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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 05:25 PM
Original message
Would someone tell me the meaning of non-deployed
as in this, thank you


Deaths amongst Non-Deployed: 55,999


The Department of Veterans Affairs, May 2007, Gulf War Veterans Information System reports the following:

Total U.S. Military Gulf War Deaths: 73,846

Deaths amongst Deployed: 17,847
Deaths amongst Non-Deployed: 55,999

Total "Undiagnosed Illness" (UDX) claims: 14,874

Total number of disability claims filed: 1,620,906

- Disability Claims amongst Deployed: 407,911
- Disability Claims amongst Non-Deployed: 1,212,995

Percentage of combat troops that filed Disability Claims 36%

Source:
http://www1.va.gov/rac-gwvi/docs/GWVIS_May2007.pdf
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jimshoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 05:36 PM
Response to Original message
1. That's more than died in Viet Nam
is it not? Also suicides are up something like 42%. And the war ghouls that be want to do it again in Iran. Are our lives so cheap that they are nothing more than grease for the war machine?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. Non-Deployed. You are NOT away from your "home base."
Say you are assigned to Installation X. You get PCS orders there, for two or three years. During that two or three years, you are shlepped over to Eye-Rack a time or two. During those times, you are DEPLOYED.

If you are Navy, or USMC assigned to a vessel, you are NOT deployed when your vessel is tied up to the pier, or operating in the general area of your HOMEPORT (farting around doing shakedowns to test readiness, or doing exercises, for a day or a week, for example). If you are steaming around in circles in the Gulf, or off to visit foreign ports in the Med, the Western Pacific, or anywhere, then you're 'deployed.' If you're on a sub, when you go out for months at a time, you're 'deployed.' If you're with an aviation unit, and your people and aircraft pack up and go work somewhere other than where your orders say you are homeported, you are deployed.

People who are wounded and hospitalized are NOT deployed, too. They're assigned to the hospital if they're gonna be there for a long time. Otherwise, they're TAD from their unit, but they, too, are not "deployed."

The word has an OPERATIONAL connotation. You are 'deployed' when you are away from where your PCS orders assigned you, AND you are performing duty in support of the national defense. Off to a class on how to be a Legal Officer? You are not deployed. Part of the Air Force Bowling Team going to the Armed Forces Championships at the Bowling Alley in Okinawa? NOT deployed. Clearing mines in East Jesus? Deployed. Off to a hellish hot nation to do paperwork for military people who are assigned to humanitarian work in Africa? DEPLOYED. A chaplain sent to Bosnia? Deployed. A doctor sent to Iraq? Deployed. A doctor assigned to Rota, Spain, at the hospital, for a three year tour with his family? NOT deployed.

Probably too much info. If you give me a specific situation, I can give you a specific answer.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Thanks so much
Here's my question what exactly does this mean?

Deaths amongst Non-Deployed: 55,999


Are these deaths soldiers that were in Iraq just not at the time of their deaths?

That's a large number, it has to be as a result of being deployed to Iraq at one time, no?









The Department of Veterans Affairs, May 2007, Gulf War Veterans Information System reports the following:

Total U.S. Military Gulf War Deaths: 73,846

Deaths amongst Deployed: 17,847
Deaths amongst Non-Deployed: 55,999

Total "Undiagnosed Illness" (UDX) claims: 14,874

Total number of disability claims filed: 1,620,906

- Disability Claims amongst Deployed: 407,911
- Disability Claims amongst Non-Deployed: 1,212,995
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KewlKat Donating Member (867 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
4. Per the original source of this data, I found this stuff
SOURCE: http://www1.va.gov/rac-gwvi/docs/GWVIS_May2007.pdf

The Non-Deployed data is annotated as "ERA". You can find a flow chart in the report on their page 2. In the flow chart is says "ERA - Non-Deployed Service Member 8/2/90 - Present.

Now, if you look at the definition in the report of what Deployed means - Active Dute and Activated Reserve Forces Only, 8/2/90 - Present ---- no mention of guard at all.

Also, paragraph 8 on their page 4 gives the following: Some of the veterans identified in this report had prior active military service. Therefore, not all of the claims counted in this report were incurred during the Gulf War period or deployment to Southwest Asia. VBA's computer systems DO NOT attribute each of a veteran's disabilities to a specific period of service or deployment.

Also note:


"These counts reflect raw data that has not been subjected to any statistical analysis nor has it been adjusted in any way to make it a mortality study. There has been no adjustment to account for age, gender, race, and other items required for a valid mortality study. In addition, the data will not reflect deaths that occurred afte March 2007. The use of these data to draw conclusions regarding mortality rates will result in inaccurate conclusions. For analysis of Gulf War verteran mortality, see "Mortality amount US Veterans of the Persian Gulf War: 7- Year Follow-up, "Han K Kang and Tim A Bullman, American Journal of Epidemiology, 2001, 154(5): 399-405.



So, this is really a jumble of data that unless further broken down is meaningless as far as mortality stats.

I'm going to see if I can find the Mortality report I referenced above. If I do find it, I'll come back and put a link here.
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KewlKat Donating Member (867 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Here is what the mortality report says and the source
ABSTRACT:

To assess the long-term health consequences of the 1991 Persian Gulf War, the authors compared cause-specific mortality rates of 621,902 Gulf War veterans with those of 746,248 non-Gulf veterans, by gender, with adjustment for age, race, marital status, branch of service, and type of unit. Vital status follow-up began with the date of exit from the Persian Gulf theater (Gulf veterans) or May 1, 1991 (control veterans). Follow-up for both groups ended on the date of death or December 31, 1997, whichever came first. Cox proportional hazards models were used for the multivariate analysis. For Gulf veterans, mortality risk was also assessed relative to the likelihood of exposure to nerve gas at Khamisiyah, Iraq. Among Gulf veterans, the significant excess of deaths due to motor vehicle accidents that was observed during the earlier postwar years had decreased steadily to levels found in non-Gulf veterans. The risk of death from natural causes remained lower among Gulf veterans compared with non-Gulf veterans. This was mainly accounted for by the relatively higher number of deaths related to human immunodeficiency virus infection among non-Gulf veterans. There was no statistically significant difference in cause-specific mortality among Gulf veterans relative to potential nerve gas exposure. The risk of death for both Gulf veterans and non-Gulf veterans stayed less than half of that expected in their civilian counterparts. The authors conclude that the excess risk of mortality from motor vehicle accidents that was associated with Gulf War service has dissipated after 7 years of follow-up.

SOURCE: http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/154/...


Cause-specific mortality among US veterans of the Persian Gulf War as compared with US non-Persian Gulf War veterans, by gender, 19901997 (Table 2)

ALL CAUSES -

GULF WAR VETERANS MALE: 4,312 FEMALE: 194
NON GULF WAR VETERANS MALE: 5,542 FEMALE: 376


If you want to see all causes then visit the link I sourced.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Thanks
:hi:
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KewlKat Donating Member (867 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-18-07 05:44 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. Since the CBS story regarding suicides has been posted
Edited on Sun Nov-18-07 05:46 AM by KewlKat
I thought I'd add these stats from the above mortality report. THESE ARE FROM 1990 TO 1997:

SUICIDE:

GULF WAR VETERANS:
MALE - 711
FEMALE - 24


NON-GULF WAR VETERANS:
MALE - 817
FEMALE - 42


What I also found odd was the number of deaths by HOMICIDE:

GULF WAR VETERANS:
MALE - 367
FEMALE - 21


NON-GULF WAR VETERANS:
MALE - 418
FEMALE - 27

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fed-up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
6. they don't set up the system to make it easy to extrapolate data that may turn people against war
This is done on purpose as part of the

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/11/15/cbs-news-inves...

Sullivan: We call it the dont look, dont find policy. If the VA doesnt collect the data, then they dont have to do anything about it.

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