Diebold president writes the NY Times.

[Eric J in MN]

How many misleading statements can you count?

========================================================
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/14/opinion/l14vote.html

To the Editor:

A recent Caltech-M.I.T. study clearly shows that touch-screens are the most accurate and efficient method of voting. The study recognizes Georgia, which uses touch-screens across the state, as making the greatest improvement in voting accuracy throughout the country.

Regarding the cost advantages of optical-scan machines, you do not mention the long-term costs related to printing ballots that are inevitably passed on to taxpayers. These costs, particularly in large cities that require many ballots in several languages, are one of the primary reasons most election officials prefer touch-screens to optical scanners.

Additionally, optical-scan machines are not "far cheaper than touch-screens." Per unit, the cost of optical scanners is about $1,000 more than a typical touch-screen machine.

If the bills in the New York Legislature are more focused on touch-screen voting as opposed to optical-scan technology, it's because forward-thinking legislators are acutely aware of the advantages of touch-screen voting.

Thomas W. Swidarski
President, Diebold Election Systems
McKinney, Tex., March 10, 2005
=========================================

I'll start. Only one optical-scanner is needed per precinct, and so his per unit price comparison is bogus.

[Liberty Belle]

1. Rigged elections or unreliable equipment result in high hidden costs

down the road, when recounts and court challenges ensue.

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

9. Optical scanner: $1,000... Real democracy: priceless

[electropop]

21. Besides, one scanner per precinct is all that's needed.

Whereas you need many TS machines. The cost argument is plain false.

[Erika]

2. And he is sure to respond

that his huge donations to the GOP has nothing to do with his statement that he would do all he could to elect Bush or the functionality of his machines with no need of paper trails.

[Eric J in MN]

26. It was the CEO of Diebold (Wally O'Dell) who said that

he would deliver Ohio to Bush.

This is the president of Diebold.

[Wilms]

3. Eric, I'll second your pan of Swidarski's scam with the optical scan. n/t

[jojo54]

4. I'm not counting misleading statements

All I know is, in manufacturing, you can make the numbers say anything you want. I see the same with these touch screen machines.

[Rush1184]

5. Did he think anyone would fall for that BS price comparison...

"
Additionally, optical-scan machines are not "far cheaper than touch-screens." Per unit, the cost of optical scanners is about $1,000 more than a typical touch-screen machine.
"


Seriously, that is an insult to our intelligence. Who does he think he is fooling?

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

12. Are voting machine firms pricing to maximize profits?

It is hard to believe touch-screen machines are cheaper to manufacture and maintain than Scantron-type scanners. I would love to see their cost calculations because it's easy to manipulate "cost." Is Diebold including, for example, the servicing costs they incur every time one of their touch-screens fails?

Touch-screens may SELL for less, but that does not mean they COST less to produce. "Price" (which is probably what they really are comparing) is completely arbitrary... whatever the seller chooses to charge.

If electronic voting machine companies are part of a conspiracy to fix elections, rather than pure profit-seeking entities, then they will likely price their machines cheaply.

Controling the presidency and Congress is worth infinitely more than whatever profit voting machine firms could earn. Keeping prices low helps Republican-and-DINO-controlled electronic vote-buying machine... I mean, vote-machine buying election directors... justify their purchase. Any conspiracy would seek control over vote "counts." It could always stuff extra dollars into the pockets of the machine manufacturers using other means. (One thing to look for: side payments to voting machine firms, like Diebold. They could operate the voting machine business as a loss-leader that generates Republican goodwill and brings in inflated profits in other businesses Diebold runs.)

("DINO" is Democrat in name only)

[mod mom]

13. Yes, there are kind hearted repugs willing to overlook profit margins in

order to keep their version of democracy low cost. Give them medals of freedom. Their altruism astounds me.

[whistle]

6. Total bullshit, this coming from the guy who told Bush he would

...deliver the presidency to him in 2004. Can CEOs be impeached?

[Boredtodeath]

7. Let's be factual - that was Wally O'Dell

not this guy.

Of course his comparisons are complete BS. Let's just hope the elections officials making the decisions see it.

[whistle]

14. Sorry, I thought it was someone from Diebold

[SophieZ]

15. There are several guys who speak for Diebold.

Walden O'Dell is the Diebold big cheese, he's based in Ohio, which is the parent company.

He promised to deliver Ohio's electoral votes to the president.


Bob Urosevich was the big cheese of the Diebold election division, which is based in McKinney, Texas. (Also brother of a big cheese at ES&S.) He so enraged California's voting panel with his lies and evasiveness, that he stepped down or back or whatever.

It appears this other guy now speaks for Diebold's election division.

[whistle]

16. They may represent different heads, but they all speak with....

...a single forked tongue!

[Eric J in MN]

27. It was the CEO of Diebold (Wally O'Dell) who said that. This is

the president of Diebold, Thomas W. Swidarski.

[roseBudd]

8. I'm rich, I'm republican and I count your votes...

[mod mom]

11. I am still cracking up about the nickname for kkkarl. nt

[whistle]

17. He got that while working under Donald Segretti during the....

...CREEP campaign of Richard Nixon I believe

<link> http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=98&contentid=1884&page=2

[mod mom]

10. Maybe the NY Times should publish this in response....

20 Amazing Facts about our Voting in the USA

20 Amazing Facts About Voting in the USA
      Did you know....
      1.80% of all votes in America are counted by only two companies: Diebold and ES&S.
      http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/042804Landes/04280 04landes.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diebold
      2.There is no federal agency with regulatory authority or oversight of the U.S. voting machine industry. http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0916-04.htm
      http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/042804Landes/04280 04landes.html
      3.The vice-president of Diebold and the president of ES&S are brothers. http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/private_company.h...
      http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/042804Landes/04280 04landes.html
      4.The chairman and CEO of Diebold is a major Bush campaign organizer and donor who wrote in 2003 that he was "committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year."
      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/07/28/sunday/main63 32436.shtml
      http://www.wishtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1647886
      5.Republican Senator Chuck Hagel used to be chairman of ES&S. He became Senator based on votes counted by ES&S machines.
      http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2004/03/0 03_200.html
      http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/031004Fitrakis/031 1004fitrakis.html
      6.Republican Senator Chuck Hagel, long-connected with the Bush family, was recently caught lying about his ownership of ES&S by the Senate Ethics Committee.
      http://www.blackboxvoting.com/modules.php?name=News& p;file=article&sid=26
      http://www.blackboxvoting.com/modules.php?name=News& p;file=article&s i d=26 http://www.hillnews.com/news/012903/hagel.aspx http://www.onlisareinsradar.com/archives/000896.php
      7.Senator Chuck Hagel was on a short list of George W. Bush's vice-presidential candidates. http://www.businessweek.com/2000/00_28/b3689130.htm http://theindependent.com/stories/052700/new_hagel27.ht...
      8.ES&S is the largest voting machine manufacturer in the U.S. and counts almost 60% of all U.S. votes. http://www.essvote.com/HTML/about/about.html
      http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/042804Landes/04280 04landes.html
      9.Diebold's new touch screen voting machines have no paper trail of any votes. In other words, there is no way to verify that the data coming out of the machine is the same as what was legitimately put in by voters. http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0225-05.htm
      http://www.itworld.com/Tech/2987/041020evotestates/pfin ndex.html
      10.Diebold also makes ATMs, checkout scanners, and ticket machines, all of which log each transaction and can generate a paper trail.
      http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0225-05.htm
      http://www.diebold.com/solutions/default.htm
      11.Diebold is based in Ohio. http://www.diebold.com/aboutus/ataglance/default.htm
      12.Diebold employed 5 convicted felons as senior managers and developers to help write the central compiler computer code that counted
      50% of the votes in 30 states.
      http://www.wired.com/news/evote/0,2645,61640,00.html
      http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/10/301469.shtml
      13.Jeff Dean, Diebold's Senior Vice-President and senior programmer on Diebold's central compiler code, was convicted of 23 counts of felony theft in the first degree.
      http://www.chuckherrin.com/HackthevoteFAQ.htm#how
      http://www.blackboxvoting.org/bbv_chapter-8.pdf
      14.Diebold Senior Vice-President Jeff Dean was convicted of planting back doors in his software and using a "high degree of sophistication" to evade detection over a period of 2 years. http://www.chuckherrin.com/HackthevoteFAQ.htm#how
      http://www.blackboxvoting.org/bbv_chapter-8.pdf
      15.None of the international election observers were allowed in the polls in Ohio. http://www.globalexchange.org/update/press/2638.html
      http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2004/10/26/loc_elexoh....
      16.California banned the use of Diebold machines because the security was so bad. Despite Diebold's claims that the audit logs could not be hacked, a chimpanzee was able to do it. (See the movie here blackboxvoting.org/baxter/baxterVPR.mov .) http://wired.com/news/evote/0,2645,63298,00.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4874190
      17.30% of all U.S. votes are carried out on unverifiable touch screen voting machines with no paper trail.
      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/07/28/sunday/main63 32436.shtml
      18.All - not some - but all the voting machine errors detected and reported in Florida went in favor of Bush or Republican candidates. http://www.wired.com/news/evote/0,2645,65757,00.html
      http://www.rise4news.net/extravotes.html
      http://www.ilcaonline.org/modules.php?op=modload&na ame=News&file=article&sid=950
      http://www.ilcaonline.org/modules.php?op=modload&na ame=News&file=article&sid=950 http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0411/S00227.htm
      19.The governor of the state of Florida, Jeb Bush, is the President's brother.
      http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/local/7 7628725.htm
      http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A10544-20 004Oct29.html
      20.Serious voting anomalies in Florida - again always favoring Bush - have been mathematically demonstrated and experts are recommending further investigation.
      http://www.computerworld.com/governmenttopics/governmen nt/policy/story/0,10801,97614,00.html
      http://www.uscountvotes.org /

from DU's own, angrygirl

[GOPBasher]

18. He forgot to mention that it's also much easier for them to steal the

election with the Diebold machines. That's another good reason for them.

[JunkYardDogg]

19. Sounds like Enron's Deregulation Mantra

One has to question why a Private Corporation is Campaigning/Advocating/Promoting No
ACCESSIBLE VOTER VERIFIED PAPER AUDIT TRAIL
This is NOT the Domain nor the Interest of a Corporation
They are lobbying

WE must Lobby
Nobody will do it for us
Enron did the same thing for Deregulation of Energy (i.e. electricity)

[brindis_desala]

20. I think the Times needs a large flood of emails from Duers in

rebuttal.

[mod mom]

22. done. Sent them the 20 Amazing Facts about our Voting in USA. nt

[FogerRox]

23. Opensecrets.org search reveals no ES&S or Seqouia employees donated to

Bush in 2004--Diebold on the other hand:


BUCCI, DAVID MR
HUDSON,OH 44236
DIEBOLD INC./SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT
6/26/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

CROWTHER, JOHN M MR
CANTON,OH 44708
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT
8/27/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

D' AMICO, THOMAS R MR
CANTON,OH 44718
DIEBOLD INC./EXECUTIVE
9/3/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

FRAZZITTA, BART MR
AKRON,OH 44333
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT
6/26/2003
$1,000
Bush, George W

FRAZZITTA, BART MR
AKRON,OH 44333
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT
9/29/2003
$1,000
Bush, George W

GESWEIN, GREGORY T MR
BENTLEYVILLE,OH 44022
DIEBOLD INC./CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICE
6/26/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

HILLOCK, JENNIFER L MRS
MASSILLON,OH 44646
DIEBOLD INC./INT'L BUSINESS EXECUTI
8/27/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

HILLOCK, MICHAEL J MR
MASSILLON,OH 44646
DIEBOLD INTERNATIONAL INC./PRESIDEN
6/26/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

INGRAM, LARRY D MR
MASSILLON,OH 44646
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT OF GLOB
6/26/2003
$1,000
Bush, George W

INGRAM, LARRY D MR
MASSILLON,OH 44646
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT OF GLOB
9/15/2003
$1,000
Bush, George W

O' DELL, WALDEN W MR
CANTON,OH 44708
DIEBOLD INC./CHAIRMAN
6/12/2003
$4,000
Bush, George W

O' DELL, WALDEN W MR
CANTON,OH 44708
DIEBOLD INC./CHAIRMAN
8/8/2003
($2,000)
Bush, George W

SCHEURER, CHARLES B MR
CANTON,OH 44708
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT
8/27/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

SWIDARSKI, THOMAS W MR
HUDSON,OH 44236
DIEBOLD INC./VICE PRESIDENT
7/9/2003
$2,000
Bush, George W

VAN CLEVE, JEFFREY J MR
CANTON,OH 44720
DIEBOLD CREDIT CORPORATION/VICE PRE
9/3/2003
$1,000
Bush, George W

VAN CLEVE, JEFFREY J MR
CANTON,OH 44720
DIEBOLD CREDIT CORPORATION/VICE PRE
6/26/2003
$500
Bush, George W

[KaryninMiami]

29. Please post where you sent this to so we can make it a family affair.

What does everyone say? Shall we tell the NY Times and our "friend" from Diabold the truth about his "factual" letter regarding the benefits of electronic voting? I'm up for it. Let's see if they respond by printing our rebuttals...

[Stevepol]

24. How in hell do they know they're accurate when you can't audit

the damned things!!! I'm sure the Caltech / MIT study gave figures for over-votes and under-votes and so on, meaningless figures in terms of the accuracy of an election.

[Bill Bored]

25. See this thread and send a rebuttal!

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x343554>

[Eric J in MN]

28. Another misleadng statement is

that while he praises the accuracy of the election in Georgia, many people in Georgia found the results in the 2002 Senate race to be full of discrepancies.