its abortion stupid!!!!!!!!!!

[rainy]

Lots of Catholic friends say they could never vote for someone who supports abortion. It is the biggest issue keeping the christians from voting for a dem..... It is so big that they ignore all of the teachings of their Jesus because they reject abortion.

[Sandpiper]

1. That's strange

Considering that 66% of Americans favor keeping it legal.

[truhavoc]

11. But will that 66% make it to the polls vs the 34%??

It sure looks like not. I am especially disappointed in the my age group (18-25) we should be ashamed of ourselves!

[LiberalVoice]

2. It was not...

I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks...Don't ignore all the info we had before yesterday...We were supposed to win this thing and * made sure rove took the steps needed to take htis election.

[Pig_Latin_Lover]

3. But, unjustified war is better?

Sad. I don't think anyone supports abortion, just a woman's right to choose.

[Midlodemocrat]

4. and what about the death penalty?

[forgethell]

58. I keep asking, because

I don't understand why we progressives continue to think that the pro-life people connect any dots between abortion and capital punishment. They don't. so why do we keep putting it out there like it's some kind of slam-dunk clincher to athe argument? It isn't.

[Democat]

5. Can we get post counts back sometime soon? It's not worth posting...

...when you can't tell the trolls from the trolls. :)

[sr_pacifica]

6. You got it--one of the factors, big time, for the stupidity of the results

I was aware of it when I saw the polls for what used to be very democratic states---Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio. How could states suffering from Bushco economics vote for this idiot? "Moral issues" trump everything else for fundamentalists.

[bling bling]

7. Somehow Clinton won despite the pro-lifers.

There is only one explaination. Bush=President=Fraud.

[davepc]

14. yeah, he carried states in the south

[Zero Division]

8. My parents and my brother are anti-choice Catholics, they voted Kerry

because they actually care about other issues,as well. Unlike many other anti-choicers, they actually care about children who've been born, as wewll. I just don't understand what happened tonight.

[qanda]

9. Even if you're a FReeper, You're right

But most people just don't get how strongly those who are against it really feel. And I have over 3000 posts, so don't try it.

[MidwestMomma]

12. And it's not just abortion

It's a culture war. We didn't lose because we didn't work hard enough or our candidate wasn't good enough. My country is de-evolving before my very eyes and it makes me weep.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

16. You know....I keep asking people that are against abortion if they are....

...going to start adopting all of the unwanted babies that are going to be born in this country, and all I get is a blank stare from 99% of them. When I follow up with a question about enacting stronger birth control measures, they want to tell me that's just as bad as abortion.

And I personally know an anti-abortion couple who went to the Ukraine to adopt a child instead of adopting one right here in the States.

Amazing philosophy.

[meow2u3]

26. There is a solution to this problem

We should make it easier for parents, especially working- and middle-class parents who otherwise couldn't afford to adopt kids, to be able to do so. I think we ought to have a national adoption network, partially subsidized by federal dollars, similar to what the late Gov. Bob Casey (D-PA)--a real pro-lifer who put his money where his mouth was, and a Democrat to boot--had implemented in Pennsylvania.
Conservatives scoff at this idea because they'd rather leave a poor single mother and her newborn child to fend for themselves. They'd rather see a helpless infant (already born) homeless, hungry, and sick/dying, along with his or her mother, than dole out one red cent to provide for their basic needs.

[MemphisTiger]

42. That's the question I ask every pro-lifer,

I get the same response. I would love to adopt a child from the US, but it costs about $15,000 dollars on average to adopt. My wife and I have good jobs but cannot afford that price tag. I personally am pro-life, but do not feel the need to legislate this on everyone else. Also, we need to look at why people are getting abortions...can they afford the child...do they have health care? These are all valid questions that need to be asked, but non are answered by the right

[loyalsister]

45. They started giving a tax credit in MO

People started using it to adopt children from overseas.
It didn't produce it's marketed expected results. Missouri's unwanted kids still wind up in foster care.

[lizzieforkerry]

32. You can also ask them

Do you buy anything that is made in China?- they have laws requiring people to get abortions!

Have you paid the medical bills for anyone that has followed their advice and not aborted? Or the medical bills of their children?

Have you offered free childcare so these women can get out and work and not have to work to pay for childcare?

If your daughter had three children would you want her to die because one pregnancy was too much for body to handle? Have you made plans to take her children in?

Which is more devastating- Finding out that your daughter had an abortion or finding out that she is dead because she had an abortion in an ally?

Everyone I have ever asked has answered no- yet they want 40 million hungry, crying needy babies in this country. They don't care about these babies they just care about their souls when they meet their maker- I certainly hope He is smarter than that.

[Maat]

59. I quite agree.

I was a Child Protective Services social worker for 7 years. Conservatives were not around when I needed to find homes for drug- or alcohol-exposed babies. They wanted perfect little white babies. They are nothing but hypocrites of the vilest sort.

[Maat]

61. And what a lie it costs $15,000!

I received at least $350 per month in foster care money for a year while the court case went through. After birth parents' rights were terminated - there was a period of a few months. Then I paid $500 to complete the adoption.

What nonsense! Rich white conservatives do not want any baby they consider less than 100% perfect - and they do not want to think of America's failings in dealing with a pervasive methamphetamine/stimulant-abuse problem.

[loyalsister]

41. The nagging question

Do they actually want to see fewer abortions or do they just want someone to mouth the words "pro-life?"
The number of abortions has increased under Bush. Any person who votes for him because they are "pro-life" isn't getting a return on their vote if they want fewer abortions.

[phylny]

10. Here's a question - is abortion legal in Canada? n/t

[Canadian_moderate]

23. Yes, but Canadians are generally less religious

or at least fundamentalist (evangelical) in their religious approach.

[phylny]

49. Not that I'll ever need an abortion

but just wanted to become informed, and to inform others...which you just did :)

[sr_pacifica]

53. A BIG plus for Canada. n/t

[are_we_united_yet]

13. Sure

You choke out the Environment and kill off the everybody with global warming,

You can kill 10's of thousand civialians with bombs

You can lie cheat and steal

You can ignore US Domestic Agnedas

But "killing babies" is the issue.


Yeah got it.

[Sterling]

20. Yes I call bullshit as well.

Anti Choice people are desperate to paint a false reality that most Americans want abortions illegal. Sad some people on this board will use this time to press a stupid agenda.

[yardwork]

55. No, no, no. You're missing the point by the poster.

Of course the logic is stupid! We all know that here! The trouble is that the fundies and the kool-aid drinkers don't seem to register the logic.

How do we fight this? Certainly not by taking away a woman's right to choose. But I think we CAN call the rethuglican's bluff. Most rethuglicans have no intention of making abortion illegal.

[are_we_united_yet]

67. I'm not missing the point.

But perhaps you missed mine. All this "soul searching" the Democratic party is going through now is meaningless until we get down to the nuts and bolts of how much voter fraud and the degree of the unethical tactics that were at play during this election.

Now, everybody wants to be a Godammned political strategist. People should have articulated their optimal strategies to the Democratic Party before Tuesday night I guess. It probably wouldn't of mattered anyway because if the fraudulent voting doesn't do you in, the flip-flopping on the "moral issues" would have. You would not have won period.

I post the 'stupid logic' because not everbody reading it is a "converted" DU'er . Not everybody has had the issue of "killing an innocent life" presented in these stark terms.

Last, I don't agree "Most rethuglicans have no intention of making abortion illegal." Roe v Wade is gone the first chance they get.

(apologies for the sharp tone)

[Media_Lies_Daily]

15. Right. A single issue caused this fiasco? You must be....

...simple in the head if you believe that crap.

[Iris]

24. MLD - I'm with you, but the media just keeps harping on the "morals" issue

I'm finding it hard to believe we'll ever get out of this religious zealot mode.

[MemphisTiger]

46. I've heard people say a vote for Kerry is a vote against Jesus himself

The right even went so far as to say that Kerry would ban the Bible

[Iris]

48. And people believe this shit. n/t

[lizzieforkerry]

34. Yeah well, I called about 3000 peopel in SW OHIO

and the majority of them told me they wanted to vote for Kerry but they didn't want to go to hell- and we were calling Democrats! So what might seem like a small issue to you was a daily battle for us in OHIO were this election is coming down to. People got flyers on their cars at Church with pictures of aborted babies on them- hundreds and hundreds of flyers every week for months! Every single Church in our town had "Undecided? Vote the Bible" on their marquees in front. This was a big issue for us in OHIO

[Ilsa]

17. I've talked to people for whom it is a single issue.

To them, it's a matter of life and death for innocent babies. Nothing else matters.

I wonder how they are going to feel when they have control of everything and this government still doesn't fix this issue permanently for them. Will they believe us when we tell them it was only a wedge issue for the politicians?

[michigandem2]

18. but the thousands that are dying in Iraq...that sounds like a nice a

alternative...IDIOTS..fucking idiots...they will be sorry...its not going to be a pretty 4 years

[SarahB]

19. Ask the pro-lifers what the right has done for them?

It's just the carrot they dangle. They've had the Supreme court for years. They could install a president for God's sake. They will never overturn Roe Vs. Wade because they'll lose half their support once they wake up to other issues.

[Iris]

21. Most Catholics vote Democrat. Don't try to blame this shit on them.

They believe in social justice and we ain't had none of THAT lately.

[ScreamingMeemie]

47. From my daughter's Catholic school mock election 151 Bush 50 Kerry

How's that go again? I won't even sit in church for months. The church (on the local level) needs to keep it's nose out of governmental affairs. Voting based on abortion goes directly against Vatican teachings. Examine and weigh the issues. Kerry won everytime...Idiot Catholics let themselves be scared. I'm ashamed and disgusted by my fellow parishoners.

[Iris]

56. Well, yeah. Kids see things in black and white.

Grown people should be able to make decisions based on probabl outcomes.

[The Flaming Red Head]

22. The Dems believe in abortion before birth

The Repubs believe in abortion after birth.

[meow2u3]

25. The way the abortion issue is framed is flawed

Maybe we ought to stop framing abortion as an issue symbolic of women's choice, and by extension, equality with men, when evidence, suppressed by pro-choice activists, suggests that more women seek abortions not out of free choice, but out of dire circumstances, economic and relational. Few abortions are sought by a woman's actually choosing for herself to go to a clinic.

I think nontraditional pro-lifers, especially the closet pro-life progressive "Red Dog" Democrats, ought to march their asses out of the closet and strive to make a far more forceful argument that keeping abortion legal as a form of after-the-fact birth control, actually has backfired on women, progressives, and the Democrats as a party.

For starters, conservatives don't have a monopoly on hypocrisy, although they have made it an art form. I see our own brand of hypocrisy and rationalizing right here on DU regarding abortion and the personhood status of the fetus/unborn kid. It can be summed up as follows: it's an unborn child if you want it, and a fetus if you don't. Conservatives, on the other hand, rail about the sanctity of life before birth, yet couldn't care less about the child after he or she is born. I ask, "Why not both"? Conservatives seem to care about the rights of the unborn, yet are downright hostile, and even hateful, towards their mothers. I ask, "Why can't we fight for both"? I think we can be both pro-woman and pro-life at the same time. We just have to learn how to present a strong, effective, and even emotional argument of the neoprogressive philosophy that we have to side with all underdogs, not just those who make the most noise.

[exsoccermom]

29. One thing that is not mentioned very much

is that prior to Roe v Wade, estimates had abortions around 1 million a year (as I recall, 500,000 -- 1,500,000) in the USA. This was at the start of the baby boom bump and the increases of women in their childbearing years. Many of these were the back alley abortions where many died or permanently injured. I remember back when I was young there all these women in my Aunt's beauty shop that had "trouble" with their period and were getting D&Cs. Hum. For poor women, there's the back alley, but for well off there is? Getting rid of Roe v Wade will not get rid of abortions: economic and other live reasons are still there. I suspect there would be a large market for RU486 (or whatever).

[Yupster]

68. Getting rid of Roe versus Wade

will not make abortions illegal.

It will throw the issue back to the state legislatures who would overwhelmingly write laws keeping abortion legal.

[Lavender Brown]

27. Bush has the blood of many children on his hands. He is NOT pro-life.

Why can't people see that?

[FlaGranny]

31. I wonder how many

pregnant Iraqi and Afghani women and their unborn babies have been killed recently? Maybe babies are only important if they are American babies - and if you are not responsible for them after they are born.

[lizzieforkerry]

35. Bush sent out mailings telling people they were going to Hell if

they voted for Kerry in Ohio- People around here are too poor to own computers so they don't know that most people are saying he is joke on the issue. All they see is Chris Matthews and Kaux news and the Billy Graham...God have mercy on the USA

[Sugarbleus]

28. There is NO direct biblical provison against abortion!!

It's all been made up!

[rbking]

40. I hope I don't get flamed over this but..,

As a fundamentalist, and a democrat, as far as I know there are only two references in the Bible to the beginning of life. They are in Genesis 2:7, and Ezekiel 37:1-6; both are clear that the body is formed and then the Lord provides the BREATH OF LIFE. For those who believe in a literal reading of the Bible this would indicate that life begins with the first breath.

That said, it wouldn't hurt if democrats, as an overall group would consider something other than a woman's right to choose when talking about abortion. For example, one in four conceptions in this great land of ours is ended with an abortion. Clearly there is a moral crisis in this country that needs to be addressed.

We democrats do not need to embrace a full pro-life stance, but if we ever care to have a chance at winning over a few pro-life voters we will have to make some kind of concessions on this issue. Clinton once said that "abortions should be legal, safe, and rare." Well he never had a problem with legal or safe, but not once did he do a thing to help make them rare.

When I talk to friends about the Iraq I bring up Scott Ritter telling us before the invasion that Iraq was disarmed, that our intelligence agencies were directing the new weapons inspectors and they were not able to find anything, that the Saddam-al Qaeda connection was being scoffed at, and that a leader with any morality would have asked his staff why this was the case before sending tens of thousands to their deaths. Morality, I tell them, includes honoring the 6th Commandment too. Democrats far too often fail to use morality in any meaningful way. It is generally only used by democrats as a way of belittling the faithful and not as a true measure of a man.

Perhaps one day a few democrats will figure out that Christians are not the enemy. When democrats, some and certainly not all, give a little respect to the faithful they will get a few more votes, but until they do the GOP is waiting with open arms.

[lizzieforkerry]

43. I've never met a democrat that wasn't a

strong Christian- in fact that is usually why we are democrats! I have also never talked to a pro-choice person who wanted people to have abortions. We feel they will be rare if people have jobs and healthcare and childcare. And Clinton did a better job at making abortions rare than Reagan or Bush Sr. or Shrub. Shrub won the prize for the state with the most abortions in the country when he was Gov of Texas (Jeb once again came in second)

[FlaGranny]

44. Of course Clinton did something to

make abortion rare. Abortions decreased under Clinton. People were working and had money. In the last four years under Bush abortion has increased.

Otherwise, I agree with you. I also agree that Christians as a whole are not the enemy, but an extremely vocal minority of them certainly are. What an unholy collusion - Deluded Christians and megacorporations/billionaires against the middle class and poor. Money and zeal - explains a lot.

[Sugarbleus]

54. I won't flame you.. =o) but I respectfully disagree with some

of your points. I am a Christian in limbo right now. I was raised evangelical ..Assembly of God. I'm 55 years old. I no longer go to those churches because they support selective morality and I don't believe Christ meant us to pick and chose which morals we want and leave the others by the wayside. etc

I no longer believe in the literal interpretation of the Bible..there is no logic to it and no empiracle evidence that it wasn't just history and allegory from Jewish Culture. I still have a spiritual desire and call upon God in my way.

I remember when the abortion issue came into focus in the evangelical fundamentalist movement. They TRIED to extrapolate a few tiny little verses associated with paganism (Hebraic culture at the time were forbidden to copy or immitate anything they deemed pagan...outside the Hebrew system of law) and how the jews viewed the practices at that time. (OLD LAW) Additionally, there are verses in Old Testament that show where a fetus killed by a fight between two men, for example, was nothing more than a small fine (women and children were property). The loss of a fetus was not a big deal in those days...the CHURCH tries to make it so, starting with the first organized, Universal (Catholic) church. I suspect this was a fostered idea formed from the early scriptures (old testament) which promotes that we GO "BE FRUITFUL" AND REPLENTISH THE EARTH....have LOTS of children, even if you drop dead from birthing too many. BTW, Jews also practiced birth control: by the moon, mensus, and so forth--they were interested in making babies but not allowed to enjoy it too much (though I'll bet they did enjoy intercourse more often than the Priests ever knew) :D

Furthermore, in the Jewish tradition to this day, a fetus/zygote..whatever stage is not fully recognized as a child until it takes it's first breath and is separated from it's mother. The moment of birth is life in their tradition...some more orthodox Jews may have slightly differing views as the tradition comes down to present day.

Finally, Jesus is the core of the Christian faith..his words, if you are strictly christ centered, never mention anything about ABORTION or the unnatural loss of a nacent life inutero. When children are with us fully alive, fully separate Jesus LOVED THE CHILDREN and warned people NOT to harm them...He was pretty unanimous about that point. I will concede that abortion gone wild might be a bit much..it should be rare, but still available and that decision must be between a woman and her doctor..not between her and the "state" religionists.

There are many many things we do not follow anymore that the Hebraic, old testament law promoted. Like making a woman go and live in a separate unit while she was menstruating, or slavery..it was A CULTURE OF CUSTOMS for the Hebrews, not intended for the whole world.

Recently, I sadly discovered that the bible we read today is a mish mash of purposely ordered writings that the early Church (Constantine was the guy I think) DECIDED we should have as our holy book. Many many writings were left out...especially writings where Women had an clout. It was and still tries to be, a "Man's World". There are writings from the dead sea scrolls and others, I can't think of the find location just now...that we have not been allowed to SEE. They even burned some writings so long ago. There is NO telling what we have in our hands...though it's beautiful and helpful to many..In any case, on this basis I can't take biblical matters literal in all ways. We KNOW that Jesus was here because the human, historical record tells us it was so. We know He was someone who impressed a lot of people and divided the Jews for and against Him and then his message went out world wide...just like all the other religions have spread to the far corners of the earth.

Finally, I fully respect the right of anyone to practice the faith of their choosing without recrimination. I do not agree, however, that moral issues can or should be legislated; even in the times of Kings and Temples in the land of Israel, non jews were welcome and were NOT forced to abide by Hebrew law--circumsion comes to mind on that one. Whatever we do, according to that bible, is of our free will and between that person and God..not community law.

There are sooooo many beautiful lessons/traditions in the bible (I could go on), but it seems that Christians just skim over them and pick out just those they want to cling to. IMO... O8)

That is my position and I hope I didn't offend. Blessings~~

[Yupster]

69. When Jesus mother

met John the Baptist's mother, John kicked in the womb in recognition.

Also, God told David that he chose him while he was still in the womb.

You're not going to convince pro-life religious fundamentalists that the bible teaches that life begins with birth. Just isn't going to work.

Personally I think abortion is a middle of the road issue where most people are not radically on one side or the other.

If a Republican candidate gets backed into attacking abortions in the first tri-mester, he/she will lose the argument. If a Democratic candidate gets backed into defending partial-birth abortion, he/she will lose the argumant. Whoever appears radical on the issue will lose.

Be prepared because parental notification is coming next.

[Stuckinthebush]

30. When their children are fighting needless wars

When their mothers and fathers are sick and dying without medicare to help them pay the bills...

When they lose their jobs to cheaper overseas labor and have to train their replacements...

When the anti-Catholic fundamentalist begin to control their schools...

When the deficit becomes so great in this country, that we can't pay for more police, fire fighters, roads, social programs, or education programs...

When their gay and lesbian friends and neighbors are denied basic civil rights and hate crimes become acceptable...

When they are searced in the middle of the night by the police without a warrent because a perturbed neighbor accused them of being terrorists...

When the real terrorists strike our country because of lax security due to overuse of resources in places like Iraq...

When the world looks at us with disdain and hatred so much that they laugh at our misfortunes...

When they can't travel outside of the country without fear of harrassment or physical violence perpetuated by those world communities who see what damage this country has done to our shared globe...

When they have more and more skin cancer due to the depleted ozone layer...

When global warming causes famine and drought in our nation and the world...

When they lament the fact that they can no longer visit national parks and forests because they have been leased to oil and timber companies...

When their children's schools start increasing class sizes to 30, 40 or 50 children per teacher due to lack of funding...

When they are injured by a product and can no longer sue for damages...

When their children can no longer afford to go to college because of elimination of grant funding...

When our world becomes a darker, more menacing place...

Ask them about that abortion thing and see if it was worth it.

[Politicub]

33. I thought it was gay rights

Most folks hate gays. That was evident from the 11 states who passed amendments banning gay marriage.

America -- the country of hate. Don't you love it?

[ElectroPrincess]

36. That's a SERIOUS misconception about US

I'm so tired of other faiths *declaring* what is RIGHT or WRONG about the Catholic faith.

We share the same 10 Commandments with other Christians and guess what? God did not weight certain categories as *more* mortally sinful (abortion, execution, immoral war).

What part of THOU SHALL NOT KILL do you not understand Protestants and fellow Catholics?

Like court *experts* you can find a Priest or Bishop to support almost any viewpoint on abortion stancs as it compares to our candidates ... voting. Vote for the balance ... in spite of ...

The Bishops and Cardinals who represent me are the ones who encourage Catholics to PERSONALLY search their souls for the candidate who best represents all of what our faith stands for Pro Life = anti-abortion AND anti-execution AND only supporting JUST WAR.

Remember, the Pope did not declare our Iraq invasion a just war.

I know numerous Catholics, including myself, who believe in our heart and soul that John F. Kerry is not only the best Presidential candidate but also "a thoughtful practicing Catholic."

And please, don't get me started on comparing Bush vs. Kerry on Social Justice issues.

[demjomr313]

37. The Death Penalty is WORSE than abortion....

DUH!?

Let the people who HAVE the issue DEAL with the issue. Feds STAY OUT of MY BODY!

[twenty2strings]

38. moment of truth... my son sean ...

came home from school and told me that another little 8 year old told him that there was something where a baby gets killed... i stopped for a minute and had to regroup. i said son i think abortion is a pretty crummy thing and should only be done for very serious reasons. i gave some examples, all pretty standard...deformations, mental deficient mom, rape, complications of pregnancy ect. i do believe the things i said but it was really hard. so i guess i understand why so many feel so strongly about it. this isn`t some back door republican post. i believe in the right to choose but it is still a hard thing. but then again i`m not a woman. it`s hard.:)

[DemBones DemBones]

39. It's votes aborted by Diebold machines, stupid.

Catholics are about 25% of the electorate and we do NOT all base our vote solely on abortion. Look at any poll and you'll see that we don't all even consider ourselves pro-life.

A majority of the people, Catholics and other Christians included, elected Bill Clinton TWICE.

A majority of the people, Catholics and other Christians included, elected Al Gore in 2000 but the Supreme Court gave it to Bush*.

According to exit polls, we elected John Kerry yesterday. Turnout was higher than it had been in decades. High turnout always benefits DEMOCRATS.

Right now, Kerry has 252 EVs and Bush* has 254.



BUSH* HAS NOT WON. IT IS NOT OVER.

[Flammable Materials]

50. They would rather vote for someone ...

... who believes they are part of a Satanic cult.

Makes sense to me.

DISCLAIMER: Author has consumed two 750ml bottles of 8% Belgian ale.

[laylah]

51. To which I respond

while I am ANTI-abortion, I am PRO-choice. As I have said to the point of hoarsness, WHO DIED AND MADE US GOD?????? I will NEVER support an act of invading the privacy of such a choice PERIOD. This is just one reason I am no longer affiliated with the Catholic Church! They suborn SEXUAL ABUSE but deny a woman's right to choose! ARGHHHHHHHHHHH!

Jenn

[The Jacobin]

52. I'm Catholic

I attend mass every week.

I teach catechism classes weekly nine months out of the year.

I voted Kerry.

Tell your Catholic friends that "life" is more than a myopic focus on the first nine months and extends through the living part as well.

[llmart]

57. If that's the case.......

then when some deranged idiot rapes their daughter or wife or sister, or a family member rapes their child, or a 16 year old stepbrother rapes his 12 year old stepsister (it happened in our small community) let them carry the baby to term and love it to death. yeah, that's the ticket. I'm sure they will.
Sarcasm intended.

[judaspriestess]

60. Hypocrites - Pro-lifers

good thread,
that is my whole point when I speak to pro-lifers.
I ask if you are pro-life but yet you practice birth control?
aren't you preventing the fertilization of an embryo, isn't that a form of abortion? always a stupid reply, like oh its not the same thing. hypocrites!!
* - FOUR MORE YEARS OF HATE!!!

[Carolab]

62. NO IT'S FRAUD STUPID

WE WERE ROBBED. AGAIN!!!!!!

[ecoalex]

63. Catholics - higher abortion rates

I've seen a few studies, and the Catholics had higher rates of abortion accross the country, reason ? birth control is objected to except for the rhythm method, no barriers , or chemicals are allowed.Just like how abortion has increased with bush, a fact, contraception was denied and frowned upon .

[ecoalex]

64. Catholics - higher abortion rates

I've seen a few studies, and the Catholics had higher rates of abortion accross the country, reason ? birth control is objected to except for the rhythm method, no barriers , or chemicals are allowed.Just like how abortion has increased with bush, a fact, contraception was denied and frowned upon .

[sadiesworld]

65. I don't think dem candidates do a very good job on this issue.

Even voters who are opposed to abortion often shy away from their positions in cases of rape, incest, fetal deformity, danger to the health of the woman, etc.

Obviously each exception involves a great deal of complexity. Is the rape victim required to file a police report? How badly does the fetus have to be deformed? Is blindness sufficient? Does the woman's life have to be a risk or is permanent damage enough? What about mental illness?

I think that most voters eyes would be spinning with visions of clogged courts, besieged physicians and ticking clocks if these points were hammered. Not to mention the squeamishness of having these very personal issues being dragged into the public square.

Just saying that it is "a woman's choice" isn't enough. The "who decides" theme should be fleshed out, ad nauseum.

[ElectroPrincess]

66. What needs to be "fleshed out" is a return to a Forth Estate ...

Investigative journalism and, at least an attempt at fair and unbiased reporting is all but non-existent.

UNTIL we can goose the USA mainstream media to "do their job" we will, from this point on, only be ruled by the rich and powerful corporations who by advertising space on, you guessed it, our atrocious whores in the USA mainstream media.

BTW may God Bless Helen Thomas and Walter Cronkite.

These are two distinguished reporters who actually "walked the walk."

[Carolab]

70. Did you tell them IT'S THE LAW??????????

Do they want to vote for someone who will go AGAINST THE LAW?

What a bunch of simple-minded twits.

My son has a friend who voted Bush and so did his wife. Want to know why? They have been trying to conceive a child "of their own" for about two years (even though he already has two kids from a prior marriage). No luck. They decided to adopt but found that the lists are long. They figure that if there are no abortions it will be easier for them to adopt a kid.

Like I said, with Repukes, it's all about THEM. THEY ARE GREEDY, SELF-SERVING HYPOCRITS who HIDE BEHIND THE BIBLE. JESUS CONDEMNED HYPOCRITS.

[marlakay]

71. I know people who voted for * for that reason n/t