A vote for Arab women

[Behind the Aegis]

Changes in the national agenda of the state's Arab public are taking place concurrent to changes in the national agenda among Israel's Jewish population. The socio-economic question, which the Arab leadership has dealt with in a general and superficial fashion until now, is getting a boost from discussions on the upcoming elections.

According to a poll released by Tel Aviv University's Konrad Adenauer program, a decisive majority - over 60 percent - of the Arab public believe the socio-economic issue will be the one that most influences their vote for the next Knesset.

The poll's results are supported by the nature of increased political activism within the Arab sector prior to the elections, especially with regard to women's representation. Arab parties, institutions, social organizations and press are intensively discussing the need to ensure Arab female representation in the next Knesset, which, in turn, is being stepped up by widespread public support.

A survey conducted by the Ibn Haldun Center for the Women Against Violence organization found that over 80 percent of the Arab public is willing to vote for women to represent them in the Knesset. These findings come against the backdrop of social change under way in Arab society, feverish activity by organizations advocating social change, and a positive example set by factions vying for the Palestinians' vote in the West Bank and Gaza Strip prior to the Palestinian Authority's legislative council elections. On all of the lists, including that of Hamas, a sizable female representation has been promised.

more..

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Behind the Aegis]

2. The ole'...

..."it's good, but..." clause.

On edit: It should be pointed out that your first link is almost 3 years old. Did that law ever pass? I can't find anything that indicates it did. If it did, that would be despicable. Have a link?

As to your second link, it shows nothing to support your opinions. But, it is a nice straw-man.

[Wordie]

4. Article on Israeli homeless:

(Note that these figures don't even appear to take into account all the Palestinians made homeless by the destruction of their homes by the IDF.)

The homeless are ignored and left to die, while cities spend less and less on them

By Nurit Wuhrgaft

At least 236 homeless people died in the years 2001-2004, according to the statistics of the Welfare Ministry.

In the five years from 2000-2004, the number of homeless known to the Welfare Ministry rose from 908 to 2,874, an increase of 217 percent. The ministry estimates that in each of those years there were about 1,000 more homeless than recorded (the ministry calls them "street dwellers"). According to Welfare Ministry statistics, during the years when the number of homeless increased, the resources to assist them declined drastically. If in 2000 the average budget for a homeless person was NIS 5,246, in 2004 it was NIS 2,162, a decline of 59 percent.

The comptroller's investigation of seven municipalities - Tel Aviv-Jaffa, Haifa, Ashdod, Ashkelon, Bat Yam, Petah Tikva and Netanya - demonstrated that the homeless are at the bottom of their priorities.

The Tel Aviv-Jaffa Municipality reported providing care for the homeless in frameworks that do not exist in the city. According to the municipality report, it spent about NIS 5.06 million on the homeless in 2004. In fact, says the state comptroller, the municipality spent only NIS 1.73 million. In other words, the municipality reported spending about NIS 3.33 million that was not spent at all.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/660997.html

These statistics tend to support your article, julianer.

[Coastie for Truth]

6. Law of Return

You posted

while anyone claiming Jewish descent, from anywhere in the world, has a right to citizenship. The aim of this policy is obvious - to ensure a 'Jewish majority' in the 'Jewish State'.

Wrong - I would recommend that you look up the International Humanitarian law on "Asylum"

The reason for "The Law of Return" is because none of the caucasian, eurocentric Western Democracies would open their borders to the refugees fleeing the Holocaust. See and "While Six Million Died: A Chronicle of American Apathy" by Arthur D. Morse, and "The Abandonment of the Jews: America and the Holocaust 1941-1945" by David S. Wyman. Only the Japanese came through - "Passage to Freedom: The Sugihara Story" by Ken Mochizuki, Dom Lee, and "The Fugu Plan: The Untold Story Of The Japanese And The Jews During World War II" by Marvin Tokayer, Mary Swartz, and the Wikipedia entry .

Your wholly erroneous statement

The aim of this policy is obvious - to ensure a 'Jewish majority' in the 'Jewish State'.

is just not in accord with the facts.

[julianer]

14. Why then are Arabs born in what is now Israel

refused the right of citizenship? Your reply about the 'law of return' would make sense if there was no discrimination against the indigenous population and its descendents.

[Coastie for Truth]

16. Why didn't the Brits or Yanks or Canadians

follow the International Humanotarian Law of ASYLUM. for the victims fleeing the Holocaust. The little island of Japan was able to (See Tokayer, "The Fugu Plan").

[julianer]

17. Because they were anti-semites

most likely.

But two wrongs don't make a right. In fact my girlfriend's dad was a child refugee who found sanctuary in Britain so it was refuge for some, but I agree - the lack of concern for Jews before and during WWII by Britain was an absolute disgrace for the most part. A sad example of the racism that continues to bubble up in our society with different targets to suit the moment. At the moment it is muslims who are the target of state racism, IMO. Anti-semitism was rife in the 1930's in Britain and many leaders were convinced anti-semites and pro-fascists.

However this point, while interesting, is not germane to Israeli citizenship. Why are people born in the present boundaries of Israel before 47/48 not allowed to become citizens of Israel? Is there any other country in the world that bars citizenship from its indigenous population?

[Coastie for Truth]

18. You do not and can not ever understand .....

You posted

However this point, while interesting, is not germane to Israeli citizenship.

Wrong! Wrong! Wrong!.

It is the basis for the Law of Return.

It is a deep, underlying, subliminal, psychological basis for the Diaspora support of Israel. We live with hidden, secret fear that "It could happen here" (fill in "here" - UK, US, Canada, Australia, France; I am not even going to raise Argentina)

[julianer]

19. Never mind all that

answer the question - why can't a member of the indigenous population become an Israeli citizen?

That should be easy enough, surely.

[julianer]

20. I realise that many people

are motivated to return to Israel because of fears of a new racist regime coming to power somewhere in the world on the back of anti-semitism.

Which is why it is so terrible that Israel is visiting a similar racial pogrom on the Palestinians as many Jewish communities have suffered throughout history, including in the UK. That is, they are hounded out of their homes to make way for someone else.

I just don't understand how you can cope with this contradiction - I couldn't. To me if you are against racism and repression on racial grounds then it really is irrelevant who the victims and perpetrators are - such things reside in the realms of morality and form the support for basic principals of humanity. They are not negotiable on the basis of other people's actions and all must take responsibility for what they personally can influence or change.

It seems to me that Israelis can effect change in their government's policies toward Palestine and the peace process and, if I was an Israeli, that is what I would be doing, I'm sure.

[pelsar]

24. what are you talking about?

arabs born in israel are citizens..as are druze, bedouin and jews.....

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[bemildred]

3. Good. What's not to like? nt

[Wordie]

5. The increased representation of women does seem very positive.

As does an increased concern for poverty issues. Thanks for posting this.

[Colorado Blue]

8. Good. Thanks.

[Jim Sagle]

10. This is more likely to spread democracy in the area than anything w is

likely to come up with.

[julianer]

11. Deleted message

This forum is NOT censored. :sarcasm:

[Behind the Aegis]

13. nope...simply, it is moderated. n/t

[julianer]

15. No, it is censored

Look at the 'guidelines' - no article or editorial older than three weeks old allowed.

So if I find a piece of research that shows that one side in the 'conflict' were practising racism and discrimination against the other I wouldn't be allowed to post it and discuss its implications.

It also means that you can link to pieces from writers supporting one side or the other which inevitably means the discussion will lapse into the usual acrimony with the concommitant impossibility of any meaningful discussion.

If we were lucky enough to have an objective article published in the MSM that truly attempted to analyse the situation we would have three weeks to discuss it - for it never to be mentioned thereafter, for fear of causing 'offense'.

I have also been censored for stating an opinion (backed up with a news link from the BBC) which might be 'offensive' to others. Discussion frequently is offensive to the participants! And what is more 'offense' is never grounds for censorship. A murderer may be offended by being described as such - that's tough luck, really.

If all the above strikes you as simple moderation....well some perspective is gained, perhaps, into the wider descriptions of societal conditions occasionally adopted on this forum. Personally I think it is awful that the sensibilities of the easily offended are given greater weight than free and open discussion.

(I wonder if this will survive).

[Tom Joad]

21. Frankly, for some who profess concern for the rights of Arab women, it

rings as hallow as the many bullets that filled the body of Iman al-Hams, a young school girl killed at an Israeli checkpoint.

Where are all these people who are so very concerned about "Arab Women rights" when a pregnant woman is held by the occupation army at a checkpoint, and forced to give birth there? Where are they when Arab women are being held without charges in an Israeli prison? When their homes are being crushed by a Caterpillar bulldozer?

Those Israeli Jews who do have real concern with human rights are joining Palestinian women and men in protests at the Wall, and helping rebuild their homes, replant destroyed crops. They stand at checkpoints with cameras and notepads to document human rights violations. They are standing bravely in a square in Jerusalem and holding signs for peace and justice, surrounded by racist extremists calling for expulsion of the Arabs. They offer real solidarity.

And isn't it interesting that while now the US vilifies Muslims, it used Muslim fundamentalism to destroy a more secular version of Arab nationalism that existed prior to the 80's? The same ploy has been used by Israel, to weaken the PLO.

Both the Israeli and US governments now embrace Christian fundamentalists.

Why is it when i see posts like this that i think the real concern is keeping the status quo of the occupation?

[barb162]

22. Arab women have more rights in Israel than they do in Arab countries

[Tom Joad]

23. Who asked you to speak for Arab women?

[pelsar]

25. care to compare....??

shall we compare the right of civil rights of "saudi arabia women to arab israeli women?..perhaps those in iran..you know the ones wearing the ninja customs to arab israeli women who go to college, earn professions and dress as they please?

or are you one of those "progressive liberal types" that believe saudi arabian women deserve to live in potato sacks?...or that honor killings amongs the jordanins is "ok" since it is after all customary?

[Tom Joad]

26. How does this help Iman al-Hams? Or her mother? Or her sisters?

Is this the "equality" that Israel will bring to Arab women?

In fact, I walked with Palestinian Arab women who were being treated equally with Palestinian men. They were made to sit down for hours (as were the Palestinian young men) as the military needlessly detained them, not allowed to walk toward the university after returning from home. (They were released. How this detention, then release can be justified as providing for security, when it is clearly harrassment... although YES, without regard to gender in this case... how so very "progressive"!)
Palestinian women can go to universities, it is the Israeli military that gets in their way.

Other ways Israel presents its gender-based equality: Palestinian Boys and girls are held in israeli jails. I am sure that at times, both genders get foul-smelling potato sacks pulled over their heads (a common practice, picked up the US occupation forces in Iraq when dealing with detainees)

I do not support reactionary policies of Saudi Arabia. I think the issue here is Israeli policies, and US support for them. Saudi Arabia policies should be discussed in the Saudi Arabia forum.

[pelsar]

28. paletenain women....

get the same treatment as do palestenain men by israelis (not always, we use to be more leniant, until some female suicide bombers straightend us out)...as i have learned from your previous posts, you seem to have very little understanding of israeli culture....and i would assume just as much of israeli security needs and processes.

actually the sacks over the heads was not "picked up by the US forces (do you just make this stuff up?)....removing sensory perception (like bags over the heads) is pretty common methodology during war

but if you want to claim that palestenain women have an equal footing within palestenain society as their male counterparts, you obviously didnt visit enough or were restricted by 'your handlers" to specific areas.....

you should have gotten out more, learn arabic, or worse...talk to israeli arabs about the way palestenain women are treated within the palestenain society.....though there are exceptions...they have a very very long way to go:

unlike other arab societies, if hamas doesnt take over, they have a chance....just dont kid yourself... either that or learn about the middle east and its complex cultures (since your not showing much knowledge here)

Gaza has operated since 1954 under the law of Egypt, with the West Bank under Jordanian law since 1967. Legal regulations and customs are also heavily influenced by the Shari'ah. Under these laws, women are treated like second-class citizens

http://womensissues.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.geocities.com%2FWellesley%2F3321%2Fwin11a.htm

[Jim Sagle]

27. Who asked you to wise off to other posters?

[barb162]

30. I can't agree with you more, thanks Jim

[barb162]

29. And who asked you

[barb162]

31. check your facts

"...In the Palestinian communities of the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Israel, and Jordan, women are executed in their homes, in open fields, and occasionally in public, sometimes before crowds of cheering onlookers. Honor killings account for virtually all of the murders of Palestinian women in these areas.
Honor killings occur for a variety of offenses, including allegations of premarital or extramarital sex, refusing an arranged marriage, attempting to obtain a divorce, or simply talking with a man. If a woman brings shame to the family, her male relatives are bound by duty and culture to kill her. "A woman shamed is like rotting flesh," a Palestinian merchant tells me. "If it is not cut away, it will consume the body. What I mean is the whole family will be tainted if she is not killed....."

http://www.worldandi.com/newhome/public/2003/may/clpub.asp