DEMS FAIL AGAIN...

[UDenver20]

Please excuse the rant, but....

Would someone please wake the damn Democratic leadership up? PLEASE? My God, they FRIGGING SUCK. Dean, I love ya dude, but you were just thrown a damn grape-fruit sized, softball pitch right down the middle and you weren't even in the batter's box. Pelosi? Reid? DLC? DFA? ANYONE?

We have been saying FOR THREE FRIGGING YEARS...

- That we did not find those weapons.
- That the intelligence was wrong.
- That the war has been more difficult than expected.
- That the war has been more difficult than he has
been telling us.
- That the war has attracted al Qaida to Iraq.
- That reconstruction efforts and the training of Iraqi
Security Forces started more slowly than we hoped.
- That his decisions have led to terrible loss.
- That Bush is responsible for those failures.

IN HIS SPEECH HE COMPLETELY AND TOTALLY ADMITTED ALL OF THOSE THINGS. But were we there to hit back? No. Were we there to provide an opposing viewpoint? No. Were we there to throw a BIG FAT "WE TOLD YOU SO" back at him?

No, we weren't.

DEMS FAIL AGAIN.

We have a "Democratic Response" to every weekly radio address... BUT WHEN OUR FRIGGING OPPORTUNITY knocked, we didn't answer.

WE ALLOWED HIM TO MISLEAD PEOPLE when HE FRAMED "the opposing viewpoint" as "If you think the terrorists would become peaceful if only America would stop provoking them, then it might make sense to leave them alone."

WE ALLOWED HIM TO MISLEAD PEOPLE when HE FRAMED US AS DEFEATISTS "defeatists who refuse to see that anything is right."

MOST IMPORTANTLY, WE FAILED BECAUSE WE CONTINUE TO ALLOW THEM TO "SET THE TONE."

"Hallelujah. Holy Shit. Honey, Where's the Tylenol."
- Chevy Chase as Clark Griswold

[0007]

1. The Senators should have been lined up for a press conference and wrestled

this sick monkey to the floor.

And just for starters, mockingly ask junior why he'd keep Rumsfeld around when he didn't know where the WMD were after Rummy told the world he knew where they were being hidden.

[cantstandbush]

58. What happened to the 'rapid response?' n/t

[ProSense]

2. From Bush came clean to this?

Bush isn't setting a dam thing. Big story is the NSA. Today was one of the most violent days in Iraq. The election isn't an elixir. Same problems exist today: Bush is a failed leader, the his illegal war is still being mismanaged and the US still needs to get out of Iraq. JMO

[UDenver20]

41. ALL of the bullets I listed came DIRECTLY from....

...the transcript of his speech.

[ProSense]

57. It was a Bush speech, like all the other Bush speeches. n/t

[cry baby]

3. I happen to think that a response just wasn't necessary.

I don't think anyone is listening to him anymore. It is also obnoxious to say "I told you so". We have the upper hand - we will be pounding him with the NSA thing, Fitzmas is coming, Delay is delayed, etc.

BTW, Barney Frank was very effective on MSNBC with T.Carlson. Wasn't "official", but really good rebuttal of the speech.

[FreedomAngel82]

18. I wonder if anyone does listen too

Has there been a poll of whether who listen's or not? I haven't listened to him for years now. Last time I listened to him was the debates and that I had to so I could see John Kerry beat his ass. I think the democrats just do official responses after state addresses. I'm not sure if they do addresses like this. :shrug: I can't remember if they do or not. But yes Bush is really being agressive now so you know they're in trouble.

[cry baby]

24. I'd love to see a poll for that...how many watch?...eom

[Nutmegger]

4. The leadership does suck

I read a few days ago that Pelosi doesn't intend to make the Iraq war a campaign issue for the 2006 elections. What's wrong with them? This is an opportune time and they don't want to take an official stance on it??!! ARRRGGG! :mad:

[liberalnurse]

8. Just pay attention everyday and you just may

catch the strategy......Oh, our leadership DOES NOT SUCK by the way. I think they are cruising nicely.....The neocons are boxed in....

[UDenver20]

45. Okay....

Let's assume that someone as obnoxiously addicted to this stuff as I am doesn't see the strategy. I'm just too dense.

Please, kindly, explain that strategy for me. Give it to me in a succinct series of steps. Now that "we've got them boxed in", are we going to make a move or are we just going to sit back and wait for 2006? Its not like they'll try to climb out of that box is it? Oh no, they'll just sit in there nicely and be quiet little boys and girls while we daintily retake the House and Senate.

Oh, and please tell me why it is that two people on a message board have to explain that strategy to each other? It should be everywhere. On every website. On every talk show. On every mailing. Out of every mouth. Every day. Every week. From both DLC mouths and "progressive" mouths. It should be clearly written and widely delivered. There should be ZERO lack of clarity. ITS CALLED LEADERSHIP.

EVERY MEMBER OF THE TEAM HAS TO BOTH HAVE THE PLAYBOOK AND UNDERSTAND IT.

BUSH HAS MORE OF A STRATEGY FOR IRAQ THEN THE DEMOCRATS DO FOR RETAKING CONTROL OF OUR OWN GOVERNMENT.

[ProSense]

55. Praising Bush to criticize Democrats? Besides, this is completely false

The Democrats' strategy helped them win in 2005. They will take control of the government in 2006. Read all about the Democrats below.

On Iraq, a collection here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5443422

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=2305360

Rest of the agenda:

http://www.democrats.org/agenda.html

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=2314399


Senate
http://democrats.senate.gov/issues.html

http://democrats.senate.gov/senators.html (find out about local issues at each members website)


House
http://democraticleader.house.gov/issues /

http://democrats.house.gov/about/member_pages.cfm (find out about local issues at each members website)


Check out the members campaign sites too, even the aspiring members sites feature an issues page.

[gulfcoastliberal]

31. Pelosi endorsed Murtha... and was promptly blasted by the DLC

She tried to make it an issue - but the power brokers at the DLC cut her down.

Reid IMHO, is no better than Daschle and perhaps worse.

Where are the results of "phase 2"? Why hasn't he "shut it down"?

Why do they not stop one piece of repuke legislation, by using procedural tactics such as "shutting it down"?!

[UDenver20]

38. Gee, it would be nice if we could...

for once... put up a credible, well crafted, response, delivered by a united group of Dem leaders, where the airtime is either purchased or covered, and then have the same talking points delivered in advance to all of Congressmen and Governors - and then distribute those same damn talking points to our email lists, websites, and boards.

It'd be nice if, for once.... we set the tone. We created the "catch phrases" and established the terminology. If, for example, instead of LABELING US "defeatists" we were able to EFFECTIVELY label them as OBSTINATE.

Is that so hard? Jeez... THEY'VE ONLY BEEN DOING IT FOR FIVE YEARS.

[UDenver20]

39. Gee, it would be nice if we could...

for once... put up a credible, well crafted, response, delivered by a united group of Dem leaders, where the airtime is either purchased or covered, and then have the same talking points delivered in advance to all of Congressmen and Governors - and then distribute those same damn talking points to our email lists, websites, and boards.

It'd be nice if, for once.... we set the tone. We created the "catch phrases" and established the terminology. If, for example, instead of LABELING US "defeatists" we were able to EFFECTIVELY label them as OBSTINATE.

Is that so hard? Jeez... THEY'VE ONLY BEEN DOING IT FOR FIVE YEARS.

[kentuck]

5. I'm not sure I agree this time...

If the Democrat had responded, they would have been the story instead of Bush. In this instance, I'm of the mind they may have done the right thing. What Democrat would have given the response? Perhaps General Clark would have had the military credentials to lend credibility to the issue but not just any Democrat...I'm not sure ...

[liberalnurse]

6. Me neither kentuck.......

What do some people expect? Do they want the Congressional Democrats to stand out on Pennsylvania Ave. and spit in the wind? Gheeze...They feel the same way we do about this abomination. To act "radical" would be well, suicidal. That would just give fodder to the neocons. They understand exactly what is happening. Our guys know they need to attack from within....not with siren's blowing and snot running down their noses.

[guidod]

11. FINALLY!!

A sane rational voice. Thank you.

[tularetom]

7. What military credentials did bush have

to make the speech in the first place? How about Murtha giving the response?

Just sayin'.

[guidod]

13. I'm sure Murtha will...

I know it's tough to deal with but we, as liberals, have to show more patience. Remember all of Washington and the media is controlled by them.

[UDenver20]

42. Good idea about Clark....

I feel as if these guys get away with EVERYTHING simply because we fail to respond.

While Bush spews hate, lies, and misleads people on the right, there's a VACUUM ON THE LEFT.

[jaxx]

9. What was new to talk about?

It was the same story he's been telling in the last weeks with all those speeches. A few new words here and there to confound the sheeple. In ignoring the speech tonight, it was kind of like......it just wasn't important. And that ought to fry dubya and his handlers.

[UDenver20]

46. Its not about saying something new...

Its not the novelty of our message - Its that we FAIL TO DELIVER IT at the opportune times.

[jackpan1260]

10. I disagree.eom

[dwightspencer]

12. Aggressive Response May Turn Away the Right

Senator Biden has made "Bush-fulfilling prophecy" his catch phrase. The fact that the polls are showing progressives are carrying the will of the people right now, could easily be tipped in the other direction with too much of an affront. Our message does not need to be "I told you so."

Instead, we need to have a more inclusive dialogue. This may sound watered down to some of the folks who frequent these boards, but it may be a better tactic for garnering continued support from those who were in bed with the Neocons.

George Bush is going to continue to tell it on himself. We should not match his bad behavior as it will do nothing to bring back our brothers and sisters in Iraq. We can influence the people on the hill to engage these problems in other ways. If the funds are no longer appropriated the Global War on Terror will be finished. We need to concentrate our efforts on building bridges in the short-term and getting majorities in Congress in the long-term.

[guidod]

16. Well said...

You hit the nail on the head.

[radio4progressives]

17. Yes, The Democrats must NOT Turn Away The Right,

The Democratic must not alienate the Right, because we need to garner the votes of the Right.

Yeah, the Democratic Party is positioning to serve the interests of the Right Wing, because the Democratic Party wants to BE a Right Wing Party.


Wonderful..


Well, at least you are honest.

[UDenver20]

48. Haha... Yep.

That's like picking our Presidential nominee based on what they say...

Because the Yankees will consult with the RedSox before hiring their next coach.

LOL.

[Erika]

20. Who is saying "I told you so"?

None that I know of. We've had no bad behavior. Our hopes are to bring the troops home from an unnecessary war.

[Erika]

21. Who is saying "I told you so"?

None that I know of. We've had no bad behavior. Our hopes are to bring the troops home from an unnecessary war.

[IndianaGreen]

26. Have you seen what the polls say about Democrats?

As badly as Bush is doing, the Democrats are not doing much better, and why is that? Perhaps it is because the Democrats don't oppose Bush and don't present an alternate choice to the people.

The choice we face right now is one between dictatorship or republic. If we let Bush get away with his extraordinary claims that he has the power to do what he pleases and ignore any law that displeases him, then we lost this country for good!

[Porcupine]

30. .I Am Sick of Dead Possum Democrats!!

As long as Vichy Dems. like Lieberman and Feinstein represent as Democrats we will only poll a hairs breadth above Bush. Why? Because there's always a "Democrat" Senator prominantly kissing Bush's ass.

So the people like me who work hard, have no health care and no relief in sight from rising prices (not inflation mind you) give all of you a hearty Fu#@ OFF!!

Will somebody please stand up and fight for me politically? I so dont' like all the other options.

[UDenver20]

49. RIGHT ON!

AMEN BROTHER! PASS THE AMMUNITION.

[ldf]

59. Dead Possum Democrats....

yep.

that is definitely a label that our fearless democratic leaders should enjoy wearing.

they have certainly earned it.

and no, that is NOT sarcasm....

[UDenver20]

36. Yup.

We need LEADERSHIP.

Preferably with some balls.

[GreenArrow]

50. nt

.

[rman]

35. So what? We're never going to win over supporters of Bush's agression.

[UDenver20]

47. So?

#1 - It shouldn't be Biden's catch phrase ("Bush-fulfilling prophecy") - it should be EVERY DEM SENATORS.

#2 - I agree. "Our message does not need to be 'I told you so.'" - It needs to be WE TOLD BUSH SO.... Go back and read my original post.

#3 - You say that "polls are showing progressives carrying ther will of the people right now" and then you say "we need to have a more inclusive dialogue"? My head is spinning. Fine, part of the response is "Not all Democrats agree about the reason, status, and progress of this war. That's okay, because in OUR PARTY, their's room for dissent. However, Democrats have...(insert the now verified objections DEMS have made)...and, were we in charge (insert strategy for success / alternative message here)"

#4 - "We should not match his bad behavior" - No one said anything about his behavior. Right now we're talking about the GOP strategy. We're talking about communication. About crafting an alternative message.

#5 - "It will do nothing to bring back our brothers and sisters in Iraq." I agree.

#6 - "If the funds are no longer appropriated the Global War on Terror will be finished." Right. These people that we've pissed off will just dissappear and go away. War over. Thanks, drive through.

#7 - "We need to concentrate our efforts on building bridges in the short-term and getting majorities in Congress in the long-term." While I disagree with this STRATEGY - I applaud you for devising one. ITS MORE THAN THE DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP IS (visibly) DOING.

[Dinger]

14. Okeedokee (nt)

[liberalnurse]

15. Looks like you are a hit and run driver.

Okay everyone.....run along, this is just a misunderstanding.......The Democrats are healthy and have their wits about them. Just ignore the posters road rage......

[snowbear]

27. Rock on Liberal Nurse! THIS POST SUCKS MR. DENVER !!

If you don't like what's happening with the Democratic party, take a FRIGGIN LOOK AT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

And then.... quit'cher *^$#@ bitching !!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

[UDenver20]

51. Really?

Well, you just keep doing what you're doing and see how far that gets ya.

Meanwhile, I dont' think the Democratic party has an overflow of voters right now. So, I'd be a bit more careful about who I tell to leave.

And by the way - you sound like Bush when you suggest that there is no room for opposition from within.

[msongs]

56. yeah yeah who do you think you are?? :-)

coming here and posting your views? your opinions? your analysis? exercising your right as an American
and DU member? America love it or leave it. My country right or wrong. USA uber alles. Go join the
republican party if you do not like the dems. hahahahahahha

actually, none of the above. You keep coming back and sharing your views despite what the knee
jerkers say about you.

The day the democratic party USA actually does something about e vote fraud will be a happy one
indeed. No more candidates who concede before their supporters even wake up on the morning following
the stolen election.

Msongs
www.msongs.com/political-shirts.htm

[saracat]

19. We aren't allowed airtime. As President he demanded the time and they

HAVE to give it to him. Grow up and stop blaming the Dems for things they have no control over. There WAS a Dem reponse to the radio address. That is all that could be done without access to the airwaves.Besides, Bush just made an ass out of himself. This speech was same old same old and nooneis listening. Even the GOP are out attacking him. Why should we send our big guns out when Lindsay Graham and John Warner are more effective? You have a problem with letting Bush self destruct at the hands of his own party? Don't you WANT to win in 06?

[Erika]

22. Bush is the same old, same old. I am an ass. I am an ass

and W is stuck on stupid.

[cry baby]

25. Haha...that is all I heard!

"I am an ass. I am an ass. I am an ass."

I already knew that he is an ass, so I tuned out.

[UDenver20]

52. BUY IT.

[wiley]

23. Lindsay Graham did a pretty good job

of adding that the Shia sect was collaborating with the Iraqi police to use the 24 prisons on the Kurds and the Sunni.

I think most people saw *'s speech as the partisan crap it was.

[wiley]

28. It's a Football Sunday

Wait until tomorrow. Bush confessed everything. Needs to be impeached. He conveneiently left out a lot of very heavy and serious mess-ups.

[Strawman]

53. That's right. And it's around the Holidays

By the time people get around to noticing this the RW meme will be that this is "old news."

[snowbear]

29. I can't believe this thread got votes...

You guys are literally losing your marbles.

It's really getting hard to stop in here these days...

* bitch, bitch, bitch, bitch, bitch *

GET OVER IT !!!!!!!!!!!!! IT'S NOT THE DEMOCRATS WHO SUCK !!!!!!

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

[MrBenchley]

32. One wonders why people who hate Democrats so much

keep hanging around....

[UDenver20]

37. Because our alternative (singluar) sucks.

And.. We don't "hate Democrats so much" But thanks for putting words in our mouth! ;)

We hate losing. We hate the Right. We hate letting the right win because we keep making the same mistakes. We hate making the same mistakes over and over again. We hate missing the boat on opportunity.

We hate that the Democrats can't get a damn strategy together even when the GOP playbook is so incredibly bad.

[MrBenchley]

40. Hey, you don't have to tell ME the Green Party is a piece of shit

"We don't "hate Democrats so much""
It shows...</sarcasm>

[ProSense]

43. Oh, so this is what this is about!

Again, trying to latch on to the Democrats' agenda. Write to the GP leadership and have them respond accordingly.

[jonnyblitz]

34. kicked and recommended. GREAT post. nt

[ProSense]

44. Bravo! n/t

[blm]

33. THE GOP CONTROLS THE BROADCAST MEDIA - That's the ONLY reason they get

away with what they do.

You can't name ONE Democrat who doesn't get their words and efforts distorted and defined by BushInc. Not one. Not for the last 10 years when BushInc cronies gained near total control of the media.

[GreenArrow]

54. part of the problem

is that large numbers of Democrats have supported Bush on far too many issues. As Bush said -- shit-eating smirk firmly on display -- when Kerry attempted to criticize his handling of Iraq during one of the debates: "But you voted for it, Senator".