Class of Teachers Sues NYC For a Pass Out of Rubber Rooms

[tonysam]

It's about time:


BROOKLYN (CN) - Some 2000 schoolteachers say New York City is discriminating against them by confining them on trumped-up charges in infamous "rubber rooms" until they retire. Rubber rooms are study hall-like places where teachers are paid full wages to do nothing -- sometime for years.

The class of tenured teachers claims School Chancellor Joel Klein is following Mayor Michael Bloomberg's orders: to abolish the public schools' tenure system by firing tenured teachers or forcing them to quit by making their work life unbearable.

Mayor Bloomberg took administrative control of the city's public schools in 2002. The named plaintiffs - Marie Anne Thomas, Leverett Holmes, Josefina Cruz, Brian Salazar, David Pakter and Paul Santucci - all were brought up on disciplinary charges after Bloomberg took over the schools.

They say Chancellor Klein had no educational experience when he was appointed, and was given the job with a directive to abolish the public school's system of tenure, and to either fire tenured teachers or force them to quit by making their work life unbearable.


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[Sarah Ibarruri]

1. Bloomberg is an asshole - I'd like to know who voted in that asshole nt

[virgogal]

2. Uuuummm---the people of NYC.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

3. All voting New Yorkers voted for him? nt

[Smarmie Doofus]

5. No. A bare majority after a 102 million dollar....

... disinformation campaign.

[Dinger]

4. K & R For Exposure

bloomberg is a prick.

[Smarmie Doofus]

6. Rec #5. No lie can live forever. But.....

... the one promulgated by Bloomberg and the anti-union $$$ NYC media that the *union* created the rubber rooms has had an amazingly long shelf-life.

[FBaggins]

7. Can you expand on that?

Where did they come from (I know they're much older than the current administration in NY) ?

I can't come up with a reason why they would exist that fits. Why would an administration do this if it effectively "fires" a teacher without saving a penny since they continue to be paid to sit there?

[tonysam]

8. It used to be teachers were fired for the most egregious offenses,

and in New York the rooms were there for those teachers to appeal those decisions; now the entire system is being abused in order to force veteran or older teachers to quit or retire. THAT'S what the real problem is with the rubber room system. Principals are "terminating" teachers for all kinds of stupid reasons in hopes these people will quit. It used to be fewer than 100 teachers were in those rooms; now the numbers are in the hundreds since Bloomberg/Klein took over.

It's ALL about cutting costs, even if it means subverting tenure laws and regulations to do it. The hearings are expensive, but so is paying veteran teachers until they retire and paying their retirement benefits.

NYC is now going to the revolving door teaching system whereby new teachers last only a couple of years and then are denied tenure to begin with. No muss, no fuss, and they never become vested in retirement.

[Smarmie Doofus]

9. What tonysam said. Plus......

there's a wealth of info at this site:

http://www.rubberroommovie.com/

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

10. So they pay teachers to just sit there?

What do do the teachers do with thier time if they have no students?
Sounds like it's time for the teachers to buy an iPhone or Kindle and try to pass time.

[tonysam]

11. I am not sure what they do. It's possible they are allowed to

have something to pass the time.

The awful thing is few of these teachers are in there for true misconduct (criminal behavior, inappropriate contact with students); more principals are throwing teachers in the rubber rooms on bogus charges in order to force senior teachers to quit or retire. This evidently is under orders from Bloomberg/Klein. Overaged teachers from closed schools, called ATRs, I believe, are also being forced into these places in order for administration to subvert seniority regulations for placement for open positions at other schools.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

12. So getting paid to do nothing is pressure to quit?

I'm sure they'd rather be teaching - that's why they became teachers (no one does it for the fame/fortune). But keeping someone on the payroll because they have tenure and you can't fire them seems like more of a problem for the people cutting the paychecks. Maybe I'm missing something.

[tonysam]

13. Yeah, you are.

You've swallowed the lie hook, line, and sinker that it is impossible to fire teachers, and you think the problem is tenure. You think these teachers deserve everything they get, being unaware of the fact principals have total control over teachers and are NOT held accountable for their actions. Tenure isn't the problem because all "tenure" is is the right to have a kangaroo hearing that's typically rigged in a school district's favor. In NYC, there are so many false cases being leveled against teachers, many of them are being reinstated.


I guess we should just get rid of these shitty teachers. Administrators never do anything wrong.

You didn't read my post above, that these phony terminations are being done to save money by dragging the tenure hearing process out for years on end. Yes, it is a way to pressure senior teachers to quit or retire.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

14. a) I read your post above

b) Please don't put words in my mouth or profess to tell me what I think.
Where did I say anything about "teachers deserve everything they get", "we should just get rid of these shitty teachers", or "Administrators never do anything wrong"? In fact, nowhere have I stated my position to be contrary to support for these teachers. I'm just trying to learn the issue.

Let me rephrase my misunderstanding with the situation...

I see that there is this concept called a "rubber room" (teacher sitting-in but not actually allowed to teach) and assume a teacher is placed there to await some sort of decision or hearing. Naturally, they would collect pay until they were put back in the classroom or fired. I also understand someone with tenure can be fired and all it means they generally get a more fair shake when the disciplinary case is heard - basically, it's harder to fire someone with tenure, especially when they've done nothing wrong in reality. Based off of this, what I'm gathering is that the school is sticking teachers in rubber rooms (likely on false premise) to somehow get them booted and avoid being vested pensions.

now here's where I get lost (and why I popped in to ask a question)...

A teacher (likely tenured in this scenario) is sitting and not working (rubber room). Because they are tenured, a trumped-up BS charge should likely go nowhere and they'll either be teaching again or back waiting in the rubber room. But either way, they're getting paid for doing nothing or getting paid for teaching again. Aside from the inconvenience of a schedule change... I just can't see why getting paid to sit there is pressure to quit. I mean, it's like getting laid off but with a paycheck every week.

[YvonneCa]

15. What you are missing is the number of occurances...

...where this happens. There ARE some bad teachers...and the process was developed to deal with those cases of bad teachers in NYC. But now, in order to save money, more teachers are being treated this way (not just in NYC, but elsewhere). They AREN'T all bad teachers...some have trumped up charges entered against them to stress them out and push them toward the retirement door earlier than they would have chosen.

These 'close-to-retirement teachers' are more expensive for school districts. They have benefits and are at the top of the salary ladder. Two new teachers can be hired if one quits...and the newbies won't get the same benefits.

It's called 'AGE Discrimination.'

[Smarmie Doofus]

16. Well... no. It's really not like that.

>>>>A teacher (likely tenured in this scenario) is sitting and not working (rubber room). Because they are tenured, a trumped-up BS charge should likely go nowhere and they'll either be teaching again or back waiting in the rubber room. But either way, they're getting paid for doing nothing or getting paid for teaching again. Aside from the inconvenience of a schedule change... I just can't see why getting paid to sit there is pressure to quit. I mean, it's like getting laid off but with a paycheck every week.>>>>

When a person is laid off, ( for starters) they get to stay home. Rubber Roomers go to "work"... but it's enforced idleness in an unfamiliar environment in the company of strangers in a ...let's be generous and say... "supervised" environment.. If you're saying "it's not exactly Abu Grhraib", that's true. But the rubber roomers, OTOH, are not engaged in or even suspected of 1. terrorism. 2. insurgency or 3. any variety of prosecutable offense.

They're teachers in good standing who may or may not stand ACCUSED of dismissable but not prosecutable ( i.e. criminal) offenses. Very often the accusations are spurious. Very often they are politically motivated. ( no I don't have a statistical breakdown; perhaps the lawsuit sited further up the thread will force the city to cough up some hard stats about the RR denizens and the historic dispositions of their cases. I do know from personal experience of people who were kept in NYC rr's for months who were later determined to be guiltless.)


>>>>Aside from the inconvenience of a schedule change... I just can't see why getting paid to sit there is pressure to quit.>>>>

More than a few are eligible for retirement; i.e. have 25+ years in and could retire on half-pay. But they still working and thus drawing top salary. It's easy for somebody facing months and maybe years of rr , plus the prospect of mounting and financing a legal defense ( lots of accused find the union of little help and opt for private lawyers to represent them at departmental ... remember: they are NOT CRIMINAL.... hearings) to say "fuck it", I'm 60-whatever years old and I'd rather retire then let this school system kill me."

The city likes this 'cause it's a cost saver and the principal who likely brought the charges likes it as well and for the same reason. ( NYC teachers are paid by the principals now; it's one of Klein's ...ahem... "reforms".)

I hope this helps. It is really a complicated topic and I recommend you google "rubber room: the movie" which has a highly informative website. If you go to the site...make sure to watch the movie trailer.

[tonysam]

17. Trumped-up BS charges are the rule, not the exception, in teacher terminations

I was shitcanned wrongfully, and opted for a "due process" hearing, which included the fact I couldn't have witnesses, the district's principal lied under oath--perjury, my "mentor" lied under oath--perjury, documents were altered, and a potential witness for me, who just happened to be the union's executive director, was bribed with a job working for human resources--the very department which spearheaded my illegal dismissal.

"Due process" hearings are kangaroo courts in almost all circumstances since the hearing officers are paid for by the districts and the unions--same thing, at least out here in Nevada, and therefore you never win them; you end up having to hire an attorney, provided one will take your case on contingency. Then the district drags your case out for five or ten years.

By the way, I was NOT paid when I was on "administrative leave." This was a scheme to get me to settle for a pittance. It didn't work.

[tonysam]

18. Here is a link to a PDF of the actual

lawsuit:

link

[LWolf]

19. I hope they are successful. nt

[Dinger]

20. How About A Padded Room For duncan't, bloomberg, rhee and the rest?

Fucking assholes.