Hey Obama - Stop treating the majority as the far left - you are going to fall on health care

[debbierlus]

I am so sick and tired of the myth that Obama is placating the right and walking the midde. Bullshit.

He is governing to the right and trying to placate the majority.

The MAJORITY want single payer health care, Mr Obama.

The doctors and nurses of this nation want single payer.

The country wants single payer.

And, you? You allow the insurance company leeches to write OUR healthcare policy for the SOLE PURPOSE for them to PROFIT off our sickness.

It is disgusting, Mr. President. It is abhorrent. It is gross.

The pushback begins now.

We are NOT the fringe

We are NOT the radicals

We are right. And, we won't be silent.

[quiller4]

1. I want single payer. You want single payer. The majority-not so much.

Although I wish he weren't, Obama is correct. His is a middle position. Yours and mine is not close to a majority view. Even in my precinct which is deeply blue, single payer has only minority support.

[Cant trust em]

2. I think you're right

I think that most Americans are more comfortable with incremental progress.

[Jennicut]

9. The public is split on closing Gitmo so its no surprise.

Obama is actually pushing left on these issues since the public opinion has been manipulated to the right.

[Kahuna]

47. Exactly! Let's get that public option going and working and incrementally

we can get to universal coverage without an extreme shock to the economy, jobs and the healthcare delivery system.

[leftstreet]

3. LOL you obviously don't know many people n/t

[grantcart]

4. I don't think the majority of Americans even understand it.

I am for it, have read quite a bit about it but am still somewhat foggy on the difference between UK, Germany, Netherlands etc.

[Occam Bandage]

6. A major problem. There is still a widespread fear of losing "the ability to choose,"

just as there is a widespread desire for massive change. That could have been overcome by a strong advertising/outreach campaign, but it seems Obama's hitched his wagon to a public option, which is at least a major reform.

[Ms. Toad]

93. A public option is not a major reform.

It is a very small change from what is already provided under HIPPA, unless it includes a public subsidy to make the public health option affordable.

Obama is talking about a public option combined with mandatory insurance requirement. Everyone must buy insurance from either the public plan or a private carrier. What he proposes for the poor is (1) a waiver so you do not get punished if you do not buy insurance (not subsidy) and (2) an "afforable" plan which provides preventative coverage (i.e. routine physicals, immunizations and things of that nature) and catastrophic coverage for actual care (which typically kicks in after you have already spent around $5000 on top of the premiums - typically in the range of $1200-$5000 for a catastrophic care policy).

Currently, virtually everyone is eligible to purchase some insurance under HIPPA (they make it hard to find, and lots of people don't know about it, but unless you are in the midst of a long term hospitalization at the time you are seeking insurance HIPPA requires that someone in your state make insurance available). The cost is the issue - currently in Ohio this option for full coverage is around $14,000 a year - not much different than premiums + $5000 out of pocket under Obama's "afforable" basic plan if your regular health care expenses run more than $5000 a year - which is not unusual for individuals with chronic health issues, and chances are if you do not have chronic health issues you have better options via short term policies or competitive "open market" insurance.

[Sebastian Doyle]

96. Well, that's probably true enough, due to corporate media manipulation.

You get the right wingers yelling "SOCIALIZED MEDICINE !1!1!!!!1" while the TV networks sell pharmaceutical drugs the same way they sell sugar coated cereal during kids progams. Had it not been for Michael Moore's "Sicko" the general public would be largely misinformed or not informed at all, and tragcially, not everyone has seen the movie, let alone done their own research on the subject.

The people who DO know are also the ones who realize the corporatist health care system is not working.

Harry Truman tried to do the right thing in 1947. That's when many other countries started their own plans. And all of them are doing better in health care now. One can only imagine what Truman would say if he were with us today. After he beat the crap out of Harry Reid and Max Baucus, that is.

[bluestateguy]

8. Health care is a very complicated policy

Because of that it's easy to mold public opinion to your liking.

You give a health insurance industry group billions to play with, some Ivy leaguge educated PR and marketing experts, and a willing cable news channel (ahem, Fox) to do their bidding, and they can make the people believe anything at all.

[ljm2002]

62. You say...

..."Even in my precinct which is deeply blue, single payer has only minority support."

Do you have any links to back that up? Because what I am reading seems to indicate otherwise:

(added on edit) The media would like us to think that ours is a minority view. They go along with our lawmakers in trying to hide the facts about what the people want. So it is easy to see why so many think it is a "minority" viewpoint. But, as they say, Google is your friend. (end edit)

3 results from a google of "poll single payer health care":

http://www.healthcare-now.org/2009/02/another-poll-shows-majority-support-for-single-payer/

Another Poll Shows Majority Support for Single-Payer

February 5, 2009 by Healthcare-NOW!


A New York Times/CBS News poll released last week shows, yet again, that the majority of Americans support national health insurance.

The poll, which compares answers to the same questions from 30 years ago, finds that, “59% say the government should provide national health insurance, including 49% who say such insurance should cover all medical problems.”

Only 32% think that insurance should be left to private enterprise.

=====

http://www.davidsirota.com/2006/03/news-flash-america-wants-single-payer.html

http://abcnews.go.com/images/pdf/935a3HealthCare.pdf

<...>As an ABC News/Washington Post poll showed in 2003, the majority of Americans support a single-payer, government-sponsored health care system, even when they hear the right-wing's alarmist arguments.

Here are the key findings:

- Question 48 in the poll shows that 79% of Americans say they support "providing health care coverage for all Americans, even if it means raising taxes" over "holding down taxes, even if it means some Americans do not have health care coverage."

- Question 49 shows 62% say they support a universal health care system "run by the government and financed by taxpayers" over the current system.

- Question 50 shows 57% say they would support this program even "if it limited your own choice of doctors" (which doesn't necessarily have to be a side-effect of a single-payer system).

- Similarly, question 51 shows 62% say they would support this program even "if it meant there were waiting lists for some non-emergency treatments" (again, not necessarily a side-effect).

<...>

=====

http://www.wpasinglepayer.org/PollResults.html

(gathers several polls that indicate broad support for single payer / universal health care)

[Honeycombe8]

65. O wants a public option. Most people would agree w/that. Sounds good to me.

I could opt in to the public option, if I wanted. But I could also buy a policy, if I wanted. (The ins. cos. would have to compete with the public option, which is why they're scared.)

Great Britain has this. Canada has this. Both countries have single payer, with the ability of citizens to still buy private ins. coverage. Most people go with the public option, I think.

This sounds good to me.

[quantass]

79. I'm Canadian and it baffles me why Majority do not

want single payer...*shutter* at the thought that the American majority is brainwashed to be afraid.

[ooglymoogly]

83. What an easy statement to make....without a link or proof

it is just a bag of wind.

[rpannier]

87. really now???

CNN/Opinion Research Corporation Poll. Feb. 18-19, 2009. N=1,046 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3.
“In general, would you favor or oppose a program that would increase the federal government’s influence over the country’s health care system in an attempt to lower costs and provide health care coverage to more Americans?”

Favor: 72%
Oppose: 27%
Unsure: 1%

"In general, would you favor or oppose a program that would increase the federal government's influence over the country's health care system in an attempt to lower costs and provide health care coverage to more Americans?" N=515 (Form A), MoE ± 4.5

favor 69
oppose 29
unsure 1

"In general, would you favor or oppose a program that would increase the federal government's influence over the health care you and your family receive in an attempt to lower costs and provide health care coverage to more Americans?" N=515 (Form A), MoE ± 4.5

favor 63
oppose 36
unsure 2

"Do you think the federal government should guarantee health care for all Americans, or don't you think so?" N=495 (Form B), MoE ± 4.5

should guarantee 62
don't think so 38
unsure 1

http://www.ask.com/bar?q=%22polls+on+single+payer+health+plan%22&page=1&qsrc=2417&ab=4&u=http%3A%2F%2Fblog.sustainablemiddleclass.com%2F%3Fcat%3D66

[debbierlus]

91. They have done their misinformation campaign well when those on our side don't know the facts

http://www.healthcare-now.org/2009/02/another-poll-shows-majority-support-for-single-payer/

[Occam Bandage]

5. The polls showing majority support for single-payer are usually something like,

"Do you think things are good now, or do you want single payer?" I haven't seen any recent polls on single payer versus public option versus cost-control reform with no public option. I don't doubt that there is a much bigger public support for single payer than there is in Washington, but I'm not sure it's majority.

[leftstreet]

10. You don't see any recent polls because they're not stupid enough to poll us

Most of the polls are older, but always ran a high % desire for single payer

This issue is so hot, the MedicalPharmaceutical Industrial Complex lobbyists don't WANT the politicians to access public opinion

[DrToast]

14. Here's a recent poll

While recent polling has shown consistent broad support for comprehensive health care reform, this poll specifically addressed whether people want a choice of a public health insurance plan. The answer is an overwhelming yes: 73% of voters want a choice of a private or public health insurance plan, including Democrats (77%), Independents (79%), and Republicans (63%).

http://www.healthcareforamericanow.org/site/content/public_rejects_insurance_industrys_misleading_claims_new_poll_shows

[leftstreet]

15. ROFL 'Healthcare For America Now' ROFL

:rofl:

[DrToast]

20. Gosh..you sound credible.

Seriously, do you really think you're doing the cause much good much spouting lies like "The majority want single payer!" No they don't. Now if you wish the majority did, then you need to start helping educate people. You don't get your way simply by pretending something is so.

[mkultra]

31. be nice, he is just being an activist

Its his job to stand semi-alone and scream incomprehensible half-truths in the name of truth and justice. Hes just doing his job.

[leftstreet]

36. I can be snarky, I'm not getting paid

;-)

[mkultra]

63. well, we appreciate your volunteerism

where would us moral relativists be without the purists.

[Kalyke]

40. But, uh... they do want it.

CNN/Opinion Research Corporation Poll. Feb. 18-19, 2009. N=1,046 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3.
“In general, would you favor or oppose a program that would increase the federal government’s influence over the country’s health care system in an attempt to lower costs and provide health care coverage to more Americans?”

Favor: 72%
Oppose: 27%
Unsure: 1%

CBS News/New York Times Poll. Jan. 11-15, 2009. N=1,112 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3.
“Should the government in Washington provide national health insurance, or is this something that should be left only to private enterprise?”

Government: 59%
Private Enterprise: 32%
Unsure: 9%

http://blog.sustainablemiddleclass.com/?p=1105 (with links to actual polls)

The poll, which compares answers to the same questions from 30 years ago, finds that, “59% say the government should provide national health insurance, including 49% who say such insurance should cover all medical problems.”

Only 32% think that insurance should be left to private enterprise.

http://www.healthcare-now.org/2009/02/another-poll-shows-majority-support-for-single-payer/

So... yes - the majority DO want some form of single-payer/nationalized health insurance plan.

[DrToast]

50. The first poll isn't about single payer

And the second poll asks the question in such a way that force people to choose public or private. But those aren't the only choices. In the poll I linked above, the public & private plans overwhelmingly beats the public only or private only plans.

[Occam Bandage]

38. I agree with your underlying point. It's impossible to find recent polls that haven't been

either commissioned by single-payer advocates (and constructed as "do you want single payer, or should everything stay like it is now") or commissioned by single-payer detractors (and constructed as, "should the government take away your right to choose your health care plan?"")

[DaLittle Kitty]

67. Letter To Obama Here... Single Payer IS OFF Da Table Cause All Da Pols Are BOUGHT!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8449124&mesg_id=8449124

[Kahuna]

26. That poll doesn't poll the "single payer" option. It addresses choice..

which is what our president supports.

[DrToast]

27. It does poll the single payer option

And you're right that most people prefer a choice between public and private. That was my point.

[Kahuna]

28. Got ya!

:thumbsup:

[DrToast]

7. The majority do not want single payer

Why do people keep saying this?

[redqueen]

16. Cause it justifies their outrage, feelings of betrayal & disappointment, etc.

[Kahuna]

23. Neither Obama or any Democrat ran on single payer. Single payer

would be great. But it will not be done overnight. This is something that must be done in baby steps. If we get a public option and people see how that can work well, we can work our way up to single payer.

Also, in this economy, no one is going to displace the workers that would be displaced by an entire overhaul of the healthcare system. It just is not going to happen. All those holding their breath are doing so in vain.

[Cant trust em]

34. Why do some people not understand how difficult it would be to implement that goal over night?

There's significant opposition to the President's plan as it stands. Imagine if he were calling for all-out single payer.

[Kahuna]

35. They're just being dense?

:shrug:
;)

[Cant trust em]

37. It's a lack of understanding of the political process.

Getting from one extreme to the other is going to be a long process. There is a lot of push back and demanding that it all happen at once is not going to get it done.

I appreciate their advocacy, without it the conversation only stays within a certain box. But demonizing Obama is not the way to achieve their goal. Taking this beyond policy and making it personal is going to alienate them from the process.

[tomp]

90. i understand the political process.

if the entire democratic party actually wanted what was good for the people we would be able to enact anything we want right now. but they don't, so we can't. (political process=max baucus)

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

56. Some will not accept political reality.

There is no way that the health insurance industry is going away completely, overnight. I hate the insurance industry and would like it to go away, but they simply have too much power and influence.

Getting a public option included in the final plan will be a major victory.

[eridani]

57. Bullshit. Medicare was implemented in a year starting from scratch

We won't be starting from scratch.

[avaistheone1]

64. That is a myth. Single-payer is not difficult to implement at all.

People can use existing medical facilities and their own doctors or get new ones if they choose to do so. The only thing that changes is that the government pays the bills and negotiates fees and services with doctors and hospitals on an annual basis.

[Cant trust em]

70. Those are logistics. There are also political concerns. nt

[avaistheone1]

72. Like what? The health insurance lobbyists don't get their payola payback?

Logistics? If we can launch a war in Afghanistan or Iraq in a matter of weeks, why can't we launch Medicare for all in a similar manner.

[Cant trust em]

73. You're exactly right. There is political opposition to single payer.

It's not going to disappear overnight.

As for your Iraq comparison it's not analogous. America has had a preoccupation with war forever, so THAT we can do at the drop of a hat. Taking care of sick people has never been as important, so it will take longer to figure out. I'm not saying that I disagree with you, but that this is going to be a long hard slog.

[avaistheone1]

76. People said it was going to be a long hard slog this last election for a black man to become

president. It happened. Yes, we can!!!!!!!!!!!

This is our TIME. NOW is our time.

Single payer national health insurance.

[Cant trust em]

78. The fight to get a black man elected president started a long time before Obama

He is the culmination of a decades long struggle in that regard. To use your analogy, I look at this health care reform the same way I would civil rights legislation. A first step in a long war.

[avaistheone1]

80. Correction: there has been a decades old movement for national health insurance since the 1940's.

btw...How soon we forget the discussion on this very board...that it would probably not be possible for a black man to become president in 2008.

[Cant trust em]

81. What was the last significant step in the national health care fight? nt

[avaistheone1]

82. What do you consider a significant step?

By the same token - what do you consider a significant step that paved the way for Obama as a black man to succeed to the presidency?

[Cant trust em]

97. A significant step for health care would be the inclusion of a public option, IMO

Up to this point there hasn't been the public option for anyone but the poor and the elderly. Opening up access to regular folks would be significant.

I'm not a huge health care advocate, so I fully admit my lack of in-depth knowledge on the subject.

As for getting Obama president, there have been several significant steps. The ending of slavery, the civil rights era, Jesse Jackson running. Also, I think that Obama is unique in his ability to communicate, so that bridged a lot of gaps. That being said, I think it's going to be a helluva long time before we see a guy like Jim Clyburn get elected president.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

59. "It cannot be done overnight"?

I'd like to get some perspective on this from older Canadians.

I have vague memories of vacationing in Canada as a child while single payer was being introduced there. I think Saskatchewan got it first.

[Butch350]

94. Thank You! Eyes opened...

and displace the workers who support them in some way, the health care suppliers, like companies who supply with forms, computer equipt, janitorial services who clean their buildings empty their trash, etc.

[avaistheone1]

66. That was a ignorant response.

You just made yourself stand out as someone who clearly have no understanding or empathy about the issue.

[redqueen]

68. I'm sure it's your opinion that that was AN ignorant response.

But IMO you just made yourself stand out as someone who doesn't understand how politics works.

[avaistheone1]

71. This about the most basic of human rights not about politics.

If you think this is about politics - when do you think the politics will be will be just right to proceed given the Democrats have the White House, Senate and the Congress?



Of all the forms of inequality, injustice in health care is the most shocking and inhumane--Martin Luther King

[LoZoccolo]

11. "The MAJORITY want single payer health care, Mr Obama." - Document or retract. n/t

[Kahuna]

21. Ed Shultz says so, so it must be true....

:eyes: Ed never provides and documentation either. :shrug:

[Sunnyshine]

43. Actually, Big Eddie did provide documentation when he interviewed Dr. Flowers.

http://www.bigeddieradio.com/videoblog/details.asp?BID=111

[Kahuna]

46. He could never have provided evidence of "single payer" because

there is none. There was a poll a while back that said Americans would be willing to pay higher taxes for healthcare, but it's a leap to assume the respondents equated that with "single payer."

[Sunnyshine]

54. Dr. Flowers presented that evidence and even cited the polling on his show!

You saw a poll a while back, but somehow you equate that one poll with our leaping to equations.

Plenty of evidence is to be found, if you are willing to do some reading and research. Shame of it is, most of these big pharma, media, insurer, lobbyist groups that fight to stop this are so tied together, their polls meticulously avoid any specific reference to Single-Payer.

For some strange reason...

[Sunnyshine]

39. The majority has for nearly 2 decades. 32% think that insurance should be left to private enterp.

Must read interview here: http://www.1payer.net/myblog/news-and-blogs/122.html

“The same people who are saying that single-payer is not politically feasible are the
same people who were saying that in 1993,” when a push for a proposal similar to GAC failed,
he says. “You’re contributing to a self-fulfilling prophecy, and you need to own up to that.”

Recent National poll:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/30/sunday/main4765027.shtml

Following polls showing support by majority is provided by:WPCSPH

http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/resources/PollMemo.pdf

http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/SunMo_poll_0209.pdf

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/november/single_payer_ballot_.php

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x2882.xml?ReleaseID=1164

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/march/most_doctors_support.php

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/december/where_are_we_on_refo.php

http://www.nhms.org/topics/12-14-2007_a.pdf

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/may/new_polls_on_univers.php

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/march/public_opinion_on_he.php

http://www.minnesotamedicine.com/PastIssues/February2007/ClinicalHealthCareFebruary2007/tabid/1709/Default.aspx

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2005/october/wsjharris_75_sup.php

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2004/november/public_opinion_of_co.php

http://abcnews.go.com/images/pdf/935a3HealthCare.pdf

?w=450&h=455

[LoZoccolo]

42. I've already read the first two and neither of them support the assertion.

The first:

On the matter of health insurance ... Nearly half of all Americans now want the government to provide it for all problems.

This is not single-payer. Yes, most people want government insurance. No, it is not established that they want only government insurance.

Second one:

Proposals to expand Medicare to all Americans as an alternative to private insurance are met with widespread
approval by voters nationwide.

This is also not single-payer. It specifically says that it's one alternative.

I am not going to go through the rest of them and find that they don't say what you say they say. I'll give you one more chance to filter your list down to three entries that definitively say that the majority want single-payer health care before I conclude that the single-payer advocates are following a mendacious strategy that has deserved them a non-place at the table.

[Sunnyshine]

51. Those polls show Americans approve of Gov. as NHI provider and payer!

Don't talk down to me. I have done nothing to attack you- nor do I deserve such a remark.

The polls are right there. You should take the time to look into the relevance of a decade of polls showing support for adopting a universal/national health insurance program in which everyone is guaranteed covered under a program like Medicare that is run by the government and financed by taxpayers. Single payer keeps everyone entitled to receiving health care, regardless of circumstance.

Who opposes that? The minority of Americans who feel they are superior to others in deserving good health.

There is no way to reform or improve a very broken and corrupt system. Of which, I work in. Instead, we want to improve the lives of every American without interference from an industry that has been built upon malfeasance. Go after the culprits with your chances...

We want a public plan that organizes health financing on a national level. It is ultimately the best way to re prioritize and equalize the basic human need of receiving health care. Our right to care for each other supersedes their right to profit from managing the sick.

Single payer eliminates insurance companies as pricey middlemen. The government pays care providers directly. That is it in a nut shell.

[LoZoccolo]

53. Neither of the polls substantiate the claim that the majority wants single-payer.

And you actually are offending me with a disingenuous claim.

[Sunnyshine]

55. Single payer describes how the cost are met via National Health Insurance.

Again, those profiting from big pharma/private ins./special interests makes sure many of these polls meticulously avoid any specific reference to Single-Payer, but the public option is certainly supported by the majority of Americans. Those polls are specific on that.

[LoZoccolo]

85. No they're not, where are they specific? Single-payer advocates come off like a bunch of liars.

Quote the poll that says the majority of Americans support that. If they really did support single-payer, they wouldn't have to phrase the thing not to mention single-payer. You know what this reminds me of? People who try to get you involved in Amway. They won't say it's Amway for a long time into the pitch.

Even you speak of a public option. There is no public option in single-payer, it's a public mandate. By definition there is one payer, and that's the government. People don't want that and it's never been established that they do, ever. Quit messing around. At this point - if I knew nothing else about health care - I would reject single-payer just due to the fact that it's proponents can't seem to stop trying to be manipulative in their rhetoric, or they can't get their act together.

[Sunnyshine]

89. Gosh, your nice. Yes there is, yes I know it means mandating one public plan to cover all.

Option refers to having a choice- as I hope we do- to fund a national public plan vs only being able to buy private insurance.

A majority of Americans do support the creation of a National Health Plan.
"59% say the government should provide national health insurance,
including 49% who say such insurance should cover all medical problems."
http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/SunMo_poll_0209.pdf

Single-payer health care is a term used in the United States to describe the payment of providers from a single fund. We already have nearly a single payer system with Medicare. I would like to be able to participate if I had that option. It would be easy to accomplish, because it would include anyone with a social security card. If you don't participate, or are not a citizen, or do not qualify for public plan- you can still buy insurance- similar to Canada. Many will buy improved, affordable, and openly accountable private insurance.

Most countries use a hybrid system, but the majority of their people still rely solely upon public plan.
The magic is, single payer encourages providers to compete based on the quality of care...not numbers.

Vets, Soldiers, Medicare, Unions, Firefighters, Uninsured workers, Nurses, Families- so many of these hard working people have been bankrupted by astronomical health cost. All these Americans want to combine our purchasing power and join forces to make a Universal Health Plan that delivers higher quality care at lower cost. What is so bad about the idea that WE stand up for ourselves and stop allowing private for profit insurance/HMO's to dictate to us how to acquire care and decisions re: our health and treatments.

We must liberate ourselves from the chains of the North American system. Their profiteering is purposely interfering with PTs and DRs.

I am tired of seeing American's being bullied by this terribly abusive system- and people die, or go broke fighting to pay bills related to living and dying. Single payer eliminates this waste and greed. Guess what? The cost and care are so improved, that it reduces the excessive number of middle man insurers. In study after study- countries realized the results were broad reaching and a positive way to improve health care primarily for the public good overall, but it also cleans up the private sector as well.

I am not manipulating anyone. I think you are just trying to scare people against what we advocate.
Weird, cuz most in the medical community agree with me. We work in Health care...go figure!

Congress said they want to make a "uniquely American solution" out of this.
If they want us to succeed- they better include a public option for all.
Single payer will rescue our majority working class and save our economy!

edit for sp. and add link

[debbierlus]

92. Here:

http://www.healthcare-now.org/2009/02/another-poll-shows-majority-support-for-single-payer/

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2006/12/31/silent_majority_for_single_payer/

And, a great overall resource on the subject:

http://www.pnhp.org/facts/single_payer_resources.php

When do we join together & fight for our health & our lives and stop meekly accepting the meager crumbs that Obama & the health insurance corporate leeches throw us?

[4lbs]

12. Howard Dean laid it out very eloquently yesterday on The Ed Show.

He said that there are three possibilities in health coverage:

1.) Almost entirely Private Insurance. That's what we have now.

2.) Private Insurance + Public Healthcare option (that would be Medicare the way Congress gets it). It allows individuals the choice of whether they want to continue their private insurance, or go with the public government sponsored option. Uninsured or underinsured will obviously choose the public option since they don't already have (enough) health coverage.

3.) Public MANDATORY single-payer (read: US Government only) health coverage. Everybody in the country is covered by government Medicare, regardless of whether they were happy with their private insurance or not.


Howard Dean said that he supported option 2. He said we have to give everyone a choice to opt in to public health care. Mr. Dean said that making it mandatory had little support.


I support option 2 as well. While I would likely opt in to the public health care option, since it would almost certainly be cheaper than what I'm paying for now, there was a time when my private insurance would have been cheaper with better coverage. Back then I would have chosen to keep my private insurance.

Howard Dean also said that this talk about taxing health care benefits was mainly targeted towards those making a lot annually (say, more than $100K). Those people can afford private insurance, but if they choose the public option, they would be asked to finance it (via taxes), to help subsidize low-income entrants.

[Jennicut]

30. Will Howard be thrown under the bus now too? Funny how Obama never promised

single payer, EVER in his campaign and yet some here are "outraged". I prefer a choice, actually.

[babylonsister]

13. Obama affirmed his support for the creation of a government-sponsored health insurance plan

Did you miss this or is that selective sight?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8447766&mesg_id=8447766

[Kahuna]

29. Some people are DEMANDING the elimination of private ins, as if

that is going to happen overnight. :crazy: It won't. It would take several years, if ever to accomplish that. In this economy, no one is going to displace employees that work for healthcare companies. It just not going to happen.

[avaistheone1]

75. Oh please, telecom jobs and software jobs have been shipped out of this country overnight for over

a decade. These engineers go to work one morning and it is announced that they are going to be training their replacement overseas and then they are given a few weeks notice to find another job. I do not support having to pay my health care dollars for a bunch of administrative employees who are wasting over 30% of my health dollars while denying care. That is plain stupid.

Besides single-payer health care will create over 2.6 million new jobs while provide peace of mind and affordable health care for all Americans.

[redqueen]

17. The 'pushback' should have started months ago...

glad we're finally all on board with the need to do our part.

[natrat]

18. who are you talking too? the guy is just another whore politician

and he is not listening to you or me
seems all we can do is vent

[redqueen]

25. "just another whore politician"...

Nice.

[Butch350]

95. He trying to do what's best for the country...

then comes you and me.

[HamdenRice]

19. "The pushback begins now." -- I am typing SO HARD on my keyboard ...

you wouldn't believe! Mr. Obama, you better watch out!1!! I'm comin to get you right here on DU. You can't hide! I know you are quaking in your BOOTS!

[Cant trust em]

33. LOL. I wonder what percentage of the rants on DU actually wind up being calls to action.

Not to say that this one isn't, but I get the sense that this is more armchair activism.

[Honeycombe8]

22. Why are you so angry? Why are you so angry at Obama? You said...

"He is governing to the right and trying to placate the majority."

How is he governing to the right?

You said, "We are NOT the fringe. We are NOT the radicals."

Do you have a link to a quote by Obama saying that people who want single payer are the fringe or are radicals?

I didn't think so.

If you want to be taken seriously, map out your arguments, focus on your true enemies, get your statements correct, and prepare to back it all up with links to sources. Otherwise, you're spittin' in the wind. It may feel good, but it doesn't advance your cause.

[dgibby]

24. I agree.

Here's an article you might find interesting. It cites a poll that shows a majority of Americans support single payer.

http://www.yesmagazine.org/article.asp?ID=2833

[EndElectoral]

32. The failure of Obama to push for this may be his sword of Damocles

We really need Single Payer. People are in dire need of it. 50 million peopel can't even get in line. 100 million aren't even sure if they are covered. it's a mess.

[Teaser]

41. "We are right. And, we won't be silent."...In space, no one can here you scream

on the internet, we can hear you, but we just don't care.

[dionysus]

44. ROFL

[WI_DEM]

45. Does the majority want single payer? I do, but I doubt the majority does

I think, actually, there are lots of people out there who are happy with there own health insurance. Do you have a poll which sites that the majority want single payer?

[quickesst]

48. If I thought the same way the op.....

...and I emphasize that if I THOUGHT THE SAME WAY as the op and the many like-minded do at this point, I'd probably feel like a total moron for being played like a fiddle by the Obama camp. Fortunately, I listened to what he said during his campaign, especially the ge, and to this point, I believe he is doing a pretty good job, therefore I do not feel like a total moron at all. With an approval rating of at least sixty percent, I doubt the "majority" feel like they're being treated like the far left. Truth is, the far left is being treated like the far left, and trying to morph them into something else is not going to work with the math being used. As I've stated before, a lot of people tried to tell others what Obama was actually saying, but the heads were so far up in the ideological clouds, there was really no point. Now that the fantasy has proven a non-reality, people don't understand how that could have happened. I do remember how many people were so fucking mad after the primaries because a few said they couldn't support Obama. They endured the accusation of racism, were called idiots, and pretty much the entire spectrum of insults were hurled their way. Seems the shoe is on the other foot, and I find it amusing how totally many on the left have embraced that way of thinking without any thought nor apology for those who came before with the same "criticisms". Thanks.
quickesst

[slipslidingaway]

49. CBS/NY Times Poll Shows Broad Support for Government Health Care

http://www.takepart.com/blog/2009/02/16/cbsny-times-poll-shows-broad-support-for-government-healthcare/

"A recent CBS News/NY Times poll shows broad public support for some form of government health care. The poll find that 49% of all Americans support a comprehensive government health care system to deal with all medical problems, while another 10% of those polled supported a limited government health care system geared toward emergencies. 32% of poll respondents thought that private enterprise should handle health care while the remaining 9% simply didn’t know..."




http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/SunMo_poll_0209.pdf

"HEALTH INSURANCE

Americans are more likely today to embrace the idea of the government providing health insurance than they were 30 years ago. 59% say the government should provide national health insurance, including 49% who say such insurance should cover all medical problems.
In January 1979, four in 10 thought the federal government should provide national insurance. Back then, more Americans thought health insurance should be left to private enterprise..."

[Cant trust em]

52. This poll seems a little dualistic.

it's like you can only be for government health care or private insurance. Is dualistic the right word?

[slipslidingaway]

58. They at least had a choice in this poll between all medical problems

and a limited plan to cover just emergencies, however they are defined.

Many countries that have a national health system still have private companies, but they are highly regulated and/or play a much smaller role than they do in the US.

Although President Obama abandoned his support for a single-payer system once he was elected to the Senate, he did state that all parties would sit down to discuss how we should move forward on HC, that has not happened.

:(

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[zulchzulu]

61. So get out in the street and make a difference...

I'm for single payer healthcare, but certainly understand that it is going to be incremental to get there. This is based on political reality and how the lobbyists in DC and elsewhere working for Big Pharma and Big Insurance have a lot of control over impending votes by politicians on both sides of the aisle.

Join a grassroots group in your town and educate people on the benefits of single payer healthcare. As for Obama, he can only do so much. He's not a dictator.

[avaistheone1]

69. "Poll Excludes Single-Payer Healthcare; Respondents Implicitly Endorse It Anyway"

An article posted at The Huffington Post yesterday, Poll: 73% of Voters Think Health Care Reform Must Include Choice of a Public Health Insurance Plan, drew attention to a recent poll commissioned by HCAN (Healthcare for America Now) that suggests strong grassroots support for the Obama-supported Healthcare reform plan. It is indeed an interesting survey, though not a particularly candid or objective one, and if one reads between the lines, the survey strongly suggests that the one option respondents were not asked to consider, the Single-Payer option, would have resoundingly defeated the others if it had been included in the survey questionnaire.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Poll-Excludes-Single-Payer-by-Jerry-Policoff-090312-353.html



No matter how much our elected officials try to reject single-payer, the number of Americans who favor continue to grow. The Democratic leadership is either totally tone deaf or they have completely sold out.

[EndElectoral]

84. Sold out...not tone deaf. They hear it, they choose to ignore it. Ask Baucus.

[Lord Helmet]

74. Outrage on the interweb is like yelling into a paper bag.

[HughMoran]

77. lol

The O/P must have asthma then.

[babylonsister]

86. YOU are awesome because of the way you frame. And your dishonesty? Ha!

DU is embarrassing at times.

Next time, angry person, apply some links. Why you are not able is interesting. You shit and go. Most always. I do recall when you were wedded to an antique biz that didn't work.

I hope you are all all right. You have a 'puter to spew, so all must be well.

[inna]

88. K&FR~!

:applause:

:kick: