How many outraged with Kerry’s stand on gay marriage are straight?

[MurikanDemocrat]

Poll question: How many outraged with Kerry’s stand on gay marriage are straight?

Edit: 6 part post
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409588
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409593
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409617
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409625
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409637
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409593

[Hav]

1. .

I think when you word the options like that, you should have also added "not outraged" although your question aims to those who are outraged.
Just a feeling from the options and you would also see how many could somehow accept Kerry's position.

[MurikanDemocrat]

12. Hey! love your sig quote!

:D

[Hav]

15. .

So now you finally found out. :D

[tryanhas]

2. What happened to...

...I'm not outraged?

[ModerateMiddle]

3. ya, that's where I would vote, too

[pippin]

4. I am outraged by a whole lot

of Kerry's positions on the issues. The man is a conservative in sheep's clothing-- a closet republican passing as democrat. His stance on gay marriage is just another glimpse as to where he is really at.

[tryanhas]

9. Most Democrats don't support gay marriage...

...DUH.

So, I guess that makes you undemocratic.

[Uzybone]

10. So all democrats are for gay marriage?

what other positions are all democrats for that Kerry is against?

[sangha]

5. I predict

a sudden infusion of gay DUers who oppose Kerry and support Dean, even though Dean never did anything for gay marriage.

[maxanne]

20. cheap shot

Dean has nothing to do with this. More flame bait. More stirring.

[AntiCoup2K4]

33. A cheap shot from Sangh(insert vowel here)??

...nah, that would never happen :eyes:

BTW... hetero who supports gay marriage here :hi:

[Taeger]

6. Is this a Zogby poll?????

Please don't fudge your polls. You refuse to include a category for straight and gay people WHO ARE NOT outraged by John Kerry's position on gay marriage.

So please be honest and consider the possibility that the majority of Democrats MAY NOT WANT gay marriage.

[Mattforclark]

13. I don't trust zogby polls

Never have. Never will.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

7. would "dissapointed" be better than "outraged"?

Theres somthing about loaded phrasing of poll questions, so, .....

[Uzybone]

8. How about not outraged?

Im not outraged because I already think all unions should be civil unions. It should be left to religious institutions to marry.

[MurikanDemocrat]

14. I'm only looking for those who are OUTRAGED by Kerry's position

[frustrated_lefty]

27. Here. Genuinely ouraged.

What is your question?

[Taeger]

16. deceptive ...

The fact that you ask a question WITHOUT offering a negative view represents a form of deception. It's like asking how many Christians believe in Christ.

[buckeye1]

11. Dumb poll.

Dean is still a loser.

[RetroLounge]

17. Poop

[MurikanDemocrat]

18. heh

:)

[corporatewhore]

19. ya know people can mess w/the poll

[dsc]

21. What the Hell kind of bullshit is this?

Of all the lamebrained, crappy ass things to post. Is it now somehow bizarre that straight people might give a shit about our rights? Do you think we come from fucking pods? We have parents, brothers, sisters, children, aunts, uncles, nieces, and nephews. And most of them are straight. You should be deeply ashamed to post such utter crap.

[janx]

23. And she says...

"heh"

[dsc]

24. Believe it or not

that was my calm version.

[janx]

26. I believe it.

;-)

[MurikanDemocrat]

25. No. It occurs to me that those MOST OUTRAGED by Kerry's position

on gay marriage are straight DUers who never gave a shit about this issue before this year and who are Kerry haters to begin with.

The irony is that Dean's and Edwards positions are EXACTLY THE SAME when it comes to gay marriage as Kerry's. It was simply my intent to point out the hypocrisy of those who HATE the position Kerry has taken JUST BECAUSE it was Kerry who took the position.

Your attempt to personalize notwithstanding.

[frustrated_lefty]

28. Sorry, the accusations of hypocrisy don't sell.

This has been an issue for me, I did give a shit about it since the 1970s.

And, no, Dean's position and Kerry's are NOT the same. Kerry is the one who said publicly he is AGAINST gay marriage.

On this issue, sir, you come off as a pompous ass. Don't dare have the nerve to tell anyone how they feel about their family and friends.

[MurikanDemocrat]

31. Nope. Their positions are the SAME

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409661

[dsc]

29. They are not the same as I have stated repeatedly

Kerry is advocating that his state take away marriage rights that gays now have. Neither Dean, nor Edwards have done that. That is different.

[MurikanDemocrat]

30. You are mistaken. Dean's and Edward's positions are the SAME

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x409661

[frustrated_lefty]

37. Say it often enough

you might believe it.

[bitchkitty]

42. Doesn't look the same to me:

"Some in Washington will use this decision to justify the proposed Federal Marriage Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. This would be the first constitutional amendment to authorize discrimination, and I oppose it.

[MurikanDemocrat]

46. The only people who seem to be OUTRAGED with Kerry's

position on gay marriage are non-gay Dean supporters who never gave a SHIT aout this issue 2 years age. Ver revealing, I'd say.

[dsc]

47. Oh really

I guess those guys I have slept with would be pretty surprised I am straight. I posted in this thread, and other places that I am outraged BTW.

[maxanne]

22. just a little more

[Dhalgren]

32. The reason a Democrat might think that most Democrats

are in favor of gay marriage is because it is a civil rights issue. One would hope that most Democrats were in favor of civil rights for all citizens. I am continually astounded at the number of centrist/right posters on this, supposedly, Liberal, Progressive site. If you are not in favor of civil rights, then we do not belong to the same party.

[AntiCoup2K4]

35. Indeed. One wonders if Kerry would applaud a wall around San Francisco...

...like he did the one Sharon built around the Palestinians.

Gotta keep those sodomite terrorists from destroying marriage, ya know!

[MAlibdem]

34. Outraged goes a little far

Disappointed perhaps

[Dhalgren]

36. Yes, "disappointed" may be the better word.

And I hope you are speaking for yourself, because we are allowed to disagree with our chosen candidate. We do not have to fall into lock-step with every utterance made by any of our chosen runners. Most of the time they say the things that we like to hear and that we can wholeheartedly support, but other times not so much.

[frustrated_lefty]

38. No, "disappointed" is not the word. Outrage fits the bill.

It is outrage, it is moral, and it is right. You got the person you wanted for a nominee, please, for christ's sake, make the man grow a pair of balls.

[MAlibdem]

39. Speak for yourself

I spoke for myself.

I'll never ask a man (or woman) to fall on a sword when he or she could accomplish much.

[frustrated_lefty]

41. I DID speak for myself

Based on your post, it looks like you think gay marriage is a lost cause?

[Dhalgren]

56. I trust that you aren't addressing the response to me.

I have never been a Kerry supporter and will never be. I may feel pressed to vote for him in Nov., but I will never "support" him.

[Hippo_Tron]

40. Not me, I know Kerry doesn't give a shit whether gay people get married...

Or not. But the Republican party base does. And the Republican party base staying home on election day is good for Kerry winning the election. Restoring integrity to the white house, getting people healthcare and jobs, and not sending our troops to fight anymore unecessary wars are all MUCH more important to me than any social issue.

[w13rd0]

43. Wow...

"Restoring integrity to the white house, getting people healthcare and jobs, and not sending our troops to fight anymore unecessary wars are all MUCH more important to me than any social issue." That's the platform Bush ran on in 2000. But turned out he was lying...

[atre]

44. Not outraged at all

And I am hoping that this doesn't loom as a huge issue in the upcoming election cycle. If it does, I think we're doomed.

Politically, homosexuality is very unpopular. Politically, it is not a winning issue for Democrats.

I think homosexuals should divert their attention to winning the battle in the courts rather than through the ballot box. The same strategy worked for black Americans.

[dsc]

50. No it didn't

Or did you forget the Civil War and the Civil Rights Act of 1964, along with the Fair Housing Act, the Voting Rights Act, and a slew of others.

[MurikanDemocrat]

45. kick for the day crew

[funky_bug]

48. Unpopular stance, but I stand by it

My best friend and my brother are both gay. My ex-husband's best friends are gay, and my kids are taking part in their unity ceremony this summer. I have zero problem with gay union and/or gay marriage. But I have less of a problem with Kerry's stance.

If my best friend and his partner get married, that will NOT guarantee they won't lose their jobs. If they get married it will NOT provide for their kids' education. A marriage ceremony will not ensure their son isn't sent to Iraq, and it will not improve our economy.

Gay marriage should NOT be the wedge that Bush uses to define this election. Kerry's response is perfect. He's not going to allow Bush to find ONE SINGLE platform for this election. There is no point in dividing the conservatives and the liberals on this issue, because the marriage and/or unity of any number of gay couples will NOT undo the damage that Bush has done, nor prevent more autrocities from occuring should he get re-elected because some evangelicals are afraid that gay folk might get married.

[dsc]

49. but same sex marriage

might be the difference between them being insured and them not being insured. The difference between them starving in old age and doing OK in old age. The difference between a child belonging to only one partner or both. And I literally could go on, and on, and on, and on, and on some more.

[funky_bug]

51. Am I just mistaken

or isn't this what civil unions and equal rights will guarantee? "Marriage" is just a term... I don't go to church, but my best friend does. He is entitled to the term "marriage" more than I am, speaking strictly on religious criteria...

If the "equal rights" of all are addressed, why does it matter what name you give it? Is this really an issue we want Bush to win on? The pandering to the religious right that gets him selected again? Come on! We had that in 2000... Bill gets him some, and suddenly the conservatives want to take their country back for God.

What Kerry does in office is anyone's guess... but what Bush is going to do if he stays is a certainty. He's said it loud and clear.

I'm willing to take my chances with ABB.

[maxanne]

53. words matter

If I get married tonight in a drunken black out in Vegas, I'll be married. (and stupid) My friends Jo and Brenda, together 20 years were civilly unioned in VT a few weeks ago. They're a hell of a lot more married than I would be. Words matter. Words are the weapons of the bigots of the world. Words are our weapons in fighting discrimination.

Separate but equal is NOT equal.

[funky_bug]

54. I know that words matter... that's my point

If the word "marriage" is the word that gets us four more years of Bush, then I'd say that word matters one hell of a lot.

It matters to those who are for it, and it matters to those who are against it.

This is not an issue we need Bush to take the moral highground on. Aside from that, when I go to the courthouse to get a license, I can stand right there before a judge and get married. Civil unions would do the same thing for gay couples... it would make them legally recognized as life partners. Then they can go straight to any gay-friendly church and have a minister marry them. Hell, I can't walk into a Catholic church and get married because I've been divorced once... but I did find a minister to bless my legally recognized right to a union. So can gay people, and they can call it "married" just the same as I do. The Catholic church doesn't recognize my marriage. Does that mean they are violating my constitutional rights? Of course not. It just means I am no longer a good little Catholic. As far as recognition goes, Kerry could stand up and call it marriage, but the conservatives of the world will NEVER recognize a marriage as anything but one man with one woman.

The word matters to a lot of people, ideologically. It does not, however matter, in the grand scheme of this election. Partner benefits are being established in corporations around the world. No one is going to suffer, if Kerry takes the evangelical term for a legally recognized union, off the table.

[maxanne]

55. I see

I am unwilling to sweep this issue off the table in the name of pandering to the right wing in an attempt to win this election.

I'm unable to dismiss civil rights so cavalierly. No one is going to suffer, eh? Just same sex couples - while being patted on the head and being told "we'll stick up for you next time around."

[funky_bug]

57. Take it that way if you want

But gay marriage is one...ONE issue. If that's someone's only issue, then I suppose I can understand their responses.

"Marriage" should be defined by a religious institution, period. Seperation of church and state should have transferred to this as well. The courthouse simply provides the documentation. I repeat, any gay couple can find a minister to marry them. If gay marriage is legally defined as such, I guarantee mainstream churches will STILL refuse to perform the ceremony. They do it for straight couples all the time.

So I guess we just fix gay "marriages," and make sure they get a word to go along with their rights, and let the rest of the problems go to hell, right? Because if GWB wins this election because some people demand the word "marriage" be utilized by our candidates, then we're going to be in a helluvalot worse mess than we are right now.

By the way, my gay friends would LOVE to be considered "married", but right now, they say they'll settle for civil rights in, and Bush out.

[Indiana Democrat]

52. I'm not outraged.

[jansu]

58. I thought we were the Party of Human Rights!

I am outraged! All marriages are Civil...you have to go to the State to apply for a Marriage License and after you are married, wherever that may take place, the State issues a Marriage Certificate. So it is a Civil affair which is called Marriage. There is no such thing as a religious marriage...you may have the ceremony in a church, etal, (but you can not do so without the Civil marriage license) and that does not mean that the marriage is religious, just the ceremony.

What other license can the state deny issuing, based on sex or sexual orientation? Driver license? Hunting license? Real Estate license? Beautician license? Barber license?

Human Rights should never be put off! The lack of it, harms people now!

We seem to be running on fear. The best thing we can do is bring out every issue we do not agree with the Repub. on. The more issues they have to answer, the less they will be able to set the agenda. Can you imagine Bush talking about more than a couple of issues at the debates? And, the more we bring up the hot topic issues, the worse the Right looks!

We are more than able to walk and chew gum at the same time! I know they can't!

"AMERICA DID NOT INVENT HUMAN RIGHTS...HUMAN RIGHTS INVENTED AMERICA"!