Nearly all of America voted for McCain

[Donald Ian Rankin]

Here's a picture that really made an impression on me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:2008_General_Election_Results_by_County.PNG

And remember, this is what the most impressive Democratic landslide for a generation or more looks like.

The biggest split in America isn't red-state vs blue-state, it's rural vs urban.

Just be grateful that America doesn't vote by acreage any more...

[Bicoastal]

1. broken link

[SidDithers]

2. Broken Link to picture...

here it is:


Sid

[iamthebandfanman]

3. u gotta keep in mind

in alot of those red counties, obama still got 40% of the vote...


last time i checked, obama won the popular vote...

[demnan]

5. Look how many blue counties are in South Carolina

who would have thought?

[sweetpotato]

34. Columbia - in the center of the state is very liberal

We are a university town as well as the seat of state government. Charleston county also went for Obama - liberal area there as well.

South Carolina has some very poor counties which are largely populated by African Americans. These counties also went for Obama.

The upstate - Greenville and Spartanburg in particular - are republican enclaves. Bob Jones university is there. There are some big money people there as well. And a lot of bigots - not much tolerance in the upstate. Heritage USA is also there (of Jim Bakker fame).

I don't have any suggestions for how to change their attitudes. I'm just glad I live in a libreal pocket.

[Two Americas]

56. anyone who has been there

It is the large cities in the northern states that turn them Democratic.

[GoesTo11]

6. Near lakes, major rivers and oceans is where they vote for Obama

The Great Lakes, Pacific and Atlantic are obvious. Then you can see the outline of the Mississippi river, the Colorado River, the Rio Grande and even the Columbia River.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

19. So to win the next election we need to build canals and induce mass flooding?

N.T.

[mmonk]

52. Sounds good.

[LiberalFighter]

22. That is where most people settle. Where most jobs are located.

[anneboleyn]

31. Those blue spots in Indiana are significant -- they happen to represent where people actually live

Indianapolis, Gary, Bloomington, etc., vs. the vast expanses of empty space and small towns that are red.

[qwlauren35]

39. Thanks for posting this - my first thought, is Iowa.

I've never thought of Iowa as "urban". Nor upper Wisconsin, nor upper Michigan. Definitely not the Texas/Mexico border, and no part of Mississippi. Not New Mexico, not Arizona.

Maine, Vermont and New Hampshire are as "un-urban" as the Northeast coast can get. And lily white, to boot.

And entire regions of Montana - unbelievable. Same as the chunks of North and South Dakota.

I looked at a map in Wikipedia that offers a really good contrast to this map, i.e. by population. The areas that McCain won definitely have low populations. But that ALSO shows that while it was a lot of land... it wasn't a lot of PEOPLE!

http:// en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:USA-2000-population-density.gif

55% of the popular vote is more than half. That's good enough for me.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

44. But all those states have urban parts.

And while I haven't checked, I'm willing to bet you all Lomard St to a china orange that in most cases it was the urban parts that went bluer than the rural ones (although I'm sure there are some exceptions).

[chiefofclarinet]

51. In Iowa, at least, that's true

IA-5, which is the eastern third of the state, went mostly solid McCain. (About six counties in IA-5 went Obama.) The only "cities" of note are Sioux City, the fourth biggest city in Iowa, which the county went a little more than 500 votes to McCain, and the city itself probably went to Obama, and Council Bluffs, the seventh largest city and an Omaha suburb. McCain won by 3 percentage points in its county, but Obama may have won the city.

IA-1 and IA-2, together making up the southeast quarter of the state, went almost solid Obama. (Butler County in District 1 went McCain a little over 300 votes. Some of District 2 also went McCain. Johnson County, home of Iowa City and the University of Iowa, went about 70% Obama.) These two districts include Cedar Rapids, the second biggest city and whose county went 60-39 in favor of Obama, Davenport, the third biggest city and whose county went 57-42 in favor of Obama, Iowa City, the fifth largest city whose county went 70-29 for Obama, Waterloo, the sixth largest city whose county went 61-38 to Obama, and Dubuque, the eighth largest city whose county went 56-39 for Obama.

IA-3 contains the largest city and the capital of Iowa, Des Moines, its suburbs, and little else. Polk County, the county that Des Moines metropolitan (yes, we can call it a metropolitan area... don't laugh) is in, went for Obama by 57-42.

IA-4 is even more desolate than IA-5 in some respects. The only "city" of note is Ames, a college town containing Iowa State University. Even though that area is rather conservative, I think the university saved the county; it went 57-41.

So, except for maybe one city, "urban" Iowa went blue, and rural Iowa went red.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

4. Vast expanses of the red area are . . . vast expanses

This map reflects exactly what you said - acreage versus population.

The other day I asked for a map that proportionately drew the states on a scale that represented their electoral votes - i.e. population - and if you look at that one you get just the opposite effect of the one you linked to here.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

9. Yes, but it also looks like the USA has had severe liposuction...

N.T.

[LynzM]

12. Those maps are really neat.

I saw one for 2004, but have yet to see one for this year... would you let me know if you find one? :hi:

[LynzM]

28. Like this one?

:D

[Donald Ian Rankin]

38. Any idea why that map is streaks of red vs blobs of blue?

Is it because of the computer programme used to generate it?

Or is it because of the actual pattern of people - blue blobs of urban sprawl that have been stretched, surrounded by red areas of countriside that have been compressed?

[slampoet]

41. Reflects the fact that people tend to live along Highways and other main roads when they are rural

[Hutzpa]

7. I don't think thats accurate n/t

[Left Is Write]

8. No, McCain wasn't chosen by "nearly all of America."

Obama won the popular vote by more than 6%.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

11. Obama was chosen by most America*n*s, certainly.

That's rather my point - even though Obama won the people by a large margin, McCain still won more land area.

[Left Is Write]

14. Then I don't understand your point. "Land area" doesn't vote.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

18. My point is that the correlation between population density and politics is strong.

If Obama can win the vote strongly, and still control massively less land area, it means that people who live in crowded areas (i.e. cities) must be voting Democratic far, far more than those in the country.

There is a strong cultural split in America; it's often discussed in terms of Red States vs Blue States; my impression is that it's closer to cities vs country, and that the difference between red states and blue states is how many of the people live in cities.

I can't find a list of US states by % of population who live in cities, but I bet that if you did nearly all the blue states would be above nearly all the red ones.

[Left Is Write]

21. Look at Idaho and Minnesota in your map.

Those blue areas are not the cities.

[chiefofclarinet]

54. In Minnesota, it is

Those little itty-bitty blue counties next to Wisconsin? That's the Twin Cities Metropolitan area, where 60% of the population lives. That went overwhelming blue (Hennepin County, home of Minneapolis, went 64-35 Obama; Ramsey County, home of St. Paul, went 66-32 Obama), whereas there are some exurb counties that either went barely Obama or barely McCain around that area.

If you move the Twin Cities to Wisconsin, the rest of the state would be as red as North Dakota. On the other hand, it would have at most 5 Congressional districts, and probably closer to 3 districts, making it smaller than Iowa and about the same size as Nebraska.

[Left Is Write]

55. I grew up in the Twin Cities. I spent 31 of my first 34 years in Dakota County.

Several of the counties directly surrounding St. Paul and Minneapolis are red, and those are heavily populated areas also.

But look at the Iron Range and Northern Minnesota - definitely rural and definitely blue.

[chiefofclarinet]

57. I assumed you were an east or west coaster...

I'm sorry about that. I get a bit defensive when I think people think everything that doesn't touch an ocean is a bunch of farmland and hicks, and maybe Chicago. (I'm from Iowa, by the way.)

You are right; there are some nice blue rural counties in Minnesota. (Not so much in Iowa, though...) And, Anoka county went barely red and Dakota and Washington counties went barely blue. But, Minnesota would be a true swing state, if not leaning red, if there weren't the Twin Cities. (as in Minneapolis and St. Paul)

[Left Is Write]

58. I get defensive in the same way!

Do you live in Iowa now or do you live in Minnesota?

How the rest of the country saw Minnesota really hit home for me the weekend the Mall of America opened. There was a "pre-grand opening" party, and I was sitting at the bar in the comedy club. An older couple sat down next to me and asked if I was from the area. When I said yes, the wife asked, "So tell me, why would anyone want to put a mall like this in the middle of nowhere?"

I told her I didn't consider the Mpls/St. Paul area to BE the middle of nowhere.


Edited to add - I was raised on the DFL, so I also always feel defensive of Minnesota's Democratic roots.

[chiefofclarinet]

62. My dad is a Minneapolis native, I am (unfortunately) a NW Iowa native

However, because I have so much family and all my parent's college friends in the Twin Cities, I felt like the Twin Cities were more like home than NW Iowa. (It also helps me like the area since the Twin Cities are liberal and NW Iowa is land of Steve King, so naturally redder than blood.)

Actually, I wanted to go to college in Minnesota (I LOVE the U of Minnesota-Twin Cities and I looked at St. Thomas and liked it.), but U of Iowa gave me more money, so I stayed "in-state". (Actually, from my parents' house, it is about an hour closer to the U of M campus than it is to the U of IA campus.) I would like to settle in Minnesota after school, but even if I don't, I will always treat Minneapolis as my second hometown.

[NEDem]

43. I think you are right

There is a real divide between urban and rural. Nowhere is that more noticeable than in Nebraska. The counties where the two largest cities are went for Obama. We have made some inroads in rural areas. If we are going to make more inroads we need to figure out what makes rural America tick and show them we understand what they want from our party. We can do it, but we'll need to go and ask them, listen to their concerns and then act on those that we agree with.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

46. Possibly it's different notions of "community".

If your community consists of 300 people, most of whom you know personally, and you seldom interact with other people, you'll get a different outlook on life than if your community is a city of hundreds of thousands.

[LiberalFighter]

23. We should split up some of those red counties into smaller counties so they turn blue.

Or split up a lot of the blue counties into smaller blue counties so there are more of them.

[Occam Bandage]

10. I consider America to be a country of people, not a country of acres.

[Mark E. Smith]

13. Real estate doesn't vote

People do. And Obama carried most of the
places where people live.

[SweetieD]

15. Most of America is empty land, thank god! lol

[jpljr77]

16. Well, it's certainly better than last time around...

the 2004 map:

[unpossibles]

17. only by geography. nt

[yellowcanine]

20. Ok here we go again. Once and for all: LAND DOESN'T VOTE, PEOPLE VOTE

It is bad enough that smaller population states have a larger voice in the electoral process simply because of geography.

[Jennicut]

24. Not a red county in all of CT, I am so proud!

[KamaAina]

60. Only one in all of "Blue England"!

:bounce:

[CATagious]

25. look at Kentucky...

Lexington and Louisville is blue while almost ALL of the rest of the state is red.

[TwilightGardener]

26. Read somewhere that rural/small-town America tends to be more conservative

because they have a tendency to depend on each other much more than urban/suburban folks. In cities and suburbs, where things are more congested and potentially less private, there is a tendency to have a "live and let live" approach, because it preserves personal space and cuts down on conflict. In rural/remote areas, you actually NEED your neighbors, and thus you would be more likely to assess and judge their character and want them to share your values.

[magdalena]

27. Wow! Go Wisconsin!

Outside of Madison and Milwaukee we're usually all red. This year mostly all blue. Jeez, we're starting to look like MA, VT, or CT. I'm so proud of our cheese-eatin', Packer-obsessed, small town, gun-totin', redneck democrats.

[anneboleyn]

29. OP poster discounts the 64 million people that voted for Obama vs. the empty prairie

[Donald Ian Rankin]

37. No, OP poster is trying to draw attention to precisely that discrepancy.

Way to miss the point...

I posted this to highlight the fact that urban (and coastal) vs rural correlates more strongly with voting patterns than red state vs blue state.

[anneboleyn]

40. The problem is that the original post is titled "Nearly all of America voted for McCain" when you

are talking about empty space, not people. So it was misleading.

[Patiod]

30. There are people who think that way

was talking to a Republican acquaintance who had just completed a bike ride across the country.

He said he never realized "most people live out in the country"

I told him no, that most of the miles he rode were country roads, but that most PEOPLE live in metro areas.

[NorthernSpy]

32. Maine's only red county is Piscataquis County, and hardly anyone lives there...

Much of Piscataquis is a huge public wilderness park, and another big chunk of the county is actually a huge lake. Beyond that, there's miles of timber. Spruce trees don't vote.


Seriously: Piscataquis county is nearly as big as Connecticut and yet fewer than 18,000 people live there.

[greendog]

33. A lot of those big counties out west have almost no human inhabitants.

For instance, Garfield County, MT has 1279 residents in 4848 sq miles. 595 of them voted for McCain. So the Republicans found 1 vote in every 8.15 sq miles of Garfield County. Big deal.

[JSK]

35. Is OK the only state with no blue?

Oh, and Alaska. Even Utah has some blue.

[PJPhreak]

36. Check out Crawford Co. Ks...

The little Blue Dot in the middle of all that Red!! Yay Pittsburg Ks. At least One County Stood Up for Itself!!

[codjh9]

42. True, but it was better than in the last 2 elections, and there were a lot of rural counties in the

northeast, NM, hell, even Texas! (my state) - that went blue. But obviously, those were the exception rather than the rule.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

45. Winning/losing land area doesn't matter, obviously, but it is informative.

It's the same here in the UK - 1997 was the biggest Labour landslide ever, and the Tories still won more land area, or nearly.

[Jed Dilligan]

47. In the same way Alaska is the biggest state in the union.

[anneboleyn]

49. yes, exactly -- or that winning Siberia means something vs. winning Moscow

[Jed Dilligan]

53. It's the neocon ideal

Fewer people consuming more resources.

That's why they're such big fans of war.

[kenny blankenship]

48. Think of it this way if you're wondering about the significance of the map and the claim

the claim that "nearly all of America voted for McCain."

You could parachute yourself onto that map in a car, and drive all day, 2 days even, and wherever you get out of your car to stop in a diner or gas station you'd hear, "Well people round here didn't vote for 'im. Nobody I know says they did. And if they did they'd know better than to admit it." Knowing how many people around you share your opinion tends to have an effect on the strength of your opinion. If you were of the McCain persuasion you could probably travel hundreds of miles in several directions and find mostly people who voted like yourself--when you manage to find people. Your rejection of Obama as President would be intensified by basically never bumping into an Obama supporter, and being surrounded by just McCain supporters. Everyone you know voted for McCain and opposed Obama, but there's Obama in the White House anyway. People who are geographically isolated tend to develop their own regional accent, to the point that people outside of their locale sometimes don't understand their speech. A polarized political map such as this will likewise tend to produce people who feel like they live in a different countries. It's that polarized. 2004 was very polarized, but this time suburbs voted more like the cities instead of the countryside. Red America and Blue America still exist, in fact they may be further apart than ever. Suburbs moved over to Blue America and took their money with them, which means Red America along with being a bit smaller in numbers, is poorer and more rural than before.

WHat I'm getting at is the significance of the map has to do with the state of mind, the sentiment and general outlook, of Red America. "More alienated than ever before, even more angry than before" is what I'd expect to see in reports written by a traveler wandering through Red State America.

[Lerrad]

50. Alaska! Look at it! Every single fringing county went to: MCCAIN!

And it is the ONLY state where every county went to McCain.
Something SMELLS!

[rucky]

59. If cows could vote, we'd be in trouble.

[Orsino]

61. Living closer together tends to encourage tolerance. n/t