HARRY REID should make clear: VOTE CONSCIENCE = VOTE "YES" OR FILIBUSTER

[Leopolds Ghost]

The reality is that most of the senior Dems in the senate (with the prominent exception of MIKULSKI?) are currently throwing in their lot
with Kerry. I am all for confirmation votes being votes of conscience. That is a time honored tradition in the senate and is the only ethical course of action.

But nevertheless, a serious filibuster attempt is being mounted. Under such circumstances,

ONE CANNOT IN GOOD CONSCIENCE VOTE "NO" ON ALITO AND "YES" TO CLOTURE.

Dems who do so are nothing but scabs and should be treated as such for the term beginning in 2006.

An organization incapable of punishing scabs is an organization that has no solidarity.

DEMS WHO DO NOT WANT TO BE TREATED AS SCABS AND PUNISHED ACCORDINGLY ON THIS IMPORTANT ISSUE, AS OLYMPIA SNOWE OR HER ILK SURELY WOULD ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE, MUST VOTE "YES" TO CONFIRM ALITO OR ELSE VOTE "NO" TO CLOTURE.

Those are the only two options the Senate leadership should be tolerating. The alternative is to make themselves look like fools whose members -- Senators who have no problem risking a meaningless "no" vote on Alito himself -- are willing to vote "yes" to cloture simply to say "fuck you" to half the senior leadership.

A vote of conscience means "YES" to Alito and "YES" to cloture
for reasons of conscience (or representing a conservative state)
or else "NO" to both. Those are the only two acceptable options.

And the Democratic whip shouldn't be the only person taking names on who crossed the picket lines on this fillibuster.

Only actual Alito SUPPORTERS get to cross the picket line. Anyone else should be severely punished, at least in the short term 2006-2008, for being a scab. Their chance to win folks over in private (please don't filibuster, we need money for Louisiana, Bush'll win anyway, etc.) was last week.

Pass it on.

[mom cat]

1. There are several other options:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x260594

[Leopolds Ghost]

2. You must understand what I am saying. Any Democrat who votes "NO" + "YES"

is a SCAB and should be treated as such by the party leadership.

That is the point of my original message.

"No on Alito, Yes to Cloture" is NOT a vote of conscience, it is
a big "fuck you" to the Democratic leaders who have chosen to
throw in their lot with Kerry. And it is not justified by their
beliefs on the relative merits of the nominee. Remember, just
by voting NO to Alito they are invoking extraordinary circumstances.

They can't have it both ways. Anyone trying to have it both ways is a coward and a picket-line crosser and should be punished.

Anyone who has not pledged their vote for Alito should be prepared to filibuster, abstain, or else be denounced as a dishonest and selfish scab and be punished accordingly in 2006-2008 session.

Don't think the Repubs would do anything different if say Snowe or Chafee supported a Dem filibuster. That is how functioning, successful organizations maintain solidarity -- consequences for deceitful behavior.

Remember, Dems who oppose Alito are already WILLING to tell their constituents they voted against the man. They are not afraid of being labeled an opponent of Alito!

If they FAIL to abstain or vote "no" on cloture then they are a SCAB attempting to curry favor with the Republican leadership in an effort to consolidate power for the center-right wing of the Democratic party.

If they vote "yes" to cloture they MUST be prepared to vote "yes" to Alito AS WELL and face their constituents accordingly, or else face the wrath of the party leadership for crossing the picket line to defeat the filibuster.

THEY CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS.

I can't believe this isn't blindingly obvious.

It is not a question of how they choose to permit the filibuster (whether by abstention or voting "no" on cloture). As Robert Mitchum said, "Dead or alive don't matter tho' I reckon dead WOULD be easier."

It is a straight "YES OR NO" vote, just like the Republicans asked for.

Either you support the filibuster (by abstaining or voting no on both counts)

....or you support Alito (yes on both counts.)

Those are the only two options that should be available to Dems who want a future in the 2006 Senate.

[mom cat]

4. I agree. When this is over, I will be doing some re-assessing.

Right now, I just want to focus on winning, as do you.
Keep up the fight!

[Leopolds Ghost]

5. Thanks! :-) n/t

[Leopolds Ghost]

3. No comment? Geez. This is relevant whether or not the filibuster succeeds.

If you can't distinguish between slimeballs and red-state DINOs who honestly think they are representing their constituents by supporting Alito flat-out, then how are you planning to punish the slimeballs if you can't articulate that "no + yes" voters -- Senators opposed to Alito who nevertheless want to see him confirmed -- are scabs seeking to undermine their own Senate leadership who will be punished in 2006?

There are plenty of polite ways of going about this.

The simplest way is to say -- "if you don't support the filibuster, either abstain or vote to confirm. "Yes on cloture" is "Yes to Alito".

"Anyone planning on casting their vote against Alito is hereby on notice: There are no conscientious options other than "yes - yes" or "no - no" which the Senate leadership will entertain going into the 2006 session.

Anyone actively opposing the filibuster supports the confirmation, and we expect them to go on record accordingly if they want to justify actively opposing the filibuster."