The wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are about oil. Period.

[devilgrrl]

Sorry, just thought I'd post a little reminder. At the moment, I'm reading 'Confessions of an Economic Hitman' by John Perkins and thought I should bring it up. In case anyone is confused, foreign aid is doled out to benefit industry and not the average citizens of the country the aid is going to. The wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are about control over natural resources and nothing about fighting terrorism. Lei capice?

I'm just saying....

[welshTerrier2]

1. look at the US base locations in Afghanistan and the new oil pipeline ...

they're side-by-side ...

the US military is a private security force paid for by the American taxpayer for the sole benefit of Big Oil ... our troops are stationed on bases all over the world to procure and protect sources of oil ...

if you really want to be blown away after you read "Confessions", read "Sorrows of Empire" by Chalmers Johnson ... it's a bit more dense than Confessions (and less first-hand narrative story-like) and covers a much wider range of time and events ...

until the Democratic Party acknowledges we are in a war with corporatist, imperialist exploitation and confronts the enemy head on, nothing will change ... little policy ideas, like looking into price gouging at the gas pump, miss the big picture ... we need to create "context" for these battles ...

and look at how badly the Democrats have handled the war in Iraq ... they've done a good job highlighting bush's incompetent leadership ... he's failed miserably ... but they still refuse to QUESTION HIS MOTIVES ... they enable the PNAC agenda by failing to point out that bush's motives were not to protect us from terrorists or to install a democracy ... it was all about oil and regional control ... but that's too scary for politicians who want to play it safe ...

[Ron Green]

2. And what this means is that SUSTAINABILITY has got to be the one word

that's the test of a real leader. If whoever is running for office does not use the word "sustainability" as an integral part of his or her speechmaking, platform, talking points, what have you.... that politician does not deserve your vote.

The eventual shift away from an oil-based economy is truly THE ONLY HOPE FOR OUR SPECIES. Anything else is just terra terra or pure bullshit.

[wiggs]

3. Good book

Sheds light on why Wolfowitz has become our World Bank rep.

[enigma000]

4. there's no oil in Afghanistan

and does anyone have an updated link on the progress of the pipeline there?

[geek tragedy]

5. No progress, just a lot of talk.

Oil theory makes sense for Iraq, but not for Afghanistan.

[bowens43]

6. Sure it makes sense for two reasons:

1.In order to control the oil in Iran, bases in Afghanstan are esential.
2. The gas pipeline. The deal has been made.

[enigma000]

8. So what you are saying is

1. an invasion of Iran, to control the oil, depends on the essential bases in Afghanistan.

2. there is a deal for a gas pipeline in a country without gas. Who is constructing it? I'd like to know so I can see if I own shares and sell them.

[bowens43]

10. What I am saying is

that an invasion of Iran is much easier if you have bases in Afghanistan and the pipeline which has been planned for decades passes through Afghanistan to pakistan. It originates near the Caspian sea where what may be the worlds largest natural gas deposit is located. US companies have invested billions in this project in the past. They intend to reap some benefits.

google is your friend......

here's a little info to get you started.
http://www.ringnebula.com/Oil/Timeline.htm

[enigma000]

11. Google is friendly.....

September 1, 2005 EurasiaNet Commentary

Indian officials are interested in the trans-Afghan pipeline (TAP) project, which would ship natural gas in Turkmenistan via Afghanistan to markets in Pakistan and India. The project has long been hampered by questions concerning pipeline security and the extent of Turkmenistan’s reserves. According to Turkmen media sources, the country’s president, Saparmurat Niyazov, discussed TAP’s prospects with visiting US Gen. John Abizaid, who visited Ashgabat in late August.

During an August 28 visit to Afghanistan, Prime Minister Singh said (.......) during a joint news conference with Afghan President Hamid Karzai. "We need both pipelines. ... India’s needs for commercial energy are increasing at an explosive rate."


No news on if it started or a deal was reached. So its a plan to provide India with oil. And congress is discussing the deal Bush made to give India nuclear technology too. hmmmmmm makes you think.

[geek tragedy]

14. Natural gas and oil are two different things. eom

[bowens43]

18. There is also oil oil in the caspian sea.

No, they're really not two different things. The motivation is the same. The companies involved are the same. The people involved are the same.

[geek tragedy]

20. Can your car run on natural gas? eom

[htuttle]

31. It's not for YOUR car or YOUR house

It's for the oil company's wallets. None of this has anything to do with supplying the US with petroleum -- it's all about supplying the petroleum multinationals with petroleum.

They'll sell to whoever will pay the most. Look at the oil pumped out of Alaska, for example. You think much of that comes down here? Nope. Most of it ends up being sold to Asia.

[geek tragedy]

15. Not one worker has been paid one hour for construction of that

pipeline.

If they invade Iran, they control Iran's sea port.

Theory debunked.

[jbane]

13. Natural gas

lots of it.

[geek tragedy]

16. No evidence that we went to war for natural gas instead of

because the rulers of Afghanistan were harboring Al-Qaeda despite repeated demands from the world community and UN sanctions.

[devilgrrl]

19. Keep telling yourself that...

history says otherwise.

[geek tragedy]

21. If by "history" you mean empty and unsubstantiated speculation,

yeah you're right.

[devilgrrl]

22. The war in Afghanistan has nothing to do with terrorism.

The captains of industry want a pipeline. Al Qaeda provided the excuse to go in there. End of story.

[geek tragedy]

23. If you say so. eom

[devilgrrl]

25. I don't say so - it is so.

eom

[geek tragedy]

26. Thanks for clearing that up. eom

[libodem]

27. you kiddin' me?

Afganistan has been about that natural gas pipeline from the start and the US has just traded one band of thugs for another as far as which warlords are in charge. We haven't done much to aleviate the suffering of most of the people and as far as capturing bad guys to send to Gitmo a lot of them were farmers that were sold for a bounty.IMO

[geek tragedy]

28. Nope. No credible evidence has ever emerged that we invaded Afghanistan

because of a natural gas pipeline instead of because of AQ.

People are free to believe it, but it's a belief based in faith, not logic and evidence.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

7. The "wars" in Iraq and Afghanistan are lost.

It's just a matter of time until the Afghans and Iraqis give us the well-deserved boot out of their countries.

No doubt, that the "wars" are about oil and the control of natural resources (not to mention politician's need to flaunt the invisible contents of their jockstraps by being "tough on terror") but, the folks in those countries have other ideas about what constitutes "democracy" and "freedom" with soldiers killing their citizenry and blowing up their houses.

[RethugAssKicker]

9. Great book...

I read it a couple of months ago... Perkins is dead-ON!
Love his label - corporatocracy! to describe our form of govt.

[jbane]

12. The only way we win is if the oil starts pumping...cheap oil!

And that's the bottom line. To hell with all this spreading Democracy crap. Iraq is about oil and anybody that thinks otherwise is not paying attention.

[Ron Green]

17. Check out this movie:

http://www.theoilfactor.com

[sepia_steel]

24. I saw 'Good Night and Good Luck' last night

(the last night out for us for awhile, i'm afraid) and I saw something that has me so excited I can't freaking wait. George Clooney's making another movie about OIL. You saw shots of Saudis, Presidents, key figures getting whacked, corrupt oil tycoons, THE WHOLE THING.

CLOONEY IS ON A ROLL!!! "God bless him," I whispered to the hubby.

The film is called 'Syriana' (if I spelled that correctly). Google it and find a trailer; I was amazed! You will be excited...

I love the smell of truth.

[drduffy]

29. a late comment... yes

it is all about oil, nat. gas, global hegemony.

go here: http://www.newhumanist.com/oil.html

any many other sites provide the data. The war on 'terra' is a ruse.

[bluedawg12]

30. That and geopolitical advantage- the neocons thought that having

military bases in an Iraq under our control would somehow beat the Iranians into submission to our will and secure the region.

Of course they forgot about the Saudi's funding insurgents against us, and they misclaculated how Iraq under US occupation.

It's oil and plain old power grubbing.