The "Dean Scream" flap

[Plaid Adder]

This is my first ever thread started in the GD Primary forum. Please be gentle with me.

Apparently Dean's speech to his supporters after his Iowa third-place finish is now being touted by the NY Post and others as a sign that he has lost his mind. Personally, when I saw the little clip of it on TV it seemed to me like perfectly normal get-psyched kind of stuff. The "yelp" at the end was a little weird-sounding, but IMHO it wasn't because it was too maniacal, but because he wasn't letting himself go *enough.*

I'm not a Dean supporter, and I have no brief for him in particular, but it pisses me off to see people treating this like it's a real issue. The Dean campaign has ridden out plenty of other manufactured media flaps and it'll survive this one. Indeed, whoever gets the nomination will have to be capable of riding out manfucatured media flaps, because there will be plenty. Courage, Dean folks!

Good luck,

The Plaid Adder

[Jack_Dawson]

1. It's Much Ado about Nothing

by a restless media. Kerry is boring - let's talk about screaming Dean.

[Cena]

2. I'm not a Dean person either...

and from what I saw, he was just pumping people up with that speech...not going mad or crazy. He was like a football coach pumping up his team who is behind at halftime, to use that analogy. Many are taking it out of context.

This shouldn't be an issue at all.

[wryter2000]

8. Welcome, Cena

:hi:

[cthrumatrix]

3. It's so that Dem issues and criticism of bush isn't discussed -- crap is

[ewagner]

4. Last night on Hardball

They played the clip over and over and then Mathews asked his Repub Consultant guest if the Repubs would be using that clip in the GE if Dean gets the nomination.

The response was very telling:

The Repub consultant said: "We don't have to. The meida is doing it already".

The cable news networks want Dean's head on a platter and I'm not sure why. (lots to speculate about tho...) They keep running that clip like it's the holy grail of this campaign.

I'm not a Dean supporter (unless he wins the nomination) but this treatment is unfair to him and needs to be questioned.

[Ripley]

5. Well said Plaid.

I, too, thought he looked goofy if anything...kind of like his 3500 screaming fans were forcing him to become this rock star persona...one maybe Clinton could pull off with shades and a sax, but the doctor just isn't quite that hip.

Funny everyone thinks he's mad because we're told he is mad. I don't smile when I'm mad, do you?

[newsjunkie]

10. I don't smile when I'm mad either

Must be a new way of showing 'anger'. LOL

[chocolateeater]

6. Thank you.

:toast:

[wryter2000]

7. Thank you!

I can't tell you how happy I was to see this subject line with Plaid Adder as the author. I knew you'd have something sensible to say.

BTW, I think the yelp came out because the man was hoarse. That's all.

[AndyP]

9. personally

I would rather have a candidate that has some fire to him, even when he loses, than have a candidate that gives prepared speaches thatsound fake.

[Ripley]

11. If Kerry or Edwards get the nomination...

Wake me up to vote. :boring:

[DinahMoeHum]

12. The press has a bad case of what I call the

"Nothing-But-The-Best-For-The-Oppressed" syndrome.

No Dem candidate is good enough for them.

A big fat F-T-S to that !!

:puke:

[Military Brat]

13. Doug Stephan's Good Day radio program had a good analysis

Doug says anyone running for president is a complex person, that Dean has been going full steam for a year, and if he seemed to be yelling, well, so what.

And here's my impression of it. It's about passion, folks. Remember passion? It's what our founding fathers brought to the democratic process when they were engaging in yelling matches and fistfights as they hammered out our Constitution. So if Dean shows emotion, hey, that's fine by me.

I would prefer, for the sake of convention, that maybe he be a bit more restrained at times, but I couldn't care less if now and then he doesn't control his voice because the fact is that he is a very powerful orator and hasn't yet mastered how to project his voice so it will be "media friendly". But so help me God, give me Dean a bit off the edge once in a while instead of a media-trained, stage-crafted, hypocritical, lying, agenda-hiding, warmongering, spendthrift megalomaniac like bush.

[chiburb]

14. Sorry Plaidder...

There isn't enough vitriol in your post for GD2004. Don't you know that you're supposed to rip on candidates and their supporters here?
Oh, that's right... you dissed Clark yesterday; never mind...

:-)

[Triana]

15. I agree PA...much ado about nothing, IMO

I'll support whomever wins the Dem Nom so I am not necessarily a Dean loyalist either, but Dems and Pugs and the media - all three, blew this thing totally out of proportion.

Idjits...

[MercutioATC]

16. Thanks, Plaid...I wholeheartedly agree.

Granted, I'm a Dean supporter, and I think the campaign will turn this to their advantage.

I'd like to thank you for your decision to post on the subject.

[Cheswick2.0]

17. the media is not the only group playing this manufactured flap

You can read the same nonsense here on DU a daily basis.

[dansolo]

18. The only problem with the scream

Was that by that time Dean had lost his voice. It sounded wierd because his voice was all hoarse. It is obvious to anyone who listened to it.

[mopinko]

19. i think this is your most important point

"Indeed, whoever gets the nomination will have to be capable of riding out manufactured media flaps, because there will be plenty."

hopefully, he will find a way to make this work for him. i, personally, would love to have some of the mixes that are going around with it.

the reaction of so many here gave me a sounding of how damaging it could be if they can't get a hold of the spin. like they say about the platte river- a mile wide and an inch deep.
makes me feel some despair that this could even be CONSIDERED to be an issue.

[waylon]

20. I guess Ill be the only one to say..

I dont think it bodes well for his future. If Leno and Letterman are harping on you, you have a problem.

Passion I like but this was over the top. He had a great opportunity to show the nation how he handles defeat. If not with grace, at least a little restraint.

That brings up a good point. I wouldnt care about the yelp or the ranting if he had won! I guess my issue is that he did this after a defeat. Not a good time to lose it. Just not very presidential and, it reflects on all of us.

[mistertrickster]

25. Waylon, did you ever go to a pep rally? I can't believe any DUers

buy into this made-by-tv crap. It's nuthin'. And if Leno and O'Brian had their way, Clinton's high favoribility ratings would have been zero during the Monica Lewinsky flap. Letterman has been doing "Bush's Joke that is not a Joke" and "George Bush: Jenius" for months and weeks, and unfortunately, it doesn't seem to hurt his ratings too much.

The revolution will not be televised, my friend.

[indigo32]

21. Thank You!

eom

[Guaranteed]

22. Great post, Plaid.

You're consistently insightful. Thank you. :)

[Meldread]

23. I liked the speech.

The speech was just the typical Dean that I always see. That's one of the reasons I like him -- he's interesting -- his speeches lack the feeling that they are "scripted" or "canned". You feel like they come straight from the heart. You can identify with him better.

Compare Dean's Speech Delivery to Bush's. Who is more inspiring? I'll concede the fact that Bush's speeches might sound more "Presidential", but really who wants a President like Bush? I'd rather have a President like Dean. I think Dean resonates more with the average Joe.

I also support Dean because he stands up to things even when they are unpopular. He first caught my attention early on (before we went into Iraq and he caught the attention of the anti-war folks) on his signing of Civil Unions in Vermont. Yes, I know all the spin surrounding what he did, but the fact of the matter is: He did it. I don't agree with him on every issue -- I wish he supported Gay Marriage, I wish he supported stronger gun control laws, but over all I feel like Howard Dean and I really have a lot in common.

I think that is going to count for more than anything else. Who do you feel you have more in common with? Bush or Dean?

I am still depressed that we lost in Iowa, but that is the nature of politics. We lost one battle, but the war is far from over. Even as I watch some people begin to jump ship, I plan to remain on board until the very end. I was on board before most Americans even knew Howard Dean existed. If Howard Dean goes down -- I'm going down with him, but in the mean time I plan to fight, fight, fight, and then fight some more.

Tonight can make or break Dean. If he loses New Hampshire things will only go down hill, even if he can manage to turn things around it'll be an uphill battle. Tonight’s Debate and Dateline interview are just the beginning. I'm a bit disappointed that Howard has to bring Judy into this mess, but I agree with this decision. He needs his wife to show up by his side to illustrate that he isn't the angry crazed maniac that he's being portrayed as. With the polls showing that about 43% of NH voters could "change their mind" about the candidates the ball is in anyone’s court.

And ultimately I also have to give Joe Lieberman credit. I don't like him much, and wouldn't even vote for him if he won the nomination but at least he stayed true to his message. At least he didn't waffle when it was no longer "popular" to be pro-Bush and pro-War. I can respect a man who stands up for what he believes in even when it isn't popular -- that's why I support Howard Dean. Because he has proven to me, despite the spin that people may place on it, that he is willing to stand up for what he believes in. That he is willing to stand up to Bush -- to some that might mean he's insane -- but to me that just means he's my hero.

[welshTerrier2]

24. Get off his back already ...

i'll repeat what i said in another thread because this topic keeps coming up:

let me say at the start that i'm supporting either kucinich or kerry and i have come to dislike many things about Howard Dean ...

BUT, i totally agree that criticisms of Dean's "a bit over-the-top" presentation after the Iowa caucus is nothing but a smear campaign ... Howard Dean is not some type of unstable psychotic ... he's a serious, rational man with great energy and many good ideas ...

i also am sickened by the piling on of, not just the press, but so many democrats supporting other candidates ... they are foolish to allow "one of our own" to be denigrated in this way !!! these unfortunate souls fail to understand that we need to build unity in our party ... and this is not the way to achieve unity ...

i commend Dean for standing up for us when most of the others were cowering under the weight of bush's 9/11 popularity ... i also commend Dean for bringing so much energy and so many new voters to the party ...

to those Dean supporters who are thinking of not voting because of the horrid treatment he's received from other democrats, i can only ask you to think long and hard about your choice to do so ... we cannot afford 4 more years of bush even if some democrats are jerks ...

[Ripley]

You got that right.

The Kerry fans who are acting so embarassed about this will be sooooooooo rational when it's Kerry's turn for the media meatgrinder. They'll of course scream it's the media twisting the truth! Something they somehow can't see is happening to Dean.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

26. Agree completely...

First, Dean is not my man.

Secondly, I watched his speech and didn't think much negatively about what I say, which was a candidate firing up his supporters after an unexpected loss. Frankly, I though it was great to see SOMEONE fired up about this election!

Then the media pile-on hit and I am left wondering just what all the fuss was about.

Last election we were left with Al Gore=LIAR...this election we have Dean=SCREAMER.

Same old same old...

[TLM]

27. I think the media is really focusing on this.... because all the others

are boring.

Kerry, boring... Clark, boring... Edwards, boring... Lieberman ZZZZZZ.


Dean is the only one out there who has a bit of life in him.

After all these boring sleepy dems that just drone on... I think people will like a candidate who isn't boring.

[Bertha Venation]

28. Hear, hear, Plaid Adder.

eom