Dogs & Chickens ?

[bvar22]

Hi All,

We are putting the finishing touches on our maximum security chicken house, and hope to have 10-12 birds within a month.
We would also like to have a dog, but are concerned about the stories of dogs and free rangechickens not mixxing well. I have experience with training dogs, but these are our first chickens.

Are there any dog breeds that are known to be better with chickens than others?

Any suggestions or advice?

Thanks!
:hi:

More info on us and our place here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=246x5729

[gateley]

1. Just kicking this -- I hope you get some good advice. nt

[terip64]

2. From my experience the dogs, goldens, labs, will go after the chickens.

I would go for an electric fence around the coop. We are in the country so raccoons, coyotes and foxes are also an issue, although that's a more of a night issue.

[terip64]

3. I just looked at your garden and OMG!! It is beautiful!

I won a fight with my husband and we are all organic now too, but geez, our garden was overrun with weeds. I spent hours weeding and still lost the fight with my strawberries this year. I am going to read up on the square foot gardening idea. Thanks for sharing. I am showing my husband your pictures!

[bvar22]

8. Thanks.

We were very happy with the garden. The Raised Boxes/Square Foot worked out well, though we are going to give almost everything more room between plants next year.

The garden is slowing down now, but still producing tomatos, beans, and gourds.
The raised boxes did help with weed control. I think that the windbreaks were beneficial too.

We used some pieces of black plastic sheeting (6mil) on the walkways between the boxes. We moved them every 2-3 weeks to control weeds in the walkways and perimeter. The black plastic is not pretty, unpleasant to walk on, and seems out-of-place in an organic garden, but it is effective. Nothing grows under the black plastic, and it easy to move around to trouble spots.


We had a late season infestation of Squash Bugs that hurt the Pumpkins. We are thinking that a few chickens will be able to deal with this next year.


Good luck with your garden.

Bob

[Bjornsdotter]

4. Not sure which breeds

...but my uncle's Springer Spaniel used to run over to the farm next door and steal chickens. It was not a good thing.

thanks again for your wonderful advice on gardening...we are going to implement many of your ideas and suggestions next year.

Good luck on your quest for the right dog.

:toast:

[Arkansas Granny]

5. I don't know which breeds might be best with chickens. My folks

always had a few free range chickens around the place and we always had dogs (all of them were mixed breed). The dogs learned as pups that the chickens were not to be chased and we never had a problem.

[morningglory]

6. Get them at the same time. Put the dog's night time dog kennel right

by the chicken coop. They will pay no attention to each other, unless you get an incorrigible breed of dog (bird dog). I had a walker hound. He was lovely with the chickens. Would romp through the flock about once a day just to watch them squawk and flap up in the air, with an air of joie de vivre. He was like a sibling to them.

[Arkansas Granny]

7. Yes. It's pretty much a matter of conditioning. It would probably

be more difficult with a breed whose specialty is hunting birds, but I think if you started with a puppy or young dog your chances of success would be much greater regardless of breed. I suppose that part of it would depend on the temperament of the individual dog, also.

[bvar22]

11. Thanks, AG.

Your reply is reassuring.
There is talk of a "meeet-up" in Ft Smith in the Arkansas Forum.
Maybe we will have the chance to meet in person. :hi:

[Arkansas Granny]

14. I hope it works out for you.

I think a meet up sounds like fun. I'm looking forward to it.

[bvar22]

12. Thanks.

Your advice is reassuring and confirms what I know in my heart about dogs.
After the chickens are established, we will be shopping for a puppy (Australian Shepherd or Border Collie).

Bob
Arkansas

[LWolf]

9. My australian shepherd is great.

I don't know if this is true of herding breeds in general.

I had some free-ranging hens when I brought her home as a puppy. The hens were bigger than she was, and she was bonding with me; the sound of disapproval if she showed too much enthusiastic interest in the chickens stopped her in her tracks.

For the first 6 months at home, she was in a dog run while I was gone during the day, and at my side the rest of the time. When we'd finished her training, socialization, etc., she had the run of the place, with the hens, and never bothered them. Every once in awhile I'd look out and see her "bathing" a hen, who would stand still until she was done, and then walk calmly off. I called her off when I saw that happening, and she realized that "bathing" was off limits.

Today, I have 6 hens, 3 roosters, and a dozen 8 wk old chicks running wild on the 6 acres; I need to clip their wings so that they will stay in their yard/coop/orchard, lol. She has never touched one. The chickens will follow me, scratch, and do their chicken stuff with her by my side, never turning a feather.

I don't know if it's the herding instinct; she'll help round them up enthusiastically, but doesn't chase them for fun. She has no interest in "catching" them. It might be that her single-minded focus on/bond with me helps, too. I'm the head of her pack, she considers herself second in line, and if the chickens are part of my pack, they are part of hers too, and she guards them.

I've had to ask my mom not to bring her dogs to visit any more; they chase, catch, and kill chickens. A retriever and a terrier mix.

[bvar22]

10. Thanks.

I read your thread on raising chickens and was inspired by it.

Our general preferences toward dogs favor the Australian Shepherd and Border Collie. We were afraid that a herd dog might worry the chickens to death by trying to keep them rounded up.

Evidently, the early socialization of the pup is more important than the specific breed, though I suspect that with some breeds the biological imperatives would be difficult to overcome.

Thanks again.
From your posts here and in the Gardening Forum, it appears we are walking the same path. :hi:

[NMDemDist2]

13. i'm thinking of adding some chickens too and I have 3 dogs

I have no worries about my aussie mix or my border collie, but am a bit concerned about the Sheltie.

the aussie and border wouldn't hurt a flea, the sheltie is quite a bit more protective. I think if you get a fairly mild temperament border as a pup and the chickens are established you'll have no trouble

[LWolf]

15. You're welcome, and

best wishes with your chicken venture.

I agree that the early socialization is the most important part. A herding dog is not driven to chase, but to control the environment. My aussie knows to leave the other critters alone, but if she sees me moving them, she is exuberant about assisting. The only time she's ever gotten aggressive with an animal is with my ram; I was out in his pasture fixing fence, and he kept trying to charge me. She backed him off several times, and finally nipped him on the nose. She also, for what it's worth, gets along well with cats.

She knows exactly where everybody is at all times, and will charge in and out of the house for every little sound, to chase off the deer, to announce coyotes, etc.. With people, and with other dogs, she is anxious. She's friendly and loving, but does not want anyone anywhere near me. She'll play with visiting dogs as long as they don't try to approach me, and she'll greet people by wiggling enthusiastically and "pushing" on them to move them back if they get closer than about 6 feet. If I'd known how territorial she would be about me, I would have spent more time socializing her with people and out in the busy world. She's never aggressive, but anxious about it.

Both the aussie and the border collie are good choices, if you have the space and time. Both are highly energetic and need an abundance of exercise. The aussie is a little larger, relatively calmer, and has a little more stamina in my experience. The border collie is a little smaller, a little more energetic and intense. Just in my experience.

Let us know what you end up doing! :hi:

[lepus]

16. my black lab was good with chickens

But it involved keeping a close eye on him and punishing him when he started chasing them.

Labs are propably the most trainable dogs in the world. They just want to make their owner happy.

[galledgoblin]

17. eep!

I wouldn't try mixing the two! either keep your dog leashed or your chickens fenced in.

huskies are beautiful dogs, but any dog with a "wolfish/wild" personality will go right for their "tasty snacks".

many dog breeds will not intentionally kill chickens, but they do play and often accidentally break their "toys".

[OnionPatch]

18. This was my experience

I have a shepherd and a pit bull mix. Both were seemingly OK around the chickens and paid them no mind although I never left them alone together. I keep my yard fenced in two areas...one for dogs and people and one for chickens and always herded the chickens into their place when I wasn't around. One day two chickens flew over the fence and ended up with the dogs. When I got home all I found were a few feet, a head and a lot of feathers. I feel positive that what happened was that the dogs were curious that the chickens were in their area and couldn't help but want to play with them. One thing led to another.....

I see from the posts that some people are able to make it work. But in my experience it doesn't. My neighbor bragged that his collie never harmed his chickens. And it didn't for a few years but one day they looked out and saw the collie eating their favorite chicken right on the front porch.

Not saying it can't work, just thinking it's pretty rare and I believe you're tempting fate if you try it.

[LWolf]

19. herding dogs

are fine. They learn quickly to leave the stock alone, regardless of size, and take their guard, sort, and gather jobs seriously.

That's probably why you find herding breeds on ranches whether or not they are actually used for herding--they are safe with the stock.

I live in semi-rural ranch country, and you can find a border collie or an aussie just about anywhere you look.

My aussie has run with chickens all of her life, and has never harmed a feather, or frightened a bird, whether it be hen, rooster, or chick.

[Tumbulu]

20. not my border collie pup, she started eating chickens at 8 weeks old

It took me months to figure out what was happening. I had three wonderful border collies who would never hurt a chicken, but they died of old age and then I got a new border collie puppy. One day I saw chicken feet in her mouth and figured some other animal had killed a hen and that she had found the feet.

After a few months I saw more feet. It took me a long time to be suspicious as my other collies had been so good. But then I saw her chase a hen and kill it so quickly, that it took my breath away. I had to build a fence around the coop and then I had to keep her on a leash when we left our yard. Now at nearly three years old she is settling down and will gently herd the hens.

Some breeds are better, but every dog is an individual and so I suggest being careful, at least more careful than I was.

[LWolf]

21. That's good advice, of course.

My aussie came as a pup, smaller than the hens. She was timid about her place in the "pack," and quickly bonded with me. My disapproval stopped her in her tracks at any point, and she actually, after a few weeks, began to engage the cats and hens, to establish her place with them, as well. I had her in a separate fenced yard in the beginning, only in the house or out where the hens were free ranging when she was with me. After a few months, she'd established a routine and a relationship with the hens, and she finished growing up WITH them.

She leaves the hens alone, but will joyfully chase rabbits, quail, etc.. She knows the difference.

I'd probably do the same with any other dog; keep them away from the other critters, and introduce them only with me as they are socialized and integrated.

[triguy46]

22. My experience has been that the two don't mix well, and its not the chickens' fault.

I'm not sure this is particularly a breed issue as much as a species issue. We kept our chickens in aa very, very large area, but well fenced to keep dogs out. Clipped the flight feathers too to keep the chickens in. Expect some predatory losses with free ranging.

[newfie11]

23. Dogs and Chickens

We have lived on a ranch for 40 years. During that time we have had a German Shepherd, a boxer cross, a lab, a golden/lab cross, a Pom, and now Newfies. It is all in how you train the dog. I don't think it depends on the breed. Yes some have a higher prey drive but training can prevent the problems with chickens cattle, horses, etc. If you have neighbors that is where your dog problem will come from.
Our problem is coyotes and bobcats.
Sherrie
http:chimneyrocknewfoundlands.com

[bvar22]

24. Thanks.

And welcome to DU.
Thanks also to everyone who posted to this thread.
The input has helped develop the current plan for keeping our birds as safe as possible.


:hi:

[yellowcanine]

25. I don't know but I would think that any of the herding dogs could be trained to

herd chickens without harming them. I have seen border collie puppies herd chickens and ducks without any training so it may not be so difficult. Also there are some sheep/livestock guard breeds that might work with chickens - and keep the foxes away also. Great Pyrenees are a popular breed for this purpose.

[MuseRider]

26. My experience.

Not with chickens because I don't have any yet but with Pygmy Goats and my 3 dogs. (Lab, Golden and a very bossy small mutt)

I had the goats out here at the farm for 6 months before our house was done. My dogs would come out to the farm with my husband and growl and menace the goats in their pen and if they were out (we tried them together) the goats would jump, the dogs would start to play, the goats would run and then it was mayhem and I would have feared for the goats if I had not been there. Once we moved I moved the goats up to the house in a 10x12 dog pen with a small fenced yard that shared a fence with my dogs yard. I never tried the experiment again but one night after my son had been visiting and out in the pen I was dozing on the couch when one of the little goats walked in. My son had not closed the door properly. All 3 dogs were inside and he had to walk around them. Apparently he had been inside for a while, there were signs. I discovered that night that being neighbors for 7 months had taken care of the problem. Now I walk them through the pastures and let them graze with the dogs and they never even really look at each other.

Maybe it was a combo of getting used to each other, becoming acquainted and the dogs seeing how much I loved and cared for the goats. It is worth a try anyway. Good luck.

[newfie11]

27. I would stay away from Siberian Huskys

or any dog with a high prey drive. When the chickens are just walking around scratching most dogs are fine but when chickens start running and fluttering around the dogs think it is party time.
They can be taught to leave them alone but it is harder with the above dogs.

[hippywife]

28. We have two dogs.

Both black lab mixes. They will kill a chicken so fast it will make your head spin. We lost six to one of the dogs last year after only having the chickens for a day. The newer lab we just got in March, figured out how to sneak into the pen and killed one yesterday morning. So, there's no way to let them free range around here at all. Not to mention all the hawks, owls, coyotes, etc.

Instead, we built them a chicken tractor and move it around so they can forage in complete safety. :hi:

[cornermouse]

29. Avoid hunting dogs.

Look at the livestock dogs.