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Will Bibi get his Likudoid?

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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:08 AM
Original message
Will Bibi get his Likudoid?
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:40 AM by occuserpens
Rumors of the Likud split keep going, and now it is possible that instead of one Likud there will be two Likudoids: one for Sharon, another - for Netanyahu. What is the proper context to discuss this development? I'd point out three recent developments.

-- Israeli withdrawal from Gaza in summer 2005 was quite a circus. It demonstrated the growing strength of the Israeli hyper-right, those who are to the right from Sharon. Netanyahu represents the secular hyper-right, but there is also a strong religious Zionist movement, both inside the Likud (Moshe Feiglin) and outside: NRP, Shas and others. All these forces fiercely opposed the "disengagement".
-- Sharon's son and close advisor Omri recently pleaded guilty of political fraud. It is clear that this could not happened without strong political pressure. The question is, what is the source of this pressure? No, it is highly unlikely that Omri Sharon has been attacked from the left, hyper-rightists are the most likely foes of Sharon Jr.
-- On the American side, there are spectacular catfights between different neoconservative factions on major ideological issues. On Iraq, "soft" neocons get more and more wary of GWOT/GSAVE while "hard" neocons are as enthusiastic as ever about their "democratic" revolution. On Intelligent Design, PNAC founder Krauthammer clearly opposes this abomination. However, there is little doubt that Krauthammer's position is purely political, he'd certainly make a case for the Martian channels research if necessary! What really matters is the clash between secular and religious far-rightists.

The conclusion is, the arrival of Likudoids in Israel would be an important turn for the global neoconservative movement. Let us wait and see whether radical and moderate neocons will be able to coexist - or there will be a split.

1. Attila Somfalvi. Sharons moment of truth: http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3170982,00.ht...
2. C.Krauthammer. Phony Theory, False Conflict: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...
3. Tal Rosner. Sharon's son to plead guilty: http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3169230,00.ht...
4. Defending and Advancing Freedom. A Symposium: http://www.commentarymagazine.com/article.asp?aid=12004...

http://inplainview.monitor.us.tt/comm.ME.htm

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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
1. There's a split in Labour, too. The GOP isn't the solid machine it
once was, either. Reshuffling of the deck going on, all over.

This was inevitable with the failure of the neocon "go for broke" gamble on regime change in the Middle East. Now, even the normally compliant Saudi moneymen are carefully reevaluating their foreign investment portfolios.

This would be a good time for the Democratic Party to hang together while the rest hang each other.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Impossible
This would be a good time for the Democratic Party to hang together while the rest hang each other.


Impossible. We Dems are already circling the wagons to get in position to shoot each other.

Me? I will be volunteering Thanksgiving Weekend, Christmas Weekend, and New Years Weekend at the nearest one of Bill Frist's HCA Hospitals. We Dems will give the White House to Frist - mark my words.
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eyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. How exactly did the withdrawal
"demonstrate the growing strength of the Israeli hyper-right"? When you come right down to it, a major policy they strenously opposed was passed with widespread public support, and their antics cost them quite a lot of sympathy in the Israeli "street"
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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. why take everything literally?
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 03:09 PM by occuserpens
It is absolutely unbelievable that the whole circus was about 8K settlers. In fact, it was a great opportunity for religious Zionists to show themselves - among other things.
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newyorican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
5. Victory Plan for Israel

Problem:

How to rally the right-wing, nationalist forces and bring down the Ariel Sharon/Labor/Meretz party government.

Solution:

1. Formation of a united front, consisting of the following elements: Likud, Tsomet, Moledet, National Religious Party, Lubavitch, the Judea, Samaria and Gaza Council, Zo Artzeinu, Gush Emunim, Women for Israel's Tomorrow, the Temple Mount Faithful, Victims of Arab Terror, Inc., plus any other compatible group.

2. The United Front, to call itself the Maccabee Party, and would be run by a council of all constituent bodies. Members would agree not to fight with each other or threaten to withdraw until the Shimon Peres-Ariel Sharon-Meretz, post-Zionist government has fallen and new elections are scheduled. Hopefully, they would also stay together through a new election and victoriously bring the nationalist camp to power.

-snip-

Maccabee Party Platform

6. Those Arabs who desire to do harm to their Jewish neighbors, or who claim sovereignty over any part of Eretz Yisrael, should be resettled among other Arab countries.

7. Arabs resisting implementation of item no. 6 should be forcibly removed from Eretz Yisrael.

8. Economic and political incentives should be made for the Arabs to emigrate to other countries.

Link



Note: Arutz Sheva is a Pro-settler publication of Israel.

A far right coalition is attempting to form with ethnic cleansing codified as a platform position. How does the splitting of Likud impact this effort?
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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. This is closer to Bibi-Likud
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Lithos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. This is also a fairly radical opinion piece even for Arutz Sheva
And the person making it has next to no influence on affairs. This is just a wish list by a rather radical individual. The odds of these particular groups getting together are zero to none.

L-
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Autz Sheva is run by a bunch of kooks out past Jabotinsky and Bibi
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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. They are religious revolutionaries
<And the person making it has next to no influence on affairs.>

They have separation of duties: some just produce rants, others - actually do something. Militant clerics seem to be closely connected with military community. In the end, it all comes to clerico-defense complex. Also, there are close ties between Israeli and American religious right.

<This is just a wish list by a rather radical individual. The odds of these particular groups getting together are zero to none.>

It is meaningless to take revolutionary rhetoric literally, it always needs interpretation.

http://inplainview.us.tt/hist/MEIsraelIdeol.htm

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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
9. Arik is almost out
However, it would be completely unnatural for him just to say clear and simple what he is going to do.
JPost. GIL HOFFMAN. Sharon has 'one foot out the door' of the Likud

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occuserpens Donating Member (836 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
10. He is out!
Edited on Sun Nov-20-05 06:05 PM by occuserpens
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Lithos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
12. Locking
This has now come to pass. Please continue in the appropriate threads for Sharon's new party and Labour's withdrawl from the coalition.

Lithos
I/P Forum Moderator
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