BC municipal election voters...See any Diebold machines?

[tuvor]

In the Courtenay election, that's who made our vote-counting machines.

[Spazito]

1. All hand counts here, no machines at all

It takes longer but I trust it more.

[V. Kid]

2. Don't think so. Vancouver uses all Machine counts on a paper ballot...

...but there's a lot of things to vote for though, since there's no neighbourhood representation. So they need to it to be quick. But they always count everything quickly for federal and provincial elections by hand, so I don't see why they couldn't then.

In any case there was a guy named James Green who ran against one of the major Candidates Jim Green. It may have caused Jim Green the election, this is what many people are saying. But other things, like a split between more moderate members of the civic left (Vision Vancouver which he was a part of) and the more left-wing people (COPE which tacitly endorsed him) also caused it some difficulty. Plus, the higher income people turn out in higher numbers. And though the council candidates on the left, got on average 40,000-53,000 votes, the right got anywhere from 49,000-60,000. And that means, right leaning majority. Although, realistically all the councillors are relativley moderate at least and usually the right leaning slate dominates. Also, the left had a crapy and unorganized campaign, which was strange cause they did a good job governing.

[Spazito]

3. I am definitely suspicious of the James Green entry

The NPA would not be above running this guy deliberately to cause confusion, imo.

[HEyHEY]

6. Yeah, but I don't think Sam Sullivan would go for that

He's an honest guy... not like George Puil and the rest of the derelicts fucks in the Old NPA.

At the same time, if you don't know the NAME of the guy you're voting for...I'm not sure I want you to vote!

[V. Kid]

7. I wouldn't be suprised if he would...

...cause Sam Sullivan talks out of both sides of his mouth.

The guy makes things up that are complete lies. For instance he wasn't the first politician who was infavour of harm reduction, heck he completely supported Jennifer Clarke's putsch of Phillip Owen, feulled by Owen's support for four-pillars. Also during the Ward camoaign he played the ethnicity card, saying ethnic representation would be hurt with wards, eventhough many studies show that's not true. It's unfortunate he was elected.

[Spazito]

9. He was on CTV this morning admitting he made a phone call

to help James Green which totally reverses his original position that he had had nothing to do with him. He was lying through his teeth and it was obvious. Jim Green is talking to his lawyer and mentioned possible election fraud.

[HEyHEY]

10. Well, if he admitted it - then there should be something done

[Spazito]

11. Yep, I agree, it sure looks like election fraud to me

although that will be hard to prove, imo. If, as the restaurant owner that says Sullivan asked him to give space to James Green as a favour to Sullivan, is true and I have no reason to think otherwise, then that is a donation-in-kind from Sullivan to James Green. In reality, it looks to me the NPA ran TWO candidates, one to be the spoiler so the other could win, it stinks beyond belief, imo!

Edited to add link to article.

I finally was able to find an article on it. Here are some interesting tidbits:

snip

Sullivan has repeatedly denied that he or his campaign had anything to do with the man who may have taken a significant number of votes from Vision Vancouver's Jim Green.

Restaurant owner Julius Simon told CTV news, in a taped interview, that Sullivan had asked him to provide free office space for Green in the complex near Simon's Azure Restaurant at the Plaza of Nations. "Sam, he asked, you know, if I can help him, you know, with his office."

He repeated that when the reporter repeated his questions to make sure he had the information correctly.

snip

James Green's campaign also generated speculation because Green, who has had financial problems in the past, rented a provincial-election-style campaign bus for the election and campaigned full-time. Typically, such buses cost $1,000 a day. He also had a professional-looking website. The website was created on Sept. 14 and its administrative contact is listed as Blair Reekie, a well-known television producer, of Fairfax Creative.

more, lots more

http://www.canada.com/vancouver/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=e2815c0e-4774-41fb-ac67-f8317ce76132

[HEyHEY]

12. Problem is nothing illegal was done

What does get me though, is who does Jim Green think he is tying to kick someone out of their office?

[Spazito]

13. Sullivan says that is not true, Jim Green DID NOT try to kick

anyone out of their offices, he says that is why he made the phone call re James Green and found out that it was a lie that Jim Green tried to do anything to James Green.

If they could prove NPA money went to James Green as well as to Sullivan, then the question of election fraud would definitely come up.

This whole thing re James Green smells to all to hell, imo. NPA is not above doing such a sleazy thing, that's for sure.

[HEyHEY]

14. Where did you hear Jim didn't try to do that?

I keep hearing the opposite.

[Spazito]

15. Sullivan said it himself when on B.C. CTV news yesterday

He said he had phoned re the office for James Green because he had been told that Jim Green had forced him out. After talking to the landlords, he said, he was told there was an insurance problem and the office problem had nothing to do with Jim Green.

He repeatedly said the story on Jim Green was false.

[HEyHEY]

16. Ah

Rokay. Hmmm, I think someone needs to look into James Green more and more.
The sad part is, at the end of the day this could all be innocent and this James Green guy coulda fucked an election up for no really good reason.

[CHIMO]

17. James Green-Jim Green controversy heats up

James Green-Jim Green controversy heats up
Last updated Nov 23 2005 08:12 AM PST
CBC News

Vancouver mayor-elect Sam Sullivan admits he did make inquiries about why independent mayoralty candidate James Green was evicted from his campaign office. But he maintains he did nothing wrong.

James Green finished third behind Sullivan and runner-up Jim Green of Vision Vancouver in Saturday's civic elections.

James Green received 4,273 votes, which is more than the difference between Sullivan and Jim Green – 3,747 ballots.

Vision Vancouver, the party that backed runner up Jim Green, is calling for an independent inquiry – arguing that Sullivan's shifting story casts a shadow on an election he may have won because there were two "Greens" on the ballot.

http://www.cbc.ca/bc/story/bc_green-sullivan20051123.html

Seems to be getting legs.

An audio and video also available.
http://www.cbc.ca/bc/

[Spazito]

19. Good article, thanks for posting!

I can't say it enough, this stinks beyond belief. Sullivan has been caught lying multiple times on this issue. Why lie if there is nothing to cover up?

I sure hope they do get an independent inquiry on this. There is a money trail to follow on this, who paid for the big campaign bus for an unknown? James Green will have to file a campaign financing disclosure statement and list all sources of donations of over $100.00 which could prove interesting, to say the least. The media should be all over this, once it is filed, imo.

[Spazito]

4. B.C. CTV news had an exclusive on the NPA Sullivan/James Green

connection. It turns out Sullivan called a friend across the street from his campaign office to ask him to give James Green FREE office space. CTV also showed Sullivan saying he didn't know James Green, etc. Jim Green, the real candidate, when told, said he wasn't sure what could be done about it but he would be talking to his lawyer.

This could get REAL interesting!

Edited to correct post to give the appropriate news agency the credit.

[HEyHEY]

5. I think Cope did a terrible job

And it's not that I don't like the party's ideals.. it's just I found the council members to be fucking morons... and I kow some of them personally. I know it's a BAD source... but Michael Smyth wrote a great column on the downfall of COPE.... too bad he didn't mention the NPA is no better.

[imouttahere]

18. I heard COPE opposes the LRT to the airport - why???

this is not the time for any party - especially one on the left - to oppose much-needed mass transit.

[V. Kid]

20. Because..

there are more financially responsible options, the residents and buisnesses of the area will be negativley affected as "cut 'n' cover" wasn't the original method and it'll likely be hugely over budget. It's already over the original budget. Also, a line to the Coquitlam area is needed more.

Oh yeah, this may be corny to those who don't live in the area, but Translink lied about protecting the Cambie Heritage Boulevard. I know most of those who don't live in the area would think it's just a few trees, so who cares? But you know what, pave paradise to put up a parking lot, well...you get a parking lot if you catch my drift.

[arikara]

8. We had them here in Sooke

And a referendum passed favouring big time developers that we didn't expect judging from the comments and feelings around town.

I would really like to find out how to get a hand count done of the ballots. The developer's dream mayor won too which wasn't a total surprise given that the vote was split 3 ways.

[Fiendish Thingy]

21. I've always thought Canada was the ideal...

all paper ballots, all hand counted, all the time...I guess I'm mistaken?
Based on the responses here, it sounds like always paper ballots, sometimes hand counted, sometimes machine counted depending on location and whether local or national?