Does Moveon's latest ad work or not? ("Quagmire")

[SeekingTruth]

On a visceral, kick the Repugs ass, I though it was good, but on the whole, I think it wasn't that good. And here is why - I don't think most Americans want to see depictions of a soldier in turmoil of any kind. I think this ad might backfire because of it will anger Americans more towards the Iraqis, than that of Bush.

How I think they should have made it is similar to what Kerry is doing now - comparing the two Gulf Wars - the 90 percent paid by allies then, to 90 percent we are paying now. The same with the level of troops and this faux coalition.

Thoughts?

[in_cog_ni_to]

1. I loved it.

It's about time the sheeple see a bit of reality. They need to see that fowers are not being thrown, but BOMS are. They need to see that people are not welcoming the soldiers with open arms, but are killing killing them. The sheeple need a wake up call. Look at what F 911 did. No, I think it's a good thing.

Kerry's next ad...or the DNC...Moveon....should be The COFFINS on the plane. SHOW THE REALITIES OF WAR.

[seraph]

2. I think it's good.

I think THIS is good too.


Radio Actuality: Kerry on $3 Trillion Cost of Bush-Cheney Agenda
To: National Desk, Political Reporter
Contact: Allison Dobson of Kerry-Edwards 2004,
202-464-2800; http://www.johnkerry.com

WASHINGTON, Sept. 18 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Continuing to show the
stark contrast between what the president says and what the
president does, the Kerry-Edwards campaign has made a new radio
actuality available today. The actuality, recorded by Senator John
Kerry, is focused on new reports that the presidents plans for
America will cost taxpayers at least $3 trillion.

Text of the actuality follows:

"After inheriting a record surplus, it only took George Bush
four years to spend his way into record deficits -- trillions upon
trillions of debt that our children will be paying down for years
to come.

"But when it comes to spending taxpayer money, the president is
just getting warmed up.

"This week, we learned that George Bush's election year promises
will cost taxpayers at least another $3 trillion. $3 trillion to
privatize Social Security. $3 trillion to pay for his ineffective,
unaffordable tax cuts. $3 trillion of more record-breaking
deficits.

"George Bush has blamed these deficits on just about everyone
but himself. But this week, we learned that the presidents
deficits are a result of the president's spending habits and this
is one $3 trillion habit that America can't afford.

"I believe it's time Washington lived within a budget just like
the rest of America does. That's why my plan is paid for while
cutting the deficit in half in four years. That's the responsible
way to handle our budget so that middle-class families can grow
theirs."

The actuality can be found at the following links:

RealAudio Stream

http://www.johnkerry.com/audio/091704(under)actuality.ram

RealAudio Download

http://www.johnkerry.com/audio/091704(under)actuality.rm

Windows Media

http://www.johnkerry.com/audio/091704(under)actuality.asf

MPEG Download

http://www.johnkerry.com/audio/091704(under)actuality.mp3

Paid for by Kerry-Edwards 2004, Inc.


http://www.usnewswire.com
-0-
/U.S. Newswire 202-347-2770/




AP-NY-09-18-04 0839EDT

[Lugnut]

3. I like it.

The Rethugs are jumping up and down over it so it must frighten them. They can't handle anybody trying to tell the truth.

[Suzi Creamcheese]

4. I agree with you completely

It gives you a visceral charge, but the soldier surrendering seems to be firing up the Bush base more than anything else

[SeekingTruth]

6. Exactly...

Also, like the above poster mentioned, dipictions of the caskets might work better than the image of a sinking soldier.

And in this thread emerges another great ad about Bush hiding shit - it can start with the images of the caskets and the Dover Test and how Bush tried to hide those photos, then move to the planned troop call ups AFTER the election, then the hiding of the latest report given to Bush back in July about how bad Iraq has been and is getting. (After reading the last several issues of the big three news magazines, I've asked co-workers - mainly repugs - if they have any idea how bad it is in Iraq and they reply that same old Repug talking point of, "Bullshit!! The media isn't reporting the good things." Really, the big three have done some really good reporting on conditions in Iraq the past three or four issues.")

[Pathwalker]

5. It's playing here in Michigan.

My family hoorahs everytime they see it - small sample to be sure, but I see nothing wrong with it - we love it!

[shrumbody]

7. The Ad Sux

Get's very difficult for us to say we support the troops with so many embracing this kind of crap. Kerry needs swing voters and this stuff isn't going to get them.

[partygirl]

8. I really like it.

I think it is very powerful to see the soldier surrendering.

Of course we support the troops, we just want to see them come home.

[SeekingTruth]

17. The solider is not surrendering...

he is trying to keep his gun out of the quagmire....

I'm sick of everyone, especially Bob Dole, saying the soldier is surrendering - he is doing what any good solider would do - keep his weapon safe so he'll have something to use....

[Southern Patriot]

18. Surrendering?

This is the second person that I've heard of who's perceived the soldier to be surrendering.

I don't see that at all. I see him holding his gun above his head to keep it out of the "quagmire." To me the image brings back images of Americans in Vietnam wading through chest deep rice paddies etc.

Oddly enough, the other person was a died in the wool Repub.

If a lot of people perceive the soldier to be surrending--- and it seems like a certain number do--- that's a terrible result.

I'd pull the commercial immediately.

[Julien Sorel]

9. It's a little risky but I like it.

As the negative news comes out and the casualties continue to mount, people are going to start thinking about Iraq, and when they do, they are going to look for someone to blame.

My only concern is timetable -- when will people decide enough is enough there -- and the possibility that people will look at the ad as defeatist. We will see.

For those who haven't seen the ad, here's a link: http://www.moveonpac.org/#

[stylerm]

10. they should make one showcasing LB killing that 17 yr old

With that "have a drink have a drive song" song playing in the background.

Have it tell the story of LB running a stop sign and killing a 17 year old...and mix in photos of GWB partying hard.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mr.Green93]

12. it should have ended

with a U.N. solider reaching down to rescue the american.

[Joe Turner]

13. The ad would be better without the soldier imagery

I fear that showing a U.S. solider sinking into the ground as he holds a gun above his head may elicit a negative reaction from many.

Right message, wrong imagery.

[Doosh]

14. it's good, just nothing has "worked" recently

[Leilani]

15. I don t like it at all.

Our soldiers are in enough of a mess, without being used as a political tool.

This ad works for committed anti-war types. They are either voting for Kerry or Nader.

It does nothing to convince those needing to be convinced.

[lgardengate]

16. You Are Right. Americans DON"T want to see our soldiers

sinking in quicksand,while giving up. This will Not do Kerry any good and may totaly backfire.