Why in the hell did Kerry vote to give that idiot authority?

[El Supremo]

The unprovoked and unsupported attack on Iraq is the most important issue of the election for me. I don't like Kerry's position. It could cost him the election. He can't deny it now.

People are saying: "He didn't vote for the war. He did vote for the war."

What a mess.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2105096/

[WI_DEM]

1. I agree with you that the war is a tragedy

and I was and am 100% with Robert Byrd and the others who voted Nay. I may wish that Kerry would say, "dammit, I was misled and if I could do it again knowing what I know today--I wouldn't do it." But I don't think he is going to do it. The people who say it would explode in his face if he did that, may be right--I don't know. But Kerry is all we have. If it isn't him--it's Bush. Four more years of Bush would be in the words of THK, "four more years of hell."

[soothsayer]

2. Don't worry. The debates are going to undo junior.

The difference will be so stark, it'll be a KO in the first round with dumbya on the mat seeing stars...

[El Supremo]

3. As I have said before...

I'll say again. Kerry should insist on debating the real head of the Executive Branch, Dick Cheney. Not his puppet.

[LiberalCat]

11. I thought that in 2000.

Gore was supposed to be a good debater. However, between, Gore and the media, junior was definitely not undone. This has me worried.

[TexasSissy]

23. I'm not so sure. * won one or more of the debates w/Gore with his

downhome, sittin' on the stool w/one foot on the floor style, and one-sentence quips. People were so charmed (stupid people) they didn't notice his stupid answers to questions.

Kerry's answers will be better substantively, no doubt. No doubt at all. But with his sing song staid voice and monotone sound, well, you know how people are in this age of television. I think Kerry will do great, mind you, when all is said and done. But I wouldn't "misunderestimate" Bush in the debate arena.

[aquart]

4. So you'll vote for Bush? Nader (which is a vote for Bush)?

Everything about the IWR vote is a disingenuous pile of crap. My Dem senators both voted for it and still have no apologies.

Iraq was NOT belligerent toward this nation. If our senators didn't know it, they should have, and they should be ashamed of that vote. Every one of them.

But they're not. They were more afraid of Republicans declaiming their lack of patriotism than finding out the truth and acting on it.

Kerry ran with the pack on this one. Damn shame.

HOWEVER. That said, you're beating a dead horse and being really annoying in the process. Kerry is the Democrat. Vote for him or vote for fascism. There's your choice. You better be prepared to live with it.

[El Supremo]

8. Boy, you twist words almost as well as Karl Rove.

I said nothing about how I would vote. I said that Kerry's election in in jeopardy.

And this "dead horse" is not going to go away.

[aquart]

14. Who do you speak for, if not yourself?

Are you saying you are smart enough to vote for Kerry, but other Americans are not?

Where is this jeopardy coming from?

[El Supremo]

20. I speak for the very small number of undecideds who will decide the electi

Are you saying you are smart enough to vote for Kerry, but other Americans are not? You bet!

Where is this jeopardy coming from? Kerry's lack of clarity. As opposed to Bush's propensity to make all issues black and white.

[ThePhilosopher04]

21. How is "Kerry's election in jeopardy"...

because he voted for the use of force resolution?? Undecided voters who rank Iraq as their primary issue are going to split evenly, for the most part, in terms of whether they're for or against the war, so either way, he's going to pull a similar number.

If you're referring to staunch, anti-war voters looking for an alternative, where are they going to go??? CERTAINLY NOT BUSH!!! Nader won't be on enough state ballots, and when push comes to shove, I don't believe there are that many IDIOTS out there that would risk voting for Bush by voting for Nader.

By supporting the resolution, Kerry could easily pull some moderate votes away from Bush based on other issues such as the economy, stem cell research, taxes, etc.

Lastly, anyone who thinks Kerry's position on Iraq is the same as Shrub's needs to pull their head out!!!

[JI7]

5. the same could be said about Afghanistan

[El Supremo]

6. No

I thought that our overthrow of the Taliban was appropriate. But we did not eliminate Al-Quaida.

[fairfaxvadem]

7. I can't reconcile myself to it either.

My BS Detector went off like crazy during that whole period and I was just flabbergasted when so many lined up to say Yea to the Resolution.

But, what the Resolution says and how Bush is trying to paint it and Kerry's vote are not the same and somehow Kerry needs to keep making the distinction while trying not to look like he's splitting hairs since so many folks are now accustomed to the lazy media's description of the vote as "voting for the war".

That's tricky.

I understand his vote politically, but still, not thrilled about it.

[bluestateguy]

9. And if he had voted no...

The Echo Machine would most certainly shut up, right?

"he voted against the troops"

"he's weak on terrorism"

"he can't be trusted to defend America"

"he's unpatriotic"

"he doesn't take 'national security' seriously"

"if he had his way Saddam would still be in power"

If anybody really thinks that voting no would somehow innoculate him against the attacks of Karl Rove and his stormtroopers, they have a lot to learn. There's no appeasing these people!

[El Supremo]

13. He should answer...

"he voted against the troops" He saved our troops lives from an unjust war.

"he's weak on terrorism" The terror threat has increased because of Iraq.

"he can't be trusted to defend America" War is not always the best defense.

"he's unpatriotic" Prove that he is.

"he doesn't take 'national security' seriously" Sure, like he takes a month vacation right before 9/11.

"if he had his way Saddam would still be in power" So what?? A lot more people (ours and theirs) would be alive today.

[KittyWampus]

10. Gee, This Is A REALLY Original Thread (Sarcasm)

And Kerry voted to give weapon's inspections the THREAT of force to back them up.

Junior used that force prematurely.

It's not complicated.

[greatauntoftriplets]

12. Sigh......

I remember the olden days when DU was against the illegal Iraq invasion.

[KittyWampus]

16. Yeah, We're All 100% FOR It Now, Right?

Right?

[greatauntoftriplets]

19. Nope.

No blood for oil. Not to mention those 14 permanent military bases in Iraq.

A bloody waste.

[CTLawGuy]

26. you are...

rather than admit Kerry is imperfect, you would rather rationalize the invasion.

[KittyWampus]

29. Nowheres In Post Did I Suggest KErry Is PErfect

or that the invasion was rationalized.

[IndianaGreen]

15. Let's put this IWR issue away, it is nothing but historical in nature!

Instead, let's ask ourselves why no one is talking about the slaughter of the Shias that our military machine is happily engaged in as Saddam did in the 1990s. Why are we are spending more time talking about a war that ended 30 years ago rather than talk about an equally abhorrent war that is taking place right now? Where is the outrage?

[UpsideDownFlag]

17. *sigh*....if only dean had gotten the nod. he'd be kicking Bush's ass

over this issue, instead of covering his own.

[molly]

30. How many primaries did Dean win?

[Catherine Vincent]

18. Kerry and the others have a lot of respect for the presidency.

They didn't realize it would turn out this way.

[Placebo]

22. As Maureen Dowd Said on Real Time w/Bill Maher Tonight...

John Kerry has allowed the bush/cheney campaign to define himself (john kerry) and the entire debate.

the president declared john kerry weak and the entire convention was about strength

the president challenged john kerry to be man enough to say he would still vote for war even though there are no WMD's and john kerry took the bait.

if john kerry changes his statement on that now and says he wouldn't vote to give the president the authority to go to war the republicans will use his own words against him to label him once again as a flip-flopper.

it's a vicious cycle here folks, it's time to stop fighting a "sensitive" campaign and realse that karl rove and the repubs have DECLARED WAR on john kerry and the democrats and will do absolutely anything to win. unless we do the same, we will lose.

[paulk]

33. Mo Dowd is hardly someone I would look to

for insight into the campaign... If we let the "cool kids" like Dowd frame this election, then we really are lost.

[mfritz]

24. It could have worked!

Voting to give Bush the authority to go to war could have worked out fine. It gave Bush the leverage to rally the UN and get the weapons inspectors. Saddam was forced to start cooperating. If Bush had just let the inspections continue a bit longer we would have known there were no WMDs. It would have been a diplomatic victory for the US. This was what Kerry had in mind when he voted to authorize force.

Unfortunately Bush wanted to go to war and all that stuff about just wanting to disarm Iraq was BS. It was all a ruse to provide an excuse to start the war, and when the inspectors couldn't find anything, and Saddam started cooperating he derailed the whole thing and attacked. A major disaster.

Now I was opposed to the whole thing from the start, and many at DU were as well. And we were right. Kerry made a costly mistake.

Moral of the story: You can't trust Bush. He will always screw things up.

[greatauntoftriplets]

25. I NEVER trusted *.

Therefore, I never expected that voting to give * the authority to go to war would EVER work out "fine". The Iraq invasion was inevitable, even if every Democrat in Congress had voted against that resolution.

[IndianaGreen]

27. Would you give the keys of your car to someone that was drunk?

That's what IWR did, give a blank check for war to a warmonger! Why is everyone surprised?

BTW, how come none of the major party candidates are addressing the slaughter of Iraqi civilians that our version of the Waffen SS is conducting across several cities in Iraq? How come no one has mentioned that the US is butchering Shias at the same rate Saddam butchered them in 1990s?

What country will impose a no-fly zone to protect the Shias from Amerikan bombs?

[GaryL]

28. I knew that.

You may have known that too. I've discovered, however, the more I say that the more it pisses people off. Most lesser informed people did NOT know that. The GOP has successfully converted this into another 'Gore invented the internet' urban legend. They did not vote FOR war, they gave duffus the authority to attack if sanctions and (mainly)inspections failed. The UN still had inspectors in the damn country when we were getting ready to attack so blame the idiot chief for violating the intention of the vote. The Senate was told there were potential nukes there and we needed the higher threat level of an impending attack to get Hussein to dismantle them. A no vote was based on listening to war protesters, not the intelligence they were given. Kerry has not made this case very well with th idiot's yes or no (dead or alive?) argument. Which is why I believe they plan a week off to develop better strategy to counter the cowboy rhetoric.

[IndianaGreen]

31. IWR was last year, what about now? How do we get out of Iraq?

We already know that the drums of war are beating again, this time against Iran. There is no doubt that if Bush is elected he will use the troops he is pulling out of Europe and Asia to attack Iran, perhaps under the pretext that Iran is assisting the Iraqi insurgency (which is quite debatable!).

How do we get out of Iraq? The proponents of "stay the course" are repeating the same mistake that Nixon made, which resulted in a prolonged and wider conflict in Southeast Asia.

[GaryL]

32. Quite debatable?

I'd like to see that. It's at best marginally debatable. And btw, Nixon went into Cambodia all on his own. When Congress found out, they voted to keep him the hell out. And if the boy king steals 2004, I'm hopin' the dems take the Senate back. As far as using troops from Europe and Asia, he's got rotate them out to bring the troops in Iraq home. We just plain don't have the forces to occupy Iraq AND begin a prolonged battle against Iran anytime soon. I do believe a draft will be HIGHLY likely in which case I'm moving to Canada and taking my boy. So let's try everything in our power to keep B* out the the whitehouse.

[greenohio]

34. Buck up

Buck up, shut up, and get back in line. Kerry's the guy. Deal with it. Get over it or go home.