Nobody is listening to you Liam (least of all, on your records).

[Lerkfish]

27. hm...how many guitarists have to face bullets?

I"m guessing the percentage is rather low.

[Dr Fate]

32. None. He seems to admit that. That is his over-simplistic point.

He says that if you dont like getting shot in combat, then dont sign up for combat.

A rather simplistic view to be sure, but I'm not sure how your retort counters it.

[bliss_eternal]

38. There you go again...are you related to Noel?

That would certainly explain your incessant need to defend him, and his idiotic comments. :)

[Dr Fate]

51. No- but personal attacks are apparently easier than adressing pointed comments.n/t

n/t

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Dr Fate]

58. I didn't think that saying someone has a silly argument or retort was a personal attack.

It is quite not like saying "you don't support the troops" just because someone asks a few pointed questions. That is what Rush etc. does.

Perhaps you are right- I should have just kept saying that "it does not make sense to me" instead of using the adjective "silly"- my apologies to anyone who took my question as an attack or personal insult.

[Name removed]

59. Deleted sub-thread

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[Lerkfish]

108. well, I guess you prefer your own conclusions on what I meant.

Instead of asking what I really meant.

I meant, as he said, guitarists don't face bullets. Since I"m a pacifist, I'm saying being a guitar player is preferable.
I was reinforcing his point that soldiers by definition will face bullets at some point. Guitarists at some point will face little or none.

:shrug:

[RandomKoolzip]

37. "LoZoccolo, call on line 1."

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

46. This guy has always been an asshole

And Oasis is not only overrated, they flat out suck.

Hey, let's just do the same melody over and over and over and over in every song for ten years except we'll use strings, look like geniuses and get proclaimed as better than the Beatles or U2.

STFU, Noel.

[baby_mouse]

52. THANK YOU!

I HATE OASIS.

[Casablanca]

54. Depends on the type of soldier.

There's the gung-ho type that signs up out of what George Carlin eloquently calls "dick fear" and a desire to work out their destructive impulses on "darkies" that they have no connection with, and therefore no hesitation in killing.

Then there's the people who sign up out of misguided but honest intention of defending their country or providing for their family or some other non-homicidal pursuit, and consider war just a necessary chore to be performed in as humane as way as possible.

Noel should have made this distinction when he mentioned "the troops". If some Animal Mother in a tank laughing and listening to the "Burn, mf'er ... burn." song gets his arms blown off by a roadside bomb after murdering Iraqi civilians for the fun of it, my support for "the troops" isn't going to compromise my concept of karmic justice.

[brentspeak]

60. Learn how to make good music, the People tell Noel Gallagher

Guy's an idiot.

[TheFarseer]

62. Stop the presses - Noel Gallagher is an Asshole!

I'm shocked, I tell ya, shocked!

[Greeby]

67. A Gallagher brother opens his mouth and spews offensive bile?

Wake me up when something new happens :boring:

[Maiden England]

71. Well I'm not defending him but...

At least when I lived in the UK, recruitment drives for the UK military were no where near the forced drives of the US, where in many small towns and inner cities across the US, joining the military is either the only way out, or the only way to pay for school. Even though the UK military will pay for school, the education system is heavily subsidised by the government, and I know that has been changing, but when I was in school 5 years ago, that meant free tuition, my local council covered room and board and I could 'borrow' money from the government with the interest rate set at the rate of inflation, and I didn't have to pay it back until I was earning money at a decent living wage. I'd reckon there is a lot higher percentage of kids in the UK army who are there because they want to be there, rather than because its a means to an end. I know when I lived there, many people choose to make the military a career, rather than a stepping stone to one, and it has always been highly regarded as an honorable career to choose.

Of course that doesn't excuse him from being an ignorant pig, but it may shed a little more light on the fact that the brits in general don't have the same perceptions of the US as far as military issues are concerned.

[Generator]

72. Getting shot?

What an ass. He should check out (though I doubt he can READ) National Geographic-oh yes just for the pictures this month. It's not about getting shot. It's about having your limbs torn off and your head ripped apart, losing your basic identity even. The pictures are horrific, one guy has no legs and one arm. And there is this picture of this kid who looks like a child to me-with no legs and a head injury. Why do those that have the most-freaking rock star wankers-have no compassion? Yes, compensation-that's a lot of blow off his lousy ass.

[Sugar Smack]

74. Who's "Oasis"?

[Ksec]

77. Big Babies???.

Noel needs his ass kicked for this. I suggest one of those troops give him a proper ass whoopin.

[lateo]

100. What a wanker.

Just a wanna be beatle anyway...who cares what he thinks.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

101. and to think this gnat compares himself to Lennon...

he's not fit to lick even ringo's shoes

[ForrestGump]

104. John got shot

What's this little f***wit waiting for with regard to completing his futile desire to outdo Dr Winston O'Boogie?

What a doofus he is, not that this fact is exactly breaking news.

[phrenzy]

107. Not totally incorrect...

Well, I think he's partially right. There are some people who join the military because they want to 'kick ass' and go over and kill arabs, etc. But many (if not most) are doing it for other reasons entirely.

[kiki]

109. Fuck you, Noel.

As if I needed any more reasons to hate you and your sickeningly overrated, lame-ass college rock band. Grow the fuck up.

I once saw Noel's brother and bandmate Liam describe Oasis as "the only band that has" what he articualtely referred to as "uh", a short guttural grunt made with the tongue pushed inside the bottom lip in a manner not unlike what schoolchildren use to perform cruel impersonations of brain-impaired people. This was presumably meant to refer to some rockin', balls-out quality of rockin' rockin'-ness.

Well Liam, I grew up listening to US hardcore bands like Minor Threat, Black Flag and SNFU, and if you'd heard these bands, I think you'd have to reluctantly agree that compared to them, the sound that more accurately sums up Oasis is more akin to that made by a six-year-old girl who's had a worm dropped down her dress.

[KG]

110. score one for Oasis!

:eyes: