Which African-American hero, real or fictional, is Obama most like?

[Rocknrule]

(note: this post is NOT intended to be a racially-charged post in any way)

Obvious choices from my POV are Martin Luther King, Mace Windu, and Morpheus. Are there other, perhaps better ones, or do those pretty much fit? I would liken this election to the Mace Windu/Darth Sidious fight in Revenge of the Sith, except for the fact that Sidious wins.

[FrenchieCat]

1. He is Atticus Finch based on content of character, and not based on the color of his skin.

Since Obama is 1/2 White, I figure I could say this. :shrug:

And yes, your OP is quite racist and ridiculous...IMO.
Why limit the potential greatness of Barack Obama
simply based on his skin color?

What purpose does your OP serve? Please tell me.

[asdjrocky]

9. Funny,

but I thought the same thing. I know the book and the play and the movie pretty well, and it suits him perfectly.

[mirrera]

11. Atticus.. yes you are very close.

[Clio the Leo]

12. He is SO Atticus Finch. Nailed it!

Even down to Gregory Peck's physique.

[SeattleGirl]

55. Atticus is the first person I thought of.

I think Obama is a universal person; not black or white.

And I think Atticus is also a universal person.

Yes, he's white, and he was defending a black man.

But I could put that man in any situation, and still say he and Obama remind me of each other.

[mamalone]

72. Great minds....

I haven't clicked on this thread until now because it the whole "African American hero" thing irritated me. Then this morning I had the thought of Atticus Finch, and thought, "What the heck, Obama is 1/2 white, so it applies just as much.."

I know it sounds trite, but until we look at each other from the inside out we aren't seeing anyone clearly. It's the only view that matters.

[rusty charly]

2. Maybe:

Mark Thackeray

http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0023978/

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

3. Do you really think Mace Windu is "African-American"?

[backscatter712]

57. African-Galactican? or Jedi-American? :p

[Occam Bandage]

87. Perhaps he meant "Haruun Kal - Coruscantian?"

[lisa58]

4. I've always thought he was a combination of MLK/RFK

[ClassWarrior]

5. Obi-Wan Kenobi.

No doubt. (Like Stephen Colbert, I'm color blind.)

NGU.

[MarthaMyDear]

17. Yep, a young Obi-wan....

[mamalone]

73. More like Qui-Gonn in my opinion...

:hi:

[riqster]

6. The man who told Joel Chandler Harris all of those stories

Wise, calm, and possessed of sublety and wit. "Uncle Remus", whoever the old gentleman was, had a lot of practical wisdom to share.

[mirrera]

7. He is unique. Chief Joseph...no,pieces of all of the great leaders.

He is a leader, period.

[TooRaLoo]

8. Himself. nt

[Drunken Irishman]

10. The president from Deep Impact.

[Amy6627]

13. Yes! Morgan Freedman

[Drunken Irishman]

20. Our country feels like a asteroid slammed into it.

[Sebastian Doyle]

71. Not an asteroid

...just an asshole.

Or more accurately the Idiot Son of an Asshole http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1fUaXCmqME

[TexasLady]

14. Sidney Poitier

on so many levels.

[Captain Hilts]

23. Love your signature picture. nt

[Perky]

46. That occured to me as well.

[Waiting For Everyman]

58. My thought too...

Sidney, updated.

[Captain Hilts]

64. Actually, Portier doesn't really need to be updated. Nor does his image.

His books are very interesting. A friend of mine worked with him on one of his more famous movies.

[Clio the Leo]

15. Barack Obama is a new American archetype.

Defying all comparisons to any other American living or dead, black or white, conservative or liberal.

(except of course for Frenchicat's Atticus Finch metaphor)

Aren't we all so lucky to be alive right now?

[BelleCarolinaPeridot]

24. Yes we are!

[Arkana]

16. I'm not going for race.

Obama is our Gandalf--wise, comforting, and cool-headed in the face of intense fire.

[political_Dem]

18. Can't anyone be bothered to think of an African-American?

Or is it easier to name someone white instead?

Afraid to dig into African-American culture and history? Afraid to go outside of one's box? Or are people so ignorant of African-American history that they can't name someone who is like Barack Obama?

That's what it seems like to me in reading the responses.

I would rather stick to the premise of the OP, being a person of color.

And, I'd say he'd be like W.E.B. Du Bois. And he has the bravery of Ida. B. Wells and Nat Turner. He has the strength of Harriet Tubman and Sojourner Truth. What it comes down to is that he is a pioneer.

Updated: I thank the people who went along with the true question of the OP. I'd be interested to see if others can do the same instead of complaining about the premise of the question.

[FrenchieCat]

I'm 1/2 Black, and people tell me all of the time that I remind them of

Kirstey Alley (when she was on Cheers) or Fergie, depending. Should folks only try to find a Black person that reminds them of me in order to show that they are not afraid? Does that even make sense, really? :wtf:

I'm not sure why you believe that it is a brave thing to compare Obama to others and limit it to only those of a certain race. What purpose does it serve, other than to divide and categorize? Why don't you answer that?

[political_Dem]

29. It shows that people actually have a knowledge of other cultures other than what is prescribed

by white privilege and entitlement. That's why.

I respect the fact that you are bi-racial. I also respect the fact that Mr. Obama is bi-racial. But it is tiring that when these questions arise there is always someone from the dominant culture screaming racism when it comes to aspects of knowledge that doesn't suit white sensibilities.

If the question asked for simply "heroes", then the answers would be apropro.

But since it didn't, it would be fair to simply honor the question and research positive role models and pioneers who are Black. Is it that hard? Or is it the fact that people find Blackness inferior that they have to resort to colorblindism in order to ignore what Black people have contributed to history, politics, popular culture and other aspects of society?

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[political_Dem]

34. Okay then.

I think it is best for you to create a thread which equates Mr. Obama's talents to simply the "heroes" that are in history, popular culture, literature and other societal institutions.

Let's have it your way and erase the "African-American" part of the question. After all, it would make you happy.

[EffieBlack]

35. I agree with you

(Sorry, Frenchie - I still love you!)

[political_Dem]

40. Thank you, Effie Black.

That was the only point I was trying to make. That's all.

I love multi-culturalism and diversity. But, I would simply like it if people could answer the question to see what comes up instead of protesting its viability. If it were asked of me to simply name a hero, I could agree with the attribution of Atticus Finch.

But that's not what the OP asked. That's why this question is a fascinating one based on culture, race, politics and history.

[elkston]

56. Are you not comfortable with your "black" side, Frenchie?

Kind of surprised to hear this from you.

[Captain Hilts]

63. I'd say General Davis. nt

[Catsbrains]

68. The first person I thought of was Abraham Lincoln because he was

president at such a crucial time in our history and handled it heroically just as Obama will. However, I can understand your irritation. How about a combination of bravery of Frederick Douglass, the brains of Booker T. Washington, the creativeness George Washington Carver and the good looks of Denzel Washington?

[Lilith Velkor]

70. Don't forget George Washington Carver

although only time will tell if he'll be that innovative, and save us from a disaster similar to what GWC faced.

[genna]

88. I still believe in identity politics. What is this question so offensive to those who want Obama to

transcend race?


Also what is it with OP that people feel is offensive? If you bring up race, then it is offensive?

Or if the OP limits the range of possibilities to Black/African real people or fictional characters it is a problem?

Is it so hard to start a race neutral thread if this offends your sensibilities?

[political_Dem]

91. First, I appreciate everyone's answers in this sub thread.

Your answers are varied, but still provided a great deal of food for thought when delving into the scope of African-American history, politics and culture.

genna, thank you for asking the very questions that went through my mind as I participated in this thread last night. It's not enough to say that the OP was blatantly racist without giving a proper definition of what is exactly racist about this subject.

Furthermore, I believe that the outcry stems from the neo-con talking point of being "colorblind"--that is if one "doesn't see a color", that means they also "ignore" the politics of race and deny the "racist activities" in "society". It also allows some to say racist things without having to own up to what was said. The stance also skims over subtle racism.

The neo-con stance of "being colorblind" is a perversion of what Dr. MLK said in his speech during The March on Washington.*

In short, it attacks and belittles identity politics, no matter how benign a person's intentions are.

*(Reference to colorblind racism and the perversion of Dr. King's speech:http://academic.udayton.edu/race/03justice/justice06.htm">Misusing MLK Legacy and the Colorblind Theory. This academic article presents an example of what I am trying to convey when approaching this topic and asking why must people protest the OP.)

[FVZA_Colonel]

19. John Omaha, from the manga Air Gear

http://brianandrew.wordpress.com/2008/06/14/air-gear-predicts-next-us-president/

It's rather obvious.

[Captain Hilts]

21. WHY limit ourselves to black heroes?????

He hasn't taken half the risks or gotten half the crap Dr. King or Jackie Robinson got.

[political_Dem]

25. Why not? Everyone is forced to think of "White Heroes" All the Time.

To have the challenge for people to research Black history and actually name Black pioneers who resemble Mr. Obama would be fascinating.

[FrenchieCat]

27. You really don't make sense....you know that, right?

[political_Dem]

30. Neither do you.

That's why we can agree to disagree.

[Captain Hilts]

62. I'm a big fan of Mary McLeod Bethune and wish more people would, at least, name kids after her.

I believe that black history, like women's history should be integrated into US history.

I really enjoy reading history relating to black Americans and have devoured stuff about the Tuskegee Airmen, etc. I would liken Obama to one of them.

[dysfunctional press]

22. frozone from 'the incredibles'

[DCBob]

26. Abraham Lincoln

[BlooInBloo]

28. Yah - because a person with dark skin just CAN'T be like a person with white skin.

[FrenchieCat]

32. According to some without profile

it is our "duty" to locate a hero of African-American ancestry to compare Obama to. Not doing so means we are afraid to study our history.....

Or some bullshit like that.

Didn't make sense to me either. :shrug:

[political_Dem]

36. Of course it doesn't.

But that's okay. Maybe it's too much trouble anyhow.

[kestrel91316]

41. I think the OP was intended to belittle blacks by highlighting the

relative dearth of outrageously successful, wildly popular high-level black politicians in American history. Never mind the fact that whites have worked overtime for hundreds of years to ensure that no such "heroes" could ever arise in the first place........

Yes, I'm calling blatant racism and flamebaiting on the OP and his/her sockpuppet.

[vaberella]

39. I think it's the character association thing.

If you turn on the media they don't relate Obama to MLK or Malcolm X. Sure you have some people who say it, but it's rare. Like Michelle is often compared to Jackie O, Obama is compared to Kennedy. I mean this is undeniable. Other's compared him to Lincoln, other's to FDR, who is very commonly related to Obama. You even see it with Clinton.

I think what the OP is trying to go for is to see what other leaders out there who are non-white who Obama reflects. I mean it's unfair when you see him often equated to amazing and revolutionary White leaders, but rarely to Black leaders of history who have done amazing, amazing things. I mean of course, Obama doesn't really face the level of antagonism and near death or even death that so many other non-white or white revolutionaries have faced.

However, it's nothing I see as divisive, more so opening to other comparisons that are not normal besides MLK. I mean I could go as far as to see Obama similar in ways to Mao, without being as funny. It's those things.

[BlooInBloo]

43. "I could go as far as to see Obama similar in ways to Mao"...

I wish you would have put that at the start, so I could have stopped reading immediately.

[vaberella]

53. LOL.

I was trying to play devil's advocate here and being fair to the poster. However, let's be serious in regards to Mao (I personally like the guy)...he did mobilize the youth and people to being extremely proactive in China. Unfortunately it went awry and ridiculously silly. But he was able to do that and there's no one who can argue that Obama has not mobilized not only the youth but this election has been revoluntionarily changed in the way he's managed to reach people...despite his race that people thought would hold him back or used to hold him back.

[political_Dem]

44. Thank you for explaining it better than myself.

I didn't expect to court controversy with my questions, but your approach, vaberella, is the aim I was trying to bring up.

[vaberella]

33. Hannibal Barca of Carthage (he was Black) , Toussaint L'Ouverture (my leader), Jesus (Yeshua)

or Malcolm X or...several others. Hannibal and Toussaint before they were taken down, but they were taken down standing for the right side.

So there are plenty...revolutionaries. People who are seeking change.

[Bucky]

50. Hannibal was Carthaginian, a Phoenician, and a semitic caucasian

Not all Africans are black.

But inasmuch as he lost a war by attacking someone else's homeland with impractical tactics, I think it's not a good comparison to Obama, now matter how valorous his folly-filled attack might have been.

[vaberella]

52. As a matter of fact the state of Africa today was drastically different from the past.

Nubian society technically had more control of the lande and dominated it even though they had alliances with Ancient Greeks/Romans and Middle East. It was predominately at around a 99%, if not more, nubian (Black by US standards) society. Let's be clear. Even to this day, Whites or any other cultural background within Africa are at a major minority. The invasion of Arab and Persian peoples was much much much much later in history.

In any event, Hannibal's race has been disputed often enough and basically with the "White-washing" of African history, it's been stated he was in fact "racially" (as defined in the US) Black. I believe it was Black Athena and several other historical works which stated he was in fact Black. Other's normally claim him to be of mixed lineage but not 100% caucasian.

This is something I have a problem with as well. So many African leaders of "importance' within African has always seemed to be "racially" white or mixed. Let's be serious. The intermixing wasn't as dominate as people claimed. Berbers (nubians) did marry Arabs to keep peace. But they didn't normally come into the Khemet territory. Further more Carthage was within Khemet boundaries which was ruled and dominated (pre-dominately) by Nubian society (ie. Ethiopia of today). Khemet was a massive land mass that took up basicall the North middle and Eastern part of Africa. Hence the reason even though some historians claim Hannibal as Caucasian his army was Nubian. I've never heard such hilarity in my bloody life. As though the possibility of his Blackness was unlikely. Shoot, there were High ranking Greek and Roman generals who were Black...

As for your claim on attacking someone's homeland in a rather self-righteous way...he actually attacked because those were the people oppressing and demolishing the status of Carthage. He had won several times and took over, it was in the final war he died and it failed. However, the war began because of he was fighting oppression.

[Occam Bandage]

85. Your Punic history is suspect.

Hannibal was a general in the Second Punic War. Carthage was not destroyed until the Third. His Second Punic War campaign was marked by astounding military victories, but few strategic gains; he lacked the siege equipment necessary to take the city of Rome itself, captured provinces reverted to Roman control the minute he left, and he lacked any way to reinforce his largely mercenary army. Hannibal became a freelance mercenary of sorts after his loss at the battle of Zama (concluding the second), and ended up committing suicide in northern Turkey rather than fall into enemy hands.

He was not fighting any sort of "oppression," nor was he oppressive himself. In the first Punic war, the two powers were fighting for control of the island of Sicily (and with it control of trade across the Western Mediterranean.) The second was a Punic attempt at revenge.

I've not seen any sort of evidence, revisionist speculation aside, that Hannibal--and the rest of Carthaginian nobility/elite, for that matter--were anything but Punic. As for the nature of his army? The Carthaginian army was almost entirely mercenary (Carthage was rich in gold but poor in manpower); only the officers were Carthaginian. The composition of Hannibal's army? Nubian, during the African campaign, most likely. During the Roman campaign? Almost certainly Hispanic--with a bit of Italic to boot.

[knixphan]

37. Heroes. (Not all African-American)

Real:

1. Ali - Superior ability to win the crowd, and keep popular support. Always a step ahead of opponents' strategies.

2. Jackie Robinson - Obvious historical reasons.


Fictional:

1. Jet Li in 'Tai-Chi Master'. Barack is a master of political weight-distribution. He CANNOT be thrown off-balance.

2. Luke Skywalker (from ROTJ). Jabba, Fett, Vader, Emperor ALL underestimated him. He led a weary resistance to finally overthrow a dark, corrupt fascist government after a long period of despair.

[Geek_Girl]

38. He has the Grace of Sidney Poitier, the Wisdom of Abe Lincoln, the eloquence of JFK

the courage of MLK, and the intellect and analytical abilities of FDR.

I predict he'll be one of our greatest presidents. He really is an extraordinary man regardless of race.

[endthewar]

42. Denzel Washington in Crimson Tide

A Harvard-educated man trying to lead his submarine crew through a worldwide crisis when a stubborn, backward-looking, old man is trying to steer the crew straight into a cataclysmic event.

[Captain Hilts]

67. Then say "Adm. Bruce Grooms." Head of all subs, Atlantic Fleet.

He also was head of the Naval Academy.

Black leadership isn't such a big deal in the military community.

[endthewar]

69. I like my analogy just fine, thanks.

The similarities are striking. Also, Denzel had a more nuanced foreign policy position than Gene Hackman, in which he wanted to establish communications before launching the nuclear missiles, kind of like talking to your enemies instead of just charging into war. Have you even seen Crimson Tide?

[Captain Hilts]

78. I saw Crimson Tide many times as everyone wanted to watch it with me...

Folks in the sub community say Hackman was right to call the missile drill while there was a fire in the galley as such fires were fairly common - the navy is getting rid of all deep fat fryers on subs - and you need to learn how to operate under adverse circumstances.

There were so many errors about people, relationships and training in the movie there are too many to count. BUT, Hackman's character would not have gone to the Naval War College to "study engineering." It's where you learn about foreign affairs and policy to get the Big Picture.

The submarine community is also one of the more congenial among crews compared to the other branches, so Hackman's sneering "you went to Harvard" is least likely to happen on a sub. It's a community that values smarts. It's also the only place in the navy where officers and enlisted ranks eat the same food. Officers still have to pay for theirs, but it's the same thing the youngest sailor eats. It's very egalitarian.

The captain of a sub cannot, by himself, launch missiles. That said, the navy reviewed its launching policies as a result of the movie. FYI the Defense Dept. also made naval people review the Air Farce's handling of nuclear weapons.

Bruce Grooms is a real guy that more people need to know about. The navy's webpages load too slowly, so here's his Wikipedia page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_E._Grooms

[endthewar]

79. Thanks for the link :-)

He really does sound like a great leader. :hi:

P.S. I still like my analogy. :rofl:

[WinkyDink]

45. Any character played by Sidney Poitier.

[maxsolomon]

47. Frozone

:eyes:

[Uzybone]

48. EPIC FAIL

Its not a racial post, but make sure you only compare him to another black person.

[Bucky]

49. Henry Fonda from "12 Angry Men". (Fonda created a sensation by playing Juror 7 "black")

Critics razzed his 1960 performance as stepenfetchitish, but he wowed audiences and gave his midcareer years a turbo-boost.

[Captain Hilts]

65. 12 'men' in the play because women weren't allowed to sit on juries in NYState back then. nt

[VenusRising]

51. Joe Clark.

Or at least how the movie Lean On Me portrayed Joe Clark.

He's a no nonsense type of person. His goal was to make things better so that everyone could succeed if they tried.

The only difference I think is the extremes each would go to in order to make things work.

In the end, Joe Clark got everyone to care about their education and their school, just like Obama is doing for Americans and the country.

[fujiyama]

54. I don't think the pop culture references do Obama justice at all

because his own quest is incredibly unique and magnificent.

I think it's also worth noting that Obama himself stands on the shoulders of great people who came before him - like Frederick Douglas, MLK Jr., Malcom X, WEB DuBois, Booker T Washington, as well as Jackie Robinson and many others that paved the way in the areas of the civil rights struggle. I named African Americans above, but I'd just as well include others like Lincoln, John Brown, other great abolitionists of slavery, as well as the many whites that risked their lives registering African Americans to vote in the deep South in the sixties.

Those people laid the ground work for where we are today.

But as another said, Obama is a class by himself. He is a movement, a phenomenon, unlike those we've seen before in US politics. The closest thing to this was likely RFK, and tragically he never realized the dream. Obama is on the edge of having the opportunity.

[deadlyaj]

59. He's not Black, but only one guy comes to mind.

[hedgehog]

80. Now, would that be Steve Rogers or Bucky?

[Teaser]

60. Green Lantern III

indomitable will, no fear.

[genna]

86. This is who I thought of. Green Lantern because he was mild mannered, powerful, and deep.

From the Justice League, I like the problem he was having trying to deal with going after Hawk Girl when he was dating Sister Cheetah.

[Essene]

61. is batman black? does he count?

[jakem]

66. Brown Hornet?

Honestly, I am not so comfortable with this "what brown guy does the brown guy remind you of", but I do enjoy the Brown Hornet!

[olegramps]

74. Clinton, the first Black to be president

[olegramps]

76. Or maybe Clark Kent

Mild mannered but a powerful champion for truth and justice and the true American way.

[yardwork]

75. I find the entire premise of this thread to be offensive.

That's all I'll say.

[Frank Booth]

77. Ralph Ellison?

Dreams from My Father wasn't as groundbreaking as Invisible Man, of course, but it had some very interesting and challenging insights on race.

[JustAnotherGen]

81. Since he said it

Superman :-)

[Occam Bandage]

82. Barack Obama.

Also: What are you, seventeen?

[lady raven]

83. Barack Obama, of course :-)

[damonm]

84. Personally, I'd have his blood checked - he's probably Vulcan!

Staying THIS cool? He's GOTTA have had the ears & eyebrows done...:silly:

[RoadRage]

89. Yoda.

If he was a lot taller.. and a bit more brown. And, if Obama said things like:

to John McCain "Evil one, you are"
to Sarah Palin "Intelligent you are not"

Ehh.. i really am NOT a big Star Wars person.. (my husband is).. so someone else will have to take over from here. ;)

[anigbrowl]

90. Septimus Severus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septimius_Severus

Roman Senator with African roots who went on to become Emperor of Rome; interesting parallels with Obama's own life.

[malik flavors]

92. Birth of the Cool era Miles Davis.

[DeepBlueDem]

93. Denzel Washington in Remember the Titans..

From start to finish