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DemonGoddess Donating Member (364 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-13-06 05:03 AM
Original message
Have a question about NAIS
how will this program impact the small farmer/breeder? I already have opinions of how it will affect the average horse owner, but am curious to know how it will affect everyone else as well. Thanks!
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riderinthestorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-23-06 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
1. Check out this thread in GD
Boy did I get hit with a load of horse shit although the guy defending the program was supersensitive and wouldn't dialogue!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=480866

(Sorry I couldn't get the link to work)

Do you have a horse?



:hi:
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Jeffery Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-03-06 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. It's about time!
I think it's about time we had something like NAIS. If everyone kept good records, there'd be no need for it, but everyone doesn't keep good records.
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hipneck Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-14-08 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. It should be called NA(z)IS
Then you either don't know much about NAIS, or you hate small farmers. It is a HUGE privacy invasion and painful expense with little likelihood of any positive impact.

If you are concerned about food safety, look at the CAFOs, not the little family farms and hobbyists.
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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-27-09 03:28 AM
Response to Reply #2
7. For those that think that NAIS is good, they haven't thought about it for a minute.
NAIS is weighted towards big corporations. The regulations allows one batch of factory farmed chickens to be "Virtually" tagged, meaning a label stuck on the door of the coop, where the chickens spend their entire lives. The RFID tags are never used on the animal, saving thousands of hours of labor, cost and equipment for the large producers.

However, if I have a flock of chickens, I need to tag each one. That means buying the equipment, tags, software and take the time to ensure that all this data is backed up and maintained. Hate to say this, but I live off the grid, and dealing with free range chickens is easy if you don't have to capture them and stress them out.

OK, so say that I am sold on the idea that "Knowing" where every animal is raised on earth is a good thing. Now I have to account for lost birds, and maintain the database. Meanwhile the Knapweed is getting ready to flower and needs to be mowed, but the mowers broken and needs repair. Or maybe an irrigation line needs repair, or maybe a nest of ground squireels has found it's way under the slab of the barn, etc.

Personally, I think the NAIS is just another way to discourage more small farmers from actually farming. The Big Agribusiness can afford the equipment, and the manpower, while the small farmer is more diversified and subject to crop failures and losses. Plus, if the NAIS goes through, it would be mandatory. That means that you cannot sell your chickens legally to anyone. Now personally, I don't raise chickens for others. I'm the one that gets the honor to feast on fresh eggs, and the delicious bird that spent it's very short life enthusiastically foraging for food while I tended the crops, or chased happily behind the mower for insect, converting these things into nutrients for the soil. But if I wanted to sell them, maybe to afford that Mower part that broke, I would be in violation of the law without all of the paraphernalia that goes along with NAIS.

As I recall, the major push for NAIS was after they Bush Administration claimed that Al Qaeda cropdusters were imminent, ready to spray some horrible pathogen. Well, that like story didn't pan out, after all, the farmers are already spraying enough nerve gas on our crops to kill the city of New York. So the next push for NAIS was becuase of avian Flu.

This beauty of Opinion Shaping uses the lame excuse that Wild Birds fly in and infect poulty farms. When one looks at the data, all outbreak of avian flu occurs within a small radius of Confined Animal Feeding Operations (CAFO's) It was found that the horrifyingly crowded and unsanitary conditions of these CAFOS was contributing to high mortality and disease, so they we dumping antibiotics into the feed by the bucketfull. Meanwhile, they never bother to clean up the shit, so the birds walk around in their own, antibiotic laced excrement. When they do clean up the shit, they feed it to the Fish in Factory fish farms, and mix it into the cattle feed. What else are they going to do with mountains of this stuff? Sell it to you as Chicken Manure when it is laced with Antibiotics? Well, yes, they do.

The Avian Flu has now been found to riginate within these factory farms, and it is tracked out into the wild by the workers on their footwear. I maintained a small flock of birds during ther heyday of Avian Flu. I was totally alert, and when neighbors chickens died unexpectedly, I was on top of it, notified the officials, and was promptly left in the dark. The local officials weren't concerned. Then I stumbled upon a book regarding this topic, I wish I could remember the name, but it outlined most of what I related above. I have done much research on this, and do not buy in to the NAIS program. It is an invasive regulation that removes our right to grow food without onerous paperwork, and extra cost and labor. I have enough work to do on my farm. I don't need any more. I can keep track of my birds on a piece of paper and a pencil. I don't need to RFID device implanted in my birds.

Considering the debacle recently where thousands of pounds of meat was contaminated at the "Value Added Processing Plant" where they marinate the salmonella and E. Coli deep within the pores of the meat along with the marinade, RFID would serve no purpose. They don't label GMO's, so until then, I would not even consider anything as insidious as NAIS.



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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-04-06 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
3. I am not happy about this.
Horses? Why? I have 7 and will have chickens and goats when I get moved out to the farm. I can't see the reasoning behind this. Maybe for large corporate farms who profit from not keeping records but for small farmers?
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achtung_circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-16-06 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. A large farm, that doesn't keep good records?
That's an oxymoron. You don't get to be a large farm without keeping lots of accurate records.

"If you don't measure it, you can't manage it" Temple Grandin
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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-27-09 03:36 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. Your right, but I can do it with pencil and paper
I don't need to pay for the transportation chain as well as growing the crop.

They have pencils and paper to. They would even get my signature too, but I guess an RFID tag is just so much more cool than a stupid farmers signature.

I have seen how complicated they want to make farming. It's like being a doctor today, some used to love it, noe they think it's like like the rat race due to HMO's, big pharma, and for profit corporations.

Why must we complicate everything to the point of being unsustainable and a chore to accomplish.

For those that are for NAIS, they obviously have been sold on the less that 40 years old Corporate way of farming. I deal with agricultural systems that are hundreds of years old, and I don't need RFID to identify my product for some idiot 3,000 miles away.
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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-05-09 03:42 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. The New Fear Ploy is African Horse Disease and Contagious Equine Metritis
Please check out http://www.animalagriculture.org/annual_meeting/2009/ScheduleOfEvents.htm and see what the Big Boys in agriculture are doing to us.

It was researching the ANIMS system in preparation to public comment and found these guys at the NIAA. This group looks like the Go To group if you want to seell more test kits, Animal ID tags, and the software to keep track of them. I'm sure most of small members of this group see nothing wrong with the scope and mission of the NIAA, but I see a very sophisticated Opinion Shapping tool created by Agribusiness to preach the gospel of Corporate Agribusiness.

There is absolutely no representation of older, proven agricultural methods, because what people don't know, is alien and scary to them.

I have yet to see Vilsacks Keynote speech at this confernece. I'm kind of afraid to see it, especially since I's like to see Obama once take a stand or position on GMO's, CAFO's or Factory Farming.

He hasen't, I'm disappointed, but it makes me prepare for the GMO disaster that looms ahead.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-20-06 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
newfie11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
9. Here is the information from NAIS
Animals Not Needing Identification



Animal identification is recommended for animals that move into commerce or marketing channels.

Recommended:

Animals that are moved from their farm, ranch, or boarding facility to locations where they "commingle", or come into contact with, animals from multiple/other locations (Examples include -livestock auctions, feedlots, or fairs)
NOT Recommended:

Animals that never leave their farm, ranch, or boarding facility, even if they move from pasture to pasture within that location

Animals that never leave their farm, ranch, or boarding facility other than when they "get out"

Animals that are moved directly from the farm or ranch where they were born to custom slaughter

If animal identification is not recommended for your animals, you may still want to get a premises identification number (PIN). By obtaining a PIN, you will receive timely information about disease events that could impact your animals. Signing up for a PIN does not obligate you to participate in animal identification or animal tracing

http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/animal_id/not_need_id.shtml

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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-05-09 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Please define "Get Out"
I saw that too, but couldn't find/didn't look for a definition of it.
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newfie11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 04:47 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. I can only give my thoughts as I didn't write this.
In ranch country where I live the term "get out" would mean the animals have got out (escaped) of their fenced areas on their own. Not let out on purpose.
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