Hey!! OBAMA and Clinton and Biden supporters. Defend your candidates inaction on the FISA bill here.

[MNDemNY]

[cali]

1. Sadly, you'd better add Biden, hadn't you? n/t

[MNDemNY]

3. ? He's listed.

[MNDemNY]

2. I predict..Nuttin' but crickets.

[IndianaJones]

5. how could you hear them over your whining? nt.

[MNDemNY]

6. Where is Hillary?????

I'm whining??

[atreides1]

11. It's not whining!!!!

It's a good question. Why can't they take the time from campaigning to do the job that they were elected to do?

Maybe they feel safer talking about how they support Dodd, but are looking at contributions from the telecoms?

It's possible!!!!!

[gmudem]

27. Whining?

I'm a constituent of Hillary's. I want to see my Senator defending the constitution and civil rights, but she obviously doesn't care enough about New Yorkers to do that.

[crikkett]

16. You rang?

By the way, why isn't Edwards on that list?

Thanks
Crikkett

[MNDemNY]

18. Um...because he is not a Senator. I don't think they'd let him on the floor.

And he certainly couldn't vote.

[crikkett]

38. ...

:blush:

please see my excuses, below.

[Connie_Corleone]

20. Because he's not in the Senate anymore?

[MNDemNY]

23. How do you feel about your candidate missing this debate?

[Connie_Corleone]

26. I don't like it. You asked for supporters to defend them.

I'm not defending him, that's why you don't see a post from me defending him.

All of them can take at least one day to be in the Senate this week. I seriously doubt missing one day of campaigning is going to make much of a difference.

I think Iowan Democrats would rather have them in the Senate for a day supporting the filibuster than campaigning. The volunteers can handle meeting with voters.

[MNDemNY]

30. That's why I asked, no offense intended.

[crikkett]

37. D'oh!!!

My excuses:
1. distracted by smell of fresh coffee
2. I keep thinking of Edwards as a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee who knew that the justification for invading Iraq was a lie, but who voted to authorize it anyway.

[MNDemNY]

41. AAAh ...coffee.

:hi:

[K Gardner]

4. No defense from me. They should ALL be there. If they're afraid

they'd miss out on campaign time, just think of the publicity it would get if ALL Presidential Contenders were actually in the Senate arguing for the same thing and against Bush's Policies.

[AspenRose]

69. Exactly

Republicans have each other's backs all the time....for stupid crap like Terri Schiavo.

These candidates squandered an opportunity.

[Vickers]

7. *chirp*

*chirp*










*chirp*

[zabet]

8. Unless they died,

their spouse died,
or their child died,
they have no excuse for
missing something this
critical.

[MNDemNY]

10. But, winning is more important than our civil rights.

[zabet]

19. I just wish they would do

the job they currently have, which
involves being there to vote.
If they cannot do the job they currently
hold, how are we to trust in them to do
the job they are trying to win?

[K Gardner]

9. Couldn't HRC fly them ALL back to D.C. real quick in the Hill-O-Copter?

Just sayin... put that damned thing to good use.

[ronnykmarshall]

12. That being said ...

Couldn't Oprah fly them back?

[K Gardner]

14. LOL.. yes, she could !! n/t

[MNDemNY]

15. I don't care if thet fuckin' walk back. Do your damn jobs, Senators!

[pleah]

77. Ditto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MNDemNY]

13. If she can..she should. They better all get back there.

This should be a deal breaker for any true progressive who values civil liberties.

[maddiejoan]

24. Now THAT would have been a brilliant move.

[PatSeg]

39. I was thinking the same thing

It would serve them all, if they joined together on this.

[K Gardner]

17. Hatch: "We're doing this for the public's good, for their safety".

Fuckers.

[MNDemNY]

21. I'll take my chances, so no thanks Hatch.

[HeraldSquare212]

22. Agreed, they have no defense - and it's a sad portent of the

kind of accountability we'll see from them if any of them is elected Pres.

[ieoeja]

25. I thought FISA was being filibustered?

If that is the case then "Not Voting" to end the filibuster carries the same weight as voting "No".

[MNDemNY]

28. They should all be on the floor in support of our civil rights.(if we have any left)

And NOT VOTING carries NO weight with me, nor should it with any progressive concerned about this monumental issue.

[K Gardner]

29. Not showing up is NOT an option in this case.. I don't care how the

not present vote counts. No excuses on this one for any of them.

[CrispyQ]

50. Absolutely!!

They should be there. NO EXCUSES!

They have significant media attention due to their campaigns. It was a prime opportunity to speak out against the lawlessness of the current administration.

I'm almost done with politics. Fuck this shit. We the People no longer exist. We are officially Government of the Corporations, by the Corporations & for the Corporations.

Fuck it. Fuck it. Fuck it.

:grr: :mad: :grr: :mad: :grr: :mad: :grr: :mad: :grr: :mad:

[Egnever]

44. And theres the answer

[MNDemNY]

48. Lame. Sorry, this is too important to phone in. They should be on the floor, using their megaphone.

[rucky]

59. and pom-poms?

because they would essentially be acting as cheerleaders.

[MNDemNY]

61. Ignoring it is wayyyy better.

[rucky]

Of course not, but to get on them

and not the 74 Senators who voted for cloiture?

Send the three candidates to bed without supper, but in the seven years under Bush (and before) there has not been a single vote in the Senate that has been a surprise to them. No debate that has changed an outcome. They know the math coming into every single vote.

I'm not saying that's okay - it's ridiculous. But to get outraged and shocked means you'd actually have an expectation that it would be different this time.

I've pretty much lost all faith and hope in the government until 2009. I have no outrage and anger left in me until then.

[MNDemNY]

67. I'll "get on" them all.

My voice only counts with these candidates and my own Senators. They will hear from me. Those Senators running for POTUS are, and should be held to a higher standard. If they wont fight this fight, what will they do?

[Lucinda]

46. I don't think they can hear you. But thanks for pointing it out.

[MNDemNY]

54. So, your answer is "It doesn't matter"? Lame.

Their status as candidates does matter. They should be in DC for this vote.

[Lucinda]

66. I didn't answer your post. I responded to another. So stop putting words in my mouth.

[Name removed]

68. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jillan]

31. Nope!

I won't do it.

[MNDemNY]

33. Wont, or can't?

[jillan]

45. Biden should have been there - I won't defend him

I know what he was doing - he was on a radio show in NH.

They all should have been there.

[youthere]

71. Yup..I agree..no excuses. They should have been there.

[flvegan]

32. 30 responses, 335 views, not a single decent response in defense.

:rofl:

[MNDemNY]

34. Just crickets.

One came up with a lame, it doesn't matter.

[flvegan]

35. And it's odd, because we know that their supporters are here in GD: P now.

So quiet about this issue all of a sudden.

Hmmmm...

[MNDemNY]

40. They are all awaiting they're marching orders.

[flvegan]

55. Been an hour now.

Orders must be coming slowly.

Just keepin' it kicked so that I'm sure they'll see it and chime in.

[MNDemNY]

56. Right, they're just getting their ducks in a row.

[flvegan]

58. We're in for some absolute brilliance, I'm sure.

[CrispyQ]

36. I'm pissed as hell.

I just called Biden's office & was told that Biden hopes to be there.

HOPES to be there?????? HOPES to be there??????

This could be a deal breaker for me. I reminded them that Chris Dodd is also running for president & he found time to defend the 4th Amendment of the Constitution of the United States. I told them I've been sending money every payday to Biden's campaign, but if he can't find time to protect the Constitution, I may not find any more money to send his way.

I'm pissed as hell over this.

[MNDemNY]

43. This SHOULD be a deal breaker for any progressive who values civil rights.

[harmonicon]

82. I hope this also makes you reconsider making ANY campaign contributions

I think campaigns should be federally funded, simple and modest, not these gigantic blowhard, bullshit carnivals they've become. These people will take your money and use it to sell you out to someone who's given them more. You're better off voting for someone who wants to limit private funding of campaigns..... not that I think this will change any time soon, unfortunately.

[1corona4u]

84. They have 30 hours...

he could still get there, but even so, it's only a symbolic jesture.

Last Wednesday, Clinton, Obama and Sen. Joe Biden (D-Del), another Democratic presidential contender, joined Dodd in a letter to Majority Leader Sen. Harry Reid (D-Nev.) asking that the counterproposal on FISA passed by the Senate Judiciary Committee be considered instead of the SSCI bill.

The current Democrat-engineered FISA mess involves what Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky) told me last week were two non-negotiable points. First, immunity from civil suits for the telecom companies whose cooperation is essential. Second, is the Dems’ initiative to impose a requirement for FISA warrants before listening in on terrorists overseas. Despite their fear of MoveOn.org, Clinton, Obama and the rest know they will lose again. And if they don’t pass a FISA bill in the ten or so days they’ll have in January, Usama bin Laden will be able to start using pay phones.

All this is posturing to appease the MoveOn.org crowd. The last time they tried to hobble FISA -- just before the August recess -- ended in a clear win for the White House. This round will end the same way, and the Dems know it. But that makes their fight this week that much more important, and that much more risky for their presidential wannabes.

They’re in a tough spot for two reasons. First, the 49 Republicans who have (under McConnell’s and Sen. Trent Lott’s (R-Miss)) leadership have stymied most of the Dems’ agenda. Second, the Dems’ leaders -- Reid and Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) -- are the least effective congressional leadership in memory (a point even Reid’s staff is conceding privately.)

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=23996&s=rcme




They asked to do this, this week, so I have to believe that they knew what they were doing. Maybe Dodd agreed to go, since someone had to be there.

[CrispyQ]

86. Symbolic gestures count.

The media is ignoring the FISA hearings. It would be much harder for them to ignore it if ALL of the dem senator candidates had shown up & spoke on the floor in support of Dodd's effort.

At any rate, it would have sent the message that they think our 4th Amendment rights are worth fighting for compared to the message that their campaigns are more important than our rights.

I'm very disappointed in Joe. :grr:

[babylonsister]

42. No excuses for any of them. No defense from me. nt

[Scriptor Ignotus]

49. agreed. -eom

[jillan]

47. Is it just my imagination, or is it only Biden supporters willing to take the heat for this?

[MNDemNY]

51. There are at least a couple of Obama folks, I see.

[Connie_Corleone]

52. It's your imagination. I posted upthread about it.

[jillan]

53. Thx - busy day - just skimmed through the responses :)

[ihavenobias]

57. Live Discussion On This Issue

can be streamed here. Currently the guest is from Openleft.com

http://winmedia.voxcdn.net/2954-WMV-aarnetvid1 (from www.theyoungturks.com)

[Adelante]

60. I have no defense to give

They should be there. They should.

[ihavenobias]

62. We have no leaders!

That's why none of them are physically showing up. Granted, a statement is better than nothing but how have our standards gotten to be so low?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cenk-uygur/where-are-our-leaders-whe_b_76909.html

[harmonicon]

83. Our standards have gotten to be so low, because people are willing to support these people...

... in the first place. Oh, sure, they argue about "compromise" and "electability" - if you vote based on that, all you elect is someone who won't mind compromising the constitution to make political headway. These people disgust me.

[Krashkopf]

63. Still waiting to hear from supporters of Obama, Clinton and Biden . . .

Why AREN'T Obama, Clinton and Biden ON THE SENATE FLOOR defending the CONSTITUTION?

I am VERY, VERY disappointed in each of them!

[K Gardner]

70. I have no defense to give of Biden.. here are "statements" from all three..

San Francisco: Will you join Sen. Chris Dodd's hold and proposed filibuster on any FISA bill that includes retroactive immunity for telecoms? Thanks for joining us for this chat today, Sen. Biden, and thanks for the leadership you provide the Democratic Party and America.

Sen. Joe Biden: Yes.


"Senator Obama has serious concerns about many provisions in this bill, especially the provision on giving retroactive immunity to the telephone companies. He is hopeful that this bill can be improved by the Senate Judiciary Committee. But if the bill comes to the Senate floor in its current form, he would support a filibuster of it."


Clinton, courtesy Talking Points Memo


Q: Can you discuss your position on the reauthorization of the FISA bill?

HRC: I am troubled by the concerns that have been raised by the recent legislation reported out of the Intelligence Committee. I haven't seen it so I can't express an opinion about it. But I don't trust the Bush Administration with our civil rights and liberties. So I'm going to study it very hard. As matters stand now, I could not support it and I would support a filibuster absent additional information coming forward that would convince me differently.

(edited to add: I am not above changing my vote)

[MNDemNY]

72. Statements are empty. Action, support on the floor is needed.

[K Gardner]

74. And I'm agreeing with you ! Sheesh.

[MNDemNY]

76. I know, I'm wound up on this one.

Please excuse me.

[K Gardner]

79. I am too, don't worry about it. I feel like my belief system just got

pulled out from under me. Kind of left out to dry kind of feeling :-)

[MNDemNY]

87. Time for scotch.

[balantz]

64. They just fucking SUCK!!!

[AspenRose]

65. I haven't chosen anyone yet, but I am bitterly disappointed

I have narrowed it down to Biden, Edwards and Dodd (not necessarily in that order)....and I am very disappointed in Biden right now for this.

No defense from me, either. This is too important.

An opportunity for the democratic presidential candidates (currently serving as senators) to present a united front has been squandered.

[balantz]

73. So! Who's in the corporate gang?! Let's see....

:eyes:

[Krashkopf]

75. Obama, Clinton and Biden are being "over-handled."

Think about how impressive - how INSPIRATIONAL- it would have been to see all four Democratic Senators running for President standing TOGETHER to DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION!

That Obama, Clinton, and Biden DIDN'Tsee that tells me that they are all being "over-handled."

I am still an "Edwards" man, but Dodd has become my "#2."

[K Gardner]

78. I'm hoping that if Dodd really does rise to Filibuster, they'll ALL get their butts on a bus

or plane or helicopter and get back there to support him. If they don't, that's it for me.

[DivorcingNeo]

80. There is no defending.

They all, including Obama, need to get a backbone. However the way people are discussing who is electable or not. No, wonder some of these folks are such cowards.

[acmavm]

81. Did anyone really expect them to show up? I knew that they wouldn't.

What was in it for them?

If you want 'em there wave a dollar bill under their noses.

[harmonicon]

85. I didn't

Anyone who's surprised by this must have just found out these folks were in the senate, because if they'd had knowledge of the way and things these people are for, they'd know me, you, and our civil liberties can be thrown under the bus for crass political calculations - only winning matters.